Sorcery
All White creatures in play are destroyed.
Would that apply as well?
Technically yes, although the connotation of ethnic cleansing of white people is mostly not about the Whiteness but about the subgroups "Jews, Armenians, Slavic..." but since there are examples of white cleansing like Haiti or the congo. It still is problematic.
But ultimately intend is all that matters not the words you use.
For Personal conversation or something like that I fully agree. Public use as in a company or people in the public eye there needs to be context to make it ok. As public things normalize things like that.
I've been desensitized to it (by my own white Grandma no less) but we have the n- word too and we use it colloqually for stuff (Like Chocolate-coated marshmallow treats/Schaumkuss)
Sorcery
All White creatures in play are destroyed.
Would that apply as well?
Technically yes, although the connotation of ethnic cleansing of white people is mostly not about the Whiteness but about the subgroups "Jews, Armenians, Slavic..." but since there are examples of white cleansing like Haiti or the congo. It still is problematic.
Thats good to hear that it would apply the same. Should we be moving from mono-color board wipes?
Sorcery
All White creatures in play are destroyed.
Would that apply as well?
Technically yes, although the connotation of ethnic cleansing of white people is mostly not about the Whiteness but about the subgroups "Jews, Armenians, Slavic..." but since there are examples of white cleansing like Haiti or the congo. It still is problematic.
Haiti no longer has indigenous culture because sadly the Taíno were completely wiped out by Europeans in the 16th century.
Thats good to hear that it would apply the same. Should we be moving from mono-color board wipes?
It seems you missed the point. Context.
Mono-Color board wipes are fine like Virtue's Ruin, or Major Teroh is also fine because there is no bad connotation
at this point all kinds of innocent acts are labeled racist, so that normal interaction cannot happen.
If someone will blame and claim the superior against you all the time, you are faced with resistance and oppression.
If someone plays Invoke Prejudice and is for that reason alone labeled a racist, then you fail to use the word properly.
It has nothing to do with racism to play that card, and its absolutely damaging and downright destructive to make anything a race topic.
Plenty of LGS and people come together and play a card game, we have fun and its welcoming.
If someone out of the blue suddenly blames people to be racist , which they absolutely are not, how is that doing anything good for the store or the community ?
It divides them, it produces actual real hate and it splits the community so deeply, that nothing positive will come out of that.
----
Being hyper sensitive to pseudo insults is only making matters worse.
Joking around in a community is absolutely normal and healthy, and nobody is superior to anybody else.
People that just claim victim status and use that as a weapon to literally destroy a community do nothing good, they are the doom of a store and kill the game in their area.
Its not helping anybody, if at all, people need to be lifted above a victim status and become part of a community, equal to each other and free of racist thoughts and blame, as a community that is based on blaming each other is just hateful and claims to do good, while burning everything down.
----
This entire show that is currently going on and years before it is not helping anybody, it just fuels the resistance and produces real hate and racism, which is many times worse than it was to begin with.
Banning these cards is not doing anything good.
Its pandering to a current very disturbing trend and removing it later will further fuel the hate, so its questionable if people are even allowed to talk about anything anymore, as anything could suddenly be labeled racist or otherwise hateful, by someone that just wants to stir up some hate, for whatever reasons.
Not everyone needs to like or be ok with everything, you can blame and dislike a lot of things, but you dont BAN stuff for that, if you can have a much more healthy discussion about a topic and allow that to happen.
Countless groups world wide will have no problem at all with these cards, but "some" people do.
That is also true for lots of other cards, and its completely unreasonable to ban all of them, as some individual might find them offensive, no matter what, any card will in some way potentially be offensive to somebody on this planet.
Even different countries in the world have very different views of what is offensive and what is not, even make stuff illegal.
- China does not allow human skulls, so all the art is changed that has them, its a lot of art that is different just for China.
- Removing religious symbols from cards was to pander to the christian fanatics.
- Removing sexy depictions of women was to please the SJW movement.
- The diversity train is currently plowing through the art of Magic.
- More characters and art had to be forced into the game to please the LGBT* crowd.
All kinds of stuff is to please some group, but non outright BANNED cards to get to their goal.
To truly help someone that is actively discriminated, any means are reasonable.
But to claim and blame all the people as racists and instigate a fight between them, is just fueling the hate, which very visible results in aggressions, destruction, blood and death ; nobody can want that, and still they push it to that level, blind to what they do.
----
People so easily become the racist they blame to fight against.
And the mob eats its own.
I honestly fear that this is exacly what is happening. Before this I didn't know that rock-throwing devils was a slur against Arabs. Now my racist vocabulary has increased and I don't think that is a good thing at all.
It is a good thing to be aware of, because it means you are educated on something not to say and you can identify someone else's intentions if they say it.
These responses honestly confuse me.
Did you really need to be educated to not insult other people beyond your preteen years?
I can't think of any contect in which rock-throwing devil might have a positive connotation and I am just avoided a big social landmine by being aware that this is indeed an insult in certain cultuals.
It is already an insult in my culture which is why I wouldn't have said it and also would have called people out for insulting others.
Literally the only people who learned something "useful" from knowing this are people who intend to use this insult.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Drop your knees to the floor
Hands to the sky
Give a round of applause
For the great Miss Y!
I honestly fear that this is exacly what is happening. Before this I didn't know that rock-throwing devils was a slur against Arabs. Now my racist vocabulary has increased and I don't think that is a good thing at all.
It is a good thing to be aware of, because it means you are educated on something not to say and you can identify someone else's intentions if they say it.
These responses honestly confuse me.
Did you really need to be educated to not insult other people beyond your preteen years?
I can't think of any contect in which rock-throwing devil might have a positive connotation and I am just avoided a big social landmine by being aware that this is indeed an insult in certain cultuals.
It is already an insult in my culture which is why I wouldn't have said it and also would have called people out for insulting others.
Literally the only people who learned something "useful" from knowing this are people who intend to use this insult.
While it may not have been a phrase you were planning to use yourself, it's quite likely that before this you would have thought little of someone using it as a "generic" insult. Now you know that it has particularly bad connotations for a particular group of people.
I honestly fear that this is exacly what is happening. Before this I didn't know that rock-throwing devils was a slur against Arabs. Now my racist vocabulary has increased and I don't think that is a good thing at all.
It is a good thing to be aware of, because it means you are educated on something not to say and you can identify someone else's intentions if they say it.
These responses honestly confuse me.
Did you really need to be educated to not insult other people beyond your preteen years?
I can't think of any contect in which rock-throwing devil might have a positive connotation and I am just avoided a big social landmine by being aware that this is indeed an insult in certain cultuals.
It is already an insult in my culture which is why I wouldn't have said it and also would have called people out for insulting others.
Literally the only people who learned something "useful" from knowing this are people who intend to use this insult.
I disagree with this. I understand the phrase with no intentions of using it to describe an individual or group, but being able to identify the connotations beyond "its an insult" means that if I hear it used in someone else's conversation I can make a better judgement about how to interact or not with that person.
I honestly fear that this is exacly what is happening. Before this I didn't know that rock-throwing devils was a slur against Arabs. Now my racist vocabulary has increased and I don't think that is a good thing at all.
It is a good thing to be aware of, because it means you are educated on something not to say and you can identify someone else's intentions if they say it.
These responses honestly confuse me.
Did you really need to be educated to not insult other people beyond your preteen years?
I can't think of any contect in which rock-throwing devil might have a positive connotation and I am just avoided a big social landmine by being aware that this is indeed an insult in certain cultuals.
It is already an insult in my culture which is why I wouldn't have said it and also would have called people out for insulting others.
Literally the only people who learned something "useful" from knowing this are people who intend to use this insult.
While it may not have been a phrase you were planning to use yourself, it's quite likely that before this you would have thought little of someone using it as a "generic" insult. Now you know that it has particularly bad connotations for a particular group of people.
Which I don't think changes much.
But as I pointed out before due to my cultural background I find it hard to see insults as more then insults, given that there is no equivelent to the n-word in my language, in the sense that there is a word that must be censored like this to not cause major outrage.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Drop your knees to the floor
Hands to the sky
Give a round of applause
For the great Miss Y!
at this point all kinds of innocent acts are labeled racist, so that normal interaction cannot happen.
If someone will blame and claim the superior against you all the time, you are faced with resistance and oppression.
If someone plays Invoke Prejudice and is for that reason alone labeled a racist, then you fail to use the word properly.
It has nothing to do with racism to play that card, and its absolutely damaging and downright destructive to make anything a race topic.
Plenty of LGS and people come together and play a card game, we have fun and its welcoming.
If someone out of the blue suddenly blames people to be racist , which they absolutely are not, how is that doing anything good for the store or the community ?
It divides them, it produces actual real hate and it splits the community so deeply, that nothing positive will come out of that.
----
Being hyper sensitive to pseudo insults is only making matters worse.
Joking around in a community is absolutely normal and healthy, and nobody is superior to anybody else.
People that just claim victim status and use that as a weapon to literally destroy a community do nothing good, they are the doom of a store and kill the game in their area.
Its not helping anybody, if at all, people need to be lifted above a victim status and become part of a community, equal to each other and free of racist thoughts and blame, as a community that is based on blaming each other is just hateful and claims to do good, while burning everything down.
----
This entire show that is currently going on and years before it is not helping anybody, it just fuels the resistance and produces real hate and racism, which is many times worse than it was to begin with.
Banning these cards is not doing anything good.
Its pandering to a current very disturbing trend and removing it later will further fuel the hate, so its questionable if people are even allowed to talk about anything anymore, as anything could suddenly be labeled racist or otherwise hateful, by someone that just wants to stir up some hate, for whatever reasons.
Not everyone needs to like or be ok with everything, you can blame and dislike a lot of things, but you dont BAN stuff for that, if you can have a much more healthy discussion about a topic and allow that to happen.
Countless groups world wide will have no problem at all with these cards, but "some" people do.
That is also true for lots of other cards, and its completely unreasonable to ban all of them, as some individual might find them offensive, no matter what, any card will in some way potentially be offensive to somebody on this planet.
Even different countries in the world have very different views of what is offensive and what is not, even make stuff illegal.
- China does not allow human skulls, so all the art is changed that has them, its a lot of art that is different just for China.
- Removing religious symbols from cards was to pander to the christian fanatics.
- Removing sexy depictions of women was to please the SJW movement.
- The diversity train is currently plowing through the art of Magic.
- More characters and art had to be forced into the game to please the LGBT* crowd.
All kinds of stuff is to please some group, but non outright BANNED cards to get to their goal.
To truly help someone that is actively discriminated, any means are reasonable.
But to claim and blame all the people as racists and instigate a fight between them, is just fueling the hate, which very visible results in aggressions, destruction, blood and death ; nobody can want that, and still they push it to that level, blind to what they do.
----
People so easily become the racist they blame to fight against.
And the mob eats its own.
I really, honestly need a lot more context about who you are as a person, where you’re from, what you’ve seen / experienced in you’re lifetime to understand this whole “there is no racism, let’s just keep doing what we’ve always done” narrative you keep pushing. Not being sarcastic.
No longer the place for conversation, sadly. The mods have been hard at work, actively censoring this topic.
it's cause every thread about these types of topics descends into an uncleanable ***** storm. i don't blame the mods even if there are many things i'd like to say about the topic.
I get where you're coming from, but that's on us as a community and the mod team as the stewards of the community. We can and should be better at developing a culture of nuanced and respectful dialogue, and I'm of the belief that just locking every thread that might be more challenging to keep on track is antithetical to developing a better culture here.
It's part of what I believe WotC wants, the fandom as a whole and individual communities that make up the fandom addressing issues of racism and bigotry.
I think that these types of discussions are important too, even as they attract trolls and what not. Just not in the "look at these cool new magic cards" part of the forum, perhaps.
at this point all kinds of innocent acts are labeled racist, so that normal interaction cannot happen.
If someone will blame and claim the superior against you all the time, you are faced with resistance and oppression.
If someone plays Invoke Prejudice and is for that reason alone labeled a racist, then you fail to use the word properly.
It has nothing to do with racism to play that card, and its absolutely damaging and downright destructive to make anything a race topic.
Plenty of LGS and people come together and play a card game, we have fun and its welcoming.
If someone out of the blue suddenly blames people to be racist , which they absolutely are not, how is that doing anything good for the store or the community ?
It divides them, it produces actual real hate and it splits the community so deeply, that nothing positive will come out of that.
----
Being hyper sensitive to pseudo insults is only making matters worse.
Joking around in a community is absolutely normal and healthy, and nobody is superior to anybody else.
People that just claim victim status and use that as a weapon to literally destroy a community do nothing good, they are the doom of a store and kill the game in their area.
Its not helping anybody, if at all, people need to be lifted above a victim status and become part of a community, equal to each other and free of racist thoughts and blame, as a community that is based on blaming each other is just hateful and claims to do good, while burning everything down.
----
This entire show that is currently going on and years before it is not helping anybody, it just fuels the resistance and produces real hate and racism, which is many times worse than it was to begin with.
Banning these cards is not doing anything good.
Its pandering to a current very disturbing trend and removing it later will further fuel the hate, so its questionable if people are even allowed to talk about anything anymore, as anything could suddenly be labeled racist or otherwise hateful, by someone that just wants to stir up some hate, for whatever reasons.
Not everyone needs to like or be ok with everything, you can blame and dislike a lot of things, but you dont BAN stuff for that, if you can have a much more healthy discussion about a topic and allow that to happen.
Countless groups world wide will have no problem at all with these cards, but "some" people do.
That is also true for lots of other cards, and its completely unreasonable to ban all of them, as some individual might find them offensive, no matter what, any card will in some way potentially be offensive to somebody on this planet.
Even different countries in the world have very different views of what is offensive and what is not, even make stuff illegal.
- China does not allow human skulls, so all the art is changed that has them, its a lot of art that is different just for China.
- Removing religious symbols from cards was to pander to the christian fanatics.
- Removing sexy depictions of women was to please the SJW movement.
- The diversity train is currently plowing through the art of Magic.
- More characters and art had to be forced into the game to please the LGBT* crowd.
All kinds of stuff is to please some group, but non outright BANNED cards to get to their goal.
To truly help someone that is actively discriminated, any means are reasonable.
But to claim and blame all the people as racists and instigate a fight between them, is just fueling the hate, which very visible results in aggressions, destruction, blood and death ; nobody can want that, and still they push it to that level, blind to what they do.
----
People so easily become the racist they blame to fight against.
And the mob eats its own.
I really, honestly need a lot more context about who you are as a person, where you’re from, what you’ve seen / experienced in you’re lifetime to understand this whole “there is no racism, let’s just keep doing what we’ve always done” narrative you keep pushing. Not being sarcastic.
This is a guy who uses neonazi dogwhistles like "clown world." Best not give him the time of day.
Please, mill me. Mill my important cards. Mill my lands. Mill it all. Because I will still deal 20 damage before you can mill 45 cards most every time.
This is a guy who uses neonazi dogwhistles like "clown world." Best not give him the time of day.
See, this crap is exactly the point.
Whoever you want to, suddenly is blamed as a Nazi, like its a joke.
If you cannot have any argument at all, and think that making such horrendous claims is doing anything, you will forever breed and increase the hate among people.
If i wanted to i could go on a rampage on how "dare you" and we will blame each other for years.
But giving words that much power over yourself is not helping anybody, at some point you have to grow up and realize that its a lot better to get along than hate each other for the rest of your life (but yea, maybe some are so ignorant that they really have to ostracize themselves to find peace, with others they also ostracize, so they form their little happy group of ostracize people, till they find something to blame each other again for. Its a circle of nonsense and it leads to nothing)
See, this crap is exactly the point.
Whoever you want to, suddenly is blamed as a Nazi, like its a joke.
If you cannot have any argument at all, and think that making such horrendous claims is doing anything, you will forever breed and increase the hate among people.
But giving words that much power over yourself is not helping anybody.
If that is your opinion why are you giving the word Nazi so much power. Why do are you "Being hyper sensitive to pseudo insults is only making matters worse"?
- China does not allow human skulls, so all the art is changed that has them, its a lot of art that is different just for China.
- Removing religious symbols from cards was to pander to the christian fanatics.
- Removing sexy depictions of women was to please the SJW movement.
- The diversity train is currently plowing through the art of Magic.
- More characters and art had to be forced into the game to please the LGBT* crowd.
Why is it an issue to make the game more inviting to more people? Is the game not having "sexy depictions of women" (which means less overtly sexualized depictions) and more racially diverse and LGBTQ+ characters taking something away from you? If I take your complaints literally, you must want a game of nothing but white guys and women in bikinis.
Seriously though, and I am asking this genuinely, what do feel you lose by someone different that you being able to identify with characters in the game the same way you can?
Why is it an issue to make the game more inviting to more people? Is the game not having "sexy depictions of women" (which means less overtly sexualized depictions) and more racially diverse and LGBTQ+ characters taking something away from you? If I take your complaints literally, you must want a game of nothing but white guys and women in bikinis.
Seriously though, and I am asking this genuinely, what do feel you lose by someone different that you being able to identify with characters in the game the same way you can?
Its not an issue, it will just ensure that somebody disagrees.
And you dont go ahead an BAN cards to push that narrative.
All of the points in the short list are things that have an effect on artwork and people will either agree or disagree, but nothing gets outright banned, unless its unavoidable as its law in the country (like the China example, but even in China i dont know if playing with non-chinese artwork cards is downright illegal or not, maybe somebody knows more about that in specific).
Let's take a quick poll...
Should Paragon of the Amesha and Valeron Outlander be censored next for their use of the word 'heathen' in their flavor texts?
Is the word not offensive to some, inherently xenophobic, and discriminatory towards non-believers of particular faith?
Why is it not considered a pejorative?
Were such individuals not sufficiently oppressed?
Does it not exclude while promoting othering?
Does anyone really care or take offense to this word because it may inadvertently describe them in a negative way and harm their self esteem or feelings of self worth?
Also, what about oppression with that sadistic flavor text?
See how this nonsense could go on forever?
Why is it an issue to make the game more inviting to more people? Is the game not having "sexy depictions of women" (which means less overtly sexualized depictions) and more racially diverse and LGBTQ+ characters taking something away from you? If I take your complaints literally, you must want a game of nothing but white guys and women in bikinis.
Seriously though, and I am asking this genuinely, what do feel you lose by someone different that you being able to identify with characters in the game the same way you can?
Its not an issue, it will just ensure that somebody disagrees.
And you dont go ahead an BAN cards to push that narrative.
All of the points in the short list are things that have an effect on artwork and people will either agree or disagree, but nothing gets outright banned, unless its unavoidable as its law in the country (like the China example, but even in China i dont know if playing with non-chinese artwork cards is downright illegal or not, maybe somebody knows more about that in specific).
China's actually relaxed that stance in recent years. The skulls thing hasn't been an issue for WOTC for a while.
Its not an issue, it will just ensure that somebody disagrees.
And you dont go ahead an BAN cards to push that narrative.
I don't know what you mean by this statement. Can you elaborate?
No longer the place for conversation, sadly. The mods have been hard at work, actively censoring this topic.
it's cause every thread about these types of topics descends into an uncleanable ***** storm. i don't blame the mods even if there are many things i'd like to say about the topic.
I get where you're coming from, but that's on us as a community and the mod team as the stewards of the community. We can and should be better at developing a culture of nuanced and respectful dialogue, and I'm of the belief that just locking every thread that might be more challenging to keep on track is antithetical to developing a better culture here.
It's part of what I believe WotC wants, the fandom as a whole and individual communities that make up the fandom addressing issues of racism and bigotry.
I think that these types of discussions are important too, even as they attract trolls and what not. Just not in the "look at these cool new magic cards" part of the forum, perhaps.
What better place for maximum exposure than the current flagship forum?
See, this crap is exactly the point.
Whoever you want to, suddenly is blamed as a Nazi, like its a joke.
If you cannot have any argument at all, and think that making such horrendous claims is doing anything, you will forever breed and increase the hate among people.
But giving words that much power over yourself is not helping anybody.
If that is your opinion why are you giving the word Nazi so much power. Why do are you "Being hyper sensitive to pseudo insults is only making matters worse"?
I can not answer for him but wish to respond to your question with my own perspective, but "pseudo-insults" as you put are just that, insults. When one resorts to ad hominems in an attempt to work against another's arguments and the other person retaliates, doesn't make them that thing. I am guilty of this too as I have called others names that was in an effort to get a reaction out of them. Resorting to insults on that level, especially when they are not true, tears the argument down and brings it to a point of both sides simply bickering, rather than communicating and trying to understand the perspective or underlying issue that could help the other. Even though certain notions can be black and white, communication and understanding isn't, and that is why talking about things matter, no matter what you are for or against.
Its not an issue, it will just ensure that somebody disagrees.
So does not having them. And what is the reason people would disagree with more inclusivity? What do they have to gain/lose? What does the company gain/lose when choosing to either increase or decrease inclusivity?
What did they loose that they banned cards in official tournaments? What did they gain?
I can not answer for him but wish to respond to your question with my own perspective, but "pseudo-insults" as you put are just that, insults. When one resorts to ad hominems in an attempt to work against another's arguments and the other person retaliates, doesn't make them that thing. I am guilty of this too as I have called others names that was in an effort to get a reaction out of them. Resorting to insults on that level, especially when they are not true, tears the argument down and brings it to a point of both sides simply bickering, rather than communicating and trying to understand the perspective or underlying issue that could help the other. Even though certain notions can be black and white, communication and understanding isn't, and that is why talking about things matter, no matter what you are for or against.
I agree but the reason I asked is that on the one hand he says that people shouldn't be so sensitive to pseudo insults, then says being labeled nazi is a joke and is "insulted" by it. That seems hypocritical to me.
Beaver: You don't need know someones background. I could tell you my background. I actually fit into one of those "Oppressed victim groups" but I don't buy into their ideology at all. So my background isn't going to be made part of my argument.
Example from popular culture a few years ago.
Black Lives Matter Protested that the LGBTQ flag was discriminatory against black people because it didn't have a black bar on the flag.
It's a rainbow flag. There are no green people. Or any people matching those colors.
You don't pander to people just because they are offended, riot, or claim something to be racist. If you do that. There will be nothing. Everything will be changed and changed again to suit every possible person. Which is a bad thing.
So banning these cards is a bad decision. Throwing a super vague term like racism around to shut down something is a bad thing.
Think about the sentence the mod eating it's own for a while.
I think I gave you a nice clear example you can understand with the LBGTQ flag.
Be careful...Your acronym is incomplete and may seem exclusionary to some who prefer 2SLGBTQQIA+
Did I miss anything? This identifier gets upgraded with a new character almost every year
I can not answer for him but wish to respond to your question with my own perspective, but "pseudo-insults" as you put are just that, insults. When one resorts to ad hominems in an attempt to work against another's arguments and the other person retaliates, doesn't make them that thing. I am guilty of this too as I have called others names that was in an effort to get a reaction out of them. Resorting to insults on that level, especially when they are not true, tears the argument down and brings it to a point of both sides simply bickering, rather than communicating and trying to understand the perspective or underlying issue that could help the other. Even though certain notions can be black and white, communication and understanding isn't, and that is why talking about things matter, no matter what you are for or against.
I agree but the reason I asked is that on the one hand he says that people shouldn't be so sensitive to pseudo insults, then says being labeled nazi is a joke and is "insulted" by it. That seems hypocritical to me.
While I do find the Nazi ideology appaling, I was often labeled a Nazi in the past simply because I am German.
That thankfully did become better with the time but in my teenage years that was still common place.
I personally don't find it insulting since I don't think that I should put much value in the opinion of people who put labels on others without knowing them.
But what I find less pleasent is that many people do not see Nazis as humans and they see themselves in the right to disregard their opinion, threaten them or outright use violence against them.
By labeling someone a Nazi (justified or not) you essentialy dehumanize that person. And I can see people objecting to this kind of treatment.
And as I said befor that is not an endorsement of Nazism but to be blunt modern Germany exists because the allied forces created a path to redemption for the German people.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Drop your knees to the floor
Hands to the sky
Give a round of applause
For the great Miss Y!
I’m Lebanese and I can’t even keep count of how often that term has been used in a racist connotation against me since 9/11.
Two years ago I declined a date with a white guy who said “that’s not how we do things here in America, if you want to be a dirty sand N***** go back to your country and take your Jihad with you. I hope Allah sends you to hell”
I’m catholic btw and Allah is the Abrahamic god in general...
Technically yes, although the connotation of ethnic cleansing of white people is mostly not about the Whiteness but about the subgroups "Jews, Armenians, Slavic..." but since there are examples of white cleansing like Haiti or the congo. It still is problematic.
For Personal conversation or something like that I fully agree. Public use as in a company or people in the public eye there needs to be context to make it ok. As public things normalize things like that.
I've been desensitized to it (by my own white Grandma no less) but we have the n- word too and we use it colloqually for stuff (Like Chocolate-coated marshmallow treats/Schaumkuss)
Thats good to hear that it would apply the same. Should we be moving from mono-color board wipes?
Current EDH Decks:
Dakkon Blackblade 2WUUB
Haiti no longer has indigenous culture because sadly the Taíno were completely wiped out by Europeans in the 16th century.
I used to be a demigod, but now I'm an omnimage
It seems you missed the point. Context.
Mono-Color board wipes are fine like Virtue's Ruin, or Major Teroh is also fine because there is no bad connotation
If someone will blame and claim the superior against you all the time, you are faced with resistance and oppression.
If someone plays Invoke Prejudice and is for that reason alone labeled a racist, then you fail to use the word properly.
It has nothing to do with racism to play that card, and its absolutely damaging and downright destructive to make anything a race topic.
Plenty of LGS and people come together and play a card game, we have fun and its welcoming.
If someone out of the blue suddenly blames people to be racist , which they absolutely are not, how is that doing anything good for the store or the community ?
It divides them, it produces actual real hate and it splits the community so deeply, that nothing positive will come out of that.
----
Being hyper sensitive to pseudo insults is only making matters worse.
Joking around in a community is absolutely normal and healthy, and nobody is superior to anybody else.
People that just claim victim status and use that as a weapon to literally destroy a community do nothing good, they are the doom of a store and kill the game in their area.
Its not helping anybody, if at all, people need to be lifted above a victim status and become part of a community, equal to each other and free of racist thoughts and blame, as a community that is based on blaming each other is just hateful and claims to do good, while burning everything down.
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This entire show that is currently going on and years before it is not helping anybody, it just fuels the resistance and produces real hate and racism, which is many times worse than it was to begin with.
Banning these cards is not doing anything good.
Its pandering to a current very disturbing trend and removing it later will further fuel the hate, so its questionable if people are even allowed to talk about anything anymore, as anything could suddenly be labeled racist or otherwise hateful, by someone that just wants to stir up some hate, for whatever reasons.
Not everyone needs to like or be ok with everything, you can blame and dislike a lot of things, but you dont BAN stuff for that, if you can have a much more healthy discussion about a topic and allow that to happen.
Countless groups world wide will have no problem at all with these cards, but "some" people do.
That is also true for lots of other cards, and its completely unreasonable to ban all of them, as some individual might find them offensive, no matter what, any card will in some way potentially be offensive to somebody on this planet.
Even different countries in the world have very different views of what is offensive and what is not, even make stuff illegal.
- China does not allow human skulls, so all the art is changed that has them, its a lot of art that is different just for China.
- Removing religious symbols from cards was to pander to the christian fanatics.
- Removing sexy depictions of women was to please the SJW movement.
- The diversity train is currently plowing through the art of Magic.
- More characters and art had to be forced into the game to please the LGBT* crowd.
All kinds of stuff is to please some group, but non outright BANNED cards to get to their goal.
To truly help someone that is actively discriminated, any means are reasonable.
But to claim and blame all the people as racists and instigate a fight between them, is just fueling the hate, which very visible results in aggressions, destruction, blood and death ; nobody can want that, and still they push it to that level, blind to what they do.
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People so easily become the racist they blame to fight against.
And the mob eats its own.
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These responses honestly confuse me.
Did you really need to be educated to not insult other people beyond your preteen years?
I can't think of any contect in which rock-throwing devil might have a positive connotation and I am just avoided a big social landmine by being aware that this is indeed an insult in certain cultuals.
It is already an insult in my culture which is why I wouldn't have said it and also would have called people out for insulting others.
Literally the only people who learned something "useful" from knowing this are people who intend to use this insult.
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I disagree with this. I understand the phrase with no intentions of using it to describe an individual or group, but being able to identify the connotations beyond "its an insult" means that if I hear it used in someone else's conversation I can make a better judgement about how to interact or not with that person.
Which I don't think changes much.
But as I pointed out before due to my cultural background I find it hard to see insults as more then insults, given that there is no equivelent to the n-word in my language, in the sense that there is a word that must be censored like this to not cause major outrage.
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I really, honestly need a lot more context about who you are as a person, where you’re from, what you’ve seen / experienced in you’re lifetime to understand this whole “there is no racism, let’s just keep doing what we’ve always done” narrative you keep pushing. Not being sarcastic.
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I think that these types of discussions are important too, even as they attract trolls and what not. Just not in the "look at these cool new magic cards" part of the forum, perhaps.
This is a guy who uses neonazi dogwhistles like "clown world." Best not give him the time of day.
See, this crap is exactly the point.
Whoever you want to, suddenly is blamed as a Nazi, like its a joke.
If you cannot have any argument at all, and think that making such horrendous claims is doing anything, you will forever breed and increase the hate among people.
If i wanted to i could go on a rampage on how "dare you" and we will blame each other for years.
But giving words that much power over yourself is not helping anybody, at some point you have to grow up and realize that its a lot better to get along than hate each other for the rest of your life (but yea, maybe some are so ignorant that they really have to ostracize themselves to find peace, with others they also ostracize, so they form their little happy group of ostracize people, till they find something to blame each other again for. Its a circle of nonsense and it leads to nothing)
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If that is your opinion why are you giving the word Nazi so much power. Why do are you "Being hyper sensitive to pseudo insults is only making matters worse"?
Why is it an issue to make the game more inviting to more people? Is the game not having "sexy depictions of women" (which means less overtly sexualized depictions) and more racially diverse and LGBTQ+ characters taking something away from you? If I take your complaints literally, you must want a game of nothing but white guys and women in bikinis.
Seriously though, and I am asking this genuinely, what do feel you lose by someone different that you being able to identify with characters in the game the same way you can?
Its not an issue, it will just ensure that somebody disagrees.
And you dont go ahead an BAN cards to push that narrative.
All of the points in the short list are things that have an effect on artwork and people will either agree or disagree, but nothing gets outright banned, unless its unavoidable as its law in the country (like the China example, but even in China i dont know if playing with non-chinese artwork cards is downright illegal or not, maybe somebody knows more about that in specific).
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Should Paragon of the Amesha and Valeron Outlander be censored next for their use of the word 'heathen' in their flavor texts?
Is the word not offensive to some, inherently xenophobic, and discriminatory towards non-believers of particular faith?
Why is it not considered a pejorative?
Were such individuals not sufficiently oppressed?
Does it not exclude while promoting othering?
Does anyone really care or take offense to this word because it may inadvertently describe them in a negative way and harm their self esteem or feelings of self worth?
Also, what about oppression with that sadistic flavor text?
See how this nonsense could go on forever?
I used to be a demigod, but now I'm an omnimage
China's actually relaxed that stance in recent years. The skulls thing hasn't been an issue for WOTC for a while.
I don't know what you mean by this statement. Can you elaborate?
What better place for maximum exposure than the current flagship forum?
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#DefundThePolice
I can not answer for him but wish to respond to your question with my own perspective, but "pseudo-insults" as you put are just that, insults. When one resorts to ad hominems in an attempt to work against another's arguments and the other person retaliates, doesn't make them that thing. I am guilty of this too as I have called others names that was in an effort to get a reaction out of them. Resorting to insults on that level, especially when they are not true, tears the argument down and brings it to a point of both sides simply bickering, rather than communicating and trying to understand the perspective or underlying issue that could help the other. Even though certain notions can be black and white, communication and understanding isn't, and that is why talking about things matter, no matter what you are for or against.
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So does not having them. And what is the reason people would disagree with more inclusivity? What do they have to gain/lose? What does the company gain/lose when choosing to either increase or decrease inclusivity?
What did they loose that they banned cards in official tournaments? What did they gain?
I agree but the reason I asked is that on the one hand he says that people shouldn't be so sensitive to pseudo insults, then says being labeled nazi is a joke and is "insulted" by it. That seems hypocritical to me.
Be careful...Your acronym is incomplete and may seem exclusionary to some who prefer 2SLGBTQQIA+
Did I miss anything? This identifier gets upgraded with a new character almost every year
I used to be a demigod, but now I'm an omnimage
While I do find the Nazi ideology appaling, I was often labeled a Nazi in the past simply because I am German.
That thankfully did become better with the time but in my teenage years that was still common place.
I personally don't find it insulting since I don't think that I should put much value in the opinion of people who put labels on others without knowing them.
But what I find less pleasent is that many people do not see Nazis as humans and they see themselves in the right to disregard their opinion, threaten them or outright use violence against them.
By labeling someone a Nazi (justified or not) you essentialy dehumanize that person. And I can see people objecting to this kind of treatment.
And as I said befor that is not an endorsement of Nazism but to be blunt modern Germany exists because the allied forces created a path to redemption for the German people.
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I’m Lebanese and I can’t even keep count of how often that term has been used in a racist connotation against me since 9/11.
Two years ago I declined a date with a white guy who said “that’s not how we do things here in America, if you want to be a dirty sand N***** go back to your country and take your Jihad with you. I hope Allah sends you to hell”
I’m catholic btw and Allah is the Abrahamic god in general...
|| UW Jace, Vyn's Prodigy UW || UG Kenessos, Priest of Thassa (feat. Arixmethes) UG ||
Cards I still want to see created:
|| Olantin, Lost City || Pavios and Thanasis || Choryu ||