I love that WOTC is just going down the list of artifact hate cards rather then just go for the lands.
Likely not wanting to risk the rage of collectors.
They've said in the past, that they want Workshop decks in the format. It has nothing to do with collectors.
Oh, I think it partially does. Vintage is a very expensive format, people pay big bucks to make a deck competitive, banning pricy cards like Workshop would upset those who invested in those cards and discourage participation. There's a reason why WotC in the past has been hesitant in banning cards in Standard, because people would restrain from getting powerful cards with potential of getting banned, which is also why WotC started a new department to do more testing on future sets, understand their impact on standard before releasing them.
I love that WOTC is just going down the list of artifact hate cards rather then just go for the lands.
Likely not wanting to risk the rage of collectors.
They've said in the past, that they want Workshop decks in the format. It has nothing to do with collectors.
Oh, I think it partially does. Vintage is a very expensive format, people pay big bucks to make a deck competitive, banning pricy cards like Workshop would upset those who invested in those cards and discourage participation. There's a reason why WotC in the past has been hesitant in banning cards in Standard, because people would restrain from getting powerful cards with potential of getting banned, which is also why WotC started a new department to do more testing on future sets, understand their impact on standard before releasing them.
You can't apply what wizards does with standard to vimtage. The reason wizards does this for standard is because they want people to have confidence buying into standard decks. They want people to play standard, because it sells new product. And you need people to have confidence in Standard, with a format that rotates, you basically have one chance to build a competitive deck before it rotates.
With Vintage, banning any card does nothing to wizards bottom line, and considering the low popularity of the format means they aren't going to alienate many with a ban. Plus, in the case of shops, the deck is actually healthy for the format. It's a check to all the busted combo decks that exist in the format. With out shops, storm decks would rain. These restrictions just help soften the decks and hopefully allow for more diversity.
You can't apply what wizards does with standard to vimtage. The reason wizards does this for standard is because they want people to have confidence buying into standard decks. They want people to play standard, because it sells new product. And you need people to have confidence in Standard, with a format that rotates, you basically have one chance to build a competitive deck before it rotates.
With Vintage, banning any card does nothing to wizards bottom line, and considering the low popularity of the format means they aren't going to alienate many with a ban. Plus, in the case of shops, the deck is actually healthy for the format. It's a check to all the busted combo decks that exist in the format. With out shops, storm decks would rain. These restrictions just help soften the decks and hopefully allow for more diversity.
Good point, I forgot Vintage has a low population that it wouldn't be the priority of WotC sales plan, nevertheless I doubt they'd want to damage the collectible market by banning a card like Workshop.
I love that WOTC is just going down the list of artifact hate cards rather then just go for the lands.
Likely not wanting to risk the rage of collectors.
If WotC can't reprint cards, else they will enrage collectors, and they can't ban cards for the very same reason then Wizards is in far deeper trouble than anyone truly thinks. If a card is harming a format and gets a ban then those collectors have no reason to complain. The ban is about the game, not about their wallets.
Likely not wanting to risk the rage of collectors.
If WotC can't reprint cards, else they will enrage collectors, and they can't ban cards for the very same reason then Wizards is in far deeper trouble than anyone truly thinks. If a card is harming a format and gets a ban then those collectors have no reason to complain. The ban is about the game, not about their wallets.
Back during the original Zendikar standard, people either plays Jace, the Mind Sculptor or play against it, usually with caw-blade either way, and WotC waited till the end of the standard rotation to ban the card, compare to recent banning of copters. At the time Worldwake boxes were sold out everywhere because everyone wants a copy of Jace, and WotC was very aware of it. I won't dismiss the possibility of business opportunity.
I'm surprised wizards took so long to restrict Thorn of Amethyst when Trinisphere was restricted upon announcement
Trini was restricted in March of 05, but was printed in 04. So there were a few months of 4x Trini decks.
Still the restriction was fast enough to make you think that Thorn of Amethyst was going to get that automatic Mind's Desire restriction...
The thing is, when Thorn was printed back in 2007 it wasn't as an effective card as it is in 2017. A decade ago, Stax was a powerful deck, and it just didn't need 8 Sphere effects. Today, with incredibly powerful creatures like Wurmcoil Engine (compared to the artifact creatures in 2007), you don't need to play grindy Stax lists. You can just play Thorn and cast your Wurmcoil with no negative effects, while your opponent struggles to get out from under your Sphere effects.
So it doesn't really have much to do with Thorn, it has more to do with the power creep of creatures over the past 10 years. Just like with Lodestone Golem, it took about 5-6 years to get restricted.
Finally, Desire was also legal in Vintage for a short period of time. It was legal for basically the month of June after the release of Scourge. Scourge was released in May 26th, 2003 and the restriction wasn't announced until June 1st and the restriction didnt go into effect until July 1st. http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dci/announce/dci20030529a
Likely not wanting to risk the rage of collectors.
If WotC can't reprint cards, else they will enrage collectors, and they can't ban cards for the very same reason then Wizards is in far deeper trouble than anyone truly thinks. If a card is harming a format and gets a ban then those collectors have no reason to complain. The ban is about the game, not about their wallets.
Back during the original Zendikar standard, people either plays Jace, the Mind Sculptor or play against it, usually with caw-blade either way, and WotC waited till the end of the standard rotation to ban the card, compare to recent banning of copters. At the time Worldwake boxes were sold out everywhere because everyone wants a copy of Jace, and WotC was very aware of it. I won't dismiss the possibility of business opportunity.
You have to remember that until Scars of Mirrodin Jace 2 barely saw play thanks to Bloodbraid Elf and Jace 2 was about $20 during that time. Jace and Cawblade were only a thing towards the end of that Standard season. Jace 2 was strong in the various control decks at the time, but not format warping, before Cawblade became a full thing in New Phyrexia. Yes, Cawblade was a deck in Mirrodin Besieged, thanks to Sword of Feast and Famine, but it wasn't much more than a variation of U/W control. It was only when Batterskull came out that suddenly Cawblade was nigh unstoppable.
That would be the reason why Jace wasn't banned until almost rotation. Jace was strong, yes, but not until he and Stoneforge Mystic became unbearable together was there a reason to ban both, or either for that matter.
Even then the idea that they needed to wait until the end of rotation is a tad ludicrous. If they can't ban or restrict a card because of their price then there is really something wrong. Did people throw a fit when we had our last Standard bannings? Well yes, although because of how bad Standard had gotten, but they didn't complain because their $12 Smuggler's Copters went down to $4.
Anyone buying cards that are incredibly expensive, like Jace 2, need to realize that something like this can happen and it is the nature of the beast, not say it is Wizards fault that they lost money.
Announcement Date: August 28, 2017
Vintage:
Thorn of Amethyst is restricted.
Monastery Mentor is restricted.
Yawgmoth's Bargain is unrestricted.
All other formats:
No changes
Effective Date: September 1, 2017
Magic Online Effective Date: August 30, 2017
The list of all banned and restricted cards, by format, is here.
Next B&R Announcement: October 17, 2017
http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/august-28-2017-banned-and-restricted-announcement-2017-08-28
GBW Ghave - BWR Kaalia - UBG Mineoplasm - URG Riku - GRW Uril - GBR Prossh, I need food - BWU Oloro Lock - UGW Derevi Blink - RBU Nekusar, the Wheeler - UBRWG Progenitus - BR Lyzolda - UB Gisa & Geralf Zombies - UG Edric, Spymaster of Trest +1 Counters matter - W Lin Sivvi - BWU Sydri Artifact Control - RWU Narset, the Attacker - GRW Mayael, the Cheater - RWUG Kynaios and Tiro of Meletis Landfall - GBW Doran, I like Big Butts - UR Mizzix Buyback BWR Edgar and his Vamps
EDH DECKS
Currently under construction
MAGECRAFT STORM
Protection from Degeneracy
Do not pray for an easy life. Pray for the strength to endure a difficult one.
This is not going to be pretty.
I love that WOTC is just going down the list of artifact hate cards rather then just go for the lands.
Likely not wanting to risk the rage of collectors.
Shu Yun, the Silent Tempest WUR Voltron Control
Temmet, Vizier of Naktamun WU Unblockable Mirror Trickery
Ra's al Ghul (Sidar Kondo) and Face-Down Ninjas
Brudiclad, Token Engineer
Vaevictis (VV2) the Dire Lantern
Rona, Disciple of Gix
Tiana the Auror
Hallar
Ulrich the Politician
Zur the Rebel
Scorpion, Locust, Scarab, Egyptian Gods
O-Kagachi, Mathas, Mairsil
"Non-Tribal" Tribal Generals, Eggs
They've said in the past, that they want Workshop decks in the format. It has nothing to do with collectors.
BUWGRChilds PlayGRWUB
BUWGR Highlander GRWUB
UBSquee's Shapeshifting PetBU
BW Multiplayer Control WB
RG Changeling GR
UR Mana FlareRU
UMerfolkU
B MBMC B
Oh, I think it partially does. Vintage is a very expensive format, people pay big bucks to make a deck competitive, banning pricy cards like Workshop would upset those who invested in those cards and discourage participation. There's a reason why WotC in the past has been hesitant in banning cards in Standard, because people would restrain from getting powerful cards with potential of getting banned, which is also why WotC started a new department to do more testing on future sets, understand their impact on standard before releasing them.
Shu Yun, the Silent Tempest WUR Voltron Control
Temmet, Vizier of Naktamun WU Unblockable Mirror Trickery
Ra's al Ghul (Sidar Kondo) and Face-Down Ninjas
Brudiclad, Token Engineer
Vaevictis (VV2) the Dire Lantern
Rona, Disciple of Gix
Tiana the Auror
Hallar
Ulrich the Politician
Zur the Rebel
Scorpion, Locust, Scarab, Egyptian Gods
O-Kagachi, Mathas, Mairsil
"Non-Tribal" Tribal Generals, Eggs
You can't apply what wizards does with standard to vimtage. The reason wizards does this for standard is because they want people to have confidence buying into standard decks. They want people to play standard, because it sells new product. And you need people to have confidence in Standard, with a format that rotates, you basically have one chance to build a competitive deck before it rotates.
With Vintage, banning any card does nothing to wizards bottom line, and considering the low popularity of the format means they aren't going to alienate many with a ban. Plus, in the case of shops, the deck is actually healthy for the format. It's a check to all the busted combo decks that exist in the format. With out shops, storm decks would rain. These restrictions just help soften the decks and hopefully allow for more diversity.
BUWGRChilds PlayGRWUB
BUWGR Highlander GRWUB
UBSquee's Shapeshifting PetBU
BW Multiplayer Control WB
RG Changeling GR
UR Mana FlareRU
UMerfolkU
B MBMC B
In his Second 100 days - Yawgmoth's Bargain is unrestricted in Vintage.
What is going to happen in the Next 100 days!!!
Trini was restricted in March of 05, but was printed in 04. So there were a few months of 4x Trini decks.
BUWGRChilds PlayGRWUB
BUWGR Highlander GRWUB
UBSquee's Shapeshifting PetBU
BW Multiplayer Control WB
RG Changeling GR
UR Mana FlareRU
UMerfolkU
B MBMC B
Good point, I forgot Vintage has a low population that it wouldn't be the priority of WotC sales plan, nevertheless I doubt they'd want to damage the collectible market by banning a card like Workshop.
Shu Yun, the Silent Tempest WUR Voltron Control
Temmet, Vizier of Naktamun WU Unblockable Mirror Trickery
Ra's al Ghul (Sidar Kondo) and Face-Down Ninjas
Brudiclad, Token Engineer
Vaevictis (VV2) the Dire Lantern
Rona, Disciple of Gix
Tiana the Auror
Hallar
Ulrich the Politician
Zur the Rebel
Scorpion, Locust, Scarab, Egyptian Gods
O-Kagachi, Mathas, Mairsil
"Non-Tribal" Tribal Generals, Eggs
If WotC can't reprint cards, else they will enrage collectors, and they can't ban cards for the very same reason then Wizards is in far deeper trouble than anyone truly thinks. If a card is harming a format and gets a ban then those collectors have no reason to complain. The ban is about the game, not about their wallets.
Still the restriction was fast enough to make you think that Thorn of Amethyst was going to get that automatic Mind's Desire restriction...
In his Second 100 days - Yawgmoth's Bargain is unrestricted in Vintage.
What is going to happen in the Next 100 days!!!
Back during the original Zendikar standard, people either plays Jace, the Mind Sculptor or play against it, usually with caw-blade either way, and WotC waited till the end of the standard rotation to ban the card, compare to recent banning of copters. At the time Worldwake boxes were sold out everywhere because everyone wants a copy of Jace, and WotC was very aware of it. I won't dismiss the possibility of business opportunity.
Shu Yun, the Silent Tempest WUR Voltron Control
Temmet, Vizier of Naktamun WU Unblockable Mirror Trickery
Ra's al Ghul (Sidar Kondo) and Face-Down Ninjas
Brudiclad, Token Engineer
Vaevictis (VV2) the Dire Lantern
Rona, Disciple of Gix
Tiana the Auror
Hallar
Ulrich the Politician
Zur the Rebel
Scorpion, Locust, Scarab, Egyptian Gods
O-Kagachi, Mathas, Mairsil
"Non-Tribal" Tribal Generals, Eggs
The thing is, when Thorn was printed back in 2007 it wasn't as an effective card as it is in 2017. A decade ago, Stax was a powerful deck, and it just didn't need 8 Sphere effects. Today, with incredibly powerful creatures like Wurmcoil Engine (compared to the artifact creatures in 2007), you don't need to play grindy Stax lists. You can just play Thorn and cast your Wurmcoil with no negative effects, while your opponent struggles to get out from under your Sphere effects.
So it doesn't really have much to do with Thorn, it has more to do with the power creep of creatures over the past 10 years. Just like with Lodestone Golem, it took about 5-6 years to get restricted.
Look at these two decks. This #2 deck is from an event in Milan in 2008 http://morphling.de/top8decks.php?id=850 and this deck from Milan in 2017 http://mtgtop8.com/event?e=15103&d=291461&f=VI
Look at all the creatures in the 2017 deck, MUD decks from 2007 had stuff like Triskelion and Razormane Masticore.
Finally, Desire was also legal in Vintage for a short period of time. It was legal for basically the month of June after the release of Scourge. Scourge was released in May 26th, 2003 and the restriction wasn't announced until June 1st and the restriction didnt go into effect until July 1st. http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dci/announce/dci20030529a
BUWGRChilds PlayGRWUB
BUWGR Highlander GRWUB
UBSquee's Shapeshifting PetBU
BW Multiplayer Control WB
RG Changeling GR
UR Mana FlareRU
UMerfolkU
B MBMC B
You have to remember that until Scars of Mirrodin Jace 2 barely saw play thanks to Bloodbraid Elf and Jace 2 was about $20 during that time. Jace and Cawblade were only a thing towards the end of that Standard season. Jace 2 was strong in the various control decks at the time, but not format warping, before Cawblade became a full thing in New Phyrexia. Yes, Cawblade was a deck in Mirrodin Besieged, thanks to Sword of Feast and Famine, but it wasn't much more than a variation of U/W control. It was only when Batterskull came out that suddenly Cawblade was nigh unstoppable.
That would be the reason why Jace wasn't banned until almost rotation. Jace was strong, yes, but not until he and Stoneforge Mystic became unbearable together was there a reason to ban both, or either for that matter.
Even then the idea that they needed to wait until the end of rotation is a tad ludicrous. If they can't ban or restrict a card because of their price then there is really something wrong. Did people throw a fit when we had our last Standard bannings? Well yes, although because of how bad Standard had gotten, but they didn't complain because their $12 Smuggler's Copters went down to $4.
Anyone buying cards that are incredibly expensive, like Jace 2, need to realize that something like this can happen and it is the nature of the beast, not say it is Wizards fault that they lost money.