Lurrus of the Dream-Den is unbanned. (clearly the nerf in companion made lurrus unbannable in vintage)
oh one more thing
they are changing the rules of cascade
CASCADE RULES CHANGE
(Provided by Magic rules manager Jess Dunks.)
Modal double-faced cards were designed to allow both faces to be playable in all situations. For example, if an effect lets you cast spells from the graveyard, players expect to be able to cast either face. Feedback has shown us, however, that in situations where certain criteria are mentioned, being able to play or cast the back face when it doesn't meet those criteria is not intuitive. This confusion, plus being allowed to cast spells without paying their mana costs that you shouldn't be able to, makes cascade an issue.
As a result, we're tweaking cascade such that the spell you cast off the triggered ability must also have lesser converted mana cost than the spell with cascade.
Here is the new cascade rule:
702.84a. Cascade is a triggered ability that functions only while the spell with cascade is on the stack. "Cascade" means "When you cast this spell, exile cards from the top of your library until you exile a nonland card whose converted mana cost is less than this spell's converted mana cost. You may cast that spell without paying its mana cost if its converted mana cost is less than this spell's converted mana cost. Then put all cards exiled this way that weren't cast on the bottom of your library in a random order."
For example, if you cast Bloodbraid Elf and exile Valki, God of Lies from your library, you'll be able to cast Valki but not Tibalt, Cosmic Impostor. On the other hand, if you exile Cosima, God of the Voyage, you may cast either Cosima or The Omenkeel, as each face has a lesser converted mana cost than Bloodbraid Elf.
This change isn't limited to double-faced cards. It also changes the way cascade works with anything that has a "dominant" set of characteristics, like the Adventurer cards from Throne of Eldraine. For example, if Bloodbraid Elf causes you to exile Fae of Wishes, you may cast Fae of Wishes, but you may not cast Granted.
Finally, the interaction between split cards and cascade is unchanged; the converted mana cost of a split card is the total converted mana cost of its halves. If you cascade into a split card with lesser converted mana cost than the spell with cascade (remember, count both halves), you may cast either half without paying its mana cost.
long story short Tibalt, Cosmic Impostor can't be cheated by cascade anymore same goes for adventure cards but split cards are no different
Oops all Spells decks, it sounds like. They weren't having a huge win percentage or share of the metagame but they were hard to interact with and essentially contributed to unfun non-games, which wizards wanted to reduce.
Remember, all of the changes that Wizards made today were made with the intention of increasing FUN!
But beside that, basically all cards that are on the "*****-list" of many people that actually play the formats.
So back to the old class of decks that dominated before these where released.
----
Crushing the value of Valki might put just another nail in the financial value of Kaldheim.
The card basically carried the entire set and will probably plummet like a dead bird out of the sky.
But beside that, basically all cards that are on the "*****-list" of many people that actually play the formats.
So back to the old class of decks that dominated before these where released.
----
Crushing the value of Valki might put just another nail in the financial value of Kaldheim.
The card basically carried the entire set and will probably plummet like a dead bird out of the sky.
In all honestly i m kinda sad they banned tibalt's trickery instead of big ol Emrakul from modern. The deck made other decks run more interaction (vs creatures and others) but a BigRakul makes 80% of instant speed interaction inrelevant. Would have liked if the version with lots of cascade spells to stick around.
For cascade: unessessary change, i mean, don't print Modal DFCs that have a side costing 2 or less while the other costs lots of mana, if they want to make the other side cheaper just make a "this spell costs 1-2-3-idk less if you don't control the other side" type of ability.
Valki was the kind of card you could sell a set of 4 very easily, 20$ a pop.
Thats not true for the EDH cards, as people either just need 1 at all, and most likely opt for the pimpest version they like (so cards that are not in a regular booster pack to begin with, so another shift to collectors packs).
----
The estimated value of kaldheim booster boxes (~50$) was already incredible low, with a 20$ Valki in the list.
Arcanist in legacy was insane! Much stronger than snapcaster since it's repeatable and cast things for free! No surprise it's gone.
this is not exactly true....
yes, the card is strong, but it's an engine, while Snapcaster is just a tool
snapcaster having flash is pretty crazy, as he transforms your entire graveyard into a toolbox at instant speed, while Arcanist must already be on the battlefield and needs to attack so he can cast something, you can actually see him coming.
that said, yes.... Arcanist is very, very strong.
T1: thoughtseize, take out the answer.
T2: Arcanist
T3: The Royal Scions
can very well take over tha game just like that, but I'm still not sure that this was so much stronger than other stuff that's already pretty unfair in legacy to warrant that ban.
Arcanist in legacy was insane! Much stronger than snapcaster since it's repeatable and cast things for free! No surprise it's gone.
this is not exactly true....
yes, the card is strong, but it's an engine, while Snapcaster is just a tool
snapcaster having flash is pretty crazy, as he transforms your entire graveyard into a toolbox at instant speed, while Arcanist must already be on the battlefield and needs to attack so he can cast something, you can actually see him coming.
that said, yes.... Arcanist is very, very strong.
T1: thoughtseize, take out the answer.
T2: Arcanist
T3: The Royal Scions
can very well take over tha game just like that, but I'm still not sure that this was so much stronger than other stuff that's already pretty unfair in legacy to warrant that ban.
Snapcaster can turn your graveyard into a toolbox at instant speed, but Arcanist can turn it into a toolbox for the rest of the game.
The problem with defining this format by what is "fun" is that everyone seems to define fun as what they don't lose to. If you keep losing to easily answered cards, that means you should improve your deck. If you don't want to improve your deck, then you should come to peace with the idea that you are going to lose because you chose to not interact with better strategies.
Arcanist in legacy was insane! Much stronger than snapcaster since it's repeatable and cast things for free! No surprise it's gone.
this is not exactly true....
yes, the card is strong, but it's an engine, while Snapcaster is just a tool
snapcaster having flash is pretty crazy, as he transforms your entire graveyard into a toolbox at instant speed, while Arcanist must already be on the battlefield and needs to attack so he can cast something, you can actually see him coming.
that said, yes.... Arcanist is very, very strong.
T1: thoughtseize, take out the answer.
T2: Arcanist
T3: The Royal Scions
can very well take over tha game just like that, but I'm still not sure that this was so much stronger than other stuff that's already pretty unfair in legacy to warrant that ban.
Snapcaster can turn your graveyard into a toolbox at instant speed, but Arcanist can turn it into a toolbox for the rest of the game.
kinda....
he's slower, easier to see coming, also not hard to kill.
when he works, he's a powerhouse and will generate tons of card advantage.
but a lot of boardstates will stonewall him.
also, everyone packs a ton of removal in legacy.
not saying the card is bad, but I completely disagree with the statement "Stronger than Snapcaster", he's a completely different card for a completely different deck.
even if you end up playing both in the same deck, they will have vastly different functions.
one is a proactive play, the other one is a reactive play, it's kinda like saying that "counterspell is better than Maelstrom Pulse" or sonething in those lines.
The fact that they fixed cascade holds zero surprise. People who speculated on Valki got what they deserved, it was a very stupid loophole.
and a loophole they had already fixed for split cards....
so, really, no idea why that even saw the light of day.
I was very surprised to see that there was no change to cascade rules in the rules primer for Kaldheim.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
not just Uro, Titan of Nature's Wrath.
its a stampede of banned cards
Historic:
Omnath, Locus of Creation is banned (from suspended).
Uro, Titan of Nature's Wrath is banned.
Pioneer:
Balustrade Spy is banned.
Teferi, Time Raveler is banned.
Undercity Informer is banned.
Uro, Titan of Nature's Wrath is banned.
Wilderness Reclamation is banned.
Modern:
Field of the Dead is banned.
Mystic Sanctuary is banned.
Simian Spirit Guide is banned.
Tibalt's Trickery is banned.
Uro, Titan of Nature's Wrath is banned.
Legacy:
Arcum's Astrolabe is banned.
Dreadhorde Arcanist is banned.
Oko, Thief of Crowns is banned. (OMG HES BANNED FROM EVERYTHING NOW!)
Vintage:
Lurrus of the Dream-Den is unbanned. (clearly the nerf in companion made lurrus unbannable in vintage)
oh one more thing
they are changing the rules of cascade
CASCADE RULES CHANGE
(Provided by Magic rules manager Jess Dunks.)
Modal double-faced cards were designed to allow both faces to be playable in all situations. For example, if an effect lets you cast spells from the graveyard, players expect to be able to cast either face. Feedback has shown us, however, that in situations where certain criteria are mentioned, being able to play or cast the back face when it doesn't meet those criteria is not intuitive. This confusion, plus being allowed to cast spells without paying their mana costs that you shouldn't be able to, makes cascade an issue.
As a result, we're tweaking cascade such that the spell you cast off the triggered ability must also have lesser converted mana cost than the spell with cascade.
Here is the new cascade rule:
702.84a. Cascade is a triggered ability that functions only while the spell with cascade is on the stack. "Cascade" means "When you cast this spell, exile cards from the top of your library until you exile a nonland card whose converted mana cost is less than this spell's converted mana cost. You may cast that spell without paying its mana cost if its converted mana cost is less than this spell's converted mana cost. Then put all cards exiled this way that weren't cast on the bottom of your library in a random order."
For example, if you cast Bloodbraid Elf and exile Valki, God of Lies from your library, you'll be able to cast Valki but not Tibalt, Cosmic Impostor. On the other hand, if you exile Cosima, God of the Voyage, you may cast either Cosima or The Omenkeel, as each face has a lesser converted mana cost than Bloodbraid Elf.
This change isn't limited to double-faced cards. It also changes the way cascade works with anything that has a "dominant" set of characteristics, like the Adventurer cards from Throne of Eldraine. For example, if Bloodbraid Elf causes you to exile Fae of Wishes, you may cast Fae of Wishes, but you may not cast Granted.
Finally, the interaction between split cards and cascade is unchanged; the converted mana cost of a split card is the total converted mana cost of its halves. If you cascade into a split card with lesser converted mana cost than the spell with cascade (remember, count both halves), you may cast either half without paying its mana cost.
long story short Tibalt, Cosmic Impostor can't be cheated by cascade anymore same goes for adventure cards but split cards are no different
Been on this forum for 10++ years
Playing since '94
Oops all Spells decks, it sounds like. They weren't having a huge win percentage or share of the metagame but they were hard to interact with and essentially contributed to unfun non-games, which wizards wanted to reduce.
Remember, all of the changes that Wizards made today were made with the intention of increasing FUN!
But beside that, basically all cards that are on the "*****-list" of many people that actually play the formats.
So back to the old class of decks that dominated before these where released.
----
Crushing the value of Valki might put just another nail in the financial value of Kaldheim.
The card basically carried the entire set and will probably plummet like a dead bird out of the sky.
WUBRG#BlackLotusMatterWUBRG
👮👮👮 #BlueLivesMatter 👮👮👮
while I do agree but one little problem
what about Vorinclex, Monstrous Raider and Koma, Cosmos Serpent and maybe Orvar, the All-Form
Uro might be following soon. and I bet it's just a question of when.... hahaha
Dreadhorde Arcanist in legacy seems very surprising.
wonder the next insta ban in 5 formats card
In all honestly i m kinda sad they banned tibalt's trickery instead of big ol Emrakul from modern. The deck made other decks run more interaction (vs creatures and others) but a BigRakul makes 80% of instant speed interaction inrelevant. Would have liked if the version with lots of cascade spells to stick around.
For cascade: unessessary change, i mean, don't print Modal DFCs that have a side costing 2 or less while the other costs lots of mana, if they want to make the other side cheaper just make a "this spell costs 1-2-3-idk less if you don't control the other side" type of ability.
Stryxhaven lets go for more MDFC...
Modern:
Valki was the kind of card you could sell a set of 4 very easily, 20$ a pop.
Thats not true for the EDH cards, as people either just need 1 at all, and most likely opt for the pimpest version they like (so cards that are not in a regular booster pack to begin with, so another shift to collectors packs).
----
The estimated value of kaldheim booster boxes (~50$) was already incredible low, with a 20$ Valki in the list.
WUBRG#BlackLotusMatterWUBRG
👮👮👮 #BlueLivesMatter 👮👮👮
this is not exactly true....
yes, the card is strong, but it's an engine, while Snapcaster is just a tool
snapcaster having flash is pretty crazy, as he transforms your entire graveyard into a toolbox at instant speed, while Arcanist must already be on the battlefield and needs to attack so he can cast something, you can actually see him coming.
that said, yes.... Arcanist is very, very strong.
T1: thoughtseize, take out the answer.
T2: Arcanist
T3: The Royal Scions
can very well take over tha game just like that, but I'm still not sure that this was so much stronger than other stuff that's already pretty unfair in legacy to warrant that ban.
But dang...that's a huge banning itinerary. I don't ever recall having seen such a prolific or populated banning to this degree.
'buster
HR Analyst. Gamer. Activist | Fearless, and forthright | Aggro-control is a mindset.
Elspeth and Jhoira rock my world.
it should be at the very least slowing down "Oops all spells" and stuff like this.
Turn 1
1) Exile SSG. Cast Wild Cantor
2) Play Swamp
3) Sacrifice Wild Cantor for B. Tap Swamp (BB in mana pool
4) Cast two Bone Pickers.
You're basically getting a "free" mana without paying anything for it. Makes sense but still...
'buster
HR Analyst. Gamer. Activist | Fearless, and forthright | Aggro-control is a mindset.
Elspeth and Jhoira rock my world.
OH COME ON!!
I just realized Thassa's Oracle dodged the bullet...AGAIN
ban it not the enablers
Snapcaster can turn your graveyard into a toolbox at instant speed, but Arcanist can turn it into a toolbox for the rest of the game.
Ugh just ban Oko in Commander.
|| UW Jace, Vyn's Prodigy UW || UG Kenessos, Priest of Thassa (feat. Arixmethes) UG ||
Cards I still want to see created:
|| Olantin, Lost City || Pavios and Thanasis || Choryu ||
kinda....
he's slower, easier to see coming, also not hard to kill.
when he works, he's a powerhouse and will generate tons of card advantage.
but a lot of boardstates will stonewall him.
also, everyone packs a ton of removal in legacy.
not saying the card is bad, but I completely disagree with the statement "Stronger than Snapcaster", he's a completely different card for a completely different deck.
even if you end up playing both in the same deck, they will have vastly different functions.
one is a proactive play, the other one is a reactive play, it's kinda like saying that "counterspell is better than Maelstrom Pulse" or sonething in those lines.
and a loophole they had already fixed for split cards....
so, really, no idea why that even saw the light of day.
I was very surprised to see that there was no change to cascade rules in the rules primer for Kaldheim.