2) There are going to be A LOT of new cards... which is a problem because Slivers has next to no design space left... they have done just about every sliver you can do...
No, this is utterly wrong. Sit me in a room by myself for a few hours and I can come up +25 brand new Slivers. Because this is a supplementary set where the cards are Vintage and Legacy legal only, and allowing me to use keywords long since abandoned and/or utilizing the Tribal card type (this is Vintage and Legacy legal, remember), than the brand new Slivers shoots to +32 Slivers right away.
Also, there are not "A LOT" of new cards. There are not nearly enough new cards to make something a valid tribe that wasn't already well-represented. We aren't getting Aetherborn tribal.
Well stepping away from slivers looking at the following possiblties at this point. (They could come with a sub-tribal in the decks.)
Dragon: well the set symbol and the Ramos art posted confirm this is real. But everyone screws this up scion not a legit dragon tribal yes it tutors them BUT TO THE GRAVE needs to be put in hand, and it only benefits the scion to turn him into dragons. his master Is the true dragon tribal commander cheapens them and can cause draw and cheat stuff out from dragon triggers.
Angel: their popularity is right up there with dragons plus 5-color has Ben wanted for years. (UG angels are morely in multi-color)
Demon: again up their with dragons and angels they don't have tribal decks because none of the legendary demons will cut it, not even Rakdos (sac half permanent version) and if you think only BR has good demons incorrect W: Butcher of the Horde note this is the one and only white demon. U: Prince of Thralls, Sol'kanar the Swamp King, Silent-Blade Oni So blue could be in as well.
Cat: this has had very high request both amonkhet sets is bringing stuff to the table, we need one with at least GW to be legit, but I have Ben hearing of want for black or red as well.
Human/soilder/knight: well all of these are pretty close to the same catergory and out of all creature types humans have the most, and these need some love as well. How ever humans can co-op with angels if they make it angels have human support in their abilities,
The unexspected
Eldrazi: now just bare with me I wouldn't be surprised if they diden't make it but there are lots of factors that give them points.
1# the devoid eldrazis have Ben attempted many times in lots of decks but never have a tribal leader.
2# wizards did say a while back they are interest/wouldn't mind making a colorless pre-constructed deck this is a opportunity since this is not a color focused product.
3# the edh fan love them a little better than other crowds and that hate is morely due to the ruining of zendikar and innistrad.
4# there is like a immense chance there is more Eldrazi Titan leaders than three known ones plus there is two other routes of Eldrazi Titan tribal first is I. The story we saw tazri in the future corrupted as a Eldrazi by kozielk, and two a tribal support versions of are known titans.
Dinosaur or pirates: very simple to advertise for the ixalan set dinosaurs is more likely because those are pretty much popular and iconic just not in mtg. but very unlikely because from the evil leaker of the rare sheet two of the cards are two legendaries that have tribal support one supports pirates the other supports dinosaurs.
Slivers: well because the can do more and people think they aren't going to make it due to running out of ideas for sliver support types, also they are no casual deck, and those things are more unfun to play against than gaddock and leovold (thank heavens he got banned.) in edh.
Elemental: despite horde of notions we could get another option plus we could get more landfall esc elementals.
Spirits: this is the most likely to me because this is a popular and iconic tribe but lesser used because of no legit leader (O-Kagachi was so close.) also they have way more power house stuff than you think and have lots of options for tribal
, and a assure you O-kagachi being in dragons doesn't kick them there are still a few legendary option.
The ain't gonna happen catergory
Zombies: have enough already plus the scarab god is pretty much the latest option why would they print a new leader for that tribal when we are close to a product
This is a elf tribal deck they did it already and plus one of the decks in the commander anthology set so it being reprinted
So I know you guys want a multi-color tribal but why would they do elf tribal if the already did and just started a reprint run of that deck.
Now all of this is just opinion but feel free to share your thoughts.
The reason we won't be getting 5 color slivers is because they already have four commanders, tons of support and would be incredibly boring as a choice for the precons.
A 5c angel is viable if about 10 out of the 14 or 15 new cards they print support the tribe. A couple of cards representing legends we didn't get such as Feather, Asha and the 4th sister and the rest brings them together
while viable, i don't see much point honestly. you're forcing 5 color for a tribe that has almost no support in at least two of those colors, and mediocre support in another 2.
it'd be like making goblin tribal u/r, theres almost no reason to.
We already have 5c Dragon Stompy, so there's nothing stopping...
-5c Human, Sliver or Ally board swarm
-5c Elemental land matters
-5c Zombie or Spirit graveyard shenanigans
-5c Warrior or Soldier aggro
-5c Eldrazi token accelerant
Angels aren't cohesive with one another enough to be a 5c deck, so if we do get an Angel deck it'll be GW(x) tokens or WU(x) enchantments.
While I won't deny that enchantments and tokens could both play a major role in an Angels deck, I think it disingenuous to say they aren't cohesive. Yes, Bant and Boros don't play all that well with each other since Bant wants narrow aggro and Boros wants wide aggro, but Empyrial and Jenara would still work well with all the aggro RW Angels. Plus if they printed the WB sister we could have all four sisters in a single deck.
Also, there are not "A LOT" of new cards. There are not nearly enough new cards to make something a valid tribe that wasn't already well-represented. We aren't getting Aetherborn tribal.
I say Aetherborn should have been Elementals. The nature of their birth screams "Elemental", and they could have presented an opportunity to extend Elementals further into black.
For new Elementals, maybe we can see Illulia of Nighthearth?
An Elemental deck would have a few different themes: +1/+1 counters, tokens, land, and sacrifice effects chief among them. I can see Awaken, Evoke, and Landfall being major mechanics in the deck.
MTGS Wikia Article about "New World Order"
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
PSA to everyone who keeps forgetting about the Reserved List:
You're on a website dedicated to talking about MtG. You're only a few keystrokes away from finding out what cards are on the Reserved List. You're also only a few keystrokes away from finding out why some cards on the Reserved List got foil printings in FtV, as Judge promos, or whatnot, as well as why that won't happen again. Stop doing this.
Dragon: well the set symbol and the Ramos art posted confirm this is real.
The full hi-res art seems hto have been removed from the author's home page. Probably because the card has not been "officially" spoiled yet ;-P
Too bad tho, I wanted to grab it as my wallpaper, but it seems either I'm a bit late or have to wait until the image is reuploaded.
Should be sadly almost 2 months before you can snag it.
I managed to find a copy of the high-res one on TheManaSource Twitter page.
I'll leave the image as an attachment in case anyone wants to see this artifact beauty in detail
EDIT: I know that the attached image is not the best, but you can find the 1500x1060 version on Twitter.
Look at that you were able to snag it sooner than we thought.
Most beautiful art ever and also proves a leak real.
And if we are lucky Rune-scarred Demon as well but I assuming we will get a lot of token makers as well because of all the "sacrifice a creature clause" clause.
I managed to find a copy of the high-res one on TheManaSource Twitter page.
I'll leave the image as an attachment in case anyone wants to see this artifact beauty in detail
EDIT: I know that the attached image is not the best, but you can find the 1500x1060 version on Twitter.
Look at that you were able to snag it sooner than we thought.
Most beautiful art ever and also proves a leak real.
And if we are lucky Rune-scarred Demon as well but I assuming we will get a lot of token makers as well because of all the "sacrifice a creature clause" clause.
Problem with Demons is that they have about the same tribal support as Angels, and that's already close to zero. The closest thing to tribal demons have is Shadowborn Apostle and Blood Speaker, after that is the ogres from Kamigawa, which usually had a drawback for not having a demon, Rakdos the Defiler, and Scroll of Griselbrand.
Sure you can play one of those cards 20+ times in a single deck, but after that demon tribal support just drops off completely.
I managed to find a copy of the high-res one on TheManaSource Twitter page.
I'll leave the image as an attachment in case anyone wants to see this artifact beauty in detail
EDIT: I know that the attached image is not the best, but you can find the 1500x1060 version on Twitter.
Look at that you were able to snag it sooner than we thought.
Most beautiful art ever and also proves a leak real.
And if we are lucky Rune-scarred Demon as well but I assuming we will get a lot of token makers as well because of all the "sacrifice a creature clause" clause.
Problem with Demons is that they have about the same tribal support as Angels, and that's already close to zero. The closest thing to tribal demons have is Shadowborn Apostle and Blood Speaker, after that is the ogres from Kamigawa, which usually had a drawback for not having a demon, Rakdos the Defiler, and Scroll of Griselbrand.
Sure you can play one of those cards 20+ times in a single deck, but after that demon tribal support just drops off completely.
let me get this strait
we are allow to get a angel tribal but yet demons is off limits?
I know angel ain't got no tribal support cards but yet we still want them.
Besides wouldn't most of the 14 new cards could be demon tribal support stuff.
I managed to find a copy of the high-res one on TheManaSource Twitter page.
I'll leave the image as an attachment in case anyone wants to see this artifact beauty in detail
EDIT: I know that the attached image is not the best, but you can find the 1500x1060 version on Twitter.
Huh? Neat. Its got a Lotus symbol that starts from its rib cage and ascends up the neck.
I managed to find a copy of the high-res one on TheManaSource Twitter page.
I'll leave the image as an attachment in case anyone wants to see this artifact beauty in detail
EDIT: I know that the attached image is not the best, but you can find the 1500x1060 version on Twitter.
Huh? Neat. Its got a Lotus symbol that starts from its rib cage and ascends up the neck.
Only thing i find strange of that art are the bird-wing decorations on the chest and on the horns. They are too much egyptian looking for a dragon built by Urza before his spark ignited.
Confirmed Urza wanted to be God-Pharaoh before Nicol Bolas.
I managed to find a copy of the high-res one on TheManaSource Twitter page.
I'll leave the image as an attachment in case anyone wants to see this artifact beauty in detail
EDIT: I know that the attached image is not the best, but you can find the 1500x1060 version on Twitter.
Look at that you were able to snag it sooner than we thought.
Most beautiful art ever and also proves a leak real.
And if we are lucky Rune-scarred Demon as well but I assuming we will get a lot of token makers as well because of all the "sacrifice a creature clause" clause.
Problem with Demons is that they have about the same tribal support as Angels, and that's already close to zero. The closest thing to tribal demons have is Shadowborn Apostle and Blood Speaker, after that is the ogres from Kamigawa, which usually had a drawback for not having a demon, Rakdos the Defiler, and Scroll of Griselbrand.
Sure you can play one of those cards 20+ times in a single deck, but after that demon tribal support just drops off completely.
let me get this strait
we are allow to get a angel tribal but yet demons is off limits?
I know angel ain't got no tribal support cards but yet we still want them.
Besides wouldn't most of the 14 new cards could be demon tribal support stuff.
Where did I say that angels are allowed in? Oh wait....I didn't. Angels shouldn't be in either, it has the same issues as demons.
As for the "14 new cards" you have to remember that each deck doesn't strictly share an even amount of cards. There will be cards that show up in all of them or in two or three. Each deck will have 8-10 exclusives just for itself. We bring that number lower another one or two because the new commanders may not be strictly "this tribe gets X or now does Y", we already see that with the dragon deck. Two of the three main dragon commanders are not strictly for dragons, and it isn't too hard to believe that it would be similar for the other decks. Sure one deck may have two commanders that perfectly fit their tribe(s), but all three will most likely not be strictly tribe or have any focus on their tribe(s).
So really each deck probably only has 6-8 new cards for their own deck to help only their tribe. At that point any tribe that has damn near zero, or actual zero, support won't be in this, even if they are popular or not. That's why I think we won't get angels, demons, starfish, ouphes, ninjas, samurai, centaurs, or eldrazi (although this one has slightly more support than angels and demons). The tribes that are in either have a ton of support, allowing WotC to make decks far easier, or on the cusp of being one (example being classes like Warrior or Cleric, or something like treefolk) and needs just a bit more to push them over.
I could easily be wrong of course. Angels could be in, at the very least they are popular, but those are my thoughts.
My only problem with Angels is that I find them boring. There's a handful of interesting ones, but usually they cost some obscene amount of mana, and usually heavily devoted to white or heavily diversified into other colors. I suppose they could do a 5 color Angel deck as well, but I feel like it won't play as smoothly as the Dragons deck would because it's lacking that synergy that brings it together. Sure, it will get some new cards, but I don't know if it would be enough to justify an Angel tribal deck.
The same can be said for demons.
If I had to imagine there's another 5 color tribe in here, I wouldn't guess Slivers, because it seems very unfair and pretty bland as opposed to the other possible tribes. I like Slivers, but something tells me they wouldn't do it because there would be too many old slivers reprinted in it running around at EDH leagues which could lead to a lot of confusion and headaches.
I would have to imagine the best option for a 5 color tribe aside from Dragons would be Elementals. They already have a decent selection of cards and some support, as well as being fairly well known and liked I believe.
I kind of feel like we won't see Merfolk or Goblins due to the Duel Decks coming out later on.
Elves is a tough one for me. One part of me says that we won't see them because they just had their psuedo-elf deck previously in Commander 2014. But they are iconic enough that I could see them making a new Elf Lord, maybe Abzan or Sultai. This could give elves a little more versatility, which is also what I think Wizards wants to do with these decks.
You do know that a five color deck doesn't need to be slow, right? With the proper cards it can get out its commander as early as turn four, which is pretty damn fast. And that is not that hard to achieve:
Turn 1: Basic Land, Sol Ring.
Turn 2: Basic land, 3 casting cost colored mana artifact, tap basic land and mana artifact, cast spell (mana fetch perhaps, or armillary Sphere)
Turn 3: Drop another land, play a creature or a spell or two.
Turn 4: Drop another land, play WUBRG commander.
I have a sliver deck that achieves this regularly if I need to be hyper aggressive.
And if I don't, I usually have some protections in play to protect the commander first, like Crystalline Sliver.
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It's about time for the reserved list to die, for the sake of Vintage and Legacy (And Commander).
You do know that a five color deck doesn't need to be slow, right? With the proper cards it can get out its commander as early as turn four, which is pretty damn fast. And that is not that hard to achieve:
Turn 1: Basic Land, Sol Ring.
Turn 2: Basic land, 3 casting cost colored mana artifact, tap basic land and mana artifact, cast spell (mana fetch perhaps, or armillary Sphere)
Turn 3: Drop another land, play a creature or a spell or two.
Turn 4: Drop another land, play WUBRG commander.
I have a sliver deck that achieves this regularly if I need to be hyper aggressive.
And if I don't, I usually have some protections in play to protect the commander first, like Crystalline Sliver.
Agreed. I have a Sliver Overlord deck that is pretty fast, and I'm not even running all the "Expensive" lands that are supposedly required for it to be perfected, and I'm sure that would make it even quicker.
You do know that a five color deck doesn't need to be slow, right? With the proper cards it can get out its commander as early as turn four, which is pretty damn fast. And that is not that hard to achieve:
Turn 1: Basic Land, Sol Ring.
Turn 2: Basic land, 3 casting cost colored mana artifact, tap basic land and mana artifact, cast spell (mana fetch perhaps, or armillary Sphere)
Turn 3: Drop another land, play a creature or a spell or two.
Turn 4: Drop another land, play WUBRG commander.
I have a sliver deck that achieves this regularly if I need to be hyper aggressive.
And if I don't, I usually have some protections in play to protect the commander first, like Crystalline Sliver.
You are talking about a god hand that starts with a turn one Sol Ring. Think about if from a less optimistic perspective. The Atraxa, Praetors' Voice deck that Wizards provided included 15 lands that entered the battlefield tapped. It it incredibly difficult to consistently cast Atraxa, Praetors' Voice on turn four with a mana base like that. With 15 lands entering tapped, it is very possible that during some of the earlier turns of the game that player won't be casting spells.
Your five color sliver deck (along with Creedmoor's) probably doesn't have 15 lands that enter the battlefield tapped. It probably also has more than 20 nonbasic lands. A five colored deck would presumably be even more difficult to mana fix because we know wizards doesn't enjoy giving players a decent or even semi competitive mana base. A deck with three or fewer colors (especially one or two) is going to be much faster, much more consistent and relies on far fewer slow/mediocre mana fixing sources.
Just imagine how unfun it would be for a player new to the format that bough a WUBRG dragons precon that isn't making a meaningful impact on the board until turn 4 or 5, compared to a BR vampires precon that has their commander and multiple vampires on the board by turn 4.
Edit: Perhaps I'm stressing the argument because I really think it would be cool if we had more WUBRG legendary creatures, but I firmly believe that a if you had a $100 dollar budget and you spent $50 dollars on a mono or two colored deck and you spent $50 dollars on a WUBRG deck, the former deck is going to be better/faster and that is primarily because of the mana base.
Let's not forget that they've designed an easy to cast five color commander in the form of Tazri quite recently.
Sure, but the dragons that were leaked in the upcoming EDH set are literally WUBRG. They are probably going to have crappy mana bases, and would presumably play much slower than a 2 colored deck.
Let's not forget that they've designed an easy to cast five color commander in the form of Tazri quite recently.
Sure, but the dragons that were leaked in the upcoming EDH set are literally WUBRG. They are probably going to have crappy mana bases, and would presumably play much slower than a 2 colored deck.
You guys always mess this up
The commander himself reduces the cost to cast the dragons.
And I exspect there are going to be quite a few old and new Ramp cards Ramos is the first one.
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Also, there are not "A LOT" of new cards. There are not nearly enough new cards to make something a valid tribe that wasn't already well-represented. We aren't getting Aetherborn tribal.
Dragon: well the set symbol and the Ramos art posted confirm this is real. But everyone screws this up scion not a legit dragon tribal yes it tutors them BUT TO THE GRAVE needs to be put in hand, and it only benefits the scion to turn him into dragons. his master Is the true dragon tribal commander cheapens them and can cause draw and cheat stuff out from dragon triggers.
Possible for exspected
Vampire: Olivia is definately the best choice right now but we need either/both WU as well for them so we can use stuff like
blood tyrant,
cliffhaven vampire,
drana's emissary
Duskmantle Seer ,
Vish Kal, Blood Arbiter
Mirko Vosk, Mind Drinker
Wizard: U alone is great but I'm sure the WBRG wizards need something to go into
http://magiccards.info/query?q=t:"Wizard" c:wbrg&v=card&s=cname look at all of those options
Angel: their popularity is right up there with dragons plus 5-color has Ben wanted for years. (UG angels are morely in multi-color)
Demon: again up their with dragons and angels they don't have tribal decks because none of the legendary demons will cut it, not even Rakdos (sac half permanent version) and if you think only BR has good demons incorrect
W: Butcher of the Horde note this is the one and only white demon. U: Prince of Thralls, Sol'kanar the Swamp King, Silent-Blade Oni So blue could be in as well.
Cat: this has had very high request both amonkhet sets is bringing stuff to the table, we need one with at least GW to be legit, but I have Ben hearing of want for black or red as well.
Human/soilder/knight: well all of these are pretty close to the same catergory and out of all creature types humans have the most, and these need some love as well. How ever humans can co-op with angels if they make it angels have human support in their abilities,
The unexspected
Eldrazi: now just bare with me I wouldn't be surprised if they diden't make it but there are lots of factors that give them points.
1# the devoid eldrazis have Ben attempted many times in lots of decks but never have a tribal leader.
2# wizards did say a while back they are interest/wouldn't mind making a colorless pre-constructed deck this is a opportunity since this is not a color focused product.
3# the edh fan love them a little better than other crowds and that hate is morely due to the ruining of zendikar and innistrad.
4# there is like a immense chance there is more Eldrazi Titan leaders than three known ones plus there is two other routes of Eldrazi Titan tribal first is I. The story we saw tazri in the future corrupted as a Eldrazi by kozielk, and two a tribal support versions of are known titans.
Dinosaur or pirates: very simple to advertise for the ixalan set dinosaurs is more likely because those are pretty much popular and iconic just not in mtg. but very unlikely because from the evil leaker of the rare sheet two of the cards are two legendaries that have tribal support one supports pirates the other supports dinosaurs.
Slivers: well because the can do more and people think they aren't going to make it due to running out of ideas for sliver support types, also they are no casual deck, and those things are more unfun to play against than gaddock and leovold (thank heavens he got banned.) in edh.
Elemental: despite horde of notions we could get another option plus we could get more landfall esc elementals.
Spirits: this is the most likely to me because this is a popular and iconic tribe but lesser used because of no legit leader (O-Kagachi was so close.) also they have way more power house stuff than you think and have lots of options for tribal
, and a assure you O-kagachi being in dragons doesn't kick them there are still a few legendary option.
The ain't gonna happen catergory
Zombies: have enough already plus the scarab god is pretty much the latest option why would they print a new leader for that tribal when we are close to a product
Goblins and merfolk: they both have the same reason this:http://magic.wizards.com/en/products/duel-decks-merfolk-vs-goblins
Far to close after commander decks come out
Elfs: this is why http://magic.wizards.com/en/products/card-set-archive/commander-2014/guided-by-nature
This is a elf tribal deck they did it already and plus one of the decks in the commander anthology set so it being reprinted
So I know you guys want a multi-color tribal but why would they do elf tribal if the already did and just started a reprint run of that deck.
Now all of this is just opinion but feel free to share your thoughts.
All the decks should be five colored. Otherwise the dragon deck will be much slower than the other decks right out of the box.
My Wishlist (That Doesn't Include A Ridiclious Tribe We Know We Won't Get Because It Only Has 10 Creatures):
WUBRG Dragons (Midrange)
WUBRG Wizards/Spirits (Control)
WUBRG Colored Human/Warrior (Aggro)
WUBRG Legendary Matters (Midrange?)
UBRKess, Dissident MageUBR - Controlling Dissidents
GRhonas the IndomitableG - Indomitable Four Drops
WUBOloro, Ageless AsceticWUB - Loot & Renanimate
while viable, i don't see much point honestly. you're forcing 5 color for a tribe that has almost no support in at least two of those colors, and mediocre support in another 2.
it'd be like making goblin tribal u/r, theres almost no reason to.
While I won't deny that enchantments and tokens could both play a major role in an Angels deck, I think it disingenuous to say they aren't cohesive. Yes, Bant and Boros don't play all that well with each other since Bant wants narrow aggro and Boros wants wide aggro, but Empyrial and Jenara would still work well with all the aggro RW Angels. Plus if they printed the WB sister we could have all four sisters in a single deck.
I say Aetherborn should have been Elementals. The nature of their birth screams "Elemental", and they could have presented an opportunity to extend Elementals further into black.
Speaking of which, Elementals are another viable WUBRG tribe option. We have Horde of Notions as an easy reprint choice, and creaturelands and the Awaken mechanic offer even more options for an Elemental tribal deck. Legends they can reprint include Ashling the Pilgrim, Ashling, the Extinguisher, Rakka Mar, Noyan Dar, Roil Shaper, Omnath, Locus of Rage and Marath, Will of the Wild. Animar, Soul of Elements and Maelstrom Wanderer are unfortunately a bit pricy at over $20 and $30 respectively.
Creaturelands vary wildly in price, from Celestial Colonnade at $27.52 and Creeping Tar Pit at $19.90 to Lavaclaw Reaches' humble $1.99. Most of them seem to hover between $5-$10.
For new Elementals, maybe we can see Illulia of Nighthearth?
1 Embodiment of Spring
1 Flamekin Harbinger
2 Ashling the Pilgrim
2 Smokebraider
3 Wispmare
3 Incandescent Soulstoke
3 Rockslide Elemental
3 Fertilid
3 Flickerwisp
3 Wayfaring Temple
3 Wilderness Elemental
3 Marath, Will of the Wild
4 Ceaseless Searblades
4 Embodiment of Fury
4 Nova Chaser
4 Forgotten Ancient
4 Ashling, the Extinguisher
4 Rakka Mar
4 Zendikar Incarnate
5 Reveillark
5 Mulldrifter
5 Ingot Chewer
5 Embodiment of Insight
5 Scion of Vitu-Ghazi
5 Noyan Dar, Roil Shaper
5 Horde of Notions
6 Spitebellows
7 Supreme Exemplar
7 Omnath, Locus of Rage
3 Chromatic Lantern
3 Lightning Coils
Enchantments
2 Hoofprints of the Stag
2 Zektar Shrine Expedition
3 Sacred Ground
3 Elemental Bond
4 Elemental Mastery
4 Flameshadow Conjuring
5 Rite of the Raging Storm
5 Zendikar's Roil
Instants
3 Encircling Fissure
3 Scatter to the Winds
Sorceries
1 Clutch of Currents
2 Ondu Rising
3 Sheer Drop
3 Ruinous Path
4 Coastal Discovery
5 Planar Outburst
6 Part the Waterveil
7 Call the Skybreaker
Land
1 Arcane Sanctum
1 Cascading Cataract
1 Command Tower
1 Crumbling Necropolis
1 Flamekin Village
1 Frontier Bivouac
1 Grove of the Guardian
1 Jungle Shrine
1 Lavaclaw Reaches
1 Mystic Monastery
1 Needle Spires
1 Nomad Outpost
1 Opulent Palace
1 Primal Beyond
1 Raging Ravine
1 Sandsteppe Citadel
1 Savage Lands
1 Seaside Citadel
1 Shambling Vent
1 Stirring Wildwood
4 Plains
4 Island
4 Swamp
4 Mountain
4 Forest
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
Should be sadly almost 2 months before you can snag it.
Maybe two or 1 week before the decks come out.
The All Consuming Oni of Chaos and some rakshasa would be cool, too.
Look at that you were able to snag it sooner than we thought.
Most beautiful art ever and also proves a leak real.
Don't worry demons has a better shot than some of these guys think.
And if we do grixis demons I better see Prince of Thralls and Silent-Blade Oni in the deck.
And Ofcoarse these important demons
And if we are lucky Rune-scarred Demon as well but I assuming we will get a lot of token makers as well because of all the "sacrifice a creature clause" clause.
Problem with Demons is that they have about the same tribal support as Angels, and that's already close to zero. The closest thing to tribal demons have is Shadowborn Apostle and Blood Speaker, after that is the ogres from Kamigawa, which usually had a drawback for not having a demon, Rakdos the Defiler, and Scroll of Griselbrand.
Sure you can play one of those cards 20+ times in a single deck, but after that demon tribal support just drops off completely.
let me get this strait
we are allow to get a angel tribal but yet demons is off limits?
I know angel ain't got no tribal support cards but yet we still want them.
Besides wouldn't most of the 14 new cards could be demon tribal support stuff.
(W/U)(B/R)GForm of Progenitus, Shape of a Scrubland
BRGJund Tokens with Prossh, the Magic Dragon Foil
URGAnimar, the RUG CleanerFoil
RRRFeldon of the Third Path 2.0 Foil
BG(B/G)Not Another Meren DeckFoil
UR(U/R)Mizzix, Y Control and X Burn Spells
(W/U)(B/R)GHarold Ramos - The 35 Foot Long Twinkie (In +1/+1 counters)
UB(U/B)Dragonlord Silumgar
have you seen the demons used in kaalia decks? Those demons are phenomenal
Besides diden't you see my list it's all of the good ones.
|| UW Jace, Vyn's Prodigy UW || UG Kenessos, Priest of Thassa (feat. Arixmethes) UG ||
Cards I still want to see created:
|| Olantin, Lost City || Pavios and Thanasis || Choryu ||
Where did I say that angels are allowed in? Oh wait....I didn't. Angels shouldn't be in either, it has the same issues as demons.
As for the "14 new cards" you have to remember that each deck doesn't strictly share an even amount of cards. There will be cards that show up in all of them or in two or three. Each deck will have 8-10 exclusives just for itself. We bring that number lower another one or two because the new commanders may not be strictly "this tribe gets X or now does Y", we already see that with the dragon deck. Two of the three main dragon commanders are not strictly for dragons, and it isn't too hard to believe that it would be similar for the other decks. Sure one deck may have two commanders that perfectly fit their tribe(s), but all three will most likely not be strictly tribe or have any focus on their tribe(s).
So really each deck probably only has 6-8 new cards for their own deck to help only their tribe. At that point any tribe that has damn near zero, or actual zero, support won't be in this, even if they are popular or not. That's why I think we won't get angels, demons, starfish, ouphes, ninjas, samurai, centaurs, or eldrazi (although this one has slightly more support than angels and demons). The tribes that are in either have a ton of support, allowing WotC to make decks far easier, or on the cusp of being one (example being classes like Warrior or Cleric, or something like treefolk) and needs just a bit more to push them over.
I could easily be wrong of course. Angels could be in, at the very least they are popular, but those are my thoughts.
The same can be said for demons.
If I had to imagine there's another 5 color tribe in here, I wouldn't guess Slivers, because it seems very unfair and pretty bland as opposed to the other possible tribes. I like Slivers, but something tells me they wouldn't do it because there would be too many old slivers reprinted in it running around at EDH leagues which could lead to a lot of confusion and headaches.
I would have to imagine the best option for a 5 color tribe aside from Dragons would be Elementals. They already have a decent selection of cards and some support, as well as being fairly well known and liked I believe.
I kind of feel like we won't see Merfolk or Goblins due to the Duel Decks coming out later on.
Elves is a tough one for me. One part of me says that we won't see them because they just had their psuedo-elf deck previously in Commander 2014. But they are iconic enough that I could see them making a new Elf Lord, maybe Abzan or Sultai. This could give elves a little more versatility, which is also what I think Wizards wants to do with these decks.
Dunes of Zairo
SHANDALAR
Innistrad - The Darkest Night
~THE RAVNICAN CONSORTIUM~
A Community Set
Commander: Allies & Adversaries
You do know that a five color deck doesn't need to be slow, right? With the proper cards it can get out its commander as early as turn four, which is pretty damn fast. And that is not that hard to achieve:
Turn 1: Basic Land, Sol Ring.
Turn 2: Basic land, 3 casting cost colored mana artifact, tap basic land and mana artifact, cast spell (mana fetch perhaps, or armillary Sphere)
Turn 3: Drop another land, play a creature or a spell or two.
Turn 4: Drop another land, play WUBRG commander.
I have a sliver deck that achieves this regularly if I need to be hyper aggressive.
And if I don't, I usually have some protections in play to protect the commander first, like Crystalline Sliver.
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Numquam evolutioni obstes. Solum conculceris.
Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.
Agreed. I have a Sliver Overlord deck that is pretty fast, and I'm not even running all the "Expensive" lands that are supposedly required for it to be perfected, and I'm sure that would make it even quicker.
Dunes of Zairo
SHANDALAR
Innistrad - The Darkest Night
~THE RAVNICAN CONSORTIUM~
A Community Set
Commander: Allies & Adversaries
You are talking about a god hand that starts with a turn one Sol Ring. Think about if from a less optimistic perspective. The Atraxa, Praetors' Voice deck that Wizards provided included 15 lands that entered the battlefield tapped. It it incredibly difficult to consistently cast Atraxa, Praetors' Voice on turn four with a mana base like that. With 15 lands entering tapped, it is very possible that during some of the earlier turns of the game that player won't be casting spells.
Your five color sliver deck (along with Creedmoor's) probably doesn't have 15 lands that enter the battlefield tapped. It probably also has more than 20 nonbasic lands. A five colored deck would presumably be even more difficult to mana fix because we know wizards doesn't enjoy giving players a decent or even semi competitive mana base. A deck with three or fewer colors (especially one or two) is going to be much faster, much more consistent and relies on far fewer slow/mediocre mana fixing sources.
Just imagine how unfun it would be for a player new to the format that bough a WUBRG dragons precon that isn't making a meaningful impact on the board until turn 4 or 5, compared to a BR vampires precon that has their commander and multiple vampires on the board by turn 4.
Edit: Perhaps I'm stressing the argument because I really think it would be cool if we had more WUBRG legendary creatures, but I firmly believe that a if you had a $100 dollar budget and you spent $50 dollars on a mono or two colored deck and you spent $50 dollars on a WUBRG deck, the former deck is going to be better/faster and that is primarily because of the mana base.
UBRKess, Dissident MageUBR - Controlling Dissidents
GRhonas the IndomitableG - Indomitable Four Drops
WUBOloro, Ageless AsceticWUB - Loot & Renanimate
Sure, but the dragons that were leaked in the upcoming EDH set are literally WUBRG. They are probably going to have crappy mana bases, and would presumably play much slower than a 2 colored deck.
UBRKess, Dissident MageUBR - Controlling Dissidents
GRhonas the IndomitableG - Indomitable Four Drops
WUBOloro, Ageless AsceticWUB - Loot & Renanimate
You guys always mess this up
The commander himself reduces the cost to cast the dragons.
And I exspect there are going to be quite a few old and new Ramp cards Ramos is the first one.