I feel like they overstated things by calling the Jund deck "lands matter". "Lands are kinda nifty" or "I wouldn't mind a land or two" would be more accurate.
"It's a lands matter deck."
"How?"
*without irony* "You can't play spells unless you play lands."
*mouth falls open*
As promised, I am mildly annoyed for not reprinting the Top on a deck that cares on the top (see what i did there) of your library. Lazy deckbuilding at its finest.
I agree that this deck was the obvious place for it, and with the increases price it seemed like they might do it, but to call it "lazy deck building" is just wrong. Putting all the obvious cards in is closer to the definition of lazy. Be more constructive with your critique. Calling it "lazy" is just mean and, well frankly, lazy.
Call it malicious laziness, then. As in "We can make the decks halfway decent, buuuuuuut don't really feel like going to all that work, so yeah, just...do...whatever. Yeah."
It's kind of their JOB, to make us happy and excited and in a mood to dispense money. Well, within reason. And it's just...it's like they have just reached the point where they don't care whether it sells or not, so long as they just make it.
As promised, I am mildly annoyed for not reprinting the Top on a deck that cares on the top (see what i did there) of your library. Lazy deckbuilding at its finest.
I agree that this deck was the obvious place for it, and with the increases price it seemed like they might do it, but to call it "lazy deck building" is just wrong. Putting all the obvious cards in is closer to the definition of lazy. Be more constructive with your critique. Calling it "lazy" is just mean and, well frankly, lazy.
Okay. Apparently it is not that obvious to add cards that provide synergy with the main theme of the deck. That's not lazy in my book. Also I don't see many cards that enable the blink ability of the face card of the deck as well. Also there are 3 zombie related cards supporting the zombie theme of the other commander. As for the Sphinx, at least they managed to add enough odd numbered cards. I guess that's something..
EDIT: Top isn't even critical in making the deck a little more streamlined. Just add more topdeck manipulation
EDIT2: Someone who played commander less than a year can understand that the Jund lands deck is all over the place. Not my fault to feel a little disappointed, since the company hyped the decks with those themes.
The only nonbasic land in all four of these decks that produces colored mana and enters the board untapped is Command Tower. Everything else enters tapped. Unbelievable. They couldn't even have chucked us some Amulet of Vigors to make up for their parsimony.
These decks feel like the Commander version of Welcome decks. I'll spend $100 on all the new singles and wash my hands of this.
I spent the value of a single one of these new EDH decks on singles this year, of just the 56 new cards and I'm very glad I chose to do that this time around. The set felt underpowered even previewing the exclusive 56 cards and now my suspicion has been confirmed. C18 is something I'll cherry pick a few singles from and be done with
It's nice seeing Unwinding Clock and Enchantress's Presence. But I will say that I was also hoping for Greater Auramancy. The issue I have with cards like Worldy Tutor, Sylvan Tutor, Greater Auramancy, Training Grounds, and so on... is that Masters sets don't have them, Commander decks don't, they just never show up anywhere. So can we ever expect to see them? Sometimes it feels like certain cards are always going to be a barrier to Commander. I often joke that there's a secret commander reserved list we don't know about. Battlebond was, strangely, the best reprint set in the last few years. IDK. I would put more of those $10-20 cards in these sets.
EDIT: Top isn't even critical in making the deck a little more streamlined. Just add more topdeck manipulation
Like Soothsaying. That thing is years overdue for a reprint.
I see I wasn't the only one mildly hoping for a reprint of Soothsaying... It's really weird they don't reprint it at all.
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What's the most resilient parasite? An idea.
A single idea from the human mind can build cities.
An idea can transform the world and rewrite all the rules...
Why don't they, instead of doing a whole Commander deck, just print supplemental products instead? Just print 20-40 new cards every year and move reprints to another format? Oh wait, they can't do that, because reprints would UTTERLY ANNIHILATE the delicate balance of all the other formats!
This is not a hard problem to solve, Wizards. It's not hard at all. A five year old could solve it. The people you're afraid of making angry are the people who aren't playing the game, but are, through their chicanery, making it harder for the rest of US, your REAL PLAYER BASE, to play the game.
There will come a time, mark my words, when all you're left with is oblivious Timmys happily swinging Bogstompers at each other every game because you don't have the balls to reprint what's necessary. Because you're afraid of upsetting investors. IT'S A CARD GAME, NOT THE STOCK MARKET. GET YOUR HEADS ROUND THAT FACT.
EDIT: Imagine if every time they made a new version of Monopoly they started removing streets on the board because 'people gaining control of these streets had a warping effect on gameplay'. It's that same stupid kind of logic. The more you hold back, the less fun the game is. The less fun the game is, the less people are going to want to play it.
I'm gonna be honest I was not expecting good manabases. The best we got was from the 4 color commander decks and even then we got pain lands at best. Wizards just hates putting decent dual lands in mass produced preconstructed decks. They always have and they always will. I was also not expecting high value cards like Greater Auramancy or Sensei's Divining Top because that's pretty ridiculous to expect in a mass produced preconstructed product.
And these decks still don't exactly live up to expectations. The new cards are pretty good and there's some neat things to see again here and there like Scrabbling Claws, Unwinding Clock, Portent, Telling Time, and Ground Seal but the deck design is just so uninspired. Even the likes of Mirror Mastery, Draconic Domination, and Peer Through Time made for better deck foundations than what we have here.
Also, holy cow is black doing nothing in the "top of library" deck. There's a handful of new black cards that deal with the topdeck, but new cards can always just be redesigned to accommodate a different color identity. It's the preexisting cards that really justify a deck's colors, but the only reprints that that were used that justify black's inclusion are Duskmantle Seer and Enigma Sphinx. I get why you wouldn't reprint Vampiric Tutor or the other valuable topdeck tutors in a precon. I also get why you wouldn't reprint Dark Confidant in a precon. But there's still a bunch of stuff they could've included. How about another Dark Confidant variant? They didn't have to stop at just Duskmantle Seer; it's fine to have more than one. Maybe some clash or explore cards? Or maybe more than just one cascade card? And Baneful Omen seems like a no-brainer. Gravepurge or Haunted Crossroads could be used to set up something neat. Lim-Dul's Vault is always great. I'm just brainstorming here, and I'm coming up with better stuff than friggin' Serra Avatar. Which of the deck's themes is that supposed to be part of?
I already pre-ordered some singles yesterday since it became obvious that this set was going to be a disappointment. Still, I underestimated the extent of said disappointment. They really couldn't throw in the odd checkland or even a scry Temple?!
Forty. F**king. Dollars. Each.
You know, Dominaria was awesome, Battlebond was pretty rad, and Core 19 was fine. I was beginning to think that a course correction was in progress, especially after the overpriced turds that were Iconic Masters and Masters 25. Commander 18 just proves that they still need to right the ship.
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Can you name all of the creature types with at least 20 cards? Try my Sporcle Quiz! Last Updated: 6/29/20 (Core Set 2021).
Also, holy cow is black doing nothing in the "top of library" deck. There's a handful of new black cards that deal with the topdeck, but new cards can always just be redesigned to accommodate a different color identity. It's the preexisting cards that really justify a deck's colors, but the only reprints that that were used that justify black's inclusion are Duskmantle Seer and Enigma Sphinx. I get why you wouldn't reprint Vampiric Tutor or the other valuable topdeck tutors in a precon. I also get why you wouldn't reprint Dark Confidant in a precon. But there's still a bunch of stuff they could've included. How about another Dark Confidant variant? They didn't have to stop at just Duskmantle Seer; it's fine to have more than one. Maybe some clash or explore cards? Or maybe more than just one cascade card? And Baneful Omen seems like a no-brainer. Gravepurge or Haunted Crossroads could be used to set up something neat. Lim-Dul's Vault is always great. I'm just brainstorming here, and I'm coming up with better stuff than friggin' Serra Avatar. Which of the deck's themes is that supposed to be part of?
Serra Avatar is supposed to be the last stab in the heart of the realization that we'll never get a Serra card in this game's existence. Unless they make some From The Vault product with Serra, Yawgmoth, The All-Consuming Oni of Chaos and all of that jazz. They wouldn't though, because they don't know how to make good product 85% of the time.
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"The essence of every world, every spell and every thought is power. Nothing else matters, because nothing else exists."
I’ve been more and more excited each year as the commander products come out. Last year I bought two decks and one of them I ramped up with full fetches, shocks, etc.
I was mildly excited for the jund and Esper decks this round but all of these decks are incredibly uninspired. People have already pointed out the abundance of missing cards. And I understand the design philosophy that these should not be ‘done’ out of the box.
I am excited for 1 card. That is the only one I will be ordering.
EDIT: Top isn't even critical in making the deck a little more streamlined. Just add more topdeck manipulation
Like Soothsaying. That thing is years overdue for a reprint.
I see I wasn't the only one mildly hoping for a reprint of Soothsaying... It's really weird they don't reprint it at all.
I wasn't really "hoping" for a Soothsaying reprint, since I don't really need the card, but I certainly was expecting it. It's an old card that's never been reprinted, it fits the deck's theme like a glove, and they don't even have the "it would upset collectors" excuse. It makes perfect sense to reprint it. I cannot fathom why they didn't, unless the entire design team had the exact same memory lapse.
Ugh. I won't be wasting one cent on any of these sealed "decks". And I'm not sure there is a single reprint I need secondary market either.
I had to share this one from DISQUS on Goldfish.
These aren't as bad as people are making out, sure the manabases and reprints suck but these are still good products...
That is like talking about pizza and saying, yeah the crust, sauce and cheese sucks but its still a good pizza. Of course, what should I expect, its Commander.
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Playing since 1994: Currently MAGS (HomeBrew),Standard & Pauper (Pioneer and Modern are degenerate trash formats)
STOP using "dude/bro" as a pejorative or insult. Grow up.
Margaret Thatcher: “The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.”
Benjamin Franklin: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
Martin Luther King Jr.: "I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character."
I keep laughing at Nature's Vengeance. Like, man what a deck design. I'm sure it couldn't be an actual Lands.dec because it does things that Wizards does not want to encourage nowadays, like spam strip mine effects, but the precon still doesn't make any sense. It's like, the most awkward ramp deck really.
I don't understand why they wouldn't even use the dual lands from Battlebond. Seriously, it was such a great idea that fits Commander so well and all we get are the same taplands as always?
I will say this - the idea of searching online for what we wanted and filling in Commander gaps, knocking 4 past characters off the list (especially Arixmethes for me) and even delivering Ninja and Enchantress commanders was brilliant, and shows progress and improvement with this product. I am so happy they designed so many cards top-down rather than bottom-up this year.
I think they should maintain this approach next year, but next time, work on their reprint policy. Because this is now where these are lacking... and not for any valid reason. But I'm not going to be too harsh on them, because honestly, these really are fun decks. But they really should stop using the "for beginners" excuse to not introduce more value, because a great way for a beginner to turn away from Commander is having to spend a fortune on the secondary market. Worse, you don't want to establish the idea of spending more money on the secondary market and less on official product. And that's damage to WOTC and Commander players at once.
It's senseless that I have to pay $50 on a Sylvan Tutor so I can have more search options for Arixmethes in my deck. Why hasn't this card ever been reprinted? It's not reserved list. We have it bad enough with that, we don't need the RL mentality to creep into a policy that involves every card over $5.
Let's all agree not to buy this overpriced mess, grab the singles we want from ebay and then maybe things will improve next year!
Or we won't get one next year because people won't buy this metaphorical piece of garbage. It's sort of a catch 22 moment. Damned if you do, damned if you don't. Only real option we have is to voice our disappointment to the various WotC reps.
Oh well, time to dust of the actual lands matters cards in the Jund colors so I can actually get a playable deck out of it.
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It's about time for the reserved list to die, for the sake of Vintage and Legacy (And Commander).
I don't understand why they wouldn't even use the dual lands from Battlebond. Seriously, it was such a great idea that fits Commander so well and all we get are the same taplands as always?
Good point, I was sure they were going to include those, they are so amazing.
The preview cards are generally quite interesting, but I feel the rest of the cards were just thrown in with little thought. Too many bland cards or filler that we have seen way too much in commander decks. I was really hoping for more... I canceled my order and will only be purchasing singles.
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"It's a lands matter deck."
"How?"
*without irony* "You can't play spells unless you play lands."
*mouth falls open*
Call it malicious laziness, then. As in "We can make the decks halfway decent, buuuuuuut don't really feel like going to all that work, so yeah, just...do...whatever. Yeah."
It's kind of their JOB, to make us happy and excited and in a mood to dispense money. Well, within reason. And it's just...it's like they have just reached the point where they don't care whether it sells or not, so long as they just make it.
Okay. Apparently it is not that obvious to add cards that provide synergy with the main theme of the deck. That's not lazy in my book. Also I don't see many cards that enable the blink ability of the face card of the deck as well. Also there are 3 zombie related cards supporting the zombie theme of the other commander. As for the Sphinx, at least they managed to add enough odd numbered cards. I guess that's something..
EDIT: Top isn't even critical in making the deck a little more streamlined. Just add more topdeck manipulation
EDIT2: Someone who played commander less than a year can understand that the Jund lands deck is all over the place. Not my fault to feel a little disappointed, since the company hyped the decks with those themes.
Marath, Will of the Wild
Friendly Kess Twin Combo
Tatyova - Sir Bounce A Lot
Gonti's Luxury Pie
Prime (Eldrazi) Speaker Zegana (Retired)
I spent the value of a single one of these new EDH decks on singles this year, of just the 56 new cards and I'm very glad I chose to do that this time around. The set felt underpowered even previewing the exclusive 56 cards and now my suspicion has been confirmed. C18 is something I'll cherry pick a few singles from and be done with
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/magic-fundamentals/magic-general/334931-what-is-the-most-pimp-card-deck-youve-seen-or?comment=5361
Commander
RGOmnath, Locus of Rage Grenades! EDHGR
UWSygg's Defense, EDH - Voltron & ControlWU
BUGMimeoplasm EDH ft. Ifnir Cycling-discard comboBUG
WBTeysa, Connoisseur of CullingBW
BWSelenia & Recruiter of the Guard suicice combo EDHWB
UBRWGO-Kagachi - 5 Color Enchantments - EDHUBRWG
I think the Bant deck is still really good.
Want list:
1. Arixmethes, Slumbering Isle
2. Yuriko, the Tiger's Shadow
3. Coveted Jewel
4. Octopus Umbra
5. Echo Storm
6. Endless Atlas
7. Aminatou's Augury
8. Boreas Charger
9. Loyal Unicorn
10. Tuvasa the Sunlit
11. Empyrial Storm
12. Tawnos, Urza's Apprentice
|| UW Jace, Vyn's Prodigy UW || UG Kenessos, Priest of Thassa (feat. Arixmethes) UG ||
Cards I still want to see created:
|| Olantin, Lost City || Pavios and Thanasis || Choryu ||
I see I wasn't the only one mildly hoping for a reprint of Soothsaying... It's really weird they don't reprint it at all.
An idea.
A single idea from the human mind can build cities.
An idea can transform the world and rewrite all the rules...
Proud father of 25 EDH decks
Yeah why should they reprint an uncommon from Mercadian Masques? The collectors will rage and roar!
Marath, Will of the Wild
Friendly Kess Twin Combo
Tatyova - Sir Bounce A Lot
Gonti's Luxury Pie
Prime (Eldrazi) Speaker Zegana (Retired)
This is not a hard problem to solve, Wizards. It's not hard at all. A five year old could solve it. The people you're afraid of making angry are the people who aren't playing the game, but are, through their chicanery, making it harder for the rest of US, your REAL PLAYER BASE, to play the game.
There will come a time, mark my words, when all you're left with is oblivious Timmys happily swinging Bogstompers at each other every game because you don't have the balls to reprint what's necessary. Because you're afraid of upsetting investors. IT'S A CARD GAME, NOT THE STOCK MARKET. GET YOUR HEADS ROUND THAT FACT.
EDIT: Imagine if every time they made a new version of Monopoly they started removing streets on the board because 'people gaining control of these streets had a warping effect on gameplay'. It's that same stupid kind of logic. The more you hold back, the less fun the game is. The less fun the game is, the less people are going to want to play it.
Hands to the sky
Give a round of applause
For the great Miss Y!
And these decks still don't exactly live up to expectations. The new cards are pretty good and there's some neat things to see again here and there like Scrabbling Claws, Unwinding Clock, Portent, Telling Time, and Ground Seal but the deck design is just so uninspired. Even the likes of Mirror Mastery, Draconic Domination, and Peer Through Time made for better deck foundations than what we have here.
Ah well they'll still be fun to collect.
Forty. F**king. Dollars. Each.
You know, Dominaria was awesome, Battlebond was pretty rad, and Core 19 was fine. I was beginning to think that a course correction was in progress, especially after the overpriced turds that were Iconic Masters and Masters 25. Commander 18 just proves that they still need to right the ship.
My 720 Peasant Cube
Serra Avatar is supposed to be the last stab in the heart of the realization that we'll never get a Serra card in this game's existence. Unless they make some From The Vault product with Serra, Yawgmoth, The All-Consuming Oni of Chaos and all of that jazz. They wouldn't though, because they don't know how to make good product 85% of the time.
I was mildly excited for the jund and Esper decks this round but all of these decks are incredibly uninspired. People have already pointed out the abundance of missing cards. And I understand the design philosophy that these should not be ‘done’ out of the box.
I am excited for 1 card. That is the only one I will be ordering.
I had to share this one from DISQUS on Goldfish.
That is like talking about pizza and saying, yeah the crust, sauce and cheese sucks but its still a good pizza. Of course, what should I expect, its Commander.
STOP using "dude/bro" as a pejorative or insult. Grow up.
Margaret Thatcher: “The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.”
Benjamin Franklin: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
Martin Luther King Jr.: "I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character."
I think they should maintain this approach next year, but next time, work on their reprint policy. Because this is now where these are lacking... and not for any valid reason. But I'm not going to be too harsh on them, because honestly, these really are fun decks. But they really should stop using the "for beginners" excuse to not introduce more value, because a great way for a beginner to turn away from Commander is having to spend a fortune on the secondary market. Worse, you don't want to establish the idea of spending more money on the secondary market and less on official product. And that's damage to WOTC and Commander players at once.
It's senseless that I have to pay $50 on a Sylvan Tutor so I can have more search options for Arixmethes in my deck. Why hasn't this card ever been reprinted? It's not reserved list. We have it bad enough with that, we don't need the RL mentality to creep into a policy that involves every card over $5.
|| UW Jace, Vyn's Prodigy UW || UG Kenessos, Priest of Thassa (feat. Arixmethes) UG ||
Cards I still want to see created:
|| Olantin, Lost City || Pavios and Thanasis || Choryu ||
Or we won't get one next year because people won't buy this metaphorical piece of garbage. It's sort of a catch 22 moment. Damned if you do, damned if you don't. Only real option we have is to voice our disappointment to the various WotC reps.
Oh well, time to dust of the actual lands matters cards in the Jund colors so I can actually get a playable deck out of it.
---
Numquam evolutioni obstes. Solum conculceris.
Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.
The preview cards are generally quite interesting, but I feel the rest of the cards were just thrown in with little thought. Too many bland cards or filler that we have seen way too much in commander decks. I was really hoping for more... I canceled my order and will only be purchasing singles.