With, so far, a lack of any counter spells that are actually worth worrying over, can these two protecting artifacts be played?
Cause I've thought about decks that are naming Ob Nixilis, the Fallen or World Queller their finishers but the only card I'm hearing about is Vines of Vastwood and that only works once and its color specific while these artifacts are not.
And I understand there mana costs and how Vines costs the least but in my opinion it does the least. What happens after you use that spell and only have the one in hand? They'll probably have enough removal to kill it next turn.
I might be wrong but I just want to know if these cards could actually see MD or at least SB potential.
Honestly, I don't think so, but it's far too early to say for sure.
There have only been a very small number of "buff" spells that have really mattered, and they normally matter more for making a bunch of reasonably costed creatures into something more significant (I'm thinking Armidillo Cloak, Rancor, Stonewood Invokation) But it's a new world and there's more removal then ever, so keeping things on the board may be a worthwile use of resources
I just feel that playing an instant speed 1 turn shroud isn't going to be as effective. At least with something like Whispersilk Cloak out, it can protect it from being targeted first and then applying Eldrazi can make your creatures evasive, unharmed by Day of Judgement, and a +1/+1 bonus.
As far as Whispersilk, equip it to creatures that you need to remain on the field no matter what like Baneslayer Angel or Ob Nixilis, the Fallen and other winning creatures and the like.
Monument wishes it were printed a few blocks back, when Bitterblossom would still be legal. without an efficient token generator (sorry, Goblin Assault is too slow) the Monument is more trouble than it's worth.
Take your monoblack deck, then set aside 14 swamps. Add 4 Creeping Tar Pits, 4 Darkslick Shores, 4 Drowned Catacombs, and 2 Jwar isle Refuge and add 4 Jace, the Mindsculptors. Your monoblack deck is instantly better. Better yet, drop those refuges, throw in some islands and some mana leaks, and lo and behold, you're now playing a real deck. Congratulations. Welcome to the world of competitive M:TG.
imo i think that the cloak does do enough it give you the evasion you need while protecting your creature from spot removal so it can stay beating later.
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I think it's foolish to assume that there's not going to be any more counterspells, or that Negate/Essence Scatter won't see some play.
Vines is very good, and will see play. It's a counterspell for a single green. Like people aren't going to play directed removal...
Whispersilk Cloak won't see constructed play. 5 mana is too much to give a guy shroud. Most often the guy will just die in response, meaning you've spent 5 mana to do nothing.
Eldrazi might see play. 5 mana and a dude a turn is kinda iffy. At least this will get all of your guys, will boost all of your guys, and help them get there. I wouldn't be too surprised to see some Master Transmuter tricks with this thing.
imo i think that the cloak does do enough it give you the evasion you need while protecting your creature from spot removal so it can stay beating later.
IMO, you're wrong. Cloak has been available for some time now and no one has played it. It is a complete waste of mana most of the time. Equip Rafiq with Cloak, sure, I'll path in response. Now you're down a creature and the mana used to play and equip cloak. Now that we have Wrath back, it gets even worse than before when it didn't see play.
Look I'm a control player and there better be a good counter spell out of Zendikar. In fact, I can safely say there will be.
But, with all of the ramping Zendikar brings, mana doesn't seem like it will be an issue for most decks. which is why it won't be impossible to see higher costing cards to see play when Zendikar comes out. And that's why I was asking if they were going to be playable options. At the least a SB spot.
Why ramp into a card that doesn't do anything without help?
Flying and indestructible more than make up for it, IMO.
If you're playing either, it's because you're going to have 4+ goblins in play. I'd rather swing for the win (or decimate their creatures) than swing for ~8 with evasion. At 5cc, you're not going to race the Day of Judgement, so the indestructible is less valuable I think.
Look I'm a control player and there better be a good counter spell out of Zendikar. In fact, I can safely say there will be.
But, with all of the ramping Zendikar brings, mana doesn't seem like it will be an issue for most decks. which is why it won't be impossible to see higher costing cards to see play when Zendikar comes out. And that's why I was asking if they were going to be playable options. At the least a SB spot.
the cloak isn't that great considering it doesn't do anything until you equip it, and that can be responded to with removal to make it a total wash.
the monument's mana cost isn't really the problem. it's the 'sacrifice a creature' clause that's the big deal.
Take your monoblack deck, then set aside 14 swamps. Add 4 Creeping Tar Pits, 4 Darkslick Shores, 4 Drowned Catacombs, and 2 Jwar isle Refuge and add 4 Jace, the Mindsculptors. Your monoblack deck is instantly better. Better yet, drop those refuges, throw in some islands and some mana leaks, and lo and behold, you're now playing a real deck. Congratulations. Welcome to the world of competitive M:TG.
I could see Eldrazi Monument getting played in some kind of Token generating deck. Sac a token to it's cost and the rest of your creatures are good to go.
In my kor deck i run eldrazi monument with con pledge. by the time the sacing really counts you should have killed them already. Whisper is also good.
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cards like: garruk, elspeth, goblin assault, and ant queen insure a somewhat steady sac fodder for the monument.
i know that the monument is good, but i feel it's not as good as most people think it is. i like the card, i like a lot of its interactions, but i just cannot see myself playing it.
+x per goblin instead of +(x-1)^2 per goblin for the same cost is better? Really?
The thing about Coat of Arms is that it gives its bonus to the entire battlefield rather than just your creatures, so your opponent can drop something like a Conqueror's Pledge out of nowhere and ruin you with it.
It has happened.
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Cause I've thought about decks that are naming Ob Nixilis, the Fallen or World Queller their finishers but the only card I'm hearing about is Vines of Vastwood and that only works once and its color specific while these artifacts are not.
And I understand there mana costs and how Vines costs the least but in my opinion it does the least. What happens after you use that spell and only have the one in hand? They'll probably have enough removal to kill it next turn.
I might be wrong but I just want to know if these cards could actually see MD or at least SB potential.
Thank you
There have only been a very small number of "buff" spells that have really mattered, and they normally matter more for making a bunch of reasonably costed creatures into something more significant (I'm thinking Armidillo Cloak, Rancor, Stonewood Invokation) But it's a new world and there's more removal then ever, so keeping things on the board may be a worthwile use of resources
in the dark we are blind
only with both can we truly see!
As far as Whispersilk, equip it to creatures that you need to remain on the field no matter what like Baneslayer Angel or Ob Nixilis, the Fallen and other winning creatures and the like.
in the dark we are blind
only with both can we truly see!
Vines is very good, and will see play. It's a counterspell for a single green. Like people aren't going to play directed removal...
Whispersilk Cloak won't see constructed play. 5 mana is too much to give a guy shroud. Most often the guy will just die in response, meaning you've spent 5 mana to do nothing.
Eldrazi might see play. 5 mana and a dude a turn is kinda iffy. At least this will get all of your guys, will boost all of your guys, and help them get there. I wouldn't be too surprised to see some Master Transmuter tricks with this thing.
IMO, you're wrong. Cloak has been available for some time now and no one has played it. It is a complete waste of mana most of the time. Equip Rafiq with Cloak, sure, I'll path in response. Now you're down a creature and the mana used to play and equip cloak. Now that we have Wrath back, it gets even worse than before when it didn't see play.
+x per goblin instead of +(x-1)^2 per goblin for the same cost is better? Really?
But, with all of the ramping Zendikar brings, mana doesn't seem like it will be an issue for most decks. which is why it won't be impossible to see higher costing cards to see play when Zendikar comes out. And that's why I was asking if they were going to be playable options. At the least a SB spot.
Flying and indestructible more than make up for it, IMO.
If you're playing either, it's because you're going to have 4+ goblins in play. I'd rather swing for the win (or decimate their creatures) than swing for ~8 with evasion. At 5cc, you're not going to race the Day of Judgement, so the indestructible is less valuable I think.
the cloak isn't that great considering it doesn't do anything until you equip it, and that can be responded to with removal to make it a total wash.
the monument's mana cost isn't really the problem. it's the 'sacrifice a creature' clause that's the big deal.
Also, it's great with Sprouting Thrinax.
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Currently playing:
Standard:
RWU Super Friends
R Devastaing Red
Extended:
RW Boros Deck Wins 0-0-0
Legacy:
Nothing
EDH:
UGR Intet, the Dreamer
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i know that the monument is good, but i feel it's not as good as most people think it is. i like the card, i like a lot of its interactions, but i just cannot see myself playing it.
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The thing about Coat of Arms is that it gives its bonus to the entire battlefield rather than just your creatures, so your opponent can drop something like a Conqueror's Pledge out of nowhere and ruin you with it.
It has happened.