The exiling is so key here. With all of the cost reduction effects available to us, this can easily be a 2BB 5/5. He's a Vampire Cathars' Crusade on a 5/5 Body basically (and with Edgar, you can use both).
It costs soooo much. Could be cheaper and smaller in size.
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While 6 mana is a lot, he is a removal spell and a lord at once. Overseer of the Damned is often a good card in my playgroups, so I definitely see this being played in every Vampire deck.
Sorry, but six is too much; I'm simply not waiting until turn six to begin capitalizing on these things when I can do it several turns sooner. I don't care how many existingcards you glom together, either.
Besides, I already have my six-drop finisher for abusing this type of Vampire deck and he's quite good.
Not sure why people say this costs too much, at least in the Vampire deck it seems like it would be in the same league as Noxious Gearhulk. It may not be enough for you, but it's certainly fairly costed.
Well, my objection is really not that he's 'too much' at six mana. That part is fine.
I'm saying I have things to do and I cannot wait until turn six to do what this card will do for me when I can already put that plan in place by turn three or four. As a casual player, this guy is 'an answer seeking a question' to me.
Of course, I'm playing 60-card casual and not EDH.. Ehh, maybe if he stays reasonably-priced, I'll try subbing thesein and see what happens.
I really don't get the hate here. He's a kill spell on a big body with grave hate and tribal pump. It's like Kalitas, Traitor of Ghet and Dark Hatchling had a baby in Gavony Township - a very messed up baby, but a solid card. Sure, it costs 4BB, which should be on the upper end, but there are lots of cheap vampires to run as you build up to this. And with all those cheap ones already on the field, he acts as immediate pump for them upon entering.
Noxious Gearhulk feels above the curve. This is a 5/5 flyer for the same cost... without the artifact weakness... and with a clunky lord effect tossed in.
I'm not sure how to feel about this. If it was just Flying Nekrataal for non-vampire creatures, it'd be great. Simple, clean, Commander Staple.
The exiling is a clunky over costed hoser, and the lord effect is overkill. More importantly, they practically guarantee this won't see print elsewhere, which is always annoying. Yeah, some commander cards reference commander, and won't see print elsewhere. But I don't like cards like this that are just so myopically designed without interest in future reprints.
Quite frankly, they could have given us this:
Vamprie Nekrataal3BB
Creature - Vampire Assassin (R)
Flying
When ~ enters the battlefield, destroy target non-vampire creature.
4/4
And that, sir, would be a great card to reprint every couple of years. Arguably too good.
A 4/4 flier with murder tacked on is already worth 6 mana. Adding on grave hate and a stacking anthem effect that plays well with cards that black already wants to be playing for free? That's a powerful card.
People seem to be forgetting this set is COMMANDER, and the cards are designed for COMMANDER format.
And yet 81 of the top 100 played cards on EDHRec have a converted mana cost of 4 or less
How many of those are mana rocks and mana creatures? How many are cards like Sol Ring that are low cost auto includes. Your comparison doesn't make this card worse or better. Regardless, you are defending a point by someone who says it's to slow for Casual 60 card games.
Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
Melek, Izzet Paragon
Oona, Queen of the Fae
Bruna, Light of Alabaster
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Rhys the Redeemed
Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Sen Triplets
The Mimeoplasm WUBRGSliver OverlordGRBUW WUBRGSliver Hivelord(Superfriends)GRBUW
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That's a heck of a Vampire
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Even if hes the only vampire he might still be worth it for the exile effect alone
Besides, I already have my six-drop finisher for abusing this type of Vampire deck and he's quite good.
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I'm saying I have things to do and I cannot wait until turn six to do what this card will do for me when I can already put that plan in place by turn three or four. As a casual player, this guy is 'an answer seeking a question' to me.
Of course, I'm playing 60-card casual and not EDH.. Ehh, maybe if he stays reasonably-priced, I'll try subbing these in and see what happens.
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2023 Average Peasant Cube|and Discussion
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And yet 81 of the top 100 played cards on EDHRec have a converted mana cost of 4 or less
So, what about the other 19 then?
I'm not sure how to feel about this. If it was just Flying Nekrataal for non-vampire creatures, it'd be great. Simple, clean, Commander Staple.
The exiling is a clunky over costed hoser, and the lord effect is overkill. More importantly, they practically guarantee this won't see print elsewhere, which is always annoying. Yeah, some commander cards reference commander, and won't see print elsewhere. But I don't like cards like this that are just so myopically designed without interest in future reprints.
Quite frankly, they could have given us this:
Vamprie Nekrataal 3BB
Creature - Vampire Assassin (R)
Flying
When ~ enters the battlefield, destroy target non-vampire creature.
4/4
And that, sir, would be a great card to reprint every couple of years. Arguably too good.
UR Melek, Izzet ParagonUR, B Shirei, Shizo's CaretakerB, R Jaya Ballard, Task MageR,RW Tajic, Blade of the LegionRW, UB Lazav, Dimir MastermindUB, UB Circu, Dimir LobotomistUB, RWU Zedruu the GreatheartedRWU, GUBThe MimeoplasmGUB, UGExperiment Kraj UG, WDarien, King of KjeldorW, BMarrow-GnawerB, WBGKarador, Ghost ChieftainWBG, UTeferi, Temporal ArchmageU, GWUDerevi, Empyrial TacticianGWU, RDaretti, Scrap SavantR, UTalrand, Sky SummonerU, GEzuri, Renegade LeaderG, WUBRGReaper KingWUBRG, RGXenagos, God of RevelsRG, CKozilek, Butcher of TruthC, WUBRGGeneral TazriWUBRG, GTitania, Protector of ArgothG
Thing is, if people don't like the deck, they won't buy it at all, so that leaves all these decks up for grabs, that you will, sadly, have to buy.
How many of those are mana rocks and mana creatures? How many are cards like Sol Ring that are low cost auto includes. Your comparison doesn't make this card worse or better. Regardless, you are defending a point by someone who says it's to slow for Casual 60 card games.
EDHREC isn't the end all be all either of EDH.
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That's not a good way to evaluate cards.
and 29 of them are Mana Ramp.... I don't think that's a reasonable rebuttal.
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and seeing this reminds me we may get a Thief of Blood reprint here.
Reprint Stasis!
Control needs more love.
EDH:
Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
Melek, Izzet Paragon
Oona, Queen of the Fae
Bruna, Light of Alabaster
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Rhys the Redeemed
Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Sen Triplets
The Mimeoplasm
WUBRGSliver OverlordGRBUW
WUBRGSliver Hivelord(Superfriends)GRBUW