Why is it templated as, "Whenever you cycle or discard a card"? Isn't cycling already discarding?
Because there are red cards that use discarding that dont cycle. This triggers off those too.
Sure, but my point is that cycling is a subset of discarding, so they could have just put, "Whenever you discard a card". That would cover cycling and "normal" discarding.
Cartouche? Really? I know it's a real word but it's pretty far removed from the 'common knowledge' box. It's not an intuitive word and it's difficult to pronounce/read for many people.
Couldn't they have gone with something like 'Medal' or 'Sigil'?
I agree. I'm in a position where I can pronounce the word properly because I took French in school, buuuuuutttt...not everyone did that. I'm also already familiar with it from work where packages of inkjet and toner cartridges are multilingual, but this is also a job where most of my customers pronounce "cartridge" as "cartlidges", so prepare for two years of awful manglings of the word. I mean hell, half the M:tG YouTubers can barely pronounce anything properly as it is.
Why is it templated as, "Whenever you cycle or discard a card"? Isn't cycling already discarding?
Because there are red cards that use discarding that dont cycle. This triggers off those too.
Sure, but my point is that cycling is a subset of discarding, so they could have just put, "Whenever you discard a card". That would cover cycling and "normal" discarding.
But the confusion can come in when someone cycles a card. At the time the thought process is "I'm cycling this card" not "I'm discarding this card." The wording is to reduce the number of missed triggers and thus reduce the headache for judges
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Currently Playing:
Standard - Some kind of control
Modern - UB Mill (casual)
EDH - Meren's Grave Shenanigans
So here's a question. Why does Embalm use up valuable complexity points by removing the mana cost of the token?
Embalm as a whole seems incredibly ham-fisted and it really feels like it eats up way too much future design space for accomplishing something that will only be less than 20 cards between this and the next set. Having creatures that create straight token copies of themselves (no extra junk thrown in like "now they are white" or "but no CMC" needed, just a copy) by paying a cost to exile them from the graveyard seems like more than enough on its own - embalm has a ton of baggage and I'm not really feeling it. A less restrictive "creature flashback" could have been used by all colours, too.
Day one spoilers seem underwhelming so far. The most exciting card is a red one drop.
Why does Nest of Scarabs say "When you put" and not "When -1/-1 counters are placed"? Is that going to mean something? Does Nest trigger when creatures enter the battlefield with -1/-1 counters on them?
Do you have to control the container of the effect to put the counters for it to trigger? Does it happen when your sources with wither or infect deal damage?
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Epic banner by Erasmus of æтђєг.
Awesome avatar provided by Krashbot @ [Epic Graphics].
I was hoping for gods that are actually godlike and exciting this time, but instead we get boring, feel-bad, standard midrange stuff. At this point it's fairly clear that they value making their mythics as competitive and balanced as possible over them actually conveying the feeling of being mythic. I'm not asking them to push them and make them unbalanced, I just wouldn't mind a god with a high mana cost and high stats and a big splashy effect rather than a "playable" mana cost with "aggressive" stats and "kinda maybe a little bit useful" effect, all marred with annoying downside. I mean, I'm starting to get the feeling WotC thinks "godlike" means "aggressively costed with downside" rather than being ACTUALLY godlike. I want stuff like Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite or Avacyn, Angel of Hope. Those cards felt divine and almighty. This just feels like a slighty bigger than normal person with no real mechanical identity.
I was hoping for gods that are actually godlike and exciting this time, but instead we get boring, feel-bad, standard midrange stuff. At this point it's fairly clear that they value making their mythics as competitive and balanced as possible over them actually conveying the feeling of being mythic. I'm not asking them to push them and make them unbalanced, I just wouldn't mind a god with a high mana cost and high stats and a big splashy effect rather than a "playable" mana cost with "aggressive" stats and "kinda maybe a little bit useful" effect, all marred with annoying downside. I mean, I'm starting to get the feeling WotC thinks "godlike" means "aggressively costed with downside" rather than being ACTUALLY godlike. I want stuff like Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite or Avacyn, Angel of Hope. Those cards felt divine and almighty. This just feels like a slighty bigger than normal person with no real mechanical identity.
Then a ton of people would complain that they are for "EDH only" or fringe reanimator strategies.
I was hoping for gods that are actually godlike and exciting this time, but instead we get boring, feel-bad, standard midrange stuff. At this point it's fairly clear that they value making their mythics as competitive and balanced as possible over them actually conveying the feeling of being mythic. I'm not asking them to push them and make them unbalanced, I just wouldn't mind a god with a high mana cost and high stats and a big splashy effect rather than a "playable" mana cost with "aggressive" stats and "kinda maybe a little bit useful" effect, all marred with annoying downside. I mean, I'm starting to get the feeling WotC thinks "godlike" means "aggressively costed with downside" rather than being ACTUALLY godlike. I want stuff like Elesh Norn, Grand Cenobite or Avacyn, Angel of Hope. Those cards felt divine and almighty. This just feels like a slighty bigger than normal person with no real mechanical identity.
Then a ton of people would complain that they are for "EDH only" or fringe reanimator strategies.
Well, we do have Aetherworks Marvel and the new cast-for-free-from-top-of-you-library artifact so if any time to make big splashy creatures that can be cheated into play would be now.
Then a ton of people would complain that they are for "EDH only" or fringe reanimator strategies.
Unless they actually build a format in which cards like that are playable. And, in any case, WotC seems fine with alienating large portions of their playerbase at a time with high-profile cards anyway. Why should standard players be the exception? They still get the majority of the rest of the set, why not let cards that want to be big splashy mythics be big splashy mythics for a change?
So here's a question. Why does Embalm use up valuable complexity points by removing the mana cost of the token?
Because it makes them more like other creature tokens. Functionally this isn't a copy effect, it's a create a token that just happens to be this size and have these abilities effect.
- Gods are about what I expected. Indestructible, midrange creatures with decent stats. I didn't expect the "become a creature" aspect again, but here it is. I'm hoping the other Gods are easier to keep online.
- I was really hoping the "Trials" would be rare cards. After all, they're a big part of the story, right? And supposed to be a great challenge?
- It looks like this set is going to need a lot of combo synergy. With all the -1/-1 counters I really hope there are some good enablers and engines you can build to make the deck function. If not, it's going to be a bumpy road.
I always try to guess how few spoilers have to come out before Magic players decide the whole set's terrible. Seems to be about 25% on average.
Also, the God is going to be a great aggro top end, and it enables its own animation, something Purphoros never did. In any case, it's a totally different card, so I'm still pretty stoked to see the rest of the gods.
Also, the Scarab card is pretty sweet with the demon that puts -1/-1 counters on stuff whenever you discard or cycle.
Mostly, I'm hoping for tons o' birds to update my Kangee, Aerie Keeper EDH deck.
Why is it templated as, "Whenever you cycle or discard a card"? Isn't cycling already discarding?
Because there are red cards that use discarding that dont cycle. This triggers off those too.
Then just use "whenever you discard a card", discarding is part of Cycling cost, so "whenerver you discard a card" fit both cycling and non-cycling discard. Adding the cycling clause is simply redundant.
RW Blaze Commando Soldier Swarm BW Edgewalker Clerics i.e. All the prevention R Ogre Menial (Fallen Feromancer) Tunnelin' Infectors GB Shaman of the Pack Elves URReclusive Artificer Artifact Control GBCatacomb Sifter Sac-Attack
Tiny Leader Decks
WU Geist of Saint Traft WKembha's Cats WRG Marath Slide Control
The only time I can remember when WotC's pendulum swung any shorter was when Shadowmoor-Eventide led straight into Alara block.
I thought that WotC was maybe on the road to recovery after SOI and KLD blocks, but now I'm starting to think that the bottoming-out that Magic experienced with BFZ block / the switch to the 2-set-block structure / the failed rotation-frequency change caused some permanent damage to this bus.
I'd forgive a lot if this set was masterfully executed, but I gotta say that aftermath and embalm are both in the running to win the booby prize for ugliest, kludgiest mechanics of the Modern era (they'll lose, but they're in the running). Amonkhet better play like a dream; it feels like design dropped the ball again, and I'm back to putting all my faith in development.
The one thing I do like (so far) is the creative angle. There's a lot I'm seeing that's original here, and that was NOT a guarantee, given the extremely-well-tread Egyptian theme.
So here's a question. Why does Embalm use up valuable complexity points by removing the mana cost of the token?
If you don't have a token and a card says make a copy, we know how to do that, grab a spare land from the land pile, flip it over face down and say thats a copy of that card.
However, they wanted to print token cards you could use because token cards with art are cool. If they put mana costs on the token cards, that would screw people up who thought it was a cast-able spell they could put in their deck. The fact that it doesn't have a mana cost makes even new players stop and go "wait.... oh, its a token".
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
Sure, but my point is that cycling is a subset of discarding, so they could have just put, "Whenever you discard a card". That would cover cycling and "normal" discarding.
Can't wait to put these in my Eugene, the Spirit Dragon deck to curve into my Faerie Mackabrays.
But the confusion can come in when someone cycles a card. At the time the thought process is "I'm cycling this card" not "I'm discarding this card." The wording is to reduce the number of missed triggers and thus reduce the headache for judges
Standard - Some kind of control
Modern - UB Mill (casual)
EDH - Meren's Grave Shenanigans
Embalm as a whole seems incredibly ham-fisted and it really feels like it eats up way too much future design space for accomplishing something that will only be less than 20 cards between this and the next set. Having creatures that create straight token copies of themselves (no extra junk thrown in like "now they are white" or "but no CMC" needed, just a copy) by paying a cost to exile them from the graveyard seems like more than enough on its own - embalm has a ton of baggage and I'm not really feeling it. A less restrictive "creature flashback" could have been used by all colours, too.
Day one spoilers seem underwhelming so far. The most exciting card is a red one drop.
Do you have to control the container of the effect to put the counters for it to trigger? Does it happen when your sources with wither or infect deal damage?
Awesome avatar provided by Krashbot @ [Epic Graphics].
No, because still only *1* card is being discarded. It's not Cycle AND Discard, it's Cycle OR Discard. So one trigger off one card.
Ruling on Rayne, Academy Chancellor supports your interpretation.
Awesome avatar provided by Krashbot @ [Epic Graphics].
Then a ton of people would complain that they are for "EDH only" or fringe reanimator strategies.
Well, we do have Aetherworks Marvel and the new cast-for-free-from-top-of-you-library artifact so if any time to make big splashy creatures that can be cheated into play would be now.
Why? Costs are set by Development to balance the effects of the cards. Flying is generally a Big Deal and could easily make it 3UU or 4U.
Because it makes them more like other creature tokens. Functionally this isn't a copy effect, it's a create a token that just happens to be this size and have these abilities effect.
- Gods are about what I expected. Indestructible, midrange creatures with decent stats. I didn't expect the "become a creature" aspect again, but here it is. I'm hoping the other Gods are easier to keep online.
- I was really hoping the "Trials" would be rare cards. After all, they're a big part of the story, right? And supposed to be a great challenge?
- It looks like this set is going to need a lot of combo synergy. With all the -1/-1 counters I really hope there are some good enablers and engines you can build to make the deck function. If not, it's going to be a bumpy road.
Dunes of Zairo
SHANDALAR
Innistrad - The Darkest Night
~THE RAVNICAN CONSORTIUM~
A Community Set
Commander: Allies & Adversaries
Also, the God is going to be a great aggro top end, and it enables its own animation, something Purphoros never did. In any case, it's a totally different card, so I'm still pretty stoked to see the rest of the gods.
Also, the Scarab card is pretty sweet with the demon that puts -1/-1 counters on stuff whenever you discard or cycle.
Mostly, I'm hoping for tons o' birds to update my Kangee, Aerie Keeper EDH deck.
fwiw, i even didn't know there was an article
Some other maddess R/B stuff.
Something to test out for Standard??
It's not even any sort of "Trial." It's just an unconditional +1 card with upside.
Probably a naming convention from a flavor side of things.
The blue one will be something like 'God of Knowledge' but named: Tut the wise or something
with their name being a synonymous adjective for the trait they represent: Fervent:Zeal::_________ : _________
EDH DECKS:
GBCatacomb Sifter Sac-Attack
The only time I can remember when WotC's pendulum swung any shorter was when Shadowmoor-Eventide led straight into Alara block.
I thought that WotC was maybe on the road to recovery after SOI and KLD blocks, but now I'm starting to think that the bottoming-out that Magic experienced with BFZ block / the switch to the 2-set-block structure / the failed rotation-frequency change caused some permanent damage to this bus.
I'd forgive a lot if this set was masterfully executed, but I gotta say that aftermath and embalm are both in the running to win the booby prize for ugliest, kludgiest mechanics of the Modern era (they'll lose, but they're in the running). Amonkhet better play like a dream; it feels like design dropped the ball again, and I'm back to putting all my faith in development.
The one thing I do like (so far) is the creative angle. There's a lot I'm seeing that's original here, and that was NOT a guarantee, given the extremely-well-tread Egyptian theme.
If you don't have a token and a card says make a copy, we know how to do that, grab a spare land from the land pile, flip it over face down and say thats a copy of that card.
However, they wanted to print token cards you could use because token cards with art are cool. If they put mana costs on the token cards, that would screw people up who thought it was a cast-able spell they could put in their deck. The fact that it doesn't have a mana cost makes even new players stop and go "wait.... oh, its a token".