Submarines confirmed acceptable for Magic. This gives me ideas for my Depths of Maris set...
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MTGS Wikia Article about "New World Order"
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
PSA to everyone who keeps forgetting about the Reserved List:
You're on a website dedicated to talking about MtG. You're only a few keystrokes away from finding out what cards are on the Reserved List. You're also only a few keystrokes away from finding out why some cards on the Reserved List got foil printings in FtV, as Judge promos, or whatnot, as well as why that won't happen again. Stop doing this.
Why a submarine? Kind of odd for a big war setting, as unless I'm mistaken no real reason either side would be concerned with underwater stuff right now.
I assume it belongs to either the Izzet or the Simic guild, more importantly why is it so bad? Yes its 2 mana for a 2/3 that gives card draw except you need to tape a 2 power creature to activate it! Smuggler's Copter was much better and in my eyes this is worse than Jhessian Thief as it doesn't have prowess. Actually this Submarine doesn't have any evasion which defeats the whole purpose of a sub. If it had islandwalk, skulk or even prowess I would have been fine with it. Instead it is a god awful rare. Also crew 2 for a 2/3 vehicle is over costed should have been crew 1.
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Oath of the Gatewatch in a nutshell;
"Earth!" shouts Nissa
"Fire!" shouts Chandra
"Wind!" shouts Jace
"Water!" shouts Kiora
"Heart!" shouts Gideon
"Go Multiverse!" shouts everyone combined
"By your powers combined, I am Captain Multiverse!" shouts Captain Multiverse
I assume it belongs to either the Izzet or the Simic guild, more importantly why is it so bad? Yes its 2 mana for a 2/3 that gives card draw except you need to tape a 2 power creature to activate it! Smuggler's Copter was much better and in my eyes this is worse than Jhessian Thief as it doesn't have prowess. Actually this Submarine doesn't have any evasion which defeats the whole purpose of a sub. If it had islandwalk, skulk or even prowess I would have been fine with it. Instead it is a god awful rare. Also crew 2 for a 2/3 vehicle is over costed should have been crew 1.
No kidding? It's worse than the card that was so ubiquitous it had to be banned in Standard? Gee, I wonder why.
I love how they have used the "war" concept to bring RTS units into Magic as vehicles, we have an Izzet tank, a Boros battlecruiser and now a Dimir submarine, however, if this doesn't have any evasion or hexproof I'd call it a huge flavor fail, this feels like it should have something like U:Silent Submarine can't be blocked this turn, or, if you wanna be really on the nose U:Silent Submarine gains +0/+3 and hexproof until end of turn
I love how they have used the "war" concept to bring RTS units into Magic as vehicles, we have an Izzet tank, a Boros battlecruiser and now a Dimir submarine, however, if this doesn't have any evasion or hexproof I'd call it a huge flavor fail, this feels like it should have something like U:Silent Submarine can't be blocked this turn, or, if you wanna be really on the nose U:Silent Submarine gains +0/+3 and hexproof until end of turn
Oh, Dimir would make sense actually. I thought it was Simic (not loud enough to be Izzet, and doesn't really seem super Azorius) but Dimir would fit too.
One mana discount, draw off hitting walkers, and +1/+0 "costs": trickier mana, rarity bump, and crew: 2?
Sounds steep. Maybe the drawing of walkers was a bit too good in this set with so many walkers? Or perhaps, that the combination of 2 power and 2 mana means you are so much more likely to be able to attack into no good blocks as soon as you drop it, meaning it can snowball in limited?
One mana discount, draw off hitting walkers, and +1/+0 "costs": trickier mana, rarity bump, and crew: 2?
Sounds steep. Maybe the drawing of walkers was a bit too good in this set with so many walkers? Or perhaps, that the combination of 2 power and 2 mana means you are so much more likely to be able to attack into no good blocks as soon as you drop it, meaning it can snowball in limited?
Yes, but you compare Common vs Rare.
1/3 common for 3 vs 2/3 rare for 2, but you need to crew it.
The problem with defining this format by what is "fun" is that everyone seems to define fun as what they don't lose to. If you keep losing to easily answered cards, that means you should improve your deck. If you don't want to improve your deck, then you should come to peace with the idea that you are going to lose because you chose to not interact with better strategies.
Is it just me or is there something wrong in the translation?
The first 3 lines of text contains 3 numbers "1", and the translation none. ("Whenever Silent Submarine deals combat damage to a player or planeswalker, draw a card.")
I think there is something more to this vehicle than known at the moment.
This is hot garbage. No evasion, it requires crewing and double blue mana. The only way this piece of trash could have had even a fringe reason for existing is if it was colorless. Then at least you are getting a bad rate on an effect that might not be available to your deck's portion of the color pie. People are comparing this to a creature with the same effect but it's a poor comparison since vehicles require creatures to run them. They are more like equipment or even enchantments since they require creatures to function. This thing compares very poorly to Arcane Flight for instance.
Think about it. Round one you have to play an aggressive off color creature with two power since blue doesn't have two power one drops. Then round two you play this trashcan of a submarine and swing with your 1 drop. Then round three you finally get to crew it and swing for 2 damage and possibly a card if your opponent has somehow failed to play a blocker for three rounds, or you use your mana to play removal to clear a path for this clunker.
Now compare it to Arcane Flight. You can play literally any creature, even a zero mana thopter round one. If you have a zero drop enchant it, if not play any 1cc creature. Round two swing with your flying +1/+1 critter for damage and a card. If you had a zero drop creature then play your regular two drop. If not, you had to pay 1 blue to enchant your critter so play another 1 drop instead with the remaining mana. Round 3 you can now attack with two creatures, one of which is pumped, flies and draws cards and can use your T3 mana any way you like.
There is just no comparison. By round three you have likely done more damage with an uncommon enchantment, have a better board state and have drawn twice as many cards.
Is it just me or is there something wrong in the translation?
The first 3 lines of text contains 3 numbers "1", and the translation none. ("Whenever Silent Submarine deals combat damage to a player or planeswalker, draw a card.")
I think there is something more to this vehicle than known at the moment.
Nope, it's just really awkwardly saying when its attack puts damage on either "player x1" or "planeswalker x1" you get to draw 1
Is it just me or is there something wrong in the translation?
The first 3 lines of text contains 3 numbers "1", and the translation none. ("Whenever Silent Submarine deals combat damage to a player or planeswalker, draw a card.")
I think there is something more to this vehicle than known at the moment.
Not really. In Japanese, it's just worded like "If it deals damage to one player or one planeswalker, draw one card." You may compare it to Japanese Daring Saboteur.
We all live in a yellow blue submarine, a blur submarine...
My question is, are the vehicles coming over from Kaldesh?
Vehicles have flavorwise always been on Ravnica, but never got cards - the same as Merfolk during the first block and many other examples. Except for Merfolk they made up a thematic excuse why we haven't seen them so far, while vehicles just weren't a design tool available before.
Expect to see them show up for a lot of return sets.
The flavor fail is that it seems like recently-amassed tokens are the guys most likely to crew it....
Actually I'd argue that often enough a creature with ETB amass ability will add counters to the Army and then crew a Vehicle (since summoning sickness doesn't stop it from doing so) and the Vehicle will attack side-by-side with the Army. And why would it be a thematic fail? Vehicles have no allegiance. And considering the Guilds have been infiltrated there is nothing really stopping Bolas's agents from using captured o otherwise misappropriated Vehicles from Ravnica.
Source: https://tokyomtg.com/articles.html?post=e29
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
"Earth!" shouts Nissa
"Fire!" shouts Chandra
"Wind!" shouts Jace
"Water!" shouts Kiora
"Heart!" shouts Gideon
"Go Multiverse!" shouts everyone combined
"By your powers combined, I am Captain Multiverse!" shouts Captain Multiverse
yellowblue submarine, a blur submarine...My question is, are the vehicles coming over from Kaldesh?
Oh, Dimir would make sense actually. I thought it was Simic (not loud enough to be Izzet, and doesn't really seem super Azorius) but Dimir would fit too.
Compared to Scroll Thief:
One mana discount, draw off hitting walkers, and +1/+0 "costs": trickier mana, rarity bump, and crew: 2?
Sounds steep. Maybe the drawing of walkers was a bit too good in this set with so many walkers? Or perhaps, that the combination of 2 power and 2 mana means you are so much more likely to be able to attack into no good blocks as soon as you drop it, meaning it can snowball in limited?
Cubetutor Peasant'ish-Funbox
Project: Khans of Tarkir Cube (cubetutor)
Yes, but you compare Common vs Rare.
1/3 common for 3 vs 2/3 rare for 2, but you need to crew it.
That card is just plain bad...
Doesn't have any form of evasion.
Also, submarines are nothing new, they've been around in our world since at least the sixteenth century. Possibly more.
---
Numquam evolutioni obstes. Solum conculceris.
Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.
It's just silent, not invisible. Who are you, Drax?
I really don't wanna pay UU in order to tap 2 power worth of creatures just to make a 2/3 Scroll Thief.
Ixalan vehicles again anyone ?
The first 3 lines of text contains 3 numbers "1", and the translation none. ("Whenever Silent Submarine deals combat damage to a player or planeswalker, draw a card.")
I think there is something more to this vehicle than known at the moment.
U Too much draw for your health Kami
C Eldrazi ramp Kozilek
WB All-in aggro Karlov of the Ghost council
U Azami, Lady of Scrolls / GB The Gitrog Monster / URG Animar, soul of Elements / UBR Kess, Dissident mage / WUR Narset, Enlightened Master / WUBRGScion of the Ur-Drago[/spoiler]
Think about it. Round one you have to play an aggressive off color creature with two power since blue doesn't have two power one drops. Then round two you play this trashcan of a submarine and swing with your 1 drop. Then round three you finally get to crew it and swing for 2 damage and possibly a card if your opponent has somehow failed to play a blocker for three rounds, or you use your mana to play removal to clear a path for this clunker.
Now compare it to Arcane Flight. You can play literally any creature, even a zero mana thopter round one. If you have a zero drop enchant it, if not play any 1cc creature. Round two swing with your flying +1/+1 critter for damage and a card. If you had a zero drop creature then play your regular two drop. If not, you had to pay 1 blue to enchant your critter so play another 1 drop instead with the remaining mana. Round 3 you can now attack with two creatures, one of which is pumped, flies and draws cards and can use your T3 mana any way you like.
There is just no comparison. By round three you have likely done more damage with an uncommon enchantment, have a better board state and have drawn twice as many cards.
Nope, it's just really awkwardly saying when its attack puts damage on either "player x1" or "planeswalker x1" you get to draw 1
Not really. In Japanese, it's just worded like "If it deals damage to one player or one planeswalker, draw one card." You may compare it to Japanese Daring Saboteur.
(Team Bolas vs. guild members)
(Army vs. navy)
(U/B)(U/B)(U/B) JUMP IN THE LINE, ROCK YOUR BODY IN TIME
(R/W)(R/W)(R/W) RISING FROM THE NEON GLOOM, SHINING LIKE A CRAZY MOON
(U/R)(R/G)(G/U) STEALIN' WHEN I SHOULD HAVE BEEN BUYIN'
Vehicles have flavorwise always been on Ravnica, but never got cards - the same as Merfolk during the first block and many other examples. Except for Merfolk they made up a thematic excuse why we haven't seen them so far, while vehicles just weren't a design tool available before.
Expect to see them show up for a lot of return sets.
Actually I'd argue that often enough a creature with ETB amass ability will add counters to the Army and then crew a Vehicle (since summoning sickness doesn't stop it from doing so) and the Vehicle will attack side-by-side with the Army. And why would it be a thematic fail? Vehicles have no allegiance. And considering the Guilds have been infiltrated there is nothing really stopping Bolas's agents from using captured o otherwise misappropriated Vehicles from Ravnica.
Finally a good white villain quote: "So, do I ever re-evaluate my life choices? Never, because I know what I'm doing is a righteous cause."
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