We are missing any form of equipment. I know is not signature for Gideon but maybe some form of Blackblade? So the text on Nahiri isn't irrelevant for limited?
Guys, you totally misunderstood. I never said that Bolas has to win, but even if he lose, it shouldn't be shown in a way so obvious even before half of the cards spoiled, before the villain itself get officially spoiled. That's just bad storytelling.
You're assuming all the cards from now on will be about bolas losing. First, we got a look at Bolas initial invasion and the devastation wrought. Now we've seen a lot of cars focused on 'rallying the troops' and offing the lieutenants like Dovin, but I expect that soon we'll get some 'darkest moment' cards that are trending the other way again. Don't forget, early in the spoiler season there where some cards that seemed to hint bolas might actually pull it off against all expectation, so until we see a card with dead bolas on it, I wouldn't assume anything about the way this war will go.
Guys, you totally misunderstood. I never said that Bolas has to win, but even if he lose, it shouldn't be shown in a way so obvious even before half of the cards spoiled, before the villain itself get officially spoiled. That's just bad storytelling.
You're assuming all the cards from now on will be about bolas losing. First, we got a look at Bolas initial invasion and the devastation wrought. Now we've seen a lot of cars focused on 'rallying the troops' and offing the lieutenants like Dovin, but I expect that soon we'll get some 'darkest moment' cards that are trending the other way again. Don't forget, early in the spoiler season there where some cards that seemed to hint bolas might actually pull it off against all expectation, so until we see a card with dead bolas on it, I wouldn't assume anything about the way this war will go.
i think thats the regular art of liliana's triumph
Guys, you totally misunderstood. I never said that Bolas has to win, but even if he lose, it shouldn't be shown in a way so obvious even before half of the cards spoiled, before the villain itself get officially spoiled. That's just bad storytelling.
It was obvious when the set was announced though. Without any cards, this was the wrap up to the Bolas arc.
I'm also not sure frying Dovin (really irks me how they turned him into a villain) really shows Bolas "losing" either. It's not like it should be a one sided stomp of the Gatewatch, we already had that.
We are missing any form of equipment. I know is not signature for Gideon but maybe some form of Blackblade? So the text on Nahiri isn't irrelevant for limited?
We have 4 open artifact slots, and we might have more if we see more colored artifacts. Buy yes until now no Equipment was spoilered.
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By the way... Is that just me or do look Gideon and Chandra like psychopaths in the Triumph artwork?
Chandra doesn't really look evil or overly gleeful but Gideon absolutely does - I think wielding Blackblade might be taking a toll on him.
While there's no indication of it right now, I could see Gideon starting to believe that with the Blackblade, he can slay any monster. Any monster. Might influence his actions in sets to come. I'd hate to see him go the "well intentioned extremist" route almost as much as him dying, but it would be an interesting turn of events, more than him dying. I'd still be just fine with him sticking around as the dependable hero, myself. The Superman to Gatewatch's Justice League, the Captain America to their Avengers.
We are missing any form of equipment. I know is not signature for Gideon but maybe some form of Blackblade? So the text on Nahiri isn't irrelevant for limited?
Not sure what this has to do with Chandra's Triumph, but Nahiri's static isn't irrelevant seeing as she also grants your creatures first strike.
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MTGS Wikia Article about "New World Order"
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
PSA to everyone who keeps forgetting about the Reserved List:
You're on a website dedicated to talking about MtG. You're only a few keystrokes away from finding out what cards are on the Reserved List. You're also only a few keystrokes away from finding out why some cards on the Reserved List got foil printings in FtV, as Judge promos, or whatnot, as well as why that won't happen again. Stop doing this.
Not when the cycle of Triumph started already with Triumph of Liliana and Gideon previously spoiled. And again, is an enormous fail narratively, to show the "Yay, the good guys won", before even showing the bad guy,and/or any bad guy big momentum at the apex of his power.
Remember that technically -at least for WotC- we don't know the Bolas card and for sure we don't know either his signature spell, or the way he fall, so showing already the "yay, we won, it's over" already, definitely ruins everything of how WotC is telling us this story.
In any media (a movie, a comic, a book) managing to tell the plot this way would be terrible, here makes no difference.
It was obvious when the set was announced though. Without any cards, this was the wrap up to the Bolas arc.
I guess in every movie/book/comic we know already that the good guy in the end wins and the bad one falls, but that's not an excuse to execute in a poor way the plot. Heck, they spoiled the triumph before even a single relevant character died, if that's not anti-climax I don't know what it is.
I mean yes and no... I mean everybody already knew that Bolas would loose here. It is story writing 101.
Gideon's Triumph just shows a bunch of dead Zombie's in the background, so hurray he won ... against a handful of Zombies. This has hardly any story impact.
Liliana's Triumph just shows her also not having any story implications. You could argue that it wasn't clever to have this card as one of the promos forcing an early reveal, but besides that it wasn't really that shocking to see. I would assume that her standard artwork will show have her face and reveal what she actually triumphed over.
Chandra's Triumph is the first one they spoiled with real story implications the presumable death of Dovin. And that was properly set up. Show Chandra, show Dovin, show their respective signature spells and have Chandra triumph in the end.
Also Bolas had his signature spell (the Citadel) already revealed and the giant statue describing him as dictator meaning that he is currently in charge of Ravnica and the fights we are seeing is the remaining Ranician resistance forces. It is really not as bad as you make it out to be...
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Kinda wish Chandra's Triumph added effect of controlling a Chandra walker included a couldn't be canceled effect. Like she learned to overcome her arch-nemesis of cancel spells.
I wouldn't be so sure that is his signature spell. The cycle of colored artifacts seems to be completely distint from the planswalkers signature spells. Vivien's Arkbow is part of the cycle of artifacts and still the true signature spell of Vivien is Vivien's Grizzly.
In a similar fashion I expect the signature spell of Bolas to be something else, hopefully a powerful mythic grixis sorcery that depict Bolas at the apex of his power (hopefully better than the crappy Apex of Power already related)
You do know that for all we know the gatewatch destroying Bolas' allies is what Bolas is counting on. Like, "Oh I didn't really care if you or my allies won. I only needed enough sparks, not specifically the sparks of the good guys. Thanks for playing your part so well. I'm off to enjoy being a god, later idiots."
Granted that's too good of a twist for magic the gathering.
I'm really hating that we get spoiled so early on who's winning instead of leaving these cards at least after Bolas being spoiled, or at least a card that gives the idea of a fall or even better, apparent triumph of Bolas. Whoever is behind this made a completely incompetent choice that kill the climax of the story.
Bolas was not spoiled, it was leaked.
We have not seen Liliana defeating Bolas on a spoiled card, that is speculation.
Chandra defeating (killing?) Dovin is most certainly *not* the climax of this story, although it is a key story moment perhaps. They are spoiling cards in more or less "story order" this time around. These triumphs may be a small exception but so far we have not had anything major spoiled. Gideon's "triumph" is over, like, a few eternals.
Anyway, I suspect that each of the Origins/Gatewatch 5 will get one to mirror the "defeat" cards we saw in Hour of Devastation. Others on the name/number crunch say that may not work, though?
You do know that for all we know the gatewatch destroying Bolas' allies is what Bolas is counting on. Like, "Oh I didn't really care if you or my allies won. I only needed enough sparks, not specifically the sparks of the good guys. Thanks for playing your part so well. I'm off to enjoy being a god, later idiots."
Granted that's too good of a twist for magic the gathering.
I'm really, really hoping in that kind of end. Especially after the flavor text of Burning Prophet, which should say something.
But you are right, creative is simply too lazy to make work a triumphant but yet not omnipotent Bolas to conclude the arc.
Kinda wish Chandra's Triumph added effect of controlling a Chandra walker included a couldn't be canceled effect. Like she learned to overcome her arch-nemesis of cancel spells.
Well obviously Chandra baited Dovin's Veto with her Pyrohelix, then followed up with her Triumph when he accidentally tapped out. Oops.
MTGS Wikia Article about "New World Order"
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
PSA to everyone who keeps forgetting about the Reserved List:
You're on a website dedicated to talking about MtG. You're only a few keystrokes away from finding out what cards are on the Reserved List. You're also only a few keystrokes away from finding out why some cards on the Reserved List got foil printings in FtV, as Judge promos, or whatnot, as well as why that won't happen again. Stop doing this.
I'm really hating that we get spoiled so early on who's winning instead of leaving these cards at least after Bolas being spoiled, or at least a card that gives the idea of a fall or even better, apparent triumph of Bolas. Whoever is behind this made a completely incompetent choice that kill the climax of the story.
Bolas was not spoiled, it was leaked.
We have not seen Liliana defeating Bolas on a spoiled card, that is speculation.
Chandra defeating (killing?) Dovin is most certainly *not* the climax of this story, although it is a key story moment perhaps. They are spoiling cards in more or less "story order" this time around. These triumphs may be a small exception but so far we have not had anything major spoiled. Gideon's "triumph" is over, like, a few eternals.
Anyway, I suspect that each of the Origins/Gatewatch 5 will get one to mirror the "defeat" cards we saw in Hour of Devastation. Others on the name/number crunch say that may not work, though?
Remember when "Oath of the Gatewatch" was revealed and the first thing spoiled by WotC were the triumphants art of our heroes on their oath cards, before like everything else? That the set was supposed to be "oh no, Kozilek still left, what we gonna do now?"
Don't understimate how terrible can be WotC at spoiling the ending before time.
We have a strong Chandra spoiled, so this looks like it could be actual playable removal.
I like WotC printing good cards, including good removal.
I don’t know if I like the planeswalker-heavy midrange meta they’re setting up.
I really hope they don’t conflate feedback they get for those two things, but I’m worried they will.
I wouldn't be so sure that is his signature spell. The cycle of colored artifacts seems to be completely distint from the planswalkers signature spells. Vivien's Arkbow is part of the cycle of artifacts and still the true signature spell of Vivien is Vivien's Grizzly.
In a similar fashion I expect the signature spell of Bolas to be something else, hopefully a powerful mythic grixis sorcery that depict Bolas at the apex of his power (hopefully better than the crappy Apex of Power already related)
Embrace the dark you call a home,
Gaze upon an empty, white throne
A legacy of lies,
A familiar disguise
Sing with me a song of conquest and fate
The black pillar cracks beneath its weight
Night breaks through the day, hard as a stone
Lost in thoughts all alone
On the pax stream they also said that the Elder Spell will get a card in the set.
Which in my book qualifies as his signatur spell as far as this set is concerned.
You do know that for all we know the gatewatch destroying Bolas' allies is what Bolas is counting on. Like, "Oh I didn't really care if you or my allies won. I only needed enough sparks, not specifically the sparks of the good guys. Thanks for playing your part so well. I'm off to enjoy being a god, later idiots."
Granted that's too good of a twist for magic the gathering.
I mean, his allies so far seem to amount to Dovin and Domri. If two sparks makes or breaks things that's pretty darn silly all things considered. And they really can't leave Bolas just sitting around, it's not like the guy is content with power. So some sort of sealing/defeat/death is going to happen.
I'm really hating that we get spoiled so early on who's winning instead of leaving these cards at least after Bolas being spoiled, or at least a card that gives the idea of a fall or even better, apparent triumph of Bolas. Whoever is behind this made a completely incompetent choice that kill the climax of the story.
Bolas was not spoiled, it was leaked.
We have not seen Liliana defeating Bolas on a spoiled card, that is speculation.
Chandra defeating (killing?) Dovin is most certainly *not* the climax of this story, although it is a key story moment perhaps. They are spoiling cards in more or less "story order" this time around. These triumphs may be a small exception but so far we have not had anything major spoiled. Gideon's "triumph" is over, like, a few eternals.
Anyway, I suspect that each of the Origins/Gatewatch 5 will get one to mirror the "defeat" cards we saw in Hour of Devastation. Others on the name/number crunch say that may not work, though?
Remember when "Oath of the Gatewatch" was revealed and the first thing spoiled by WotC were the triumphants art of our heroes on their oath cards, before like everything else? That the set was supposed to be "oh no, Kozilek still left, what we gonna do now?"
Don't understimate how terrible can be WotC at spoiling the ending before time.
I mean, again, the mistake is in thinking that they want the ending to be a surprise. Though with Oath they did specifically say that was a mistake, and they showed with Eldritch Moon that they can keep the ending under wraps. Here though there isn't really any need for that. Being vague when it serves no purpose is just pointless obfuscation.
But then, who knows. They might actually do it this time. God knows they already assassinated his character. May as well actually kill him too.
Someone hovering between Lawful Neutral and Lawful Good taking a big nosedive to be Lawful or maybe even Neutral Evil is pretty sucky yeah. Given we've got two other White/Blue Planeswalkers though (and maybe more) I don't think it's a bad thing if he does die, but I like him. Turning him into a villain really makes no sense.
If we hadn't already had news of the book sequel released, I'd suggest the set art Liliana's Triumph could just as easily show her burning up with flavour text to match the style of Gidein's and Chandra's. Something like 'Liliana's triumph wasn't in prolonging her life, but in realising some things are more important than life itself'.
You're assuming all the cards from now on will be about bolas losing. First, we got a look at Bolas initial invasion and the devastation wrought. Now we've seen a lot of cars focused on 'rallying the troops' and offing the lieutenants like Dovin, but I expect that soon we'll get some 'darkest moment' cards that are trending the other way again. Don't forget, early in the spoiler season there where some cards that seemed to hint bolas might actually pull it off against all expectation, so until we see a card with dead bolas on it, I wouldn't assume anything about the way this war will go.
i think thats the regular art of liliana's triumph
thats the only non promo not shown
(man i got to stop saying this prediction)
It was obvious when the set was announced though. Without any cards, this was the wrap up to the Bolas arc.
I'm also not sure frying Dovin (really irks me how they turned him into a villain) really shows Bolas "losing" either. It's not like it should be a one sided stomp of the Gatewatch, we already had that.
We have 4 open artifact slots, and we might have more if we see more colored artifacts. Buy yes until now no Equipment was spoilered.
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Also, this is pretty damned good.
Lightning Strike was already playable.
Reprint Stasis!
Control needs more love.
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Oona, Queen of the Fae
Bruna, Light of Alabaster
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Rhys the Redeemed
Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
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While there's no indication of it right now, I could see Gideon starting to believe that with the Blackblade, he can slay any monster. Any monster. Might influence his actions in sets to come. I'd hate to see him go the "well intentioned extremist" route almost as much as him dying, but it would be an interesting turn of events, more than him dying. I'd still be just fine with him sticking around as the dependable hero, myself. The Superman to Gatewatch's Justice League, the Captain America to their Avengers.
Not sure what this has to do with Chandra's Triumph, but Nahiri's static isn't irrelevant seeing as she also grants your creatures first strike.
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
Not when the cycle of Triumph started already with Triumph of Liliana and Gideon previously spoiled. And again, is an enormous fail narratively, to show the "Yay, the good guys won", before even showing the bad guy,and/or any bad guy big momentum at the apex of his power.
Remember that technically -at least for WotC- we don't know the Bolas card and for sure we don't know either his signature spell, or the way he fall, so showing already the "yay, we won, it's over" already, definitely ruins everything of how WotC is telling us this story.
In any media (a movie, a comic, a book) managing to tell the plot this way would be terrible, here makes no difference.
I guess in every movie/book/comic we know already that the good guy in the end wins and the bad one falls, but that's not an excuse to execute in a poor way the plot. Heck, they spoiled the triumph before even a single relevant character died, if that's not anti-climax I don't know what it is.
Gideon's Triumph just shows a bunch of dead Zombie's in the background, so hurray he won ... against a handful of Zombies. This has hardly any story impact.
Liliana's Triumph just shows her also not having any story implications. You could argue that it wasn't clever to have this card as one of the promos forcing an early reveal, but besides that it wasn't really that shocking to see. I would assume that her standard artwork will show have her face and reveal what she actually triumphed over.
Chandra's Triumph is the first one they spoiled with real story implications the presumable death of Dovin. And that was properly set up. Show Chandra, show Dovin, show their respective signature spells and have Chandra triumph in the end.
Also Bolas had his signature spell (the Citadel) already revealed and the giant statue describing him as dictator meaning that he is currently in charge of Ravnica and the fights we are seeing is the remaining Ranician resistance forces. It is really not as bad as you make it out to be...
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Give a round of applause
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I wouldn't be so sure that is his signature spell. The cycle of colored artifacts seems to be completely distint from the planswalkers signature spells. Vivien's Arkbow is part of the cycle of artifacts and still the true signature spell of Vivien is Vivien's Grizzly.
In a similar fashion I expect the signature spell of Bolas to be something else, hopefully a powerful mythic grixis sorcery that depict Bolas at the apex of his power (hopefully better than the crappy Apex of Power already related)
Granted that's too good of a twist for magic the gathering.
Bolas was not spoiled, it was leaked.
We have not seen Liliana defeating Bolas on a spoiled card, that is speculation.
Chandra defeating (killing?) Dovin is most certainly *not* the climax of this story, although it is a key story moment perhaps. They are spoiling cards in more or less "story order" this time around. These triumphs may be a small exception but so far we have not had anything major spoiled. Gideon's "triumph" is over, like, a few eternals.
Anyway, I suspect that each of the Origins/Gatewatch 5 will get one to mirror the "defeat" cards we saw in Hour of Devastation. Others on the name/number crunch say that may not work, though?
I'm really, really hoping in that kind of end. Especially after the flavor text of Burning Prophet, which should say something.
But you are right, creative is simply too lazy to make work a triumphant but yet not omnipotent Bolas to conclude the arc.
Well obviously Chandra baited Dovin's Veto with her Pyrohelix, then followed up with her Triumph when he accidentally tapped out. Oops.
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
Remember when "Oath of the Gatewatch" was revealed and the first thing spoiled by WotC were the triumphants art of our heroes on their oath cards, before like everything else? That the set was supposed to be "oh no, Kozilek still left, what we gonna do now?"
Don't understimate how terrible can be WotC at spoiling the ending before time.
I like WotC printing good cards, including good removal.
I don’t know if I like the planeswalker-heavy midrange meta they’re setting up.
I really hope they don’t conflate feedback they get for those two things, but I’m worried they will.
Augur of Bolas could be considered his signature spell.
Gaze upon an empty, white throne
A legacy of lies,
A familiar disguise
Sing with me a song of conquest and fate
The black pillar cracks beneath its weight
Night breaks through the day, hard as a stone
Lost in thoughts all alone
Which in my book qualifies as his signatur spell as far as this set is concerned.
WSram, UBaral, RPurphoros, GFreyalise
(G/W)Trostani, (B/G)Izoni, (B/R)Rakdos, (U/B)Yuriko, (U/R)Locust God
U(B/R)Marchesa, W(R/G)Zacama, G(W/B)Karador, B(R/W)Edgar, U(W/B)Silas/Tymna
G(U/R)Animar, W(G/U)Derevi, U(B/G)Muldrotha, G(B/R)Windgrace, G(R/W)(U/B)Jodah
I mean, his allies so far seem to amount to Dovin and Domri. If two sparks makes or breaks things that's pretty darn silly all things considered. And they really can't leave Bolas just sitting around, it's not like the guy is content with power. So some sort of sealing/defeat/death is going to happen.
I mean, again, the mistake is in thinking that they want the ending to be a surprise. Though with Oath they did specifically say that was a mistake, and they showed with Eldritch Moon that they can keep the ending under wraps. Here though there isn't really any need for that. Being vague when it serves no purpose is just pointless obfuscation.
Is he, though? We've been here before.
But then, who knows. They might actually do it this time. God knows they already assassinated his character. May as well actually kill him too.
Someone hovering between Lawful Neutral and Lawful Good taking a big nosedive to be Lawful or maybe even Neutral Evil is pretty sucky yeah. Given we've got two other White/Blue Planeswalkers though (and maybe more) I don't think it's a bad thing if he does die, but I like him. Turning him into a villain really makes no sense.