If Werewolves are the unexpected tribe, I expect it to have a slight wolf token side-theme. And tying all the decks together I would expect at least a few changelings to help fill a few creature slots. Amoeboid Changeling can be very good with or against tribal. I just hope they take the opportunity to print more changelings, and a colorless one!
If Werewolves are the unexpected tribe, I expect it to have a slight wolf token side-theme. And tying all the decks together I would expect at least a few changelings to help fill a few creature slots. Amoeboid Changeling can be very good with or against tribal. I just hope they take the opportunity to print more changelings, and a colorless one!
I can see that for werewolf sub tribal being wolf/hound
Changeling funny you say that my theory of another possible is a 5-color legendary that enters as any creature type you wish and gives a lord ability to the chosen type (cheapen cost, +1/+1, static abilities.)
And for colorless for that to happen here in commander 2017 or t has to be either Eldrazi or Myr both of those are interesting/popular enough for the set (Eldrazi has atvantage due to more creatures and tribal support toys. Than Myr)
Given how annoying flip cards are I don't think we will see werewolves. No matter what kind of player someone is, if they sleeve cards or better yet, double sleeve like I do, flip cards become incredibly inconvenient.
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Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
MTGS Wikia Article about "New World Order"
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
PSA to everyone who keeps forgetting about the Reserved List:
You're on a website dedicated to talking about MtG. You're only a few keystrokes away from finding out what cards are on the Reserved List. You're also only a few keystrokes away from finding out why some cards on the Reserved List got foil printings in FtV, as Judge promos, or whatnot, as well as why that won't happen again. Stop doing this.
Given how annoying flip cards are I don't think we will see werewolves. No matter what kind of player someone is, if they sleeve cards or better yet, double sleeve like I do, flip cards become incredibly inconvenient.
If they do werewolves I expect they'll have a checklist styled card for in the deck and a token "flip card" for when you actually play it. Taking the card out of the sleeve each time is a real pain, so i always use clear sleeves for my DFC's anyways.
Given how annoying flip cards are I don't think we will see werewolves. No matter what kind of player someone is, if they sleeve cards or better yet, double sleeve like I do, flip cards become incredibly inconvenient.
If they do werewolves I expect they'll have a checklist styled card for in the deck and a token "flip card" for when you actually play it. Taking the card out of the sleeve each time is a real pain, so i always use clear sleeves for my DFC's anyways.
The trouble is you'd need a lot of checklist cards in a true werewolf tribal deck, and given they want to keep decks uniform in size they would have to take the place of tokens. So, I'm fairly sure werewolves are out.
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Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Having each deck be based off one of the major tribal sets or blocks has some appeal as well. But honestly, I expect that the Innistrad deck would be GW Humans, seeing as they have yet to get a GW Legend that's also a Human. Like him or not, Werewolves have Ulrich of the Krallenhorde, and I doubt that one deck out of four is going to have DFCs given the extra printing expenses involved. If they ever do DFCs in a supplemental product, you can bet biscuits to buns that they'll be the feature of the product, and most likely it'll be a draft product a la Conspiracy or Masters.
That said, I could see Humans and Dragons being two of the featured tribes in the product based on tribal sets and blocks.
MTGS Wikia Article about "New World Order"
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
PSA to everyone who keeps forgetting about the Reserved List:
You're on a website dedicated to talking about MtG. You're only a few keystrokes away from finding out what cards are on the Reserved List. You're also only a few keystrokes away from finding out why some cards on the Reserved List got foil printings in FtV, as Judge promos, or whatnot, as well as why that won't happen again. Stop doing this.
Having each deck be based off one of the major tribal sets or blocks has some appeal as well. But honestly, I expect that the Innistrad deck would be GW Humans, seeing as they have yet to get a GW Legend that's also a Human. Like him or not, Werewolves have Ulrich of the Krallenhorde, and I doubt that one deck out of four is going to have DFCs given the extra printing expenses involved. If they ever do DFCs in a supplemental product, you can bet biscuits to buns that they'll be the feature of the product, and most likely it'll be a draft product a la Conspiracy or Masters.
That said, I could see Humans and Dragons being two of the featured tribes in the product based on tribal sets and blocks.
I think that if by chance they figure out how to do the double faced cards in this commander set my guess is it would have no tokens and they'd have placeholders and keep your flip cards on the side. Or maybe each deck would have some flip cards too. Maybe they can make an Arlin commander for the werewolf deck and a sarkhan commander for the dragon deck.
Four five-color decks is boring as hell though, and kind of pointless for most tribes.
A legend in two or three colors would work well. We already have RB goblin legends, but a Uwb merfolk legend and a Gwb Elf legend would be nice.
The only real options for 5-color are Eldrazi, Elementals and humans (General Tazri but without the Ally please).
Four five-color decks is boring as hell though, and kind of pointless for most tribes.
A legend in two or three colors would work well. We already have RB goblin legends, but a Uwb merfolk legend and a Gwb Elf legend would be nice.
The only real options for 5-color are Eldrazi, Elementals and humans (General Tazri but without the Ally please).
Lol, Invasion block ftw .
They don't need 5color humans thanks to Tazri. I want something fresh and new.
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Four five-color decks is boring as hell though, and kind of pointless for most tribes.
A legend in two or three colors would work well. We already have RB goblin legends, but a Uwb merfolk legend and a Gwb Elf legend would be nice.
The only real options for 5-color are Eldrazi, Elementals and humans (General Tazri but without the Ally please).
What's dragons and angels for 5-color chop liver
And for Eldrazi correction devoid 5-color.
And tazri corrupted could be just that
(Story of OGW showed her in the future corrupted by Kozilek.)
Given how annoying flip cards are I don't think we will see werewolves. No matter what kind of player someone is, if they sleeve cards or better yet, double sleeve like I do, flip cards become incredibly inconvenient.
If they do werewolves I expect they'll have a checklist styled card for in the deck and a token "flip card" for when you actually play it. Taking the card out of the sleeve each time is a real pain, so i always use clear sleeves for my DFC's anyways.
The trouble is you'd need a lot of checklist cards in a true werewolf tribal deck, and given they want to keep decks uniform in size they would have to take the place of tokens. So, I'm fairly sure werewolves are out.
That's why you put the slightly fancier than normal checklist card in the deck, and have the dfc be included in the tokens.
The trouble is you'd need a lot of checklist cards in a true werewolf tribal deck, and given they want to keep decks uniform in size they would have to take the place of tokens. So, I'm fairly sure werewolves are out.
That's why you put the slightly fancier than normal checklist card in the deck, and have the dfc be included in the tokens.
How does that reduce the amount of cardboard in total though? Ultimately the token pile will contain like 30 or so cards (be it checklist or DFC). If they wanted to keep the deck sizes uniform, that means every other deck would also need to include 30 plus tokens.
Not impossible (if they're generous and I suppose it doesn't cost that much to print another 20 or so pieces of cardboard), but still a scenario that's highly unlikely.
The trouble is you'd need a lot of checklist cards in a true werewolf tribal deck, and given they want to keep decks uniform in size they would have to take the place of tokens. So, I'm fairly sure werewolves are out.
That's why you put the slightly fancier than normal checklist card in the deck, and have the dfc be included in the tokens.
How does that reduce the amount of cardboard in total though? Ultimately the token pile will contain like 30 or so cards (be it checklist or DFC). If they wanted to keep the deck sizes uniform, that means every other deck would also need to include 30 plus tokens.
Not impossible (if they're generous and I suppose it doesn't cost that much to print another 20 or so pieces of cardboard), but still a scenario that's highly unlikely.
My Commander 2015 deck came with plenty of tokens that could be potentially dfcs.
The trouble is you'd need a lot of checklist cards in a true werewolf tribal deck, and given they want to keep decks uniform in size they would have to take the place of tokens. So, I'm fairly sure werewolves are out.
That's why you put the slightly fancier than normal checklist card in the deck, and have the dfc be included in the tokens.
How does that reduce the amount of cardboard in total though? Ultimately the token pile will contain like 30 or so cards (be it checklist or DFC). If they wanted to keep the deck sizes uniform, that means every other deck would also need to include 30 plus tokens.
Not impossible (if they're generous and I suppose it doesn't cost that much to print another 20 or so pieces of cardboard), but still a scenario that's highly unlikely.
My Commander 2015 deck came with plenty of tokens that could be potentially dfcs.
I would also assume a Werewolf tribal would include the various Wolf tribal components from Innistrad (Plus new ones printed for the deck), which would also help cut back on the number of DFCs needed. I don't think we'd be getting a purely Werewolf deck, if we were to get a Werewolf deck.
Ultimately I'm just going to be a pessimist and assume all we're getting is Dragon/Elf/Goblin/Zombie, even though all of those tribes are (IMO) tired, boring and have been done to death (and back, in the latter's case).
If I'm right, I won't be as disappointed. If I'm wrong, I'm pleasantly surprised.
I took a look at the Werewolf cards to see what all the fuss is about and then I see the transformation requirements....Which are hopelessly random in 4 person multiplayer. Your werewolf could flip back and forth by the time its your turn again.
I don't see how this is a great fit for multiplayer other than for the most casual of casual games on top of the card flipping annoyance.
It's why an EDH leader who helps you control your transformations would be so beneficial to the tribe in general.
Didn't Maro make a comment that DFC was highly unlikely in Commander products due to printing and logistics cost. In fact I seem to remember him saying this way more than once.
Didn't Maro make a comment that DFC was highly unlikely in Commander products due to printing and logistics cost. In fact I seem to remember him saying this way more than once.
Maybe he did
But if I have known this I would have eliminated werewolfs.
Didn't Maro make a comment that DFC was highly unlikely in Commander products due to printing and logistics cost. In fact I seem to remember him saying this way more than once.
He's mentioned it before, but I also think it's possible that they've managed to work out the logistics of it. Plus, that would certainly make it more surprising, no?
Didn't Maro make a comment that DFC was highly unlikely in Commander products due to printing and logistics cost. In fact I seem to remember him saying this way more than once.
He did. That is one reason I believe we won't see DFC in a Commander unless we see them do 4 Innistrad tribes. If they were to do Humans, Werewolves, Vampires, and Zombies all with DFC in their decks it would be more likely. Since cards are printed on 121 card sheets, dividing up that many DFC among 4 decks would be reasonable and cost effective for WotC.
I could see them doing DFC in a Masters type set, such as Iconic Masters (though not the one due in November) because in boosters, having the DFC slot is easier to manage.
Didn't Maro make a comment that DFC was highly unlikely in Commander products due to printing and logistics cost. In fact I seem to remember him saying this way more than once.
He also said they couldn't figure out a feasible legendary transformation card (in original Innistrad) which is why Huntmaster of the Fells ended up not being legendary. They find solutions to old problems all the time - while I don't think werewolves will be included in this set - it's not because of the logistics of transformation cards
He also said they couldn't figure out a feasible legendary transformation card (in original Innistrad) which is why Huntmaster of the Fells ended up not being legendary. They find solutions to old problems all the time - while I don't think werewolves will be included in this set - it's not because of the logistics of transformation cards
Card design and card printing are two completely different things. Wizards can't "find solutions" to make machines work differently. Logistics absolutely are going to be the biggest factor against werewolves, whether you choose to believe it or not. Will they do it someday anyway? Maybe, but that doesn't change the reality of the situation.
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I can see that for werewolf sub tribal being wolf/hound
Changeling funny you say that my theory of another possible is a 5-color legendary that enters as any creature type you wish and gives a lord ability to the chosen type (cheapen cost, +1/+1, static abilities.)
And for colorless for that to happen here in commander 2017 or t has to be either Eldrazi or Myr both of those are interesting/popular enough for the set (Eldrazi has atvantage due to more creatures and tribal support toys. Than Myr)
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
If they do werewolves I expect they'll have a checklist styled card for in the deck and a token "flip card" for when you actually play it. Taking the card out of the sleeve each time is a real pain, so i always use clear sleeves for my DFC's anyways.
The trouble is you'd need a lot of checklist cards in a true werewolf tribal deck, and given they want to keep decks uniform in size they would have to take the place of tokens. So, I'm fairly sure werewolves are out.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
That said, I could see Humans and Dragons being two of the featured tribes in the product based on tribal sets and blocks.
RG Dragons
GW Humans
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
I think that if by chance they figure out how to do the double faced cards in this commander set my guess is it would have no tokens and they'd have placeholders and keep your flip cards on the side. Or maybe each deck would have some flip cards too. Maybe they can make an Arlin commander for the werewolf deck and a sarkhan commander for the dragon deck.
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Four five-color decks is boring as hell though, and kind of pointless for most tribes.
A legend in two or three colors would work well. We already have RB goblin legends, but a Uwb merfolk legend and a Gwb Elf legend would be nice.
The only real options for 5-color are Eldrazi, Elementals and humans (General Tazri but without the Ally please).
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Lol, Invasion block ftw .
They don't need 5color humans thanks to Tazri. I want something fresh and new.
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What's dragons and angels for 5-color chop liver
And for Eldrazi correction devoid 5-color.
And tazri corrupted could be just that
(Story of OGW showed her in the future corrupted by Kozilek.)
That's why you put the slightly fancier than normal checklist card in the deck, and have the dfc be included in the tokens.
How does that reduce the amount of cardboard in total though? Ultimately the token pile will contain like 30 or so cards (be it checklist or DFC). If they wanted to keep the deck sizes uniform, that means every other deck would also need to include 30 plus tokens.
Not impossible (if they're generous and I suppose it doesn't cost that much to print another 20 or so pieces of cardboard), but still a scenario that's highly unlikely.
You make fun of it, but blue-red Merfolk actually got a commander already as well: Jori En, Ruin Diver.
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My Commander 2015 deck came with plenty of tokens that could be potentially dfcs.
I would also assume a Werewolf tribal would include the various Wolf tribal components from Innistrad (Plus new ones printed for the deck), which would also help cut back on the number of DFCs needed. I don't think we'd be getting a purely Werewolf deck, if we were to get a Werewolf deck.
Ultimately I'm just going to be a pessimist and assume all we're getting is Dragon/Elf/Goblin/Zombie, even though all of those tribes are (IMO) tired, boring and have been done to death (and back, in the latter's case).
If I'm right, I won't be as disappointed. If I'm wrong, I'm pleasantly surprised.
It's why an EDH leader who helps you control your transformations would be so beneficial to the tribe in general.
Maybe he did
But if I have known this I would have eliminated werewolfs.
He's mentioned it before, but I also think it's possible that they've managed to work out the logistics of it. Plus, that would certainly make it more surprising, no?
He did. That is one reason I believe we won't see DFC in a Commander unless we see them do 4 Innistrad tribes. If they were to do Humans, Werewolves, Vampires, and Zombies all with DFC in their decks it would be more likely. Since cards are printed on 121 card sheets, dividing up that many DFC among 4 decks would be reasonable and cost effective for WotC.
I could see them doing DFC in a Masters type set, such as Iconic Masters (though not the one due in November) because in boosters, having the DFC slot is easier to manage.
He also said they couldn't figure out a feasible legendary transformation card (in original Innistrad) which is why Huntmaster of the Fells ended up not being legendary. They find solutions to old problems all the time - while I don't think werewolves will be included in this set - it's not because of the logistics of transformation cards
I can eliminate werewolfs from the unexspected list.
All I got left is eldrazi/Myr, no red ghosts(spirits) and demons alone.