maybe they will do planeswalker split cards! limit it to like 2 abilities and that could plausibly fit on a card alright.
I mean, that's what DFCs do nowadays. An alternate/additional cost that lets players cast the back side of a DFC or have the permanent enter the battlefield transformed is something that we surprisingly haven't seen yet.
Hard to tell. Kiora stated that Thassa’s bident was much less powerful away from Theros. Still powerful but like 50% of max power.
It's strongly implied that Theran God-hoog is tied quite closely to devotion in not only a mechanical sense, but also thematically. Xenagos probably didn't lose the ignited spark, but by 'walking off-plane he would remove himself from the devotion of his followers and hence the source of his power. It seems reasonable that on a plane without devotees his powers as planeswalker would outrank his powers as God. In addition the powers of the Theran pantheon are tied to Nyx as is shown in about anything that has to do with them, so 'walking out of Theros means also 'walking out of Nyx.
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Planar Chaos was not a mistake neither was it random. You might want to look at it again.
[thread=239793][Game] Level Up - Creature[/thread]
My bet is that Ral, Domri, Dovin, Kaya and Jaya will all die, along with a handful of nameless Planeswalker Red Shirts. Most of these characters will have fulfilled their narrative usefulness at the end of the story, so you may as well use them to turn up the Planeswalker body count (otherwise the "war" will have like 1 casualty and will thus not be a "war" so much as an intramural scrimmage game). If they want to make it spicy, they could easily kill Samut and Arlinn, since we are not likely to go back to either Amonkhet or Innistrad any time soon and, when we do, the planes will be given a new status quo anyway.
maybe they will do planeswalker split cards! limit it to like 2 abilities and that could plausibly fit on a card alright.
I mean, that's what DFCs do nowadays. An alternate/additional cost that lets players cast the back side of a DFC or have the permanent enter the battlefield transformed is something that we surprisingly haven't seen yet.
Why not just have double-faced cards that are just two separate cards? Not linked, don't transform. Just two separate cards in one. That would allow them to print more Planeswalkers without increasing the amount of cards in a set, or technically even the number of rares/mythics. Just include a checklist card in every pack.
Why not just have double-faced cards that are just two separate cards? Not linked, don't transform. Just two separate cards in one. That would allow them to print more Planeswalkers without increasing the amount of cards in a set, or technically even the number of rares/mythics. Just include a checklist card in every pack.
That would be a nightmare for prerelease and casual formats. If a player is using a deck with the colors of both walkers they could just play whichever one suits them better in that moment and say they forgot to check the box. There would be no real way to deal with that.
Why not just have double-faced cards that are just two separate cards? Not linked, don't transform. Just two separate cards in one. That would allow them to print more Planeswalkers without increasing the amount of cards in a set, or technically even the number of rares/mythics. Just include a checklist card in every pack.
No, that isn't a very good idea. Without transformation, there wouldn't be much of an advantage to doing this over just printing two separate cards. It takes all of the inconvenience of using DFCs (which is the main reason why some players don't like them) without any of the interesting parts that players who like DFCs want to see. A lose-lose, if you will.
My bet is that Ral, Domri, Dovin, Kaya and Jaya will all die, along with a handful of nameless Planeswalker Red Shirts. Most of these characters will have fulfilled their narrative usefulness at the end of the story
Will they though? Kaya certainly hasn't visited all the planes that have Spirits worth assassinating. Ral and Domri haven't even made appearances on other planes. Though admittedly Domri seems kinda superfluous to begin with and overall a far less interesting aspect of the Gruul than e. g. the Raze-Boar. It's rare that a planeswalker doesn't feel mishandled unless it appears on at least two different planes. Xenagos is the only one who I recall having a proper storyline motivated by his planeswalker nature that can be considered fully explored within his homeplane - and we didn't even see his body.
I think one cannot judge a characters remaining narrative usefulness properly without knowing were the story goes. I'd e. g. like to see Dovin's take on witnessing New Phyrexia or its inhabitants. Depending on what story arcs are coming up there is a lot of potential for potential in there.
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Planar Chaos was not a mistake neither was it random. You might want to look at it again.
[thread=239793][Game] Level Up - Creature[/thread]
tbh i could see liliana 'dying' (elspeth style maybe). seems like wizards has gone out of their way to portray her in a light that welcomes a tragic end. the whole 'im conniving and selfish but desperately lonely and deep down i want acceptance but dont know how to change and no one believes me anyways' deal. that and the constant hints at her lingering feelings towards jace, but being trapped by circumstance.
easy platform for heroic self sacrifice if you ask me.
long shot, but its plausible imo. the thing with killing a bunch of 'redshirt' walkers or side characters is that it makes sense on paper, but translating that sense of gravitas/drama in card form doesnt seem very feasible. the set isnt THAT big, and they still have to set the stage for whatever the hell bolas is actually doing that took him like 3-4 years of sets to put into motion.
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Modern: UWGSnow-Bant Control BURGrixis Death's Shadow GWBCoCo Elves WCDeath and Taxes (sold)
Won't happen, we have the whole raven-man thing to solve
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How i feel about competitive players and casual players in EDH: The competitive are german tourists, the casual are italian tourists, both in a italian beach. The italians asking themselves "why are the germans here?" make a legitimate question, the answer is because the beach is beautiful, no matter the country you came from. The italians wanting to ban the germans are dumb, because if the germans pay for their stay and follow the rules like everyone else, they have the right to be in the beach. Hovewer, if the germans started to ask themselves "why are the italians here?"... they would be dumb as hell.
Domri seems like such a waste of a planeswalker. He doesn't seem like the type that wants to visit other worlds and is just content staying where he is.
Won't happen, we have the whole raven-man thing to solve
yeh i didnt forget about that guy, so i put dying in quotes because they could potentially take liliana out of commission where maybe her 'death' isnt explicit or happens under unusual circumstances. like say she has some sort of self sacrifice moment to save jace, is presumed dead, but for some reason the stunned jace believes there has to be more going on and he teams up with the dutiful gideon whom has also gotten closer to liliana to investigate. however that storyline unfolds then segues into the raven man being hashed out.
wild speculation i know lol. i mean i agree that its unlikely when the easier line is lili just surviving, is now finally free from the contract(s) business, and she goes on her way to resolve the chain veil/raven man stuff on her own or reluctantly stays around to either help maybe karn or ajani finish their business on phyrexia/theros (or wherever else). so probably gonna be sideline for a while regardless considering her getting out of the 'serve bolas or die' situation unscathed seems unlikely.
I could see planeswalkers being reprinted in War of the Spark, focusing on planeswalkers available in Standard so as to reduce the number of new planeswalkers being pumped into Standard.
If they want to reprint a bats**t number of planeswalkers, they could limit the majority to high-cost PWs that will likely see less play in Standard, but I'd expect those to be mostly a Masterpieces type of deal. In fact, a Masterpiece set would work nicely here, as a Masterpiece PW could take the place of a WAR planeswalker on occassion, allowing them to appear in packs without putting them into Standard. These could be the planeswalkers printed in WAR:
Gideon Blackblade
Jace, Arbiter of Guilds
Liliana, Slave of Bolas
Chandra, Jaya's Disciple
Ajani, the Gatherer
Nicol Bolas, Elder Dragon
MTGS Wikia Article about "New World Order"
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
PSA to everyone who keeps forgetting about the Reserved List:
You're on a website dedicated to talking about MtG. You're only a few keystrokes away from finding out what cards are on the Reserved List. You're also only a few keystrokes away from finding out why some cards on the Reserved List got foil printings in FtV, as Judge promos, or whatnot, as well as why that won't happen again. Stop doing this.
Domri seems like such a waste of a planeswalker. He doesn't seem like the type that wants to visit other worlds and is just content staying where he is.
I just noed somewhere else how much a planeswalker character is mistreaded in most cases if they do not make appearances on multiple planes. And Domri has a really severe case of that. Nissa eventually broke her Oath over wanting to go home, but at least she wandered first. Even cases like Azor count as better examples, where the character's influence is felt on multiple planes - and Azor didn't even get a planeswalker card (yet).
Considering the stated purpose of planeswalkers is to have characters that can appear across planes such a thing is weird.
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Planar Chaos was not a mistake neither was it random. You might want to look at it again.
[thread=239793][Game] Level Up - Creature[/thread]
Well we haven't exactly visited a lot of planes where Domri wants to go recently. If we return to Alara, there's a chance he'll be there for the Naya portion (and maybe Jund to a lesser extent). Zendikar and Theros might have something for him as well. But most important is that they have a story reason for him to show up somewhere, whether as friend or foe. After WAR, he'll have made contact with a good number of fellow PWs, so he might have more reason to travel to different planes then.
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MTGS Wikia Article about "New World Order"
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
PSA to everyone who keeps forgetting about the Reserved List:
You're on a website dedicated to talking about MtG. You're only a few keystrokes away from finding out what cards are on the Reserved List. You're also only a few keystrokes away from finding out why some cards on the Reserved List got foil printings in FtV, as Judge promos, or whatnot, as well as why that won't happen again. Stop doing this.
Its cause WOTC doesn't allow Nonwalkers to move the plot I agree Domri really doesn't need to be a Walker but post Mending only Walkers can travel Planes and only Walkers get to be main characters. Ergo to influence plot as much as he is doing Domri has to be a Walker. Also he needs to be a Walker to sort of justify his win over Borbo since Neowalkers are always stomping Legends these days.
I mean Wizards wanted 5 Walker aligned with Bolas. However I hardly see them as the main characters of the story. They are supporting cast and therefore kind of low profile.
Vaska, Domri and Ral are all Ravnican and were perfectly happy to be middle management on their home plane for a good chunk of their life. Only Vraska did get a bit of character development but only recently.
Dovin and Kaya were both specifically created to fit into the respective guilds and are therefore a kind of one note characters.
So with the exception of Vraska all of these characters are quite underutilized.
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Drop your knees to the floor
Hands to the sky
Give a round of applause
For the great Miss Y!
Middle Management? They all wanted the Top Job in their Respective Guilds that is hardly middle management. They are basically all on the Heads of Departments or Board Members with Jace or Bolas as CEO.
Won't happen, we have the whole raven-man thing to solve
Yep. Some planeswalkers have varying degrees of usefulness. I could, for instance, see Domri and Nissa teaming up to destroy all civilization throughout the multiverse, but that just puts Domri at about a 6 or 7 on the Venser Scale, same as Koth. Though Gruul fatties are easier to design than red "lands matter". Dovin, Vraska, and Ral all have similarly useful mechanical themes.
Kaya? An assassin is cool, and I still want a Kitty Pryde movie, but both of her incarnations weren't all that useful or fun.
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Card advantage is not the same thing as card draw. Something for 2B cannot be strictly worse than something for BBB or 3BB. If you're taking out Swords to Plowshares for Plummet, you're a fool. Stop doing these things!
I could see planeswalkers being reprinted in War of the Spark, focusing on planeswalkers available in Standard so as to reduce the number of new planeswalkers being pumped into Standard.
If they want to reprint a bats**t number of planeswalkers, they could limit the majority to high-cost PWs that will likely see less play in Standard, but I'd expect those to be mostly a Masterpieces type of deal. In fact, a Masterpiece set would work nicely here, as a Masterpiece PW could take the place of a WAR planeswalker on occassion, allowing them to appear in packs without putting them into Standard. These could be the planeswalkers printed in WAR:
Gideon Blackblade
Jace, Arbiter of Guilds
Liliana, Slave of Bolas
Chandra, Jaya's Disciple
Ajani, the Gatherer
Nicol Bolas, Elder Dragon
Xenagos: Simple weapon? You mean a wepon crafted by a god that crafts deity class items. One that is always at full power and not linked to Nyx? Sure so “simple”. Now Bolas, explain to me how a 40,000+ year old dragon who’s whole focus is being a master manipulator gets out played by a mortal with no where near the power or years of experience to equal said master manipulator? Yeah didn’t think so douche bag. Check-Mate!!
Bolas-😲😤🤕
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WOut of the ground,I rise to grace...W BAfter the lights go out on you, after your worthless life is through. I will remember how you scream...B
All of them were around for two Ravnica blocks and were more or less middle management there. They are now all top of the guild yes. But before that they didn't travel much around the multiverse but were perfectly contained in being somehow in the corperate ladder of their respective guild.
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Drop your knees to the floor
Hands to the sky
Give a round of applause
For the great Miss Y!
I could see Domri joining the Temur at some point, but I’m just kinda sick of Gruul planeswalkers, especially if they made him cost 4 mana. Why has Wizards made so many Gruul planeswalkers that cost 4 mana?
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Modern
JundBGR
RW Blood MoonRW
Pauper
Delver U
Elves G
Control B
Commander
Edgar Markov BRW
Captain Sisay GW
Niv-Mizzet, Parun UR
Tymna and Ravos WB
All of them were around for two Ravnica blocks and were more or less middle management there. They are now all top of the guild yes. But before that they didn't travel much around the multiverse but were perfectly contained in being somehow in the corperate ladder of their respective guild.
Vraska canonically travelled around a lot and brought home plenty of souvenirs including an off-screen trip to Tarkir IIRC. She clearly needed to multitask to become a guildleader while at the same time running errands for Bolas on Ixalan and getting petty revenge on Azorius officials.
Ral gets a story that directly revolves around his role as a planeswalker under direct scrutiny of a curious, smart, egomaniac dragon. While he didn't actually leave the plane much as far as we know the story set up the conflict that kept him into "middle-management" as long as Niv-Mizzet was around and in this way basically set him on a trajectory that naturally lead to him taking over the guild.
One could argue that Ral's story could have ended different ways e. g. abandoning the position under Niv-Mizzet to journey across the planes, but seeing more of the picture you can clearly see that the conflict and ambition always was there. It's just a matter of the timing of the realization of that narrrative possibility better coincides with an event like the final of the Bolas arc than not, but it's been a two-step journey from "introduce Ral" to "make Ral a guild leader".
Domri's case is even more clear-cut since Domri wasn't even middle-management, but pretty much bottom-level rookie right until the moment he ascended, which is the only snapshot we got of him. If anything immediately being revealed to become a guild leader next set makes this a lightning fast career that we would expect beyond the capabilities of lesser characters.
So, Iexpected to yield at least one of these, but I'm not certain why I would.
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Planar Chaos was not a mistake neither was it random. You might want to look at it again.
[thread=239793][Game] Level Up - Creature[/thread]
I mean, that's what DFCs do nowadays. An alternate/additional cost that lets players cast the back side of a DFC or have the permanent enter the battlefield transformed is something that we surprisingly haven't seen yet.
Stay reasonable, be mindful of your expectations and don't feed the trolls.
Doomsdayin'
It's strongly implied that Theran God-hoog is tied quite closely to devotion in not only a mechanical sense, but also thematically. Xenagos probably didn't lose the ignited spark, but by 'walking off-plane he would remove himself from the devotion of his followers and hence the source of his power. It seems reasonable that on a plane without devotees his powers as planeswalker would outrank his powers as God. In addition the powers of the Theran pantheon are tied to Nyx as is shown in about anything that has to do with them, so 'walking out of Theros means also 'walking out of Nyx.
Finally a good white villain quote: "So, do I ever re-evaluate my life choices? Never, because I know what I'm doing is a righteous cause."
Factions: Sleeping
Remnants: Valheim
Legendary Journey: Heroes & Planeswalkers
Saga: Shards of Rabiah
Legends: The Elder Dragons
Read up on Red Flags & NWO
Why not just have double-faced cards that are just two separate cards? Not linked, don't transform. Just two separate cards in one. That would allow them to print more Planeswalkers without increasing the amount of cards in a set, or technically even the number of rares/mythics. Just include a checklist card in every pack.
That would be a nightmare for prerelease and casual formats. If a player is using a deck with the colors of both walkers they could just play whichever one suits them better in that moment and say they forgot to check the box. There would be no real way to deal with that.
No, that isn't a very good idea. Without transformation, there wouldn't be much of an advantage to doing this over just printing two separate cards. It takes all of the inconvenience of using DFCs (which is the main reason why some players don't like them) without any of the interesting parts that players who like DFCs want to see. A lose-lose, if you will.
Will they though? Kaya certainly hasn't visited all the planes that have Spirits worth assassinating. Ral and Domri haven't even made appearances on other planes. Though admittedly Domri seems kinda superfluous to begin with and overall a far less interesting aspect of the Gruul than e. g. the Raze-Boar. It's rare that a planeswalker doesn't feel mishandled unless it appears on at least two different planes. Xenagos is the only one who I recall having a proper storyline motivated by his planeswalker nature that can be considered fully explored within his homeplane - and we didn't even see his body.
I think one cannot judge a characters remaining narrative usefulness properly without knowing were the story goes. I'd e. g. like to see Dovin's take on witnessing New Phyrexia or its inhabitants. Depending on what story arcs are coming up there is a lot of potential for potential in there.
Finally a good white villain quote: "So, do I ever re-evaluate my life choices? Never, because I know what I'm doing is a righteous cause."
Factions: Sleeping
Remnants: Valheim
Legendary Journey: Heroes & Planeswalkers
Saga: Shards of Rabiah
Legends: The Elder Dragons
Read up on Red Flags & NWO
easy platform for heroic self sacrifice if you ask me.
long shot, but its plausible imo. the thing with killing a bunch of 'redshirt' walkers or side characters is that it makes sense on paper, but translating that sense of gravitas/drama in card form doesnt seem very feasible. the set isnt THAT big, and they still have to set the stage for whatever the hell bolas is actually doing that took him like 3-4 years of sets to put into motion.
UWGSnow-Bant Control
BURGrixis Death's Shadow
GWBCoCo Elves
WCDeath and Taxes(sold)Won't happen, we have the whole raven-man thing to solve
What if her death releases the Raven Man or something, setting up the next big bad?
He is already released. He's in Darksiders II, and he's annoying as hell.
wild speculation i know lol. i mean i agree that its unlikely when the easier line is lili just surviving, is now finally free from the contract(s) business, and she goes on her way to resolve the chain veil/raven man stuff on her own or reluctantly stays around to either help maybe karn or ajani finish their business on phyrexia/theros (or wherever else). so probably gonna be sideline for a while regardless considering her getting out of the 'serve bolas or die' situation unscathed seems unlikely.
UWGSnow-Bant Control
BURGrixis Death's Shadow
GWBCoCo Elves
WCDeath and Taxes(sold)W Ajani, Adversary of Tyrants
W Gideon Blackblade
U Jace, Arbiter of Guilds
U Tezzeret, Artifice Master
B Liliana, Untouched by Death
R Chandra, Jaya's Disciple
R Sarkhan, Fireblood
G Vivien Reid
WU Dovin, Grand Arbiter
BR Angrath, the Flame-Chained
RG Domri, Chaos Bringer
WB Kaya, Orzhov Usurper
UR Ral, Izzet Viceroy
BG Vraska, Golgari Queen
RW Huatli, Warrior Poet
UBR Nicol Bolas, Elder Dragon
If they want to reprint a bats**t number of planeswalkers, they could limit the majority to high-cost PWs that will likely see less play in Standard, but I'd expect those to be mostly a Masterpieces type of deal. In fact, a Masterpiece set would work nicely here, as a Masterpiece PW could take the place of a WAR planeswalker on occassion, allowing them to appear in packs without putting them into Standard. These could be the planeswalkers printed in WAR:
Jace, Arbiter of Guilds
Liliana, Slave of Bolas
Chandra, Jaya's Disciple
Ajani, the Gatherer
Nicol Bolas, Elder Dragon
And these could be the Masterpiece PWs:
Bolas: You also died to a blade on a stick. What kind of idiot god lets a mortal kill them with a simple weapon?
*Gideon quietly unsheathes Blackblade*
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
I just noed somewhere else how much a planeswalker character is mistreaded in most cases if they do not make appearances on multiple planes. And Domri has a really severe case of that. Nissa eventually broke her Oath over wanting to go home, but at least she wandered first. Even cases like Azor count as better examples, where the character's influence is felt on multiple planes - and Azor didn't even get a planeswalker card (yet).
Considering the stated purpose of planeswalkers is to have characters that can appear across planes such a thing is weird.
Finally a good white villain quote: "So, do I ever re-evaluate my life choices? Never, because I know what I'm doing is a righteous cause."
Factions: Sleeping
Remnants: Valheim
Legendary Journey: Heroes & Planeswalkers
Saga: Shards of Rabiah
Legends: The Elder Dragons
Read up on Red Flags & NWO
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
Vaska, Domri and Ral are all Ravnican and were perfectly happy to be middle management on their home plane for a good chunk of their life. Only Vraska did get a bit of character development but only recently.
Dovin and Kaya were both specifically created to fit into the respective guilds and are therefore a kind of one note characters.
So with the exception of Vraska all of these characters are quite underutilized.
Hands to the sky
Give a round of applause
For the great Miss Y!
Yep. Some planeswalkers have varying degrees of usefulness. I could, for instance, see Domri and Nissa teaming up to destroy all civilization throughout the multiverse, but that just puts Domri at about a 6 or 7 on the Venser Scale, same as Koth. Though Gruul fatties are easier to design than red "lands matter". Dovin, Vraska, and Ral all have similarly useful mechanical themes.
Kaya? An assassin is cool, and I still want a Kitty Pryde movie, but both of her incarnations weren't all that useful or fun.
On phasing:
Xenagos: Simple weapon? You mean a wepon crafted by a god that crafts deity class items. One that is always at full power and not linked to Nyx? Sure so “simple”. Now Bolas, explain to me how a 40,000+ year old dragon who’s whole focus is being a master manipulator gets out played by a mortal with no where near the power or years of experience to equal said master manipulator? Yeah didn’t think so douche bag. Check-Mate!!
Bolas-😲😤🤕
BAfter the lights go out on you, after your worthless life is through. I will remember how you scream...B
Hands to the sky
Give a round of applause
For the great Miss Y!
JundBGR
RW Blood MoonRW
Pauper
Delver U
Elves G
Control B
Commander
Edgar Markov BRW
Captain Sisay GW
Niv-Mizzet, Parun UR
Tymna and Ravos WB
Vraska canonically travelled around a lot and brought home plenty of souvenirs including an off-screen trip to Tarkir IIRC. She clearly needed to multitask to become a guildleader while at the same time running errands for Bolas on Ixalan and getting petty revenge on Azorius officials.
Ral gets a story that directly revolves around his role as a planeswalker under direct scrutiny of a curious, smart, egomaniac dragon. While he didn't actually leave the plane much as far as we know the story set up the conflict that kept him into "middle-management" as long as Niv-Mizzet was around and in this way basically set him on a trajectory that naturally lead to him taking over the guild.
One could argue that Ral's story could have ended different ways e. g. abandoning the position under Niv-Mizzet to journey across the planes, but seeing more of the picture you can clearly see that the conflict and ambition always was there. It's just a matter of the timing of the realization of that narrrative possibility better coincides with an event like the final of the Bolas arc than not, but it's been a two-step journey from "introduce Ral" to "make Ral a guild leader".
Domri's case is even more clear-cut since Domri wasn't even middle-management, but pretty much bottom-level rookie right until the moment he ascended, which is the only snapshot we got of him. If anything immediately being revealed to become a guild leader next set makes this a lightning fast career that we would expect beyond the capabilities of lesser characters.
So, Iexpected to yield at least one of these, but I'm not certain why I would.
Finally a good white villain quote: "So, do I ever re-evaluate my life choices? Never, because I know what I'm doing is a righteous cause."
Factions: Sleeping
Remnants: Valheim
Legendary Journey: Heroes & Planeswalkers
Saga: Shards of Rabiah
Legends: The Elder Dragons
Read up on Red Flags & NWO