So I saw silence when it was spoiled, and of course instantly thought "hmm why make a half Orim's Chant?" Then I'm reading a thread about M10 and see lots of people saying that Silence is the same or better in comparison to Chant...
How can this be?
The last time I played chant was when it was in standard(so like 30 years ago), but back then I rarely saw chant without kicker. So unless I'm missing something, the only advantage Silence could EVER have over Chant is in multiplayer correct?
So like I say I'm confused as to why I'm not hearing more "it's ok, but a half Chant" and less "its as good or better."
No silence is and always will be inferior to chant; chant can prevent them from attacking you. Silence can't. Chant does everything silence does and more the only reason it could be 'better' is because it is legal in formats where chant is illegal i.e. standard and extended.
Orim's Chant > Silence. End of story
Oh so chant targets...good god that is really situational. I don't really see that big a disadvantage to chant targeting whereas silence doesn't. Orim's Chant can still stop attackers which makes it better
No silence is and always will be inferior to chant; chant can prevent them from attacking you. Silence can't. Chant does everything silence does and more the only reason it could be 'better' is because it is legal in formats where chant is illegal i.e. standard and extended.
Orim's Chant > Silence. End of story
This simply is not true. If I were playing in the Eternal Formats, and I were running a "scepter chant" deck, I would sooner run Silence over Chant (possibly even both), not because of the Kicker (remember when you use the Scepter to cast Orim's Chant, you never get the kicker in the first place at least unless I am missing something). Thus unless you are wanting Orim's Chants 5-8, the Silence spell is in my opinion superior in that situation to the Chant, due to its ability to AVOID TARGETING!
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"As the size of an explosion increases, the number of social situations it is incapable of solving approaches zero." -- Varsuvius, Order of the Stick
In a dedicated White Blue Extended deck, you could give Silence Stick, and a No Stick in conjunction, with Meddling Mage to protect your investments.
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or things such as Misdirection or Swerve cards that would make Orim's Chant cringe big time.
Ok, so in reality runed halo is the only played card in standard that would make chant worse? I thought there was something I was missing with how the stack worked with the reminder text on silence, but I guess not.
Seems to me like chant is still pretty much 95% of the time better than silence... bummer.... why not reprint chant
or things such as Misdirection or Swerve cards that would make Orim's Chant cringe big time.
This simply is not true. If I were playing in the Eternal Formats, and I were running a "scepter chant" deck, I would sooner run Silence over Chant (possibly even both), not because of the Kicker (remember when you use the Scepter to cast Orim's Chant, you never get the kicker in the first place at least unless I am missing something). Thus unless you are wanting Orim's Chants 5-8, the Silence spell is in my opinion superior in that situation to the Chant, due to its ability to AVOID TARGETING!
OK maybe I should clarify. I'd really rather talk about the standard implications not other formats.
Ok, so in reality runed halo is the only played card in standard that would make chant worse? I thought there was something I was missing with how the stack worked with the reminder text on silence, but I guess not.
Seems to me like chant is still pretty much 95% of the time better than silence... bummer.... why not reprint chant
It's called a block mechanic. Kicker's not going to be in a Core set.
What we're doing here is akin to taking the text of Moby Dick, locating specific words therein, rearranging them to create a passage from Fight Club, and concluding from this evidence that Tyler Durden is based on Ahab.
The reason people are excited about Silence is simple: It will be in standard and Orim's Chant won't be.
Just because a card isn't as good as its predecessor doesn't mean it is bad. Don't tell me people wouldn't pay $40 for a card that said: UU
Instant
Draw 3 cards.
The reason people are excited about Silence is simple: It will be in standard and Orim's Chant won't be.
Just because a card isn't as good as its predecessor doesn't mean it is bad. Don't tell me people wouldn't pay $40 for a card that said: UU
Instant
Draw 3 cards.
they didn't pay 40 bucks for Ancestral Vision... so the only difference between that and the card you are proposing, is that the card you just proposed is an instant where as Vision was a sorcery that you had to wait 4 turns for.
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"As the size of an explosion increases, the number of social situations it is incapable of solving approaches zero." -- Varsuvius, Order of the Stick
they didn't pay 40 bucks for Ancestral Vision... so the only difference between that and the card you are proposing, is that the card you just proposed is an instant where as Vision was a sorcery that you had to wait 4 turns for.
I would gladly pay $40 for an Ancestral Recall, which is what he's referring to.
Some cards are worse than preceding cards. However, they can still be good cards, and great in newer formats.
I would gladly pay $40 for an Ancestral Recall, which is what he's referring to.
Some cards are worse than preceding cards. However, they can still be good cards, and great in newer formats.
if you didn't notice... so was I... the only version of Ancestral Recall you are likely to see in any form in any recent or future standard... was the card I mentioned. It was the definitive functional reprint of that card.
Silence on the other hand, is in some ways worse than Orim's Chant... due to it not having the kicker ability primarily. In other ways, it is primarily speaking a better card than Orim's Chant, primarily due to it not being a targeted spell the way Orim's Chant is, and the fact that it does not affect only ONE opponent, but ALL opponents.
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"As the size of an explosion increases, the number of social situations it is incapable of solving approaches zero." -- Varsuvius, Order of the Stick
A)Silence will be in standard & extended, Chant won't be.
B)People are probably going to buy playset to add to a white deck (Which means price will go up for it if its so HOT), while Chant won't be bought as much because most older players have a playset of it already and newer players usually want whats in good Standard.
C)If this was back when Dragonstorm or heck Faeires were trumping standard for instance it would have smoothed the format out quite a bit, can you imagine your opponent just getting stopped from winning because they weren't allowed to play that one spell that would probably have finished you off.
(Now this isn't to be rude, just looking at it from my view where Silence is mostly going to be used.)
if you didn't notice... so was I... the only version of Ancestral Recall you are likely to see in any form in any recent or future standard... was the card I mentioned. It was the definitive functional reprint of that card.
Silence on the other hand, is in some ways worse than Orim's Chant... due to it not having the kicker ability primarily. In other ways, it is primarily speaking a better card than Orim's Chant, primarily due to it not being a targeted spell the way Orim's Chant is, and the fact that it does not affect only ONE opponent, but ALL opponents.
Whoops, I misread the intent of your post.
Anyway, now that I know what you mean I can tell you I think you're wrong. ;P
Assuming the UU Recall was a rare, it would probably cost more than $40.
Vision is, what, a $5 card now, and it's not even standard? What was it back when it saw play in a number of blue decks in standard?
Concentrate is the more definitive functional reprint of Recall. And it saw some play.
My point in all this is my point said in my previous post. Your posts are just reiterating what everyone else said (that it's not as good as Chant... that much is clear) while seemingly disagreeing with Galspanic's post, when he was arguing that a strictly weaker card can still be good.
The title of the thread is "Explanation of Silence." Why do people think it's good? Because, though it's weaker than Chant, as original poster, you, and a few others have stated, that's not the entire point. It can be good anyway, thanks to the environment it is in.
they didn't pay 40 bucks for Ancestral Vision... so the only difference between that and the card you are proposing, is that the card you just proposed is an instant where as Vision was a sorcery that you had to wait 4 turns for.
You do understand there is a gigantic difference between paying UU and paying U and waiting 4 turns, right? I'm more just using Recall as an example of an older ridiculous card that could have it's power significantly cut and still be a bomb.
How can this be?
The last time I played chant was when it was in standard(so like 30 years ago), but back then I rarely saw chant without kicker. So unless I'm missing something, the only advantage Silence could EVER have over Chant is in multiplayer correct?
So like I say I'm confused as to why I'm not hearing more "it's ok, but a half Chant" and less "its as good or better."
Someone please explain the reasoning to me.
Orim's Chant > Silence. End of story
Oh so chant targets...good god that is really situational. I don't really see that big a disadvantage to chant targeting whereas silence doesn't. Orim's Chant can still stop attackers which makes it better
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or things such as Misdirection or Swerve cards that would make Orim's Chant cringe big time.
This simply is not true. If I were playing in the Eternal Formats, and I were running a "scepter chant" deck, I would sooner run Silence over Chant (possibly even both), not because of the Kicker (remember when you use the Scepter to cast Orim's Chant, you never get the kicker in the first place at least unless I am missing something). Thus unless you are wanting Orim's Chants 5-8, the Silence spell is in my opinion superior in that situation to the Chant, due to its ability to AVOID TARGETING!
In a dedicated White Blue Extended deck, you could give Silence Stick, and a No Stick in conjunction, with Meddling Mage to protect your investments.
The Merciless Lord of Torture, Permanently Bound To: ">[THE PACK] 11/5/63 - 11/25/09 Goodbye mom, i'll always love you...
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Ok, so in reality runed halo is the only played card in standard that would make chant worse? I thought there was something I was missing with how the stack worked with the reminder text on silence, but I guess not.
Seems to me like chant is still pretty much 95% of the time better than silence... bummer.... why not reprint chant
OK maybe I should clarify. I'd really rather talk about the standard implications not other formats.
It's called a block mechanic. Kicker's not going to be in a Core set.
Guildmaster Jarad
You can pay W when you play Orim's Chant from Isochron, because kicker is an additional cost.
Yes the above works
no
One word:multiplayer
though chant is better in "real" formats
Just because a card isn't as good as its predecessor doesn't mean it is bad. Don't tell me people wouldn't pay $40 for a card that said:
UU
Instant
Draw 3 cards.
WUBRGPauper Battle BoxWUBRG ... and why I am not a fan of Wayne Reynolds' Illustrations.
they didn't pay 40 bucks for Ancestral Vision... so the only difference between that and the card you are proposing, is that the card you just proposed is an instant where as Vision was a sorcery that you had to wait 4 turns for.
I would gladly pay $40 for an Ancestral Recall, which is what he's referring to.
Some cards are worse than preceding cards. However, they can still be good cards, and great in newer formats.
if you didn't notice... so was I... the only version of Ancestral Recall you are likely to see in any form in any recent or future standard... was the card I mentioned. It was the definitive functional reprint of that card.
Silence on the other hand, is in some ways worse than Orim's Chant... due to it not having the kicker ability primarily. In other ways, it is primarily speaking a better card than Orim's Chant, primarily due to it not being a targeted spell the way Orim's Chant is, and the fact that it does not affect only ONE opponent, but ALL opponents.
A) Silence will be in standard & extended, Chant won't be.
B) People are probably going to buy playset to add to a white deck (Which means price will go up for it if its so HOT), while Chant won't be bought as much because most older players have a playset of it already and newer players usually want whats in good Standard.
C) If this was back when Dragonstorm or heck Faeires were trumping standard for instance it would have smoothed the format out quite a bit, can you imagine your opponent just getting stopped from winning because they weren't allowed to play that one spell that would probably have finished you off.
(Now this isn't to be rude, just looking at it from my view where Silence is mostly going to be used.)
Whoops, I misread the intent of your post.
Anyway, now that I know what you mean I can tell you I think you're wrong. ;P
Assuming the UU Recall was a rare, it would probably cost more than $40.
Vision is, what, a $5 card now, and it's not even standard? What was it back when it saw play in a number of blue decks in standard?
Concentrate is the more definitive functional reprint of Recall. And it saw some play.
My point in all this is my point said in my previous post. Your posts are just reiterating what everyone else said (that it's not as good as Chant... that much is clear) while seemingly disagreeing with Galspanic's post, when he was arguing that a strictly weaker card can still be good.
The title of the thread is "Explanation of Silence." Why do people think it's good? Because, though it's weaker than Chant, as original poster, you, and a few others have stated, that's not the entire point. It can be good anyway, thanks to the environment it is in.
You do understand there is a gigantic difference between paying UU and paying U and waiting 4 turns, right? I'm more just using Recall as an example of an older ridiculous card that could have it's power significantly cut and still be a bomb.
WUBRGPauper Battle BoxWUBRG ... and why I am not a fan of Wayne Reynolds' Illustrations.