As of right now cEDH cards drive the price of cards a lot.
The amount of cards that matter in constructed formats outside of commander are fairly selective and small, they have a hard time filling sets with these cards over and over again, so every set will kinda look like a "Commanders Masters" as its much easier to fill a set with these cards (and its also the crowd thats most easily interested in alternate arts, the players for constructed really dont give a dime about alt arts).
----
The big money card in these sets is basically always Mana Crypt, and the only format that card sees any play (outside of fringe Vintage of course) is cEDH.
Biggest question is at what point the market is saturated for Mana Crypt (nobody really needs more than 1 and they put out the same ugly art every time, so the alt-art one helps in that regard).
ah, trotting out the mana crypt to make the set sell. classic.
my wallet is so fatigued by these product releases i don't even care about this one. its just nonstop bombardment now. there needs to be breathing room.
ah, trotting out the mana crypt to make the set sell. classic.
my wallet is so fatigued by these product releases i don't even care about this one. its just nonstop bombardment now. there needs to be breathing room.
Try what I do, just don't buy their stuff I don't want. I haven't spent 1 cent on any of the 3 sets of Collector's Boosters ripoffs, haven't spent 1 cent on the Secret Lair Drop junk. I don't play Commander so not one red cent spent on those. Not a penny on Mystery Boosters and I will probably pass on JumpStart. I won't squander money on junk I perceive as crap. Works well for me at least.
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Playing since 1994: Currently MAGS (HomeBrew),Standard & Pauper (Pioneer and Modern are degenerate trash formats)
STOP using "dude/bro" as a pejorative or insult. Grow up.
Margaret Thatcher: “The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.”
Benjamin Franklin: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
Martin Luther King Jr.: "I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character."
None of the previewed cards intrigues me. I avoid Atraxa and Kallia, for one, and it's not my style to play Doubling Seasons or Blightsteel. Mana Crypt is kinda cheating so I only use it in one of my decks. Though, I'm sure it's a great way to save money by buying a box; even hitting one of the cash cards would refund a chunk of its cost, let alone "double".
I will likely never buy a pack (maybe when traveling is possible and I can go to my "local" game store), but I like this just to have reprints to help cheapen the cards.
I also feel like this leading to a good compromise between alternate art and trying to built a cohesive style. Having more nontraditional art on promos helps the promo feel more special.
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I certainly like the idea of double rares and foils in each pack, but if these are more than $7 I am not going to spend a dime on packs. As much as I do enjoy this I will say that this is yet another product in the past years of too many products. Even if a product is good I'm going to be so tired of them that I'll end up ignoring it more than anything else.
I don't quite know how WotC thinks its player base is going to keep being able to spend like this, virus or not.
Amazon has some prices up, and it's roughly the same as UMA pricing. $300/box, $35 for 3 boosters, $15 for 1 booster. Remember, this comes with 2 rares per pack, 2 foils with a good possibility of 1 foil rare and a non-zero chance of 2 foil rares per pack. And don't forget boxes come with 2 boxtoppers.
The big question we have is the quality of rares. UMA got away with it because of how good the rares are, and even ignoring the boxtopper many boxes were getting above MSRP on each box. Adding in the boxtopper brought some real value to the situation. UMA was an amazing set and will age extremely well.
When you really think about it, 2 rares makes each pack half the MSRP, ie MM1 level. However, MM1 was so good because there are some real hits in the uncommon and even common slot, though you could argue the extra foil slot may make up for that a little. Unfortunately, there are so many rares. How many of them are going to be absolute junk? UMA had very few "bad" rares. I can list off a dozen really good rares right off the top of my head. Very few were actually bulk. But with 100+ rares, you know a good amount of them are going to be bulk. This makes me extremely nervous. It seems like they're setting us up to have major dud boxes.
So far they've only shown us mythics. And with 40 there's a good chance 15-20 will be garbage. Things look good, but things could go south very quickly once we get into full spoiler season.
The only time I'd want to see this kind of setup, 40 mythics and 100+ rares, is if they ever decided to do a VMA style set in paper, ie Reserve Masters. Have a crap ton of rares, a bunch of mythics, and a bonus section for the power 9, which would be like an alternate art slot that we see in Standard. At least there all the bulk chaff would be justified. Sure, 20 of my packs had junk, but I found a dual land in one of my slots to justify everything. I don't see that kind of value here unless a huge chunk of rares are $10+, but I don't see that happening.
I'm just glad the release is a month and a half away, ie spoilers a month away. Compare that to EMA where iirc they spoiled the set like 3-4 months before release. We won't have too much longer to wait on this. It'll be spoiler season for like a month, with M21 starting early to mid June, then Jumpstart, then 2XM right after, back to back to back.
Wizards says that fetches will be printed this year (outside of the secret lair and presumably outside of the secondary secret lair giveaway if you get the full summer set). With that in mind, I have to measure all singles I want to order against fetches. Do I want a blightsteel or do I want a Fetch? Do I want a mana crypt or do I want two fetches?
attachment has the price listings for preorder on Amazon.
Thanks for sharing, but as I thought, too much greed for me to give them any money for these. Every rare and mythic in the set would have to be a guaranteed 5 dollars and up for me to pay 12 to 16 dollars a pack. We know that never happens. More product for the whales.
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Playing since 1994: Currently MAGS (HomeBrew),Standard & Pauper (Pioneer and Modern are degenerate trash formats)
STOP using "dude/bro" as a pejorative or insult. Grow up.
Margaret Thatcher: “The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.”
Benjamin Franklin: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
Martin Luther King Jr.: "I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character."
And they still refuse to just make it a set to get the needed cards people want. Nope it sell has to be a draft set. Stop making everything draft WotC! Every f-ing set doesn’t need to be draft. Stop doing that for reprint focused sets....just f-ing stop!
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Sets with 6.99$ MTGO boosters have normally been around 180€ in Europe. Even with double rares and foils, it shouldn't be completely unrealistic for prices to drop to a similar level if the top cards are Commander-oriented like these first previews.
But I'm not an optimistic person. I still expect cards like Dark Confidant to be in, causing a wider range of people beeing interested (which is obviously good) and what's more important, there will be fanboys with wallets full of money even with a worldwide economic crisis ongoing that will speculate on the product. Prices will go up and LGSs won't benefit from it as they deserve, as they desperately need in every country. This was the perfect occasion to sell the product at 4$ a booster, leaving apart every economical aspect, forgetting every analysis of the market they keep hidden in their vampire clothes behind the scenes. It was the best moment to shoot high, to make something astonishing to keep paper Magic alive, but WotC thinks only about its profit. Moreover, it isn't brave enough to explicitly admit that it takes secondary market into account (see MaRo's tweet to The Professor last night). Well, that's the American way... isn't it?
And they still refuse to just make it a set to get the needed cards people want. Nope it sell has to be a draft set. Stop making everything draft WotC! Every f-ing set doesn’t need to be draft. Stop doing that for reprint focused sets....just f-ing stop!
I agree, when have they EVER done a set just for reprints and forgot about Draft? Chronicles? They aren't concerned with getting us these cards we would like to have and they are totally in tune with the secondary market manipulators. Same old same old.
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Playing since 1994: Currently MAGS (HomeBrew),Standard & Pauper (Pioneer and Modern are degenerate trash formats)
STOP using "dude/bro" as a pejorative or insult. Grow up.
Margaret Thatcher: “The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.”
Benjamin Franklin: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
Martin Luther King Jr.: "I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character."
I agree, when have they EVER done a set just for reprints and forgot about Draft? Chronicles? They aren't concerned with getting us these cards we would like to have and they are totally in tune with the secondary market manipulators. Same old same old.
I think it really was Chronicles as the last reprint set that didn't focus on draft, because it was the set that caused card prices to fall sharply at the time and prompted Wizards to establish the Reserve List policy. I can't find the history, but you can probably state that when the limited draft format was officially established, that's when draft booster sets came into focus.
Altough I agree that with the high price tag I would like to see more cards of value, I don't see the point of having a randomized set without the limited aspect as that is literally just a lottery/lootbox.
I agree, when have they EVER done a set just for reprints and forgot about Draft? Chronicles? They aren't concerned with getting us these cards we would like to have and they are totally in tune with the secondary market manipulators. Same old same old.
I think it really was Chronicles as the last reprint set that didn't focus on draft, because it was the set that caused card prices to fall sharply at the time and prompted Wizards to establish the Reserve List policy. I can't find the history, but you can probably state that when the limited draft format was officially established, that's when draft booster sets came into focus.
I was there when Chronicles released. I bought many packs hoping for stuff like the Power Nine or other powerful cards from ABU/Antiquities/Arbian Nights/Legends. We bought a lot of this stuff blind at the time/pre internet and info from Magazines like The Duelist. Those cards weren't there in Chronicles and it really didn't lower the price of the "good stuff" at the time. I got in around April of 94 and the supply of ABU/Antiquites/AN?Legends had dried up, they were gone. There was still a trickle of The Dark out but even then the prices of those packs were shooting up into the 5 to 10 plus dollar range. Prices of the Power9, other strong cards and dual lands didn't move down, they moved up. Jank like Elder Dragons and high cmc Legends dropped, but they were just that, jank. Its not 1994 any more, WotC needs to print a dedicated (NON draft) reprint set with cards that need reprints due to heavy play and fringe cards that have never had a single reprint whose values are high because of low supply. Of course this won't happen with how they run things.
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Playing since 1994: Currently MAGS (HomeBrew),Standard & Pauper (Pioneer and Modern are degenerate trash formats)
STOP using "dude/bro" as a pejorative or insult. Grow up.
Margaret Thatcher: “The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.”
Benjamin Franklin: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
Martin Luther King Jr.: "I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character."
Altough I agree that with the high price tag I would like to see more cards of value, I don't see the point of having a randomized set without the limited aspect as that is literally just a lottery/lootbox.
Yea we need to see the set first ultimate masters was the closest to the pack a being a fair price when it was first released this could be the same case
I agree, when have they EVER done a set just for reprints and forgot about Draft? Chronicles? They aren't concerned with getting us these cards we would like to have and they are totally in tune with the secondary market manipulators. Same old same old.
I think it really was Chronicles as the last reprint set that didn't focus on draft, because it was the set that caused card prices to fall sharply at the time and prompted Wizards to establish the Reserve List policy. I can't find the history, but you can probably state that when the limited draft format was officially established, that's when draft booster sets came into focus.
I was there when Chronicles released. I bought many packs hoping for stuff like the Power Nine or other powerful cards from ABU/Antiquities/Arbian Nights/Legends. We bought a lot of this stuff blind at the time/pre internet and info from Magazines like The Duelist. Those cards weren't there in Chronicles and it really didn't lower the price of the "good stuff" at the time. I got in around April of 94 and the supply of ABU/Antiquites/AN?Legends had dried up, they were gone. There was still a trickle of The Dark out but even then the prices of those packs were shooting up into the 5 to 10 plus dollar range. Prices of the Power9, other strong cards and dual lands didn't move down, they moved up. Jank like Elder Dragons and high cmc Legends dropped, but they were just that, jank. Its not 1994 any more, WotC needs to print a dedicated (NON draft) reprint set with cards that need reprints due to heavy play and fringe cards that have never had a single reprint whose values are high because of low supply. Of course this won't happen with how they run things.
Sorry if this seems naive but I don't get your argument at all. Only the rare slot(s) and *maybe* a few uncommons drive the value of a pack of cards. The draft experience is driven by the commons mostly, and the uncommons and rares to a small extent. If you look at Mystery Boosters as the most recent example, they did a great job filling the set with needed reprints, and it was also a blast to draft. Why on earth would you want them to stop making the drafts fun? When we were going to Magic Fests and Commandfest before COVID, I loved doing Mystery drafts because I had a great play experience and walked away with an Elesh Norn and a Grave Titan. To me, having a set be a good draft experience is just added value. And when I buy a booster box, which I do every set, I do not just want to rip it open and throw away 95% of the cards. I want to draft it or play Sealed even, so I can enjoy every card I open.
I’m just waiting for this to have the same pool of boring cards with mana crypt and another mythic or two to sell the set. It’s nigh impossible to find a hurricane, worldly tutor or a whole slew of interesting off the wall older cards that don’t look like chewed up wads of cotton. And they never get reprinted. Hell I know not to anticipate value here but the sheer fact even interesting cards in need of a border and text update can’t find their way here is infuriating
If you want to buy a box, just buy 8 multipacks instead. $35 x 8 = $280 but also 3x8 = 24 Packs. The only thing you miss out on the $20 value is a box topper.
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The amount of cards that matter in constructed formats outside of commander are fairly selective and small, they have a hard time filling sets with these cards over and over again, so every set will kinda look like a "Commanders Masters" as its much easier to fill a set with these cards (and its also the crowd thats most easily interested in alternate arts, the players for constructed really dont give a dime about alt arts).
----
The big money card in these sets is basically always Mana Crypt, and the only format that card sees any play (outside of fringe Vintage of course) is cEDH.
Biggest question is at what point the market is saturated for Mana Crypt (nobody really needs more than 1 and they put out the same ugly art every time, so the alt-art one helps in that regard).
WUBRG#BlackLotusMatterWUBRG
👮👮👮 #BlueLivesMatter 👮👮👮
my wallet is so fatigued by these product releases i don't even care about this one. its just nonstop bombardment now. there needs to be breathing room.
Try what I do, just don't buy their stuff I don't want. I haven't spent 1 cent on any of the 3 sets of Collector's Boosters ripoffs, haven't spent 1 cent on the Secret Lair Drop junk. I don't play Commander so not one red cent spent on those. Not a penny on Mystery Boosters and I will probably pass on JumpStart. I won't squander money on junk I perceive as crap. Works well for me at least.
STOP using "dude/bro" as a pejorative or insult. Grow up.
Margaret Thatcher: “The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.”
Benjamin Franklin: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
Martin Luther King Jr.: "I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character."
Shu Yun, the Silent Tempest WUR Voltron Control
Temmet, Vizier of Naktamun WU Unblockable Mirror Trickery
Ra's al Ghul (Sidar Kondo) and Face-Down Ninjas
Brudiclad, Token Engineer
Vaevictis (VV2) the Dire Lantern
Rona, Disciple of Gix
Tiana the Auror
Hallar
Ulrich the Politician
Zur the Rebel
Scorpion, Locust, Scarab, Egyptian Gods
O-Kagachi, Mathas, Mairsil
"Non-Tribal" Tribal Generals, Eggs
|| UW Jace, Vyn's Prodigy UW || UG Kenessos, Priest of Thassa (feat. Arixmethes) UG ||
Cards I still want to see created:
|| Olantin, Lost City || Pavios and Thanasis || Choryu ||
I also feel like this leading to a good compromise between alternate art and trying to built a cohesive style. Having more nontraditional art on promos helps the promo feel more special.
"You can tell how dumb someone is by how they use Mary Sue"
I don't quite know how WotC thinks its player base is going to keep being able to spend like this, virus or not.
The big question we have is the quality of rares. UMA got away with it because of how good the rares are, and even ignoring the boxtopper many boxes were getting above MSRP on each box. Adding in the boxtopper brought some real value to the situation. UMA was an amazing set and will age extremely well.
When you really think about it, 2 rares makes each pack half the MSRP, ie MM1 level. However, MM1 was so good because there are some real hits in the uncommon and even common slot, though you could argue the extra foil slot may make up for that a little. Unfortunately, there are so many rares. How many of them are going to be absolute junk? UMA had very few "bad" rares. I can list off a dozen really good rares right off the top of my head. Very few were actually bulk. But with 100+ rares, you know a good amount of them are going to be bulk. This makes me extremely nervous. It seems like they're setting us up to have major dud boxes.
So far they've only shown us mythics. And with 40 there's a good chance 15-20 will be garbage. Things look good, but things could go south very quickly once we get into full spoiler season.
The only time I'd want to see this kind of setup, 40 mythics and 100+ rares, is if they ever decided to do a VMA style set in paper, ie Reserve Masters. Have a crap ton of rares, a bunch of mythics, and a bonus section for the power 9, which would be like an alternate art slot that we see in Standard. At least there all the bulk chaff would be justified. Sure, 20 of my packs had junk, but I found a dual land in one of my slots to justify everything. I don't see that kind of value here unless a huge chunk of rares are $10+, but I don't see that happening.
I'm just glad the release is a month and a half away, ie spoilers a month away. Compare that to EMA where iirc they spoiled the set like 3-4 months before release. We won't have too much longer to wait on this. It'll be spoiler season for like a month, with M21 starting early to mid June, then Jumpstart, then 2XM right after, back to back to back.
Could be worse, I have to get a box of these
Have to? Why?
Wizards says that fetches will be printed this year (outside of the secret lair and presumably outside of the secondary secret lair giveaway if you get the full summer set). With that in mind, I have to measure all singles I want to order against fetches. Do I want a blightsteel or do I want a Fetch? Do I want a mana crypt or do I want two fetches?
Et cetera.
Thanks for sharing, but as I thought, too much greed for me to give them any money for these. Every rare and mythic in the set would have to be a guaranteed 5 dollars and up for me to pay 12 to 16 dollars a pack. We know that never happens. More product for the whales.
STOP using "dude/bro" as a pejorative or insult. Grow up.
Margaret Thatcher: “The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.”
Benjamin Franklin: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
Martin Luther King Jr.: "I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character."
Yep not that surprised paper is 15.99
Looks like on sticking with buying singles again
BAfter the lights go out on you, after your worthless life is through. I will remember how you scream...B
Niiiiice, I'm feeling the same vibe when they brought back Richard Ferguson to work a new blackblade art.
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But I'm not an optimistic person. I still expect cards like Dark Confidant to be in, causing a wider range of people beeing interested (which is obviously good) and what's more important, there will be fanboys with wallets full of money even with a worldwide economic crisis ongoing that will speculate on the product. Prices will go up and LGSs won't benefit from it as they deserve, as they desperately need in every country. This was the perfect occasion to sell the product at 4$ a booster, leaving apart every economical aspect, forgetting every analysis of the market they keep hidden in their vampire clothes behind the scenes. It was the best moment to shoot high, to make something astonishing to keep paper Magic alive, but WotC thinks only about its profit. Moreover, it isn't brave enough to explicitly admit that it takes secondary market into account (see MaRo's tweet to The Professor last night). Well, that's the American way... isn't it?
I agree, when have they EVER done a set just for reprints and forgot about Draft? Chronicles? They aren't concerned with getting us these cards we would like to have and they are totally in tune with the secondary market manipulators. Same old same old.
STOP using "dude/bro" as a pejorative or insult. Grow up.
Margaret Thatcher: “The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.”
Benjamin Franklin: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
Martin Luther King Jr.: "I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character."
I think it really was Chronicles as the last reprint set that didn't focus on draft, because it was the set that caused card prices to fall sharply at the time and prompted Wizards to establish the Reserve List policy. I can't find the history, but you can probably state that when the limited draft format was officially established, that's when draft booster sets came into focus.
I was there when Chronicles released. I bought many packs hoping for stuff like the Power Nine or other powerful cards from ABU/Antiquities/Arbian Nights/Legends. We bought a lot of this stuff blind at the time/pre internet and info from Magazines like The Duelist. Those cards weren't there in Chronicles and it really didn't lower the price of the "good stuff" at the time. I got in around April of 94 and the supply of ABU/Antiquites/AN?Legends had dried up, they were gone. There was still a trickle of The Dark out but even then the prices of those packs were shooting up into the 5 to 10 plus dollar range. Prices of the Power9, other strong cards and dual lands didn't move down, they moved up. Jank like Elder Dragons and high cmc Legends dropped, but they were just that, jank. Its not 1994 any more, WotC needs to print a dedicated (NON draft) reprint set with cards that need reprints due to heavy play and fringe cards that have never had a single reprint whose values are high because of low supply. Of course this won't happen with how they run things.
STOP using "dude/bro" as a pejorative or insult. Grow up.
Margaret Thatcher: “The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.”
Benjamin Franklin: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
Martin Luther King Jr.: "I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character."
Yea we need to see the set first ultimate masters was the closest to the pack a being a fair price when it was first released this could be the same case
Sorry if this seems naive but I don't get your argument at all. Only the rare slot(s) and *maybe* a few uncommons drive the value of a pack of cards. The draft experience is driven by the commons mostly, and the uncommons and rares to a small extent. If you look at Mystery Boosters as the most recent example, they did a great job filling the set with needed reprints, and it was also a blast to draft. Why on earth would you want them to stop making the drafts fun? When we were going to Magic Fests and Commandfest before COVID, I loved doing Mystery drafts because I had a great play experience and walked away with an Elesh Norn and a Grave Titan. To me, having a set be a good draft experience is just added value. And when I buy a booster box, which I do every set, I do not just want to rip it open and throw away 95% of the cards. I want to draft it or play Sealed even, so I can enjoy every card I open.
because draft. Sealed. Reasons
|| UW Jace, Vyn's Prodigy UW || UG Kenessos, Priest of Thassa (feat. Arixmethes) UG ||
Cards I still want to see created:
|| Olantin, Lost City || Pavios and Thanasis || Choryu ||