Finally, a 'walker that checks all the boxes for Legacy Lands... All three abilities are always relevant (gets back Exploration/Manabond!), and at 5 mana it's not unreasonable. I'll be testing this for sure
Welll.... this is kinda unexpected to me. Anyway, being able to fire off her ultimate in one turn is a big draw, especially given that it becomes permanent card advantage. The low - ability number is a slight weirdo given her massive starting loyalty, but oh well.
I will probably be chewed out for this, but am I the only one who accidentally mistook this nissa for the PW deck one. I mean, lets be real, the PW deck nissa has way better art, and it has a better second ability (getting two cards instead of one) and a better ultimate (immediately impacts the board, and in most cases just wins the game; versus may never impact the board at all unless you still have lands to play). Overall, I kinda think the PW nissa is better, if it only cost 5 like this one
This card is a lot stronger in gameplay, but its artwork is for sure terrible.
They even put this terrible artwork on the champions playmate for gameday , like "WHY ?"
Who exactly thought this would be a good artwork ? (Even a mother cant love that art ... )
Especially as the other 2nd one is so much better (and like anyone has that opinion, absolutely nobody will like this artwork more).
Terrible decision of who ever was in charge.
And they should feel terrible for it.
you're probably right that the set nissa is more powerful, because I have to assume they tested both of them, but I would at least rather have the second ability from the PW deck card over the serious one, just at a less drastic loyalty drop; -4 is too much, but top decking 2 cards that if they are lands go right into play or if not in your hand is really strong, and I would say it is better than a regrowth.
This is going to be a great finisher for midrange decks. Being able to generate a 5/5 that can either immediately attack or stick around to block is great and all of the rest of the abilities are just pure card-advantage.
Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
Melek, Izzet Paragon
Oona, Queen of the Fae
Bruna, Light of Alabaster
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Rhys the Redeemed
Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Sen Triplets
The Mimeoplasm WUBRGSliver OverlordGRBUW WUBRGSliver Hivelord(Superfriends)GRBUW
Kiora from BFZ untaps a land and a creature as her +1. And she is U/G
I know that other untap effects exist in the game. How I wish I could play Kiora inn my GW deck. But Kiora doesn't do all that other stuff. When you have plenty of defense, you use the 5/5 land for mana and cast something else. When you don't, you block with it, or you can beat down with it, and hopefully next turn you get to ultimate Nissa or maybe make another 5/5 to let her survive the ultimate. I was just trying to point out the flexibility - like so many good PWs, there is a good number of ways to play her. Good card.
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When I hit my 3000 post mark, I'm gone for good.
Stay reasonable, be mindful of your expectations and don't feed the trolls.
She looks quite really strong. She can protect herself for a full turn cycle, barring flyers, then can pull the trigger and drown in value.
She's like a late-game flood insurance.
Tezzeret will not be Esper, he lacks any white character traits.
Just like Liliana will not be in SoI block?
I still think it was illogical for her to be there after the crap she pulled in the original Innistrad block, but she is clearly very confident in her power, and the vampire was distracted by Nahiri going on a rampage and the angels going insane, so there is that.
And Tezz still doesn't have *any* white character traits.
Being a head judge is white enough to have it as his 3rd color on this specific card. The function really fits adding more white to him.
Being the head judge of an inventors fair does not make one white, if anything it makes one blue. >.<
The Orzhov is modeled after the mob and the catholic church, their members are "family" and follow a strict hierarchy. That is how the Orzhov are white.
Right, I agree that is why Orzhov is white. None of what you said indicates how they "Care about others". Hence why Orzhov seems to be a perfect example of how WB doesn't have to care about others. In fact - their very nature is about extorting others and using every loophole to bind others to indentured servitude even after death - which is very much the opposite of "caring about others", but is something you would expect black to do within a rigid structure of order that white provides.
To be very clear - I'm not arguing Tezzeret should be Esper (I know nothing of his story except what I've seen here. I played Shards of Alara but I didn't follow it's story and I didn't even play either Mirrodin block) - I'm just not sure that W still has to care about others when paired B which is about using others for their own agenda. Conflicting values on colour pairings usually cancel each other out (but may still appear in specific instances)
Saying that W has to care about others when paired with B is like saying U is detached from their emotions and impartial even when paired with R.
Orzhov cares about other Orzhov, they are family.
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It's about time for the reserved list to die, for the sake of Vintage and Legacy (And Commander).
Judge/Judging is white/blue in the context of law, thus Azorius. Judging in the context of a contest can be any color that is relevant to the contest, in this case artifice, which means blue.
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It's about time for the reserved list to die, for the sake of Vintage and Legacy (And Commander).
She looks quite really strong. She can protect herself for a full turn cycle, barring flyers, then can pull the trigger and drown in value.
She's like a late-game flood insurance.
I feel like the only one who disagree but still: her ultimate is not worthy at all the 5-mana + wait&see !
You have to survive infiniteturns and be able to drop lands during thse turns for it to be decent!
5 mana is already worth plenty of CA in mtg one shot or repeatable (Tidings, Jace,Unraveler of Secrets...), here you get something strictly worse than Honden of Seeing Winds (yes the honden is weak to enchantment removal unlike the emblem but these are less common than ways to kill the Nissa).
The "-3" is never going to be as good as a simple Restock because it only gets permanents and you need 3 turns for netting 2 cards... (just compare it to Kiora, Master of the depths minus ability...)
Her only good ability is her "+1" that is arguably worse than having just a dude.
I don't foresee any deck in which I would not play Arborback Stomper over her maindeck. Post sideboard she is less useful even though stronger against control deck but weaker than any card draw engine.
She seems on par with "planeswalker deck" cards: atrociously bad!
This presents a 5/5 threat every turn that control can't easily answer with creature removal... including the turn you cast it. That's excellent against control and not a poor blocker.
Honden of seeing winds would likely be totally playable right now, and this is actually probably better, since it isn't at all unlikely that you will play and crack an evolving wilds once or twice after her ult, not to mention any land ramp spells you might be playing.
The -3 gets back a wide range of superb threats and even some removal in the right deck. Just cycling walkers is great, but if need be you can pickup the white gearhulk or statis field or whatnot. Considering that den protector, at 5 mana to play and flip, was a format defining card and is still highly played. This is only a bit weaker in that capacity and has the ability to swing for 5 or ult and become a super tireless tracker. Remember that you don't need to ult right away and kill it.
This card is way better than you think and probably significantly better than worldwaker was. It's certainly a whole lot better than the PW deck walkers.
She looks quite really strong. She can protect herself for a full turn cycle, barring flyers, then can pull the trigger and drown in value.
She's like a late-game flood insurance.
I feel like the only one who disagree but still: her ultimate is not worthy at all the 5-mana + wait&see !
You have to survive infiniteturns and be able to drop lands during thse turns for it to be decent!
5 mana is already worth plenty of CA in mtg one shot or repeatable (Tidings, Jace,Unraveler of Secrets...), here you get something strictly worse than Honden of Seeing Winds (yes the honden is weak to enchantment removal unlike the emblem but these are less common than ways to kill the Nissa).
The "-3" is never going to be as good as a simple Restock because it only gets permanents and you need 3 turns for netting 2 cards... (just compare it to Kiora, Master of the depths minus ability...)
Her only good ability is her "+1" that is arguably worse than having just a dude.
I don't foresee any deck in which I would not play Arborback Stomper over her maindeck. Post sideboard she is less useful even though stronger against control deck but weaker than any card draw engine.
She seems on par with "planeswalker deck" cards: atrociously bad!
This presents a 5/5 threat every turn that control can't easily answer with creature removal... including the turn you cast it. That's excellent against control and not a poor blocker.
Honden of seeing winds would likely be totally playable right now, and this is actually probably better, since it isn't at all unlikely that you will play and crack an evolving wilds once or twice after her ult, not to mention any land ramp spells you might be playing.
The -3 gets back a wide range of superb threats and even some removal in the right deck. Just cycling walkers is great, but if need be you can pickup the white gearhulk or statis field or whatnot. Considering that den protector, at 5 mana to play and flip, was a format defining card and is still highly played. This is only a bit weaker in that capacity and has the ability to swing for 5 or ult and become a super tireless tracker. Remember that you don't need to ult right away and kill it.
This card is way better than you think and probably significantly better than worldwaker was. It's certainly a whole lot better than the PW deck walkers.
It does not provide multiple 5/5s, only 1 contrary to Nissa, Worldwaker's 4/4 tramplers.
Your evolving wilds argument is irrelevant since the times where you don't actually have lands to play probably come up as often and it's a deck restriction. Jace, Unraveler of Secrets "+" is a way better card-drawing engine than Honden honestly, and still does not see tons of play (he might later on though, contrary to this nissa in my opinion...).
The "-" is not good, it does not get nonpermanent unlike both Den protector or even Restock(which never saw play with a better rate).
Your definition of "irrelevant" is amusing.
I'll concede that unraveler of secrets is likely a stronger card, and may see play once super-jace rotates, but green is a stronger color than blue presently. Please try to recall this conversation when this card sees play in standard, as will I if it turns out to be way worse than my estimation.
New Nissa seems fair, I like her Regrowth-like ability for Commander especially, though, it will be pretty nice in a PW-heavy shell as well - being able to grow back a Planeswalker that died earlier can be very strong.
I don't believe she's the best possible turn-five play in Standard. Getting set back on land at that point in the game can be very painful and the animated land is vulnerable to sorcery-speed removal. On the other hand, at least Ruinous Path might be better suited to taking out Nissa herself, so meh. Five toughness at least is very nice against cards that mostly take care of toughness 3 and 4.
Having to use the few pieces of removal you have that can deal with this on a land is painful if you use her at later stages, where lands start being too plentiful.
Of course using her in that way runs counter to her ultimate ability, so I don't preclude casting her on curve if the situation fits.
As for the whole 'is Tezzeret white or not' discussion: Remember he's the Head Judge. According to the MTR, the Head Judge is the final authority. So if Tezzeret declares he's white, he's white.
Until then, consider the following: People can change. Even if Tezz so far has not shown much inclination towards considering others but himself, this does not mean he may never do so. If the game or the story requires it, that is what will happen.
Or as seen from a different perspective: So far we have Planeswalkers in the G, R and UR parts of the color wheel. So both B and W Planeswalkers remain unspoiled so far. Depending on how many and which Planeswalkers we are to see (Both Dovin Baan and Ajani have been hinted at, but Liliana might be possible as well, albeit unlikely), he might need to fill specific color requirements.
I, for one, think that this nissa would do stupendus work in a 26-land control shell: kill everything you see, eventually make all your landdrops cantrip so you can avoid late game flood, and if you ever run out of gas just season past for all your removal back (and some evolving wilds too for the added avalanche of late game card advantage). Something like this comes to mind (usual disclaimers: first draft, spoilers incomplete, metagame unknown, etc).
Notes: flaying tendrils is obviously terrible, but it's basically a placeholder for a BB 4 mana conditional sweeper like Languish. If such a thing does not get printed, then we might have to go Jund for radiant flames (going WW for planar outburst is a chance too, but the 5-drop slot is a bit tight).
Also, Emrakul is a possibility, since we already run quite a bunch of different card types and nissa actually provides some ramping power. Maybe replacing the Seasons Past? I like the inevitability of SP, and buying back all your removal could be great after you emblem, but beating down with a 13/13 is also cool. Maybe 1-off Emrakul instead of the gearhulk? though I do like the gearhulk gaining life (we spend quite a bit of life on Ob Nixilis and live fast) perhaps kalitas is enough.
And if you really want to go off the deep end, add a nissa's renewal somewhere (i like renewal more than splendid reclamation because it lets us gain life).
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Legacy - WRG Lands, WR Shortcake, RR Burn, UBRG Delver
you're probably right that the set nissa is more powerful, because I have to assume they tested both of them, but I would at least rather have the second ability from the PW deck card over the serious one, just at a less drastic loyalty drop; -4 is too much, but top decking 2 cards that if they are lands go right into play or if not in your hand is really strong, and I would say it is better than a regrowth.
Poruq no los dos? She would synergize beautifully WITH Koth.
Storm Crow is strictly worse than Seacoast Drake.
Tezzeret is likely Dimir or Esper, not Orzhov. And Dovin is likely Azorius. Could be something else but doubtful.
The art we have for him is probably not Planeswalker art:
Reprint Stasis!
Control needs more love.
EDH:
Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
Melek, Izzet Paragon
Oona, Queen of the Fae
Bruna, Light of Alabaster
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Rhys the Redeemed
Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Sen Triplets
The Mimeoplasm
WUBRGSliver OverlordGRBUW
WUBRGSliver Hivelord(Superfriends)GRBUW
Stay reasonable, be mindful of your expectations and don't feed the trolls.
Doomsdayin'
quitereally strong. She can protect herself for a full turn cycle, barring flyers, then can pull the trigger and drown in value.She's like a late-game flood insurance.
Being the head judge of an inventors fair does not make one white, if anything it makes one blue. >.<
Orzhov cares about other Orzhov, they are family.
---
Numquam evolutioni obstes. Solum conculceris.
Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.
Judge/Judging is white/blue in the context of law, thus Azorius. Judging in the context of a contest can be any color that is relevant to the contest, in this case artifice, which means blue.
---
Numquam evolutioni obstes. Solum conculceris.
Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.
This presents a 5/5 threat every turn that control can't easily answer with creature removal... including the turn you cast it. That's excellent against control and not a poor blocker.
Honden of seeing winds would likely be totally playable right now, and this is actually probably better, since it isn't at all unlikely that you will play and crack an evolving wilds once or twice after her ult, not to mention any land ramp spells you might be playing.
The -3 gets back a wide range of superb threats and even some removal in the right deck. Just cycling walkers is great, but if need be you can pickup the white gearhulk or statis field or whatnot. Considering that den protector, at 5 mana to play and flip, was a format defining card and is still highly played. This is only a bit weaker in that capacity and has the ability to swing for 5 or ult and become a super tireless tracker. Remember that you don't need to ult right away and kill it.
This card is way better than you think and probably significantly better than worldwaker was. It's certainly a whole lot better than the PW deck walkers.
Your definition of "irrelevant" is amusing.
I'll concede that unraveler of secrets is likely a stronger card, and may see play once super-jace rotates, but green is a stronger color than blue presently. Please try to recall this conversation when this card sees play in standard, as will I if it turns out to be way worse than my estimation.
I don't believe she's the best possible turn-five play in Standard. Getting set back on land at that point in the game can be very painful and the animated land is vulnerable to sorcery-speed removal. On the other hand, at least Ruinous Path might be better suited to taking out Nissa herself, so meh. Five toughness at least is very nice against cards that mostly take care of toughness 3 and 4.
Having to use the few pieces of removal you have that can deal with this on a land is painful if you use her at later stages, where lands start being too plentiful.
Of course using her in that way runs counter to her ultimate ability, so I don't preclude casting her on curve if the situation fits.
As for the whole 'is Tezzeret white or not' discussion: Remember he's the Head Judge. According to the MTR, the Head Judge is the final authority. So if Tezzeret declares he's white, he's white.
Until then, consider the following: People can change. Even if Tezz so far has not shown much inclination towards considering others but himself, this does not mean he may never do so. If the game or the story requires it, that is what will happen.
Or as seen from a different perspective: So far we have Planeswalkers in the G, R and UR parts of the color wheel. So both B and W Planeswalkers remain unspoiled so far. Depending on how many and which Planeswalkers we are to see (Both Dovin Baan and Ajani have been hinted at, but Liliana might be possible as well, albeit unlikely), he might need to fill specific color requirements.
21 BG lands
4 Evolving wilds
1 Blighted fen
Creatures (4)
3 Kalitas, traitor of Ghet
1 Noxious Gearhulk
4 grasp of darkness
Sorcery (10)
2 Die Young
2 Ruinous path
4 Live Fast
2 Seasons Past
4 flaying tendrils
4 metalspinner's puzzleknot
Walkers (7)
4 Liliana, the last hope
3 Nissa, Vital Force
1 Ob Nixilis Reignited
Notes: flaying tendrils is obviously terrible, but it's basically a placeholder for a BB 4 mana conditional sweeper like Languish. If such a thing does not get printed, then we might have to go Jund for radiant flames (going WW for planar outburst is a chance too, but the 5-drop slot is a bit tight).
Also, Emrakul is a possibility, since we already run quite a bunch of different card types and nissa actually provides some ramping power. Maybe replacing the Seasons Past? I like the inevitability of SP, and buying back all your removal could be great after you emblem, but beating down with a 13/13 is also cool. Maybe 1-off Emrakul instead of the gearhulk? though I do like the gearhulk gaining life (we spend quite a bit of life on Ob Nixilis and live fast) perhaps kalitas is enough.
And if you really want to go off the deep end, add a nissa's renewal somewhere (i like renewal more than splendid reclamation because it lets us gain life).