Based on the comments of this and of the lack of flying on Beholders, people are seeing one of the problems with crossovers. Meeting the proper expectation within the confines of another property is difficult at best.
Also, Wizards doing what they always do and overusing a concept until it's annoying. This has no business being a dinosaur. This is a beast - not every giant, somewhat lizard-like creature needs to be classified as a dinosaur (looks over at Ikoria glaringly). If everything is a dinosaur, then being a dinosaur is not special. If my Gishath deck ends up being filled with non-dinosaur, "dinosaurs" then it doesn't really feel right.
A pretty bad representation of what is supposed to be the big bad monster from D&D.
Its not even crazy big as a 10/10 and actually very easy to kill here.
This. they missed the boat on this one. When I'd rather play Carnage Tyrant over a Tarrasque, you know something is wrong.
SO far, not getting bundles on Arena or boxes live.
The Beholder doesn't fly or gain flying till EOT, doesn't use its eyestalks and this Tarrasque is extremely weak.
So far, Drizz't and the Sphere of Annihilation are the only decent crossovers.
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The "Crazy One", playing casual magic and occasionally dipping his toes into regular play since 1994.
Currently focusing on Pre-Modern (Mono-Black Discard Control) and Modern (Azorious Control, Temur Rhinos).
Find me at the Wizard's Tower in Ottawa every second Saturday afternoons.
Do beholders actually fly or just levitate a bit off the ground? Flying in Magic tends to imply being very high for evasive purposes. It doesn't seem to have any need to try and evade you. That just makes it harder to blast you with its eye powers. It also seems to do just fine with the eye stalks. It immobilizes you and causes you to act for it. From what I can see, it does quite well at representing a beholder just like Tarrasque does everything it's supposed to do. It just isn't as overpowered as some people want it to be so they can whine about it being overpowered later.
I mean Ward is a lovely mechanic... But there is so much wrong with this card.
First of indestructible, regeneration or some kind of recursion effect.
But also simple things like reach are missing. I mean in one iteration the Tarrasque forced pretty much everything on the ground that could fly you could literally not fly over that thing...
I mean I get the cast restriction, but that thing is currently not much better than a Gigantosaurus.
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It does regenerate and have resistance to dying based on being a Magic card. It has 10 toughness. That means unless it takes TEN damage this turn, it regenerates back to full health at the end of the turn. It "comes back" with full health. It also has psudo trample. It fights before combat, so even when, in all likelyhood, it kills whatever it fights it's still hitting for 10. As far as I can see, it manages to do everything it does in D&D lore and have text that fits on a Magic card. I've never played D&D but I know it has books. You can have a lot more abilities when a book describes them. This isn't an Egyptian God Card situation where they had too many abilties to accurately represent on a Yugioh card. I'm quite a fan of Tarrasque. It's big, splashy, and impressive, but not overpowered.
Believe me, there were ways of showing its abilities and fitting it on the card. Yes, it wasn't going to have everything the monster does in D&D, but this card is definitely missing at least a couple of aspects.
Do beholders actually fly or just levitate a bit off the ground? Flying in Magic tends to imply being very high for evasive purposes. It doesn't seem to have any need to try and evade you. That just makes it harder to blast you with its eye powers. It also seems to do just fine with the eye stalks. It immobilizes you and causes you to act for it. From what I can see, it does quite well at representing a beholder just like Tarrasque does everything it's supposed to do. It just isn't as overpowered as some people want it to be so they can whine about it being overpowered later.
Yes Beholders are ok without flying because of their “slow” levitate speed NO! The Tarrasque is not ok without some form of unlimited recursion (like returning to deck) and a way to trample over a bunch of creatures, even ones with deathtouch, fighting one is not ok, the sight of the tarrasque is the doom for towns, even with multiple people defending it. Not having trample and a way to return is just bad design and flavor(on the d20 set why not just make a “when tarrasque dies, instead of putting it into the graveyard roll a d20 and put it on top of its owner library beneath that many cards.”)
It could have a put it into library or even the Weatherseed Treefolk ability, but whatever you do is going to be wordy. It can also realistically only be so doomy. It has to be a reasonable card that doesn't just win the game on the spot when it resolves. Now, if the deathtouch is that big of an issue, it could have had bite instead of fight, but it doesn't need trample in addition to haste, ward, and fight. I think it's actually kind of similar to an eldrazi titan in design, although obviously not as powerful as the Emrakul the Aeons Torn card. That was way too much on the automatic win scale.
So... would've indestructible on this be too much? I mean it's EXTREMELY difficult to kill a Tarrasque, which is classically killed by putting it into a Bag of Holding, then putting that Bag of Holding into another Bag of Holding. These are pretty much invulnerable.
almost feels like a french vanilla in today's power creep, leaving me thinking this is kinda meh.
Also, having all of it's protections could've been represented with shroud of hexproof. I think the massive ward is just to push the new, possibly evergreen keyword.
You made a joke and didn't even realize it... The Tarrasque has it's origins in French gothic folklore. Read about it here:
Since it fights, yeah indestructible would be too much.
I mean i get its 9 mana, but a 10/10 that can kill virtually anything on attack and is basically immune to targeted removal is strong already. Making it so it survives every fight, and most boardwipes, is just absurd. Something would have to go
The tarrasque in 5th edition has no regeneration or immortality. It's actually a "vanilla" even in D&D. Maybe it's this latest version they used as inspiration?
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How i feel about competitive players and casual players in EDH: The competitive are german tourists, the casual are italian tourists, both in a italian beach. The italians asking themselves "why are the germans here?" make a legitimate question, the answer is because the beach is beautiful, no matter the country you came from. The italians wanting to ban the germans are dumb, because if the germans pay for their stay and follow the rules like everyone else, they have the right to be in the beach. Hovewer, if the germans started to ask themselves "why are the italians here?"... they would be dumb as hell.
The tarrasque in 5th edition has no regeneration or immortality. It's actually a "vanilla" even in D&D. Maybe it's this latest version they used as inspiration?
The mtg version is actually a very good representation of the 5E Tarrasque. The problem is that the 5E Tarrasque is essentially a pushover compared to previous versions. Not even a comment that the thing returns to the earth when defeated like in 4E... It just dies. How very bizarr.
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NO! The Tarrasque is not ok without some form of unlimited recursion (like returning to deck) and a way to trample over a bunch of creatures, even ones with deathtouch, fighting one is not ok, the sight of the tarrasque is the doom for towns, even with multiple people defending it. Not having trample and a way to return is just bad design and flavor(on the d20 set why not just make a “when tarrasque dies, instead of putting it into the graveyard roll a d20 and put it on top of its owner library beneath that many cards.”)
The other thing it's missing is its Frightful Presence being integrated in the card. I don't need trample, but Fear/Intimidate would make perfect sense on it.
The tarrasque in 5th edition has no regeneration or immortality. It's actually a "vanilla" even in D&D. Maybe it's this latest version they used as inspiration?
If so it's definitely a clash between the module showcases calling back to the 70s/80s while having the latest version of a monster for a version that hasn't been out a decade yet.
As was noted to MaRo on Blogatog, a reader posted "Another fun thing about Ward 10 is that Ward is actually harder to get around that hexproof right now. There are a number of ways of targeting creatures as though they did not have hexproof, but Ward 10 is, in a large number of cases, stronger than hexproof."
What scenarios is Ward 10 stronger than Hexproof? All I can think of is Arcane Lighthouse's activated ability. What else am I missing?
As was noted to MaRo on Blogatog, a reader posted "Another fun thing about Ward 10 is that Ward is actually harder to get around that hexproof right now. There are a number of ways of targeting creatures as though they did not have hexproof, but Ward 10 is, in a large number of cases, stronger than hexproof."
What scenarios is Ward 10 stronger than Hexproof? All I can think of is Arcane Lighthouse's activated ability. What else am I missing?
As was noted to MaRo on Blogatog, a reader posted "Another fun thing about Ward 10 is that Ward is actually harder to get around that hexproof right now. There are a number of ways of targeting creatures as though they did not have hexproof, but Ward 10 is, in a large number of cases, stronger than hexproof."
What scenarios is Ward 10 stronger than Hexproof? All I can think of is Arcane Lighthouse's activated ability. What else am I missing?
ward is better because hexproof can be removed with a few effects via shadowspear and Bonds of Mortality for example but ward is a cost and no way to turn it off for the moment so if the number or cost it high enough it gets per sudo hexproof that’s untouchable
but Really for this they really should have also throw in a way to get it out of the yard or a ability similar to regenerate
This is sad. It is far far behind the description in D&D. The whole point of this mythical monster is how hard is to kill it. I would remove the second ability and replace it with permanent Indestructible, and I would add "can't be sacrificed" to its "played" abilities. And even then it would be not a broken creature, merely decent, due it can be easily chumped... but at least, hard to kill.
Oh, no, no, no. This is not even close to the Eldrazi power level. Lets see:
Artisan of Kozilek - Uncommon, 9cc, 1U$.
First, it is colorless, so you can play it in any deck and it is easier to achieve 9 colorless mana and 6GGG (Tron, infinite colorless). Point for Artisan.
Annihilator 2 means you will take 2 perm AND 10 damage or another perm when it attacks. Tarrasque, in the best case, will kill 2 creatures. Card advantage for Artisan, but Tarrasque could point kill a key creature. Draw.
Both of them have some benefits from being casted. Tarrasque will hit the same turn, so if you kill it with a sorcery, you will be punished in 10 and 1 creature. Artisan will raise a creature, no matter the cost, so probably will target another fatty. The Ward 10 is great for Tarrasque too, but if it is countered, it will do nothing. Due counter spells are limited to 1 color, I will say this is point for Tarrasque (but just for a little bit).
In the end, The Tarrasque, the legendary, mythical rare (and the most powerful creature in its universe) is at par with an uncommon Eldrazi (and barely used in any deck). No, you dont want to pull this out of your boosters. And no, it does not represent the power level of its lore. As I said, even being indestructible and unsacrificable it would be barely playable.
Also, Wizards doing what they always do and overusing a concept until it's annoying. This has no business being a dinosaur. This is a beast - not every giant, somewhat lizard-like creature needs to be classified as a dinosaur (looks over at Ikoria glaringly). If everything is a dinosaur, then being a dinosaur is not special. If my Gishath deck ends up being filled with non-dinosaur, "dinosaurs" then it doesn't really feel right.
This. they missed the boat on this one. When I'd rather play Carnage Tyrant over a Tarrasque, you know something is wrong.
SO far, not getting bundles on Arena or boxes live.
The Beholder doesn't fly or gain flying till EOT, doesn't use its eyestalks and this Tarrasque is extremely weak.
So far, Drizz't and the Sphere of Annihilation are the only decent crossovers.
Currently focusing on Pre-Modern (Mono-Black Discard Control) and Modern (Azorious Control, Temur Rhinos).
Find me at the Wizard's Tower in Ottawa every second Saturday afternoons.
First of indestructible, regeneration or some kind of recursion effect.
But also simple things like reach are missing. I mean in one iteration the Tarrasque forced pretty much everything on the ground that could fly you could literally not fly over that thing...
I mean I get the cast restriction, but that thing is currently not much better than a Gigantosaurus.
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Believe me, there were ways of showing its abilities and fitting it on the card. Yes, it wasn't going to have everything the monster does in D&D, but this card is definitely missing at least a couple of aspects.
Yes Beholders are ok without flying because of their “slow” levitate speed
NO! The Tarrasque is not ok without some form of unlimited recursion (like returning to deck) and a way to trample over a bunch of creatures, even ones with deathtouch, fighting one is not ok, the sight of the tarrasque is the doom for towns, even with multiple people defending it. Not having trample and a way to return is just bad design and flavor(on the d20 set why not just make a “when tarrasque dies, instead of putting it into the graveyard roll a d20 and put it on top of its owner library beneath that many cards.”)
such a miss
Since it fights, yeah indestructible would be too much.
I mean i get its 9 mana, but a 10/10 that can kill virtually anything on attack and is basically immune to targeted removal is strong already. Making it so it survives every fight, and most boardwipes, is just absurd. Something would have to go
https://www.dndbeyond.com/monsters/tarrasque
The mtg version is actually a very good representation of the 5E Tarrasque. The problem is that the 5E Tarrasque is essentially a pushover compared to previous versions. Not even a comment that the thing returns to the earth when defeated like in 4E... It just dies. How very bizarr.
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Give a round of applause
For the great Miss Y!
Yes, but why would you ever ramp this out rather than Ugin or Emergent Ultimatum that just win the game?
This is just a bad card, ramp payoffs need to be better than mediocre creatures like this.
The other thing it's missing is its Frightful Presence being integrated in the card. I don't need trample, but Fear/Intimidate would make perfect sense on it.
If so it's definitely a clash between the module showcases calling back to the 70s/80s while having the latest version of a monster for a version that hasn't been out a decade yet.
What scenarios is Ward 10 stronger than Hexproof? All I can think of is Arcane Lighthouse's activated ability. What else am I missing?
Kaya, Bane of the Dead, Shadowspear, Detection Tower, Glaring Spotlight, Archetype of Endurance, Bonds of Mortality. The asker there did forget that cards that can't be countered can safely target ward permanents though.
ward is better because hexproof can be removed with a few effects via shadowspear and Bonds of Mortality for example but ward is a cost and no way to turn it off for the moment so if the number or cost it high enough it gets per sudo hexproof that’s untouchable
but Really for this they really should have also throw in a way to get it out of the yard or a ability similar to regenerate
Frightful Presence- Tarrasque can’t be blocked by creatures with power 2 or less.
Wondering how one could Bar the Gate for the Tarrasque...
Artisan of Kozilek - Uncommon, 9cc, 1U$.
First, it is colorless, so you can play it in any deck and it is easier to achieve 9 colorless mana and 6GGG (Tron, infinite colorless). Point for Artisan.
Annihilator 2 means you will take 2 perm AND 10 damage or another perm when it attacks. Tarrasque, in the best case, will kill 2 creatures. Card advantage for Artisan, but Tarrasque could point kill a key creature. Draw.
Both of them have some benefits from being casted. Tarrasque will hit the same turn, so if you kill it with a sorcery, you will be punished in 10 and 1 creature. Artisan will raise a creature, no matter the cost, so probably will target another fatty. The Ward 10 is great for Tarrasque too, but if it is countered, it will do nothing. Due counter spells are limited to 1 color, I will say this is point for Tarrasque (but just for a little bit).
In the end, The Tarrasque, the legendary, mythical rare (and the most powerful creature in its universe) is at par with an uncommon Eldrazi (and barely used in any deck). No, you dont want to pull this out of your boosters. And no, it does not represent the power level of its lore. As I said, even being indestructible and unsacrificable it would be barely playable.