This deck likes to ramp and kill. I think it could be tier 2 after RoE because it looks as if standars is going to slow down. This decks best match-ups seem to be midrange and post sideboard control. Comments plz
Because she's the hero standard deserves, but not the one it needs right now... and so we'll chase her... because she can take it... because she's not a hero... she's a silent guardian
I'd say dreamstone hedron > skittering invasion because you can use it every turn and continue powering out eldrazi.
That makes sense heres a quick pro con list
Skittering Invasion
Pros
Give 5 mana to be used once
Gives 5 0/1 bodies that can chump
Cons:
0/1 bodies destroyed by mass removal (although that can be a pro due to them wasting such removal)
Costs 1 more (unless temple is out)
Used once and done
Dreamstone Hedron
Pros
1 less mana
Draws 3
Re-usable
Cons
only nets 3 mana
Can't chump block
Wow, in my head those are practically even. If you use invasion, it gives more mana, which is good because you really only need to play 1 eldrazi to win or start winning. But with Dreamstone hedron, you can keep an otherwise meh hand, such as 4 land, the hedron, a rampant growth, and a harrow. It could go either way.
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EllE:
Because she's the hero standard deserves, but not the one it needs right now... and so we'll chase her... because she can take it... because she's not a hero... she's a silent guardian
Have a helicopter drop you off out front. Light your cigar with a small Indonesian boy holding a black lotus. Then bust out a craw wurm deck with no sleeves. Raw dog shuffle, loose terribly, flip the table, leave in a hovercraft.
Acidic slime seems like a bad choice, splash red and run the Eldrazi Siege gang commander.
Could you explain why acidic slime is a bad choice?
I see it as a way to keep consistency and stall for ramp. Playing that on turn 4 is a good way to keep your opponent at bay. Play it, screw them of mana and take away a manland, plus they won't want to attack due to deathtouch
Also, the Eldrazi Siege gang commander is not good. You would rather run invasion or dreamstone hedron. Hedron is 1 more mana for same production of mana but consistently.
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EllE:
Because she's the hero standard deserves, but not the one it needs right now... and so we'll chase her... because she can take it... because she's not a hero... she's a silent guardian
Why not ramp into something that will win the game like Iona? You're going to be walking right into Terminate / Maelstrom Pulse. You're going to be paying 10 mana for a draw 4 more times than not.
Why not ramp into something that will win the game like Iona? All your Eldrazi walk right into Terminate / Maelstrom Pulse. You're going to be paying 10 mana for a draw 4 more times than not.
its funny because you just made a horrible generalization. Ulamog is indestructible so terminate maelstrom pulse sucks on that, and emrakul has protection. So, there are 3 eldrazi that will die. However, drawing 4 cards and getting them to play a removal spell isn't that bad. Chances are that the 5 cards you draw (4 plus normal draw) will contain another fattie. Also this deck beats iona, due to colorless and sweeps
Edit: Looking at gp brussels top 8, jund runs an average of 5 thing that kill only kozilek. i run 7 eldrazi. The chances that i draw two eldrazi is more likely than them drawing two removal spells that deal with kozilek. Not to mention if they fizzle out from a bloodbraid when i don't have anything on the field
Because she's the hero standard deserves, but not the one it needs right now... and so we'll chase her... because she can take it... because she's not a hero... she's a silent guardian
However, in today's culture of Justin Bieber, Jersey Shore, and Twilight, where every song on the radio, every program on television and every site on the internet is just another monument to the pinnacle of human stupidity, it's certainly not the worst thing that people could be watching.
I'd say just Polymorph. Khalni garden, into Kozilek/Ulamog/Emrakul/Iona, all possible win-cons.
All of those are sub optimal to iona when polymorphed except maybe emrakul. They need to be cast for their abilities to work.
However, this deck can beat iona i believe as i've said b4 due to the all is dust
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EllE:
Because she's the hero standard deserves, but not the one it needs right now... and so we'll chase her... because she can take it... because she's not a hero... she's a silent guardian
I think there is a lot of power in the ramping strategy. The main weakness of the Polymorph Eldrazi is that it is an all-eggs-in-one-basket approach. Yeah, you play your big guy, but if they deal with it then your efforts were for nothing. If the strategy, though, is to just get as much mana as possible, you can cast an Eldrazi (get all the benefits of casting them), and be able to back it up with another Eldrazi if they deal with the first one. This is why I prefer Dreamstone Hedron for this deck - so that you can keep getting mana for the future. The strength of this deck, to me, is inherent in its ability to continue playing large creatures turn after turn, rather than just getting 1 out as early as possible.
This deck likes to ramp and kill. I think it could be tier 2 after RoE because it looks as if standars is going to slow down. This decks best match-ups seem to be midrange and post sideboard control. Comments plz
I frankly have no idea why people realy believe this "meta is gonna slow down" theory. Why is it? I can't see the signs...
Monowhite winnie decks are rising, boros decks are rising, vampires decks are already very strong, jund is not going anywhere - NO deck slower than Jund seem to be able to battle it anyway... and blue decks will have to eat summoning traps and eldrazis soon to make it even more ironic!
Ramp is a dangerous strategy. It can either win games fast or simply loose to itself, since it lacks the consistency of a "normal" curved deck. Ramp cards as topdecks or expensive spells at the start of a game happen a lot and are not pretty.
That said, I think it can be FUN and will make a casual eldrazi deck myself, but I'm going the monoblack (or G/B) route. If you want to go green, maybe the best way to do so is to try some Nissa Eldrazi variant and use those elves to play an Eldrazi or two you have in the middle of the deck just in case...
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Alea iacta est
I'm a Spike Vorthos - I love lore and flavor, but only if the cards are competition worthy.
@Zahar: I believe the meta is going to slow down, just look at RoE. There are no incredibly fast cards. Level up is a slow mechanic and to be used will no doubt slow down standard somewhat. You cannot tell me that 248 cards won't do anything to standard. I would like to see where you are getting boros on the rise and white weenie on the rise.
Looking at recent tournament results in pro tour san diego, grand prix brussels, and grand prix kuala lumpur, white weenie and boros have a combined 2 placings, and neither have one. Oh and there are no vampires. So, you were saying? Jund isn't all that fast to a point where this deck can survive against with a sweep, and same goes with boss naya. Looking at top 8 at brussels which is the most recent standard tournament, there were 2 finest hour bants which is again pretty slow.
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EllE:
Because she's the hero standard deserves, but not the one it needs right now... and so we'll chase her... because she can take it... because she's not a hero... she's a silent guardian
Bant with their goldfishes can end a game quite fast IMO. RBW had 1 placing too. And remember the undefeated Naya Allies? That was pretty fast too.
The fact remains that with the current cards, we see SoW, Kargan Dragonlord as very good cards for the WW and Boros archetype. Not to mention the fact that the very presence of the Eldrazi Spawn means for me cards that will ramp up to the Eldrazi fast enough without dedicating that much to ramp. Emrakul's Hatcher is one IMO. So I think the meta will still be quite fast IMO.
@Heron: yes Kargon Dragonlord and SoW are good cards for those decks. How does that mean they are really fast? Also I don't understand why you would think guys that make 0/1 mana dork tokens would speed up a meta
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EllE:
Because she's the hero standard deserves, but not the one it needs right now... and so we'll chase her... because she can take it... because she's not a hero... she's a silent guardian
I can guarantee you that unless you're playing Emrakul a removal spell would be kept on hand for an eldrazi coming into play. Granted they are great cards but there are about a bazillion ways around them.
i would run less Kozilek, and more of one of the other 2.
have you considered playing around with the over grown battlements? maybe in place of the slimes, one in play is a nice wall or 1 mana, 2 in play is 4 mana. they seem very nice for what you're working at
@pobabylon: Yea that sounds interesting seeing as they are good blockers too. I will try to fit in overgrown battlements
@ Harbinger: Against white its true that unless i play emrakul i may have a problem, however if i play kozilek then i will be able to draw 4 and probably draw another. Not against white i am fine because ulamog is indestructible
@Stygian: I don't think you realize i have to hard cast the eldrazi for their abilities
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EllE:
Because she's the hero standard deserves, but not the one it needs right now... and so we'll chase her... because she can take it... because she's not a hero... she's a silent guardian
Not against white i am fine because ulamog is indestructible
i have to hard cast the eldrazi for their abilities
still have to be watchful of Path hitting ula tho, that's rough.
I agree with really wanting to keep Kozy and Ema harcasted because drawing 4 or taking an extra turn is beautiful. but imo, i wouldn't be too upset about being able to slide Ula into play and missing his destroy a perm. ability. sneaking a 10/10, Indestructable, Annih4 into play isn't bad a'tol. and for that matter, i think i'd be ok sneaking Ema into play for the 15/15 pro colored spells, flying, Annih6.
the uncounterable + extra turn makes hard casting Ema worth it, and with Kozy having no protection is too easy to be picked off to not want his hardcast, but i really like the idea of sneaking Ula.
@ pobayalon: Hmm ok, maybe take out a day of judgement and all is dust for two summoning trap?
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EllE:
Because she's the hero standard deserves, but not the one it needs right now... and so we'll chase her... because she can take it... because she's not a hero... she's a silent guardian
This is my approach I proxied to Eldrazi Ramp and I'm quite impressed how fast you can cast your Eldrazi dudes.
The deck is probably missing Nature's Spiral - Eternal Witness, how I miss you... Realms Uncharted with Nature's Spiral is a beast seeing as you can reliably hit Eldrazi Temple and Eye of Ugin. The tutor part of Eye is awesome: Lotus Cobra coupled with Khalni Heart Expedition grants you'll hit 7 mana soon.
Baneslayer and Stirring Wildwood are alternative win-cons I thought at first, but everytime I hit mana for Baneslayer, I want to cast an Eldrazi, so she's kinda out of place.
@Zahar: I believe the meta is going to slow down, just look at RoE. There are no incredibly fast cards. Level up is a slow mechanic and to be used will no doubt slow down standard somewhat. You cannot tell me that 248 cards won't do anything to standard. I would like to see where you are getting boros on the rise and white weenie on the rise.
Looking at recent tournament results in pro tour san diego, grand prix brussels, and grand prix kuala lumpur, white weenie and boros have a combined 2 placings, and neither have one. Oh and there are no vampires. So, you were saying? Jund isn't all that fast to a point where this deck can survive against with a sweep, and same goes with boss naya. Looking at top 8 at brussels which is the most recent standard tournament, there were 2 finest hour bants which is again pretty slow.
OK, maybe I skipped some steps of my rationale, so I'll explain my opinion...
You don't need new cards to keep Jund winning, you just need nothing to be AS GOOD as jund. And while jund don't seem to be receiving any impressive new card (other than, maybe, the new Sarkhan), it sure doesn't look to be receiving some HARDCORE hoser that will make it loose the crown either. So the speed will still be measured by Jund decks.
About Boros and WW, by "rising" I meant they seem to be the receiving end of some very good and solid upgrades. Student of warfare and Gideon, those cards point to probable better results for those decks. Since both decks are faster than jund, they seem to point to faster decks trying to take the crown, not slower ones.
So, why whould the meta be slower? People would simply put their decks aside because they had enought wins playing as jund and decide to try new and slower decks? Unless something better AND slower rises, nothing is gonna slow down. And my personal irony is that Summoning Trap ALONE makes any try to play blue denial even more useless than it already is with today's meta - the ONLY decks that could fear you will abuse your denial to kill you with some Eldrazi dude.
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Alea iacta est
I'm a Spike Vorthos - I love lore and flavor, but only if the cards are competition worthy.
@Zahar: Thanks for clarifying, i see what you are saying, right now all of this is on paper, so i will try to proxy and test
@Lockie: Your deck looks just fine however i often find lotus cobra to be auto removed and as such im trying to play the deck without mana dorks. I like how your deck puts good use to realms uncharted though.
Maybe i should post a mana dork version? It would have more targeted removal etc.
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EllE:
Because she's the hero standard deserves, but not the one it needs right now... and so we'll chase her... because she can take it... because she's not a hero... she's a silent guardian
@Lockie: Your deck looks just fine however i often find lotus cobra to be auto removed and as such im trying to play the deck without mana dorks. I like how your deck puts good use to realms uncharted though.
Maybe i should post a mana dork version? It would have more targeted removal etc.
If Cobra sticks then you can eaisily get an eldrazi turn 4-5, and if he doesn't... oh well! Thats one less removal that will kill Krozi. Honestly I believe you should try to find room for cobra in your deck, esp. with those Harrows in there.
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So how do we get them out? Ramp
Lookie here
Green Ramp:
4 Rampant Growth
4 Harrow
3 Acidic Slime
Eldrazi Spells
4 All is Dust
3 Kozilek
2 Ulamog
2 Emrakul
4 Everflowing Chalice
3 Explorers Map
4 Skittering Invasion
White Spells
4 Day of Judgement
Lands
1 Eye of Ugin
4 Eldrazi Temple
10 Forest
8 Plains
4 Angelsong
2 Fog
4 Oblivion Ring
2 Pithing Needle
1 Acidic Slime
2 Mold Shambler
This deck likes to ramp and kill. I think it could be tier 2 after RoE because it looks as if standars is going to slow down. This decks best match-ups seem to be midrange and post sideboard control. Comments plz
UPDATE: Manadorks Version
Green Ramp:
4 Overgrown Battlements
4 Joraga Treespeaker
4 Lotus Cobra
3 Realms Uncharted
Eldrazi Spells
3 Kozilek
2 Ulamog
2 Emrakul
Colorless Ramp
3 Everflowing Chalice
3 Explorers Map
3 Dreamstone Hedron
3 Oblivion Ring
3 Path To Exile
Lands
2 Eye of Ugin
4 Eldrazi Temple
4 Verdant Catacombs
1 Marsh Flats
6 Forest
4 Sunpetal Grove
3 Plains
4 Angelsong
4 Perimeter Captain
4 Acidic Slime
3 Dauntless Escort
EllE:
MTGO account name: FSM
MTGO rating: 1795
That makes sense heres a quick pro con list
Skittering Invasion
Pros
Give 5 mana to be used once
Gives 5 0/1 bodies that can chump
Cons:
0/1 bodies destroyed by mass removal (although that can be a pro due to them wasting such removal)
Costs 1 more (unless temple is out)
Used once and done
Dreamstone Hedron
Pros
1 less mana
Draws 3
Re-usable
Cons
only nets 3 mana
Can't chump block
Wow, in my head those are practically even. If you use invasion, it gives more mana, which is good because you really only need to play 1 eldrazi to win or start winning. But with Dreamstone hedron, you can keep an otherwise meh hand, such as 4 land, the hedron, a rampant growth, and a harrow. It could go either way.
EllE:
Could you explain why acidic slime is a bad choice?
I see it as a way to keep consistency and stall for ramp. Playing that on turn 4 is a good way to keep your opponent at bay. Play it, screw them of mana and take away a manland, plus they won't want to attack due to deathtouch
Also, the Eldrazi Siege gang commander is not good. You would rather run invasion or dreamstone hedron. Hedron is 1 more mana for same production of mana but consistently.
EllE:
its funny because you just made a horrible generalization. Ulamog is indestructible so terminate maelstrom pulse sucks on that, and emrakul has protection. So, there are 3 eldrazi that will die. However, drawing 4 cards and getting them to play a removal spell isn't that bad. Chances are that the 5 cards you draw (4 plus normal draw) will contain another fattie. Also this deck beats iona, due to colorless and sweeps
Edit: Looking at gp brussels top 8, jund runs an average of 5 thing that kill only kozilek. i run 7 eldrazi. The chances that i draw two eldrazi is more likely than them drawing two removal spells that deal with kozilek. Not to mention if they fizzle out from a bloodbraid when i don't have anything on the field
EllE:
I'm Da_Man on Cockatrice
All of those are sub optimal to iona when polymorphed except maybe emrakul. They need to be cast for their abilities to work.
However, this deck can beat iona i believe as i've said b4 due to the all is dust
EllE:
MTGO account name: FSM
MTGO rating: 1795
I frankly have no idea why people realy believe this "meta is gonna slow down" theory. Why is it? I can't see the signs...
Monowhite winnie decks are rising, boros decks are rising, vampires decks are already very strong, jund is not going anywhere - NO deck slower than Jund seem to be able to battle it anyway... and blue decks will have to eat summoning traps and eldrazis soon to make it even more ironic!
Ramp is a dangerous strategy. It can either win games fast or simply loose to itself, since it lacks the consistency of a "normal" curved deck. Ramp cards as topdecks or expensive spells at the start of a game happen a lot and are not pretty.
That said, I think it can be FUN and will make a casual eldrazi deck myself, but I'm going the monoblack (or G/B) route. If you want to go green, maybe the best way to do so is to try some Nissa Eldrazi variant and use those elves to play an Eldrazi or two you have in the middle of the deck just in case...
I'm a Spike Vorthos - I love lore and flavor, but only if the cards are competition worthy.
Looking at recent tournament results in pro tour san diego, grand prix brussels, and grand prix kuala lumpur, white weenie and boros have a combined 2 placings, and neither have one. Oh and there are no vampires. So, you were saying? Jund isn't all that fast to a point where this deck can survive against with a sweep, and same goes with boss naya. Looking at top 8 at brussels which is the most recent standard tournament, there were 2 finest hour bants which is again pretty slow.
EllE:
The fact remains that with the current cards, we see SoW, Kargan Dragonlord as very good cards for the WW and Boros archetype. Not to mention the fact that the very presence of the Eldrazi Spawn means for me cards that will ramp up to the Eldrazi fast enough without dedicating that much to ramp. Emrakul's Hatcher is one IMO. So I think the meta will still be quite fast IMO.
Currently playing:
T2
BW Aggro-Midrange BW
EllE:
have you considered playing around with the over grown battlements? maybe in place of the slimes, one in play is a nice wall or 1 mana, 2 in play is 4 mana. they seem very nice for what you're working at
@ Harbinger: Against white its true that unless i play emrakul i may have a problem, however if i play kozilek then i will be able to draw 4 and probably draw another. Not against white i am fine because ulamog is indestructible
@Stygian: I don't think you realize i have to hard cast the eldrazi for their abilities
EllE:
still have to be watchful of Path hitting ula tho, that's rough.
I agree with really wanting to keep Kozy and Ema harcasted because drawing 4 or taking an extra turn is beautiful. but imo, i wouldn't be too upset about being able to slide Ula into play and missing his destroy a perm. ability. sneaking a 10/10, Indestructable, Annih4 into play isn't bad a'tol. and for that matter, i think i'd be ok sneaking Ema into play for the 15/15 pro colored spells, flying, Annih6.
the uncounterable + extra turn makes hard casting Ema worth it, and with Kozy having no protection is too easy to be picked off to not want his hardcast, but i really like the idea of sneaking Ula.
EllE:
The deck is probably missing Nature's Spiral - Eternal Witness, how I miss you... Realms Uncharted with Nature's Spiral is a beast seeing as you can reliably hit Eldrazi Temple and Eye of Ugin. The tutor part of Eye is awesome: Lotus Cobra coupled with Khalni Heart Expedition grants you'll hit 7 mana soon.
Baneslayer and Stirring Wildwood are alternative win-cons I thought at first, but everytime I hit mana for Baneslayer, I want to cast an Eldrazi, so she's kinda out of place.
2 Plains
8 Forest
4 Misty Rainforest
4 Verdant Catacombs
4 Stirring Wildwood
4 Eldrazi Temple
2 Eye of Ugin
4 Baneslayer Angel
1 Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre
1 Kozilek, Butcher of Truth
4 Lotus Cobra
2 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
// Spells
3 Expedition Map
2 Skittering Invasion
2 All Is Dust
2 Oblivion Ring
4 Path to Exile
3 Realms Uncharted
4 Khalni Heart Expedition
My old nickname was lockheart87.
i'd like to know how that comes out in testing. I think running 6 sweepers instead of 8 is good too.
OK, maybe I skipped some steps of my rationale, so I'll explain my opinion...
You don't need new cards to keep Jund winning, you just need nothing to be AS GOOD as jund. And while jund don't seem to be receiving any impressive new card (other than, maybe, the new Sarkhan), it sure doesn't look to be receiving some HARDCORE hoser that will make it loose the crown either. So the speed will still be measured by Jund decks.
About Boros and WW, by "rising" I meant they seem to be the receiving end of some very good and solid upgrades. Student of warfare and Gideon, those cards point to probable better results for those decks. Since both decks are faster than jund, they seem to point to faster decks trying to take the crown, not slower ones.
So, why whould the meta be slower? People would simply put their decks aside because they had enought wins playing as jund and decide to try new and slower decks? Unless something better AND slower rises, nothing is gonna slow down. And my personal irony is that Summoning Trap ALONE makes any try to play blue denial even more useless than it already is with today's meta - the ONLY decks that could fear you will abuse your denial to kill you with some Eldrazi dude.
I'm a Spike Vorthos - I love lore and flavor, but only if the cards are competition worthy.
@Lockie: Your deck looks just fine however i often find lotus cobra to be auto removed and as such im trying to play the deck without mana dorks. I like how your deck puts good use to realms uncharted though.
Maybe i should post a mana dork version? It would have more targeted removal etc.
EllE:
If Cobra sticks then you can eaisily get an eldrazi turn 4-5, and if he doesn't... oh well! Thats one less removal that will kill Krozi. Honestly I believe you should try to find room for cobra in your deck, esp. with those Harrows in there.
About Mindslaver rulings: