Service oh well I guess I have to get used to the new trend of “once per turn” with that said this is amazing with discard on the fly activated ability in play
downfall:… *huffs*
"Odric tried to fight the curse of the vampires while he could. However, in his life of fighting monsters, he could not avoid the fate of becomeing a monster himself"
My codulence's to Odric fans. He’s the vampire I knew it was him or Thalia for sure for that card.
but the card HOLY COW THEY DOWNSHIFTED IT TO UNCOMMON!
Odric is going to be one of the white vampire cards in set.
Hero's Downfall at uncommon is kind of surprising, but then actually makes sense when you consider we have been getting cards like Feed the Serpent at common recently.
I don't mind the "only once each turn" clause, never did really. It's a drawback that allows WotC to make powerful effects at a reasonably costed mana value while not degenerating the card into boring Solitaire combo material.
With that out of the way, Dreadful Service seems like hot garbage. It should either cost 1B or have a secondary enabler effect, something like "2, discard a card, target creature gets lifelink".
Hero's Downfall at uncommon is nice. As for the flavor text... with Thalia, Adeline and Odric all filling the "mono-W Cathar Human Legend" slot, I don't mind Odric shifting to a WB Vampire Legend from a mechanical standpoint, but I do hope they keep the character's integrity and be respectful to him from a flavor standpoint... *looks at Dack Fayden*
I don't mind the "only once each turn" clause, never did really. It's a drawback that allows WotC to make powerful effects at a reasonably costed mana value while not degenerating the card into boring Solitaire combo material.
With that out of the way, Dreadful Service seems like hot garbage. It should either cost 1B or have a secondary enabler effect, something like "2, discard a card, target creature gets lifelink".
Hero's Downfall at uncommon is nice. As for the flavor text... with Thalia, Adeline and Odric all filling the "mono-W Cathar Human Legend" slot, I don't mind Odric shifting to a WB Vampire Legend from a mechanical standpoint, but I do hope they keep the character's integrity and be respectful to him from a flavor standpoint... *looks at Dack Fayden*
MaRo has indicated there will be monowhite vampires in this set too so Odric seems like a strong candidate for that.
Every card with "triggers once each turn" is such a disappointment. I know it's to prevent them from being broken, but still... it just ends up being trash instead.
Odric as a vampire… well if we had got Thalia with a blessing of Sant Traft of some kind then we would have the Cathar(or Thraben) monster trio (Arlin, Odric, Thalia).
In another note: Glad they removed decayed from the zombie tokens, that enchantment looks at least playable without it.
Dreadful Service can be useful only really with Cryptbreaker, so at least you get 2 zombies per discard. Other than that, it becomes one of those "yes, I'll get that card but only so I can complete the set" cards.
Maro always talks about preventing feel-bad moments, but even when they're balanced power-wise, a lot of these "only once per turn" effects are such a letdown. You start reading the effect and get all excited because you get to do something literally every time something happens, but then you read the last line and it's "oh ... so whenever something happens ... but only once per turn." It's feel-bad incarnate, like opening a bag of chips and realizing the contents are 50% air.
In the debut after show (weekly mtg) Mark or Adam Prosak said that there will be legendary Vampires in all 2 color combination included in Mardu. We got multiple Rakdos versions with Anje and Olivia but are missing a Boros and Orzhov one. So I guess Odric will fill one of those. here is the youtube video.
Every card with "triggers once each turn" is such a disappointment. I know it's to prevent them from being broken, but still... it just ends up being trash instead.
It really needed an additional effect to like... idk, discsrd, draw for mana?
Poor a glass out for a fallen brother. Odric, Master Tactician was my finisher in the original Innistrad human deck and is one of my all time favourite cards.
I know this is incredibly unlikely but I'm really hoping that Odric continues to protect humans even after turning. I'm dreaming of an Odric vampire whose abilities offer support to humans rather than vampires.
This thread encapsulates the reason there's so much power creep in MtG. I'm not saying you guys are wrong--it would be more fun if you could figure out a way to dump your hand and just put like 10 power on board, but...why? This essentially gives you free 2/2s every turn, it's perfectly fine and powerful as is.
This thread encapsulates the reason there's so much power creep in MtG. I'm not saying you guys are wrong--it would be more fun if you could figure out a way to dump your hand and just put like 10 power on board, but...why? This essentially gives you free 2/2s every turn, it's perfectly fine and powerful as is.
If you can do that every turn, then sure. It's strong. Game winning? Possibly. Power creep? Not so much.
We saw a land a few years ago do what this thing does about 10x better. This is nowhere near power creep, unless you look at Zombie Infestation as something it may have crept over.
This thread encapsulates the reason there's so much power creep in MtG. I'm not saying you guys are wrong--it would be more fun if you could figure out a way to dump your hand and just put like 10 power on board, but...why? This essentially gives you free 2/2s every turn, it's perfectly fine and powerful as is.
If you can do that every turn, then sure. It's strong. Game winning? Possibly. Power creep? Not so much.
We saw a land a few years ago do what this thing does about 10x better. This is nowhere near power creep, unless you look at Zombie Infestation as something it may have crept over.
It's functionally closer to a twist on Bitterblossom than Zombie Infestation. And, as I recall that was quite strong. Now, I'm not saying that I agree with the power creep statement but I do think this is being hated on more than it should be.
[quote from="Dontrike »" url="/forums/magic-fundamentals/the-rumor-mill/824243-vow-dreadful-service-and-heros-downfall-reprint?comment=17"]
It's functionally closer to a twist on Bitterblossom than Zombie Infestation. And, as I recall that was quite strong. Now, I'm not saying that I agree with the power creep statement but I do think this is being hated on more than it should be.
Difference being BB allows you to continue to play the game as normal while it does its thing, this forces you to pitch everything to have similar effect. That and flying tends to mean more in the long run. Though where BB could be worse in multiples this gets better in multiples.
This card here isn't bad, but it's certainly not amazing (queue months later where this is the namesake card of a deck and I'm super duper wrong.)
This thread encapsulates the reason there's so much power creep in MtG. I'm not saying you guys are wrong--it would be more fun if you could figure out a way to dump your hand and just put like 10 power on board, but...why? This essentially gives you free 2/2s every turn, it's perfectly fine and powerful as is.
Compare to Drake Haven, a card that gives you tokens that are much more powerful due to being fliers, has better synergy with the set's mechanics since cycling can give you surprise blockers while Blood can't and has no restriction on how many you can make in one turn, and whose only drawback is paying a measly additional 1.
At 3 mana, this card is just not good, and it's not just the "only OPT" restriction that makes it crap. At 2 I could excuse it since it would curve well with Falkenrath Forebear or allow you to play it at turn 3 after Voldaren Bloodcaster and crack a Blood at the same turn. At 3 you need to make at least 2 Zombies to break even while also relying on outside synergy because by itself it's a do-nothing enchantment, which would be a great incentive to turn it into a build-around were it not for the fact you're hard-capped at one 2/2 per turn no matter how much discard outlets you have.
This thread encapsulates the reason there's so much power creep in MtG. I'm not saying you guys are wrong--it would be more fun if you could figure out a way to dump your hand and just put like 10 power on board, but...why? This essentially gives you free 2/2s every turn, it's perfectly fine and powerful as is.
Compare to Drake Haven, a card that gives you tokens that are much more powerful due to being fliers, has better synergy with the set's mechanics since cycling can give you surprise blockers while Blood can't
Blood can be used during your opponents turn as well and this card is active during opponents turns as well. The zombies this creates aren't decayed either. This can give you surprise blockers just as much as Drake Haven.
This thread encapsulates the reason there's so much power creep in MtG. I'm not saying you guys are wrong--it would be more fun if you could figure out a way to dump your hand and just put like 10 power on board, but...why? This essentially gives you free 2/2s every turn, it's perfectly fine and powerful as is.
Compare to Drake Haven, a card that gives you tokens that are much more powerful due to being fliers, has better synergy with the set's mechanics since cycling can give you surprise blockers while Blood can't
Blood can be used during your opponents turn as well and this card is active during opponents turns as well. The zombies this creates aren't decayed either. This can give you surprise blockers just as much as Drake Haven.
I don't think you know what "surprise" means. The Blood will be sitting on the field, as well as the open mana - your opponent will know exactly if and how much you have.
[quote from="Dontrike »" url="/forums/magic-fundamentals/the-rumor-mill/824243-vow-dreadful-service-and-heros-downfall-reprint?comment=17"]
It's functionally closer to a twist on Bitterblossom than Zombie Infestation. And, as I recall that was quite strong. Now, I'm not saying that I agree with the power creep statement but I do think this is being hated on more than it should be.
Difference being BB allows you to continue to play the game as normal while it does its thing, this forces you to pitch everything to have similar effect. That and flying tends to mean more in the long run. Though where BB could be worse in multiples this gets better in multiples.
This card here isn't bad, but it's certainly not amazing (queue months later where this is the namesake card of a deck and I'm super duper wrong.)
</blockquote>
I certainly don't think it's as good as BB, just that it's closer to BB than Zombie Infestation. As others have pointed out it's a good payoff for Blood and does give you 4 PT across 2 bodies per turn cycle. Which, isn't bad. I'd certainly take it in a draft of I was already high on Blood and maybe if I was playing enough flashback and blood I'd run it in constructed.
That being said, cycling will trigger this so Blood is only one possible direction to go.
I don't think you know what "surprise" means. The Blood will be sitting on the field, as well as the open mana - your opponent will know exactly if and how much you have.
And it was really surprising when the cycling deck had open mana and cycled on their turn?
I loved Drake Haven by the way, played the cycling control deck that whole standard. You very rarely made more than one Drake per turn cycle, especially since sometimes you actually needed to cast your cards with cycling. I think this is probably about as good as Drake Haven all things considered. I don't think it's a multi-format all-star but that was sort of my point--every rare doesn't need to be. This is potentially fine to good in Standard.
Not a huge fan of the comparison with Field of the Dead, because that card was and is total nonsense.
Lastly, to clarify--I'm not saying this card is an example of creep. I'm saying look what creep has done to people's expectations of what is "good." I'm seeing it everywhere on the forum on a number of cards, but only responded on this one.
I don't think you know what "surprise" means. The Blood will be sitting on the field, as well as the open mana - your opponent will know exactly if and how much you have.
And it was really surprising when the cycling deck had open mana and cycled on their turn?
Came here to say the same thing! Neither is the gold standard of "surprise" blockers, more like "potential on-board trick."
I loved Drake Haven by the way, played the cycling control deck that whole standard. You very rarely made more than one Drake per turn cycle, especially since sometimes you actually needed to cast your cards with cycling. I think this is probably about as good as Drake Haven all things considered. I don't think it's a multi-format all-star but that was sort of my point--every rare doesn't need to be. This is potentially fine to good in Standard.
Not a huge fan of the comparison with Field of the Dead, because that card was and is total nonsense.
Lastly, to clarify--I'm not saying this card is an example of creep. I'm saying look what creep has done to people's expectations of what is "good." I'm seeing it everywhere on the forum on a number of cards, but only responded on this one.
Yeah, the 1 mana cost with drake haven is as much of a limitation as "once per turn" in my mind - sometimes better, sometimes worse, but meaningful.
I think Dreadful Service is going to be pretty good. If you have a discard outlet / reason to discard anyway, it only has to trigger twice to do its job. The fact that the main vampire mechanic of the set gives you tokens that let you rummage is pretty compelling.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
Service oh well I guess I have to get used to the new trend of “once per turn” with that said this is amazing with discard on the fly activated ability in play
downfall:… *huffs*
My codulence's to Odric fans. He’s the vampire I knew it was him or Thalia for sure for that card.
but the card HOLY COW THEY DOWNSHIFTED IT TO UNCOMMON!
Hero's Downfall at uncommon is kind of surprising, but then actually makes sense when you consider we have been getting cards like Feed the Serpent at common recently.
RUNIN: Norse mythology set (awaiting further playtesting)
FATE of ALARA: Multicolour factions (currently on hiatus)
Contibutor to the Pyrulea community set
I'm here to tell you that all your set mechanics are bad
#Defundthepolice
With that out of the way, Dreadful Service seems like hot garbage. It should either cost 1B or have a secondary enabler effect, something like "2, discard a card, target creature gets lifelink".
Hero's Downfall at uncommon is nice. As for the flavor text... with Thalia, Adeline and Odric all filling the "mono-W Cathar Human Legend" slot, I don't mind Odric shifting to a WB Vampire Legend from a mechanical standpoint, but I do hope they keep the character's integrity and be respectful to him from a flavor standpoint... *looks at Dack Fayden*
MaRo has indicated there will be monowhite vampires in this set too so Odric seems like a strong candidate for that.
RUNIN: Norse mythology set (awaiting further playtesting)
FATE of ALARA: Multicolour factions (currently on hiatus)
Contibutor to the Pyrulea community set
I'm here to tell you that all your set mechanics are bad
#Defundthepolice
In another note: Glad they removed decayed from the zombie tokens, that enchantment looks at least playable without it.
ugh
|| UW Jace, Vyn's Prodigy UW || UG Kenessos, Priest of Thassa (feat. Arixmethes) UG ||
Cards I still want to see created:
|| Olantin, Lost City || Pavios and Thanasis || Choryu ||
It really needed an additional effect to like... idk, discsrd, draw for mana?
I know this is incredibly unlikely but I'm really hoping that Odric continues to protect humans even after turning. I'm dreaming of an Odric vampire whose abilities offer support to humans rather than vampires.
Modern: WRHumans aggroWR
If you can do that every turn, then sure. It's strong. Game winning? Possibly. Power creep? Not so much.
We saw a land a few years ago do what this thing does about 10x better. This is nowhere near power creep, unless you look at Zombie Infestation as something it may have crept over.
It's functionally closer to a twist on Bitterblossom than Zombie Infestation. And, as I recall that was quite strong. Now, I'm not saying that I agree with the power creep statement but I do think this is being hated on more than it should be.
Difference being BB allows you to continue to play the game as normal while it does its thing, this forces you to pitch everything to have similar effect. That and flying tends to mean more in the long run. Though where BB could be worse in multiples this gets better in multiples.
This card here isn't bad, but it's certainly not amazing (queue months later where this is the namesake card of a deck and I'm super duper wrong.)
At 3 mana, this card is just not good, and it's not just the "only OPT" restriction that makes it crap. At 2 I could excuse it since it would curve well with Falkenrath Forebear or allow you to play it at turn 3 after Voldaren Bloodcaster and crack a Blood at the same turn. At 3 you need to make at least 2 Zombies to break even while also relying on outside synergy because by itself it's a do-nothing enchantment, which would be a great incentive to turn it into a build-around were it not for the fact you're hard-capped at one 2/2 per turn no matter how much discard outlets you have.
Blood can be used during your opponents turn as well and this card is active during opponents turns as well. The zombies this creates aren't decayed either. This can give you surprise blockers just as much as Drake Haven.
RUNIN: Norse mythology set (awaiting further playtesting)
FATE of ALARA: Multicolour factions (currently on hiatus)
Contibutor to the Pyrulea community set
I'm here to tell you that all your set mechanics are bad
#Defundthepolice
I certainly don't think it's as good as BB, just that it's closer to BB than Zombie Infestation. As others have pointed out it's a good payoff for Blood and does give you 4 PT across 2 bodies per turn cycle. Which, isn't bad. I'd certainly take it in a draft of I was already high on Blood and maybe if I was playing enough flashback and blood I'd run it in constructed.
That being said, cycling will trigger this so Blood is only one possible direction to go.
And it was really surprising when the cycling deck had open mana and cycled on their turn?
I loved Drake Haven by the way, played the cycling control deck that whole standard. You very rarely made more than one Drake per turn cycle, especially since sometimes you actually needed to cast your cards with cycling. I think this is probably about as good as Drake Haven all things considered. I don't think it's a multi-format all-star but that was sort of my point--every rare doesn't need to be. This is potentially fine to good in Standard.
Not a huge fan of the comparison with Field of the Dead, because that card was and is total nonsense.
Lastly, to clarify--I'm not saying this card is an example of creep. I'm saying look what creep has done to people's expectations of what is "good." I'm seeing it everywhere on the forum on a number of cards, but only responded on this one.
Came here to say the same thing! Neither is the gold standard of "surprise" blockers, more like "potential on-board trick."
Yeah, the 1 mana cost with drake haven is as much of a limitation as "once per turn" in my mind - sometimes better, sometimes worse, but meaningful.
I think Dreadful Service is going to be pretty good. If you have a discard outlet / reason to discard anyway, it only has to trigger twice to do its job. The fact that the main vampire mechanic of the set gives you tokens that let you rummage is pretty compelling.