Never played against him, luckily. Thought several times of building a deck with him but every time I looked him up or watched a video about him, I would just lose all motivation. He just seemed too unfun. Just looking at the things people would do with him got me a little depressed, tbh.
Well, maybe we'll get that a BUG Elf that's not too oppressive.
Never played against him, luckily. Thought several times of building a deck with him but every time I looked him up or watched a video about him, I would just lose all motivation. He just seemed too unfun. Just looking at the things people would do with him got me a little depressed, tbh.
Well, maybe we'll get that a BUG Elf that's not too oppressive.
The few times I fought Leovald, people knew well enough to kill him first. No one enjoys having their fun taken away, regardless of leet level, let alone by something so strong for so cheap a cost.
EDIT: well, I HAD purchased 2 copies at $3 from StrikeZoneOnline, before they cancelled on my as "out of stock". Last time I buy from them. Pissed me off too, I didn't buy these to flip, but to use. Also, at the time I could have bought from other sellers at $6 but didn't, now that ship has sailed.
Same- the turd I bought from on eBay also cancelled my order,
even though they were $10 each.
Stupid greedy people.
Don't list the cards at a price if you aren't willing to sell for that price.
I hate to tell you this but.
I got mine for $7.5 including. Shipping and mine is not canceled...yet
Never played against him, luckily. Thought several times of building a deck with him but every time I looked him up or watched a video about him, I would just lose all motivation. He just seemed too unfun. Just looking at the things people would do with him got me a little depressed, tbh.
Well, maybe we'll get that a BUG Elf that's not too oppressive.
The few times I fought Leovald, people knew well enough to kill him first. No one enjoys having their fun taken away, regardless of leet level, let alone by something so strong for so cheap a cost.
Sweet. Got one and a Foothills I'm getting white-bordered for Radha. Deal with War Mammoth and Grizzly Bears off Hulk, rawr!
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The "Crazy One", playing casual magic and occasionally dipping his toes into regular play since 1994.
Currently focusing on Pre-Modern (Mono-Black Discard Control) and Modern (Azorious Control, Temur Rhinos).
Find me at the Wizard's Tower in Ottawa every second Saturday afternoons.
Leovold is not too shocking. Protean being unbanned is quite a surprise. I personally hope it is like Kokusho in that its powerful but not outright broken.
ha, i picked up a double playset of hulks a few years ago and the shop owner asked me why if i only play edh where its banned. i told him i felt like it wouldn't stay banned forever and they're cheap so might as well.
that day has come!
kinda glad leovold is gone. someone recently put that deck together and its one of the most brutally obnoxious things i've ever played against
Huh, I wonder if I should part with my Hulk or throw it into my Meren deck. I don't build hyper competitive decks, so I wouldn't need it for any infinite combo, but the deck is all about sacrificing creatures for value. That pricetag could get me a few nice cards though. Hm..
Got a Japanese Protean Hulk for 6 Euro and Italian one for 3 Euro, both NM.
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EDH: Toshiro Umezawa Muzzio, Visionary Architect Maelstrom Wanderer Kruphix, God of Horizons Xenagos, God of Revels Keranos, God of Storms Lazav, Dimir Mastermind Brago, King Eternal Selvala, Explorer Returned
I'm hoping to see Leovold drop in price after the ban, so I can get one at reasonable price for my kitchen-table decks... Yet it is still at 50 euro on mkm
At least I never sold my hulks I got from Dissension boosters, so... Yay
Leovold isn't about to get cheaper. That price tag is from Legacy play.
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Check out the thread for my cube if you have the time, and tell me how terrible it is.
Generals meant to be drafted first in a single pack of 6 cards.
And here is the actual cube, meant to be drafted in 4 regular sized packs. (60 card decks)
Got a Japanese Protean Hulk for 6 Euro and Italian one for 3 Euro, both NM.
At least you hope so. I jumped on MCM 2 minutes after the ban announcement and bought 2 Hulks for 1 euro a pop, I'm just waiting for the "Sorry I wont sell to you" message at this point...
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My Commander decks:
Chandra, Torch of Defiance - Oops! All Chandras.
Prime Speaker Zegana - Draw for Power.
Pir & Toothy - Counterpalooza.
Arcades, the Strategist - Another Brick in the Wall.
Zacama, Primal Calamity - Calamity of Double Mana.
Edgar Markov - Vampires Don't Die.
Child of Alara - Dreamcrusher.
Took 15 mins to go from $3 to $8, and another 15 mins to go from $8 to $13. Managed to snag 2 from StrikeZoneOnline for $3 apiece.
EDIT: well, I HAD purchased 2 copies at $3 from StrikeZoneOnline, before they cancelled on my as "out of stock". Last time I buy from them. Pissed me off too, I didn't buy these to flip, but to use. Also, at the time I could have bought from other sellers at $6 but didn't, now that ship has sailed.
I'm sure it doesn't make you feel any better, but from what I understand talking to some friends who run LGS's and sell through Crystal Commerce (which SZO does iirc), they have very poor inventory coordination mechanisms which causes issues like this to happen with some degree of regularity when things spike. The orders end up canceled automatically later on when Crystal Commerce reconciles the inventory. I know a few owners who get frustrated because they get hate mail from people accusing them of canceling because of the spike.
Not saying no owners do that and not saying it's definitely a Crystal Commerce issue in this case, but knowing that made me more forgiving about this kind of thing.
Part of the issue for a lot of sellers as well, is that a lot of stores also sell in multiple places. Whether from their own website using something like crystal commerce to process the sales, or on ebay, or possibly even other places. When a buyout happens that fast, often times whatever inventory management software they use cannot update the inventory quickly enough, and you end up seeing over-sales. Honestly I've always felt that if a store is selling in multiple locations, then each location should have separate inventory precisely for situations such as this. And, secondarily, if crystal commerce is incapable of handling processing and updating inventory as quick as sales can be made, then they either need to update their software to deal with this issue, or sellers should start using another service that doesn't have this rather large glitch attached to it, that leads to such a large amount of negative customer sentiment when things such as this occur.
When it comes to sudden price spikes, it has always seemed that well over 50% of sales get cancelled. Some are places that just flat out refuse to sell a now $20 card, for $1 or $5 or whatever, and are willing to take the PR hit to get that extra money, and some places simply have poor inventory management setups that lead to over-sales as such mentioned above. My general sentiment is that if you are going to buy a card that is spiking, you should always buy from multiple sources and hope for the best later on. Worst case, if you get all you ordered, you can always re-sell or trade off the extras, and with any luck at least one of the multiple sources for the purchases will pan out.
For those that had their orders cancelled, unfortunately there is little anyone can do about it, other than leave negative feedback accordingly on whichever platforms the cards were purchased on, go onto the market street area of these forums and in the appropriate thread in the store discussion area add your experience to the others in similar instances that have occurred from cancelled orders so people will know in the future who to avoid purchasing from when a price spike occurs.
But, as before, its important to be somewhat understanding that not all cancellations are meant to be malicious in nature. Some are not 100% the fault of the sellers/stores, little consolation unfortunately for those buyers who missed out, but still something to keep in mind.
I think the best combo with Hulk in GWB is 1: Viscera Seer + Karmic Guide (bring back Hulk and sac) 2: Saffi Eriksdotter + whatever (use saffi on guide, sac guide to bring back hulk) 3: Revilark + whatever. You can then put any number of creatures costing 6 or less from your library into play and replay them an unbounded number of times - it is easy to make a win combo from that, e.g. add Siege Rhino.
Only Viscera Seer is a bad card that might not be playable in goodstuff decks.
You can also do it in UWG, like: 1: Sidisi's Faithful+ Karmic Guide (stack triggers from Faithfull below the trigger bringing Hulk back and sac it to the trigger - bounce faithfull or something else) 2: Saffi Eriksdotter + Mirror entity (sac saffi to protect guide afterwards use mirror entity on 0 many times) 3: Revilark. Again, you can put any number of creatures into play from library/gy costing at most 6 (most dies at once though - exceptions include Knight of the Reliquary). You can then win with Cloudthresher and Kitchen Finks.
Took 15 mins to go from $3 to $8, and another 15 mins to go from $8 to $13. Managed to snag 2 from StrikeZoneOnline for $3 apiece.
EDIT: well, I HAD purchased 2 copies at $3 from StrikeZoneOnline, before they cancelled on my as "out of stock". Last time I buy from them. Pissed me off too, I didn't buy these to flip, but to use. Also, at the time I could have bought from other sellers at $6 but didn't, now that ship has sailed.
I'm sure it doesn't make you feel any better, but from what I understand talking to some friends who run LGS's and sell through Crystal Commerce (which SZO does iirc), they have very poor inventory coordination mechanisms which causes issues like this to happen with some degree of regularity when things spike. The orders end up canceled automatically later on when Crystal Commerce reconciles the inventory. I know a few owners who get frustrated because they get hate mail from people accusing them of canceling because of the spike.
Not saying no owners do that and not saying it's definitely a Crystal Commerce issue in this case, but knowing that made me more forgiving about this kind of thing.
That's a possibility, although what led me to believe my order was valid was that I was buying through Amazon, SZO had 3 in stock, so I added all 3 and by the time I went to check out it corrected to say that the seller only had 2 in stock. Since it WAS able to correct 3 copies to 2 but not 3 copies to 0, that leads me to believe the store cancelled rather than a true inventory issue (although I will admit I could be wrong).
Took 15 mins to go from $3 to $8, and another 15 mins to go from $8 to $13. Managed to snag 2 from StrikeZoneOnline for $3 apiece.
EDIT: well, I HAD purchased 2 copies at $3 from StrikeZoneOnline, before they cancelled on my as "out of stock". Last time I buy from them. Pissed me off too, I didn't buy these to flip, but to use. Also, at the time I could have bought from other sellers at $6 but didn't, now that ship has sailed.
I'm sure it doesn't make you feel any better, but from what I understand talking to some friends who run LGS's and sell through Crystal Commerce (which SZO does iirc), they have very poor inventory coordination mechanisms which causes issues like this to happen with some degree of regularity when things spike. The orders end up canceled automatically later on when Crystal Commerce reconciles the inventory. I know a few owners who get frustrated because they get hate mail from people accusing them of canceling because of the spike.
Not saying no owners do that and not saying it's definitely a Crystal Commerce issue in this case, but knowing that made me more forgiving about this kind of thing.
That's a possibility, although what led me to believe my order was valid was that I was buying through Amazon, SZO had 3 in stock, so I added all 3 and by the time I went to check out it corrected to say that the seller only had 2 in stock. Since it WAS able to correct 3 copies to 2 but not 3 copies to 0, that leads me to believe the store cancelled rather than a true inventory issue (although I will admit I could be wrong).
Ahhh, they sell on amazon too eh? Well, then I can guarantee it was a legitimate case of overselling. As I mentioned in my response a little earlier, a lot of online stores will put the same inventory on a variety of platforms (amazon/crystal commerce through their own website/ebay/etc), using software that will update the inventories on those platforms as their inventory sells. However most of these inventory update softwares have lag time before the inventory will update. In the case of the amazon purchase, Its likely that they had the same 3 listed on amazon/ebay/their own website, and inevitably the instant the unban was announced, people came in on 2 or quite possibly all 3 platforms at the same time and bought up the cards. What you saw was likely someone on amazon buying 1 of the card, leaving 2 being shown on amazon (since amazon's inventory software adjusts the inventory immediately versus some of the other programs), however its also likely that someone else on either ebay or their own website had already purchased the other 2 by that point and the cross-platform inventory adjustment software simply hadn't had the time yet to update the inventory on amazon or otherwise to reflect that. I've known a lot of 100% honest an legitimate online stores that have run into the very same issue over the years, and it honestly does come down to an issue of cross-platform selling, or poor inventory update software for whatever platform they are selling on as people are all trying to buy the same batch of cards from the same seller literally all at the exact same moment (sometimes even the exact same second). 99.99% of the time, none of this is ever an issue, because most card sales don't see such huge demand spikes like that to where you would need to have perfect to the millisecond updating inventory information across platform or otherwise. However when unbannings happen, of course, you suddenly see the mother of all demand spikes and you have 1,000+ people all vying for the same inventory from the platform or platforms of their choice all at the same time.
Part of the reason why when I ran a shop I kept 100% separate inventory between the brick and mortar shop and my ebay sales, and only did online sales through ebay, so no issues like that could ever happen. For larger online businesses though, the cross-platform exposure is necessary for them, so I don't blame them for taking advantage of it when it is available, just as I try to be understanding in instances when unusual circumstances like an unbanning can cause an issue with unintentional overselling, which is why I learned to purchase from a variety of sources on unbanned cards to make sure I got at least as much as I was needing just in case.
Now if strikezone immediately listed more at a much higher price, then that would obviously be an example of potential abuse, however, showing zero inventory for a while after until perhaps they get more in stock (if they get more in stock) and then listing those at a higher price (after having to pay considerably more to be able to get them in stock) isn't unreasonable at all. I try to assume that most buyers and sellers will be honest when it comes down to it. Will there be some bad apples that will let greed take over and intentionally cancel orders or otherwise? Certainly, but I like to think such sellers are in the minority, especially when it comes to more established, well known online stores.
In the end, that doesn't do you or anyone else who's order was cancelled any good, but at least it goes to show what may have happened, why it happened, and that, inevitably, it was likely or at least possibly not an intentional act of cancelling an order to list for more after the spike.
Took 15 mins to go from $3 to $8, and another 15 mins to go from $8 to $13. Managed to snag 2 from StrikeZoneOnline for $3 apiece.
EDIT: well, I HAD purchased 2 copies at $3 from StrikeZoneOnline, before they cancelled on my as "out of stock". Last time I buy from them. Pissed me off too, I didn't buy these to flip, but to use. Also, at the time I could have bought from other sellers at $6 but didn't, now that ship has sailed.
I'm sure it doesn't make you feel any better, but from what I understand talking to some friends who run LGS's and sell through Crystal Commerce (which SZO does iirc), they have very poor inventory coordination mechanisms which causes issues like this to happen with some degree of regularity when things spike. The orders end up canceled automatically later on when Crystal Commerce reconciles the inventory. I know a few owners who get frustrated because they get hate mail from people accusing them of canceling because of the spike.
Not saying no owners do that and not saying it's definitely a Crystal Commerce issue in this case, but knowing that made me more forgiving about this kind of thing.
Using software that you know doesn't take these issues into account, and not paying attention to your inventory on ban day is not an excuse for poor business practices. In fact, those are poor business practices, which they compound by then cancelling orders because of their own poor business practices. They deserve every bit of bad publicity that comes doing this, and no one should understand or feel sorry for them.
Got a Japanese Protean Hulk for 6 Euro and Italian one for 3 Euro, both NM.
At least you hope so. I jumped on MCM 2 minutes after the ban announcement and bought 2 Hulks for 1 euro a pop, I'm just waiting for the "Sorry I wont sell to you" message at this point...
MKM explicitly stated that they will not tolerate any cancellations. You don't have to accept any "Sorry, bla bla.." messages.
Actually I got mine from frontline games connected to TCGplayer.com
My brother told me TCGplayer.com forbids cancels as well that's why I thought I would not get a cancel.
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Well, maybe we'll get that a BUG Elf that's not too oppressive.
BK'rrik Goodstuff
GWSythis Enchantress
URYusri Coin Flip
BRGKorvold Tokens
BGUYarok Lands Matter
WUBRaffine Looter
The few times I fought Leovald, people knew well enough to kill him first. No one enjoys having their fun taken away, regardless of leet level, let alone by something so strong for so cheap a cost.
Shu Yun, the Silent Tempest WUR Voltron Control
Temmet, Vizier of Naktamun WU Unblockable Mirror Trickery
Ra's al Ghul (Sidar Kondo) and Face-Down Ninjas
Brudiclad, Token Engineer
Vaevictis (VV2) the Dire Lantern
Rona, Disciple of Gix
Tiana the Auror
Hallar
Ulrich the Politician
Zur the Rebel
Scorpion, Locust, Scarab, Egyptian Gods
O-Kagachi, Mathas, Mairsil
"Non-Tribal" Tribal Generals, Eggs
I hate to tell you this but.
I got mine for $7.5 including. Shipping and mine is not canceled...yet
EDIT: drat they canceled it. Those idiots
Amen.
BK'rrik Goodstuff
GWSythis Enchantress
URYusri Coin Flip
BRGKorvold Tokens
BGUYarok Lands Matter
WUBRaffine Looter
Currently focusing on Pre-Modern (Mono-Black Discard Control) and Modern (Azorious Control, Temur Rhinos).
Find me at the Wizard's Tower in Ottawa every second Saturday afternoons.
Glad to see one of my Dirty Dozen back in the game!
Pretty funny
But reminder in about week the price will drop again but not to where it was before.
Because this is just a regular old hype stock from one card.
I mean after all this is not the first time a card got unbanned from edh
Kokusho, the Evening Star was previously banned and got a stock rise like this but then later on it drop a little bit again.
that day has come!
kinda glad leovold is gone. someone recently put that deck together and its one of the most brutally obnoxious things i've ever played against
Another great example is Staff of Domination. It experienced a huge spike and then was permanently "damaged" price-wise even after the fall.
Trades
Pucatrade with me!
(Signature courtesy of Argetlam of Hakai Studios
Toshiro Umezawa
Muzzio, Visionary Architect
Maelstrom Wanderer
Kruphix, God of Horizons
Xenagos, God of Revels
Keranos, God of Storms
Lazav, Dimir Mastermind
Brago, King Eternal
Selvala, Explorer Returned
Leovold isn't about to get cheaper. That price tag is from Legacy play.
Generals meant to be drafted first in a single pack of 6 cards.
And here is the actual cube, meant to be drafted in 4 regular sized packs. (60 card decks)
At least you hope so. I jumped on MCM 2 minutes after the ban announcement and bought 2 Hulks for 1 euro a pop, I'm just waiting for the "Sorry I wont sell to you" message at this point...
Chandra, Torch of Defiance - Oops! All Chandras.
Prime Speaker Zegana - Draw for Power.
Pir & Toothy - Counterpalooza.
Arcades, the Strategist - Another Brick in the Wall.
Zacama, Primal Calamity - Calamity of Double Mana.
Edgar Markov - Vampires Don't Die.
Child of Alara - Dreamcrusher.
Part of the issue for a lot of sellers as well, is that a lot of stores also sell in multiple places. Whether from their own website using something like crystal commerce to process the sales, or on ebay, or possibly even other places. When a buyout happens that fast, often times whatever inventory management software they use cannot update the inventory quickly enough, and you end up seeing over-sales. Honestly I've always felt that if a store is selling in multiple locations, then each location should have separate inventory precisely for situations such as this. And, secondarily, if crystal commerce is incapable of handling processing and updating inventory as quick as sales can be made, then they either need to update their software to deal with this issue, or sellers should start using another service that doesn't have this rather large glitch attached to it, that leads to such a large amount of negative customer sentiment when things such as this occur.
When it comes to sudden price spikes, it has always seemed that well over 50% of sales get cancelled. Some are places that just flat out refuse to sell a now $20 card, for $1 or $5 or whatever, and are willing to take the PR hit to get that extra money, and some places simply have poor inventory management setups that lead to over-sales as such mentioned above. My general sentiment is that if you are going to buy a card that is spiking, you should always buy from multiple sources and hope for the best later on. Worst case, if you get all you ordered, you can always re-sell or trade off the extras, and with any luck at least one of the multiple sources for the purchases will pan out.
For those that had their orders cancelled, unfortunately there is little anyone can do about it, other than leave negative feedback accordingly on whichever platforms the cards were purchased on, go onto the market street area of these forums and in the appropriate thread in the store discussion area add your experience to the others in similar instances that have occurred from cancelled orders so people will know in the future who to avoid purchasing from when a price spike occurs.
But, as before, its important to be somewhat understanding that not all cancellations are meant to be malicious in nature. Some are not 100% the fault of the sellers/stores, little consolation unfortunately for those buyers who missed out, but still something to keep in mind.
Only Viscera Seer is a bad card that might not be playable in goodstuff decks.
You can also do it in UWG, like: 1: Sidisi's Faithful+ Karmic Guide (stack triggers from Faithfull below the trigger bringing Hulk back and sac it to the trigger - bounce faithfull or something else) 2: Saffi Eriksdotter + Mirror entity (sac saffi to protect guide afterwards use mirror entity on 0 many times) 3: Revilark. Again, you can put any number of creatures into play from library/gy costing at most 6 (most dies at once though - exceptions include Knight of the Reliquary). You can then win with Cloudthresher and Kitchen Finks.
Again Sidisi's Faithful is fairly bad for goodstuff decks, Mirror entity depends on the deck whether it is good and Cloudthresher is borderline.
This is an unbanning that I didn't see coming, and I fear that it's only a matter of time before the Hulk becomes banned again ... for good
That's a possibility, although what led me to believe my order was valid was that I was buying through Amazon, SZO had 3 in stock, so I added all 3 and by the time I went to check out it corrected to say that the seller only had 2 in stock. Since it WAS able to correct 3 copies to 2 but not 3 copies to 0, that leads me to believe the store cancelled rather than a true inventory issue (although I will admit I could be wrong).
Don't worry approximately next week it should get a price drop, just not to the 3.5 from before. Probably about to $13-$16ish
Ahhh, they sell on amazon too eh? Well, then I can guarantee it was a legitimate case of overselling. As I mentioned in my response a little earlier, a lot of online stores will put the same inventory on a variety of platforms (amazon/crystal commerce through their own website/ebay/etc), using software that will update the inventories on those platforms as their inventory sells. However most of these inventory update softwares have lag time before the inventory will update. In the case of the amazon purchase, Its likely that they had the same 3 listed on amazon/ebay/their own website, and inevitably the instant the unban was announced, people came in on 2 or quite possibly all 3 platforms at the same time and bought up the cards. What you saw was likely someone on amazon buying 1 of the card, leaving 2 being shown on amazon (since amazon's inventory software adjusts the inventory immediately versus some of the other programs), however its also likely that someone else on either ebay or their own website had already purchased the other 2 by that point and the cross-platform inventory adjustment software simply hadn't had the time yet to update the inventory on amazon or otherwise to reflect that. I've known a lot of 100% honest an legitimate online stores that have run into the very same issue over the years, and it honestly does come down to an issue of cross-platform selling, or poor inventory update software for whatever platform they are selling on as people are all trying to buy the same batch of cards from the same seller literally all at the exact same moment (sometimes even the exact same second). 99.99% of the time, none of this is ever an issue, because most card sales don't see such huge demand spikes like that to where you would need to have perfect to the millisecond updating inventory information across platform or otherwise. However when unbannings happen, of course, you suddenly see the mother of all demand spikes and you have 1,000+ people all vying for the same inventory from the platform or platforms of their choice all at the same time.
Part of the reason why when I ran a shop I kept 100% separate inventory between the brick and mortar shop and my ebay sales, and only did online sales through ebay, so no issues like that could ever happen. For larger online businesses though, the cross-platform exposure is necessary for them, so I don't blame them for taking advantage of it when it is available, just as I try to be understanding in instances when unusual circumstances like an unbanning can cause an issue with unintentional overselling, which is why I learned to purchase from a variety of sources on unbanned cards to make sure I got at least as much as I was needing just in case.
Now if strikezone immediately listed more at a much higher price, then that would obviously be an example of potential abuse, however, showing zero inventory for a while after until perhaps they get more in stock (if they get more in stock) and then listing those at a higher price (after having to pay considerably more to be able to get them in stock) isn't unreasonable at all. I try to assume that most buyers and sellers will be honest when it comes down to it. Will there be some bad apples that will let greed take over and intentionally cancel orders or otherwise? Certainly, but I like to think such sellers are in the minority, especially when it comes to more established, well known online stores.
In the end, that doesn't do you or anyone else who's order was cancelled any good, but at least it goes to show what may have happened, why it happened, and that, inevitably, it was likely or at least possibly not an intentional act of cancelling an order to list for more after the spike.
Good for you
Unfortunately mine got canceled
So I have to wait for the hype stock to end first.
Just like for other people with Kokusho, the Evening Star and staff of domination
Using software that you know doesn't take these issues into account, and not paying attention to your inventory on ban day is not an excuse for poor business practices. In fact, those are poor business practices, which they compound by then cancelling orders because of their own poor business practices. They deserve every bit of bad publicity that comes doing this, and no one should understand or feel sorry for them.
Check out http://www.mtgbrodeals.com/author/john-murphy/ for my EDH articles!
Actually I got mine from frontline games connected to TCGplayer.com
My brother told me TCGplayer.com forbids cancels as well that's why I thought I would not get a cancel.