I suppose they are referencing Bolas behind the scenes activities? But yeah Bolas only came to the forefront for Hours of Devastation.
And yes it does seem a bit too soon for a rematch but I suppose Jace got his powers fully unlocked, Chandra trained with Jaya, and Gideon got the Blackblade.
Plus Teferi is joining and presumably Ajani has recruited some other walkers.
But yes story wise color me not impressed by the build up and feeling like we were rushing to another Eldrazi Titans fall to Channel Fireball. But hey if Bolas kills one Gatewatcher he will out perform Three Eldrazi Titans.
Ya know, if this is the supposed showdown with Bolas, it makes me wonder what they plan to do with the Gatewatch following any conclusion at the end of Ravnica Allegiance, assuming Bolas meets his long-last fall from grace. Will this be the end of the existing Gatewatch and replaced with a new cast of characters with a new story arc, or will they continue on to finish off Emrakul still stuck in the Innistradi moon?
Wonders will never cease!
'buster
They been setting up nice rogues gallery with Dovin, Ob, Nahiri and Garuuk, as well as possibly Sorin who have issues with one or more of the gatewatch. And a few people have pointed out Tezzeret might be a threat if he can get out of Bolas claws.
I think will go with a team of big bads if do a major walker threat again ...a League of Villains so to speak because past Bolas and Ugin no one walker is strong enough to really menace a team alone.
Depends how the gatewatch looks after Bolas and the story direction. Might be we only see one or two of them on a world at a time.
I mean maybe some of the names you mentioned we be good enough for the Old Jacetice League 1 v team but a new one with Teferi, Karn and Jaya around yeah not a chance.
Only Teferi is taking an oath. To me Jaya is going to pull a Toph and say "I'm to old for this ***** (as in physically) and go back to Regatha at the end of Dominaria (possible to help protect it against Bolas) and unknown if Karn will say or if his goal of fighting Phyrexia is all he cares bout.
Plus your underestimate Nahiri, Ob and Sorin who all where old walkers and iirc are older or close to as old Karn, Teferi and Jaya are.
Still I think Phyrexia is next. Its the most obvious threat and has build up.
Sure I've been pointing out how they have set up future villains.
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I wish but how likely do you think it is WOTC is going to kill most of them and bench the rest for whole sets?
I am just saying at this point only Bolas or Ugin is known solo walker threat against a Gatewatch of even just Jace, Chandra, Gideon, Ajani and Teferi. Of those names you mentioned Nahiri has the best chance because Leyline Manipulation is hax so with setup she can do crazy things. And some of the rest are straight laughable like Dovin. I do like the Toph Reference.
Fair Enough.
Honestly, if I was making a team that wanted to hunt down the Gatewatch and Friends. It probably be Nahiri got in the way of her revenge, Tezz plenty of beef with Jace, Garruk not a fan of Jace or the Gatewatch being friends with Lili...and maybe KOTH depending on if Karn joins especially if he actually nukes New Phyrexia and Elspeth depending on how she is feeling after getting out of the Underworld, I can see her not being all that happy to see Ajani. Sorin might have beef but he should be grateful considering the Gatewatch saved Innistrad from Nahiri. And Dovin eh forgettable. Kinda hard to predict without knowing the size and membership of the Gatewatch at the end of the arc.
I wish but how likely do you think it is WOTC is going to kill most of them and bench the rest for whole sets?
They done that for the most part. Lore-wise SoI only had Jace and Liliana show up, Kaladesh only had Gideon and Jace show up at the end, Amonkhet didn't have Ajani, Ixalan only had Jace in both sets and Dominaria only have the whole team for a second between all the stories but its mostly Gideon, Liliana and Chandra.
I could see Jace being busy with the aftermath of Bolas, part of his growth during Ixalan was him realizing he been a horrible guildpact and wanting to do better.
I am just saying at this point only Bolas or Ugin is known solo walker threat against a Gatewatch of even just Jace, Chandra, Gideon, Ajani and Teferi. Of those names you mentioned Nahiri has the best chance because Leyline Manipulation is hax so with setup she can do crazy things. And some of the rest are straight laughable like Dovin. I do like the Toph Reference.
I wouldn't say Sorin isn't a threat.
I only mention Dovin since Maro mentions it so I take as a hint creative is going to bring him back un happy with the gatewatch.
[Sorin might have beef but he should be grateful considering the Gatewatch saved Innistrad from Nahiri.
Or be pissed they left Emrakul in the moon, especially if what most guess come to past, Emrakul influence will still drive people mad and turn them into eldrazi ( somewhere in the a middle of how she was felt during SoI and Eldritch Moon).
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“There are no weak Jews. I am descended from those who wrestle angels and kill giants. We were chosen by God. You were chosen by a pathetic little man who can't seem to grow a full mustache"
"You can tell how dumb someone is by how they use Mary Sue"
Ob and Tezzeret are both the kind of person to ally with people they don't particularly care for, if it means accomplishing their goals. And I could see both Ashiok and Tibalt taking orders from/playing along with a big bad, so long as they get what they want. That right there could be the basis for a villain team.
Oh I will throw a parade if this ends the Gatewatch Story and we shift focus to new group for the Second Phyrexian War (as Phyrexia is the most likely next threat with Bolas and Titans off the table) which really the Gatewatch has little connection to...Karn, Teferi, KOTH, etc should be the focus of such a story.
Sadly I think it's highly unlikely, given that any new set that involves New Phyrexia/Mirrodin would be judged by the player base on the standards of the old New Phyrexia block, in terms of power level. If that new set doesn't have cards on the same power level as Mox Opal, Phyrexian Obliterator, Karn Liberated et al., players will see it as a step down.
Also, a new war involving New Phyrexia would be... what, the fifth Phyrexian war? (The Thran civil war, The Brothers' War, the Invasion and the one for Mirrodin being one through four).
Weren't technically Phyrexia for the Thran Civil War
Eh Proxy War at best for Brother's
Was counting Invasion
Mirrodin Resistance got rekt.
Only counting wars when one plane attacks another plane.
By the time of the Thran Civil War, Yawgmoth's followers were already calling themselves Phyrexians, turning themselves into techno-organic monstrosities, and were largely operating out of Phyrexia. I mean, it's commonly referred to as the Thran-Phyrexian War; it definitely counts.
Ajani has barely been a member so far quite frankly.
I said solo threat of the names you mentioned Nahiri is the biggest. Not that Sorin is no threat at all. He also has the added barrier of escape from rock.
Yeah but he cannot really expect them to be able to get Emrakul off plane. He might have beef against them but he still go after Nahiri first or Olivia. Whereas Nahiri is more likely to go after the Jacetice League first. Granted Sorin might not be rational after being stuck in a rock.
“It's going to be a wild ride as we return to one of Magic's favorite planes, and the long-boiling war with Nicol Bolas reaches its crescendo.“
Long boiling war?!?
The Gatewatch literally confronted Edit: Bolas for the first time just recently on Amonkhet!!
Even only counting the current arc of the Bolas storyline, he's had his fingers in the pie since Kaladesh, which means the entire current Standard rotation has in some way been influenced by him.
That said, Bolas has been around being a pain in the ass for a lot longer. Going only 60 years back in-universe, he fought Teferi on Dominaria shortly before The Mending, facilitated Liliana's deal with the demons, caused war to break out across Alara leading to a conflict with Ajani, and manipulated Sarkhan, Chandra, and Jace into opening the Eye of Ugin and releasing the imprisoned Eldrazi titans on Zendikar. And that's not even counting his interests in New Phyrexia and Kamigawa, neither of which have been explored as of yet in story, nor does it cover the thousands of years of general villainy he was responsible for pre-Mending.
So yes, I think "long-boiling" is an apt description of the overarching conflict with Bolas.
“It's going to be a wild ride as we return to one of Magic's favorite planes, and the long-boiling war with Nicol Bolas reaches its crescendo.“
Long boiling war?!?
The Gatewatch literally confronted Edit: Bolas for the first time just recently on Amonkhet!!
Even only counting the current arc of the Bolas storyline, he's had his fingers in the pie since Kaladesh, which means the entire current Standard rotation has in some way been influenced by him.
That said, Bolas has been around being a pain in the ass for a lot longer. Going only 60 years back in-universe, he fought Teferi on Dominaria shortly before The Mending, facilitated Liliana's deal with the demons, caused war to break out across Alara leading to a conflict with Ajani, and manipulated Sarkhan, Chandra, and Jace into opening the Eye of Ugin and releasing the imprisoned Eldrazi titans on Zendikar. And that's not even counting his interests in New Phyrexia and Kamigawa, neither of which have been explored as of yet in story, nor does it cover the thousands of years of general villainy he was responsible for pre-Mending.
So yes, I think "long-boiling" is an apt description of the overarching conflict with Bolas.
I am quite familiar with Mtg lore thank-you on the subject of both Bolas and the current storyline.
AND I STILL think it’s much too soon. There needs to be a better build up of the Planeswalkers regrouping and coming together before a rematch in my opinion.
I like Ravnica. But I wanted more time
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Wizards. listen. The Vorthos community will await the consequences of the Eldrazi Titans' deaths/sealing. We will keep the watch.
“The wind whispers, ‘come home,’ but I cannot.”
— Teferi
I could see Jace getting one PW card. Vraska too. There are too many Planeswalkers on Ravnica for the showdown for any to get multiples.
At least Ral Zarek can come out to Daddy Niv as a planeswalker.
With how many there may be I actually hope we get like twenty, or more, of them. If there is some nutty PW centric war/battle the more the better in my book.
So Ravnica gets to have the Lands most associated with its Plane but Dominaria doesn't get the same treatment? Ravnica gets three sets but Dominaria can only get one... SMFH. All I can say is they better push the power on that Third Ravnica Infinity War Set.
I counted 10 Walkers Confirmed. And that is not counting any maybes like Jaya or Karn or anybody Ajani could have rounded up or anybody who should show up but might not like Domri Rade.
Hurt so bad to watch that video. Why are they there again?
To give Gavin Verhey someone to squint at.
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Playing since 1994: Currently MAGS (HomeBrew),Standard & Pauper (Pioneer and Modern are degenerate trash formats)
STOP using "dude/bro" as a pejorative or insult. Grow up.
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I don't see why everyone is hating on Maria and Meghan so much. If anything their enthusiasm is a welcome departure from the Verheytron's preprogrammed corporate musings.
I don't see why everyone is hating on Maria and Meghan so much. If anything their enthusiasm is a welcome departure from the Verheytron's preprogrammed corporate musings.
I agree. While cheesy, they were still fun. Cheesy is much preferable to over-the-top ‘edgy’.
The same way we love, and cringe at ‘dad jokes’
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Wizards. listen. The Vorthos community will await the consequences of the Eldrazi Titans' deaths/sealing. We will keep the watch.
“The wind whispers, ‘come home,’ but I cannot.”
— Teferi
So Ravnica gets to have the Lands most associated with its Plane but Dominaria doesn't get the same treatment?
To be fair, Dominaria's mana is still severely depleted from the Invasion and the rifts, while Ravnica's is known for being plentiful and varied. So there's at least an explanation for that from a lore standpoint.
And while I am admittedly a big fan of Ravnica sets - as are many, many others, which is why they keep going back there - I do hope Dominaria gets a bit more spotlight going forward.
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Cheeseburger, french fries, chocolate shake, somebody's mind I's about to take!
I feel if they had faith in this set it'd be MaRo and/or Forsythe spoiling cards and finished art. Them revealing concept art in the unhypest way possible tells me this set maybe wasn't even meant to be Ravnica to begin with.
They will most likely be very conservative about it, which is boring, but not necessarily bad. Since their newest planes (from Kaladesh on, but I'd argue that Theros and Tarkir also ended up rather meh) haven't done particularly well, WotC needs time to figure out what exactly went wrong.
Personally, I think the "planes vaguely based on real world cultures" appproach got old extremely fast as it strangled creativity and dialed back on magical in a game of magic. For example, I'd love to see a "winter" plane, but not a Norse plane, because the latter sets certain expectations that need to be met in order to satsfy the "Norse" criteria, like some pop-culture references to the mythology, while they can do pretty much anything with the former.
I wonder if the guild kits were made just because they couldn't fit all the guilds into the set associated peconstructed decks, knowing that there are only 2 Planeswalker decks per set as opposed to 4 theme decks, or 5 intro packs?
They will most likely be very conservative about it, which is boring, but not necessarily bad. Since their newest planes (from Kaladesh on, but I'd argue that Theros and Tarkir also ended up rather meh) haven't done particularly well, WotC needs time to figure out what exactly went wrong.
Personally, I think the "planes vaguely based on real world cultures" appproach got old extremely fast as it strangled creativity and dialed back on magical in a game of magic. For example, I'd love to see a "winter" plane, but not a Norse plane, because the latter sets certain expectations that need to be met in order to satsfy the "Norse" criteria, like some pop-culture references to the mythology, while they can do pretty much anything with the former.
We’ve gotten Kamigawa, Innistrad, Theros, and Amonkhet. That’s not that many. I can’t quite recall if Ixalan is top down or bottom up, but even if it is top down they still make up the minority of Planes. And Kamigawa always felt like one of the most magical of planes. The least for me would be something like Mirrodin, which is as bottom up as you can get.
I enjoy planes like Alara, Tarkir, and Ravnica because it allows the to develop a series of distinct styles with in one set. Each of these sets felt like 5-10 planes in one, due to the flavor-win on developing such visually distinct realms or areas for each of the color pairings.
I too would love a winter planes that is a blend of the Temur shaman style and Ice Age fantasy brutalism, mixed with a bit more Conan. It doesn't have to be Norse. We know that Norse has already inspired so many fantasy tropes, why can't we just embrace the fantasy heritage of these aesthetics?
They will most likely be very conservative about it, which is boring, but not necessarily bad. Since their newest planes (from Kaladesh on, but I'd argue that Theros and Tarkir also ended up rather meh) haven't done particularly well, WotC needs time to figure out what exactly went wrong.
Personally, I think the "planes vaguely based on real world cultures" appproach got old extremely fast as it strangled creativity and dialed back on magical in a game of magic. For example, I'd love to see a "winter" plane, but not a Norse plane, because the latter sets certain expectations that need to be met in order to satsfy the "Norse" criteria, like some pop-culture references to the mythology, while they can do pretty much anything with the former.
We’ve gotten Kamigawa, Innistrad, Theros, and Amonkhet. That’s not that many. I can’t quite recall if Ixalan is top down or bottom up, but even if it is top down they still make up the minority of Planes. And Kamigawa always felt like one of the most magical of planes. The least for me would be something like Mirrodin, which is as bottom up as you can get.
Ixalan was somewhere in the middle, it started out with just the idea "Vampire conquistadors" but very quickly was figured out to be a tribal set and that what most of the design was structured on.
But every plane has been "planes vaguely based on real world cultures" except for Mirrodin and Zendikar.
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And yes it does seem a bit too soon for a rematch but I suppose Jace got his powers fully unlocked, Chandra trained with Jaya, and Gideon got the Blackblade.
Plus Teferi is joining and presumably Ajani has recruited some other walkers.
But yes story wise color me not impressed by the build up and feeling like we were rushing to another Eldrazi Titans fall to Channel Fireball. But hey if Bolas kills one Gatewatcher he will out perform Three Eldrazi Titans.
Depends how the gatewatch looks after Bolas and the story direction. Might be we only see one or two of them on a world at a time.
Only Teferi is taking an oath. To me Jaya is going to pull a Toph and say "I'm to old for this ***** (as in physically) and go back to Regatha at the end of Dominaria (possible to help protect it against Bolas) and unknown if Karn will say or if his goal of fighting Phyrexia is all he cares bout.
Plus your underestimate Nahiri, Ob and Sorin who all where old walkers and iirc are older or close to as old Karn, Teferi and Jaya are.
Sure I've been pointing out how they have set up future villains.
"You can tell how dumb someone is by how they use Mary Sue"
I am just saying at this point only Bolas or Ugin is known solo walker threat against a Gatewatch of even just Jace, Chandra, Gideon, Ajani and Teferi. Of those names you mentioned Nahiri has the best chance because Leyline Manipulation is hax so with setup she can do crazy things. And some of the rest are straight laughable like Dovin. I do like the Toph Reference.
Fair Enough.
Honestly, if I was making a team that wanted to hunt down the Gatewatch and Friends. It probably be Nahiri got in the way of her revenge, Tezz plenty of beef with Jace, Garruk not a fan of Jace or the Gatewatch being friends with Lili...and maybe KOTH depending on if Karn joins especially if he actually nukes New Phyrexia and Elspeth depending on how she is feeling after getting out of the Underworld, I can see her not being all that happy to see Ajani. Sorin might have beef but he should be grateful considering the Gatewatch saved Innistrad from Nahiri. And Dovin eh forgettable. Kinda hard to predict without knowing the size and membership of the Gatewatch at the end of the arc.
They done that for the most part. Lore-wise SoI only had Jace and Liliana show up, Kaladesh only had Gideon and Jace show up at the end, Amonkhet didn't have Ajani, Ixalan only had Jace in both sets and Dominaria only have the whole team for a second between all the stories but its mostly Gideon, Liliana and Chandra.
I could see Jace being busy with the aftermath of Bolas, part of his growth during Ixalan was him realizing he been a horrible guildpact and wanting to do better.
I wouldn't say Sorin isn't a threat.
I only mention Dovin since Maro mentions it so I take as a hint creative is going to bring him back un happy with the gatewatch.
Or be pissed they left Emrakul in the moon, especially if what most guess come to past, Emrakul influence will still drive people mad and turn them into eldrazi ( somewhere in the a middle of how she was felt during SoI and Eldritch Moon).
"You can tell how dumb someone is by how they use Mary Sue"
By the time of the Thran Civil War, Yawgmoth's followers were already calling themselves Phyrexians, turning themselves into techno-organic monstrosities, and were largely operating out of Phyrexia. I mean, it's commonly referred to as the Thran-Phyrexian War; it definitely counts.
I said solo threat of the names you mentioned Nahiri is the biggest. Not that Sorin is no threat at all. He also has the added barrier of escape from rock.
Yeah but he cannot really expect them to be able to get Emrakul off plane. He might have beef against them but he still go after Nahiri first or Olivia. Whereas Nahiri is more likely to go after the Jacetice League first. Granted Sorin might not be rational after being stuck in a rock.
That said, Bolas has been around being a pain in the ass for a lot longer. Going only 60 years back in-universe, he fought Teferi on Dominaria shortly before The Mending, facilitated Liliana's deal with the demons, caused war to break out across Alara leading to a conflict with Ajani, and manipulated Sarkhan, Chandra, and Jace into opening the Eye of Ugin and releasing the imprisoned Eldrazi titans on Zendikar. And that's not even counting his interests in New Phyrexia and Kamigawa, neither of which have been explored as of yet in story, nor does it cover the thousands of years of general villainy he was responsible for pre-Mending.
So yes, I think "long-boiling" is an apt description of the overarching conflict with Bolas.
I am quite familiar with Mtg lore thank-you on the subject of both Bolas and the current storyline.
AND I STILL think it’s much too soon. There needs to be a better build up of the Planeswalkers regrouping and coming together before a rematch in my opinion.
I like Ravnica. But I wanted more time
The Vorthos community will await the consequences of the Eldrazi Titans' deaths/sealing. We will keep the watch.
“The wind whispers, ‘come home,’ but I cannot.”
— Teferi
If they actually succeed in taking down Nicol Bolas i drop the ball, no joke, this is not even funny at all, this is hilarious stupidity to the max.
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It feels bad.
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With how many there may be I actually hope we get like twenty, or more, of them. If there is some nutty PW centric war/battle the more the better in my book.
I counted 10 Walkers Confirmed. And that is not counting any maybes like Jaya or Karn or anybody Ajani could have rounded up or anybody who should show up but might not like Domri Rade.
To give Gavin Verhey someone to squint at.
STOP using "dude/bro" as a pejorative or insult. Grow up.
Margaret Thatcher: “The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.”
Benjamin Franklin: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
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I agree. While cheesy, they were still fun. Cheesy is much preferable to over-the-top ‘edgy’.
The same way we love, and cringe at ‘dad jokes’
The Vorthos community will await the consequences of the Eldrazi Titans' deaths/sealing. We will keep the watch.
“The wind whispers, ‘come home,’ but I cannot.”
— Teferi
To be fair, Dominaria's mana is still severely depleted from the Invasion and the rifts, while Ravnica's is known for being plentiful and varied. So there's at least an explanation for that from a lore standpoint.
And while I am admittedly a big fan of Ravnica sets - as are many, many others, which is why they keep going back there - I do hope Dominaria gets a bit more spotlight going forward.
They will most likely be very conservative about it, which is boring, but not necessarily bad. Since their newest planes (from Kaladesh on, but I'd argue that Theros and Tarkir also ended up rather meh) haven't done particularly well, WotC needs time to figure out what exactly went wrong.
Personally, I think the "planes vaguely based on real world cultures" appproach got old extremely fast as it strangled creativity and dialed back on magical in a game of magic. For example, I'd love to see a "winter" plane, but not a Norse plane, because the latter sets certain expectations that need to be met in order to satsfy the "Norse" criteria, like some pop-culture references to the mythology, while they can do pretty much anything with the former.
this is definitely when the bolas story arc will end.
And ravnica is too popular to be destroyed
Oh you all forgot something about number of walker cards you did remember that Ajani is fetching as many as possible before this battle right?
We’ve gotten Kamigawa, Innistrad, Theros, and Amonkhet. That’s not that many. I can’t quite recall if Ixalan is top down or bottom up, but even if it is top down they still make up the minority of Planes. And Kamigawa always felt like one of the most magical of planes. The least for me would be something like Mirrodin, which is as bottom up as you can get.
I too would love a winter planes that is a blend of the Temur shaman style and Ice Age fantasy brutalism, mixed with a bit more Conan. It doesn't have to be Norse. We know that Norse has already inspired so many fantasy tropes, why can't we just embrace the fantasy heritage of these aesthetics?
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Ixalan was somewhere in the middle, it started out with just the idea "Vampire conquistadors" but very quickly was figured out to be a tribal set and that what most of the design was structured on.
But every plane has been "planes vaguely based on real world cultures" except for Mirrodin and Zendikar.
"You can tell how dumb someone is by how they use Mary Sue"