I think that WoTC doesn't change the amount of produce released even if there is a Modern Masters GP; this means that the product that goes to the GP gets subtracted from what the print and that gets shipped out to suppliers.
By not having a GP, it gives a lot more product to send out to suppliers.
after a shord research sesson i could see following cards as the shard rares:
Bant: Stoic Angel (Confirmed)
Esper: Magister Sphinx (Seems perfect for Blink and as a finisher, even without Flash)
Grixis: Nicol Bolas, Planeswalker; or Cruel Ultimatum (No instant that returns a creature, but ultimatum is clearly a control card and redicolus in this draft environment, i think; Bolas just as good stuff and freaky for Dark Intimations)
Jund: Madrush Cyclops (Only serious option for me.)
Naya: Titanic Ultimatum (Sorry, but this seems to combine both archetypes at best, would still be a sad feeling to open it in draft, though.)
Wizards has been pretty clear through their behavior--and words too, if I'm not mistaken--that Planeswalkers aren't happening at rare. So no Nicol Bolas--especially in light of the fact that he'll probably get a PW card in Amonkhet or Hour of Devastation.
pucatrade
big receipts
alpha mox emerald
beta time walk
4 goyfs received
3 liliana of the veil
4 karn liberated
3 force of will
4 grove of the burnwillows
snapcaster mage
3 horizon canopy
2 full art damnation
after a shord research sesson i could see following cards as the shard rares:
Bant: Stoic Angel (Confirmed)
Esper: Magister Sphinx (Seems perfect for Blink and as a finisher, even without Flash)
Grixis: Nicol Bolas, Planeswalker; or Cruel Ultimatum (No instant that returns a creature, but ultimatum is clearly a control card and redicolus in this draft environment, i think; Bolas just as good stuff and freaky for Dark Intimations)
Jund: Madrush Cyclops (Only serious option for me.)
Naya: Titanic Ultimatum (Sorry, but this seems to combine both archetypes at best, would still be a sad feeling to open it in draft, though.)
Wizards has been pretty clear through their behavior--and words too, if I'm not mistaken--that Planeswalkers aren't happening at rare. So no Nicol Bolas--especially in light of the fact that he'll probably get a PW card in Amonkhet or Hour of Devastation.
In interested in knowing what cards fit into the archetypes they presented to us.
UW - Blink (Just good stuff, i guess.)
UB - Instant control (A big sign for Snapcaster Mage, as well as Flash-Matter cards e.g. Glen Elendra Pranksters and Mystical Teachings)(Seems like Modern Masters original Faerie theme could return as a subtheme)
BR - Unearth Aggro (With only 14 red/black cards with unearth? Maybe with Goryo's Vengeance as Rare and Through the Breach at Mythic, but what legends would make any sense? Urabrask the Hidden, Sheoldred, Whispering One?)
RG - Go Wide (WTF? I've no idea here besides Boartusk Liege)
GW - Populate (With only 13 cards? Very simple and boring i think. Only Growing Ranks in uncommon could make this limited playable in my opinion.)
I think the Praetor Cycle would be cool, though I personally don't think they would, mainly because the last time they reprinted any, they only had Elesh Norn.
Value is good. But Dredgevine isn't supposed to be about value. It's supposed to be about V-8; 2000 pounds of nitro boosted war vegetables. The more velocity, the better.
Modern:
DredgeVine EDH:
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Anima Standard:
I think the Praetor Cycle would be cool, though I personally don't think they would, mainly because the last time they reprinted any, they only had Elesh Norn.
I wouldn't count them out just yet-
they're clearly stuffing a lot of value in the Rare slot,
so the Mythics may be toned down as a result.
They had the Kamigawa Dragons in MM1, and I could see the Praetors filling a similar role here,
especially since literally all of them are popular in EDH.
Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
Melek, Izzet Paragon
Oona, Queen of the Fae
Bruna, Light of Alabaster
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Rhys the Redeemed
Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Sen Triplets
The Mimeoplasm WUBRGSliver OverlordGRBUW WUBRGSliver Hivelord(Superfriends)GRBUW
Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
Melek, Izzet Paragon
Oona, Queen of the Fae
Bruna, Light of Alabaster
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Rhys the Redeemed
Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Sen Triplets
The Mimeoplasm WUBRGSliver OverlordGRBUW WUBRGSliver Hivelord(Superfriends)GRBUW
I think the Praetor Cycle would be cool, though I personally don't think they would, mainly because the last time they reprinted any, they only had Elesh Norn.
I wouldn't count them out just yet-
they're clearly stuffing a lot of value in the Rare slot,
so the Mythics may be toned down as a result.
They had the Kamigawa Dragons in MM1, and I could see the Praetors filling a similar role here,
especially since literally all of them are popular in EDH.
They can afford to print more high value stuff at Mythic than you might think; keep in mind that each Mythic only occurs .2 times per box, so even with 2-4 Mythics in the $40-90+ range (think LotV, Snappy, Cavern, etc.) and the rest in the $2-25 range, they wouldn't even be adding a fifth of the value of the box. EMA had some ridiculous EV at mythic that was all $75-150+ before printing: Karakas ($150), Force of Will ($100), Mana Crypt ($175), JTMS ($85), plus some $25-50 stuff: Vampiric Tutor ($30), Natural Order ($35), Sneak Attack ($40), Dack Fayden ($25).
Even then, lots of value at rare too: Wasteland ($60 pre-EMA), Sensei's Divining Top ($30), Gamble ($30), Entomb ($30), Sinkhole ($25), Necropotence ($12), Toxic Deluge ($15) Shardless Agent ($20), Enlightened Tutor ($15), Heritage Druid ($12).
Obviously you're not going to see anything as crazy as Karakas or Mana Crypt in MM17--Tarmagoyf is really the only modern-legal card in that price range away--but ostensibly MM17 is going to have the same EV as EMA, which means they actually still have s ton of room to cram a bunch of EV into the set at Mythic. Keep in mind two of the more desired reprints that are likely to be at Mythic--Cavern of Souls and Snapcaster Mage--can both be had for no more than $40. The only two big ticket Mythics over $50 that might show up are Goyf and LotV.
Tl;dr: my guess is you're right that the Mythics won't be as good as say EMA, just because there aren't that many insane Mythic Rares to print, but it's not like Wizards is going to need to reprint the Kamigawa Dragons to stay at EV either.
You know, it's funny the set reveal turned out like this because at my LGS we had a conversation about what kind of MM3 it would be if they reprinted fetches in it and basically concluded it would be like a mini-Kahns block with mana fixing everywhere. Lo and behold by miracle we got a Land Masters 2017. The downside is that I don't think we are going to see Horizon Canopy and getting Cavern of Souls in there might be a bit tight.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
You know, it's funny the set reveal turned out like this because at my LGS we had a conversation about what kind of MM3 it would be if they reprinted fetches in it and basically concluded it would be like a mini-Kahns block with mana fixing everywhere. Lo and behold by miracle we got a Land Masters 2017. The downside is that I don't think we are going to see Horizon Canopy and getting Cavern of Souls in there might be a bit tight.
We know we aren't seeing Horizon Canopy, but the competition around the Cavern of Souls slot isn't too bad.
They'd be crazy not to reprint Cavern of Souls; (1) Where else are they going to reprint it? (2) Where are they going to get the EV from if they don't print a few strong mythic rares?
They'd be crazy not to reprint Cavern of Souls; (1) Where else are they going to reprint it? (2) Where are they going to get the EV from if they don't print a few strong mythic rares?
Hypothetically, they could print it in a set based on tribes, like innistrad. The name doesn't have a plane-based term to fix it to any one block.
EV is pretty evident with fetches. LOL Domri Rade doesn't really help to agree with you on some level tho.
@Colt 47: This is not a Star Fox thread....Land Masters....I think that fetches hit more people than Cavern of Souls for the tribal modern brews.
Wow, I didn't even catch that when I wrote it.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
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So basically like the original MMA and to a lesser extent EMA--I reckon most people are probably good with that.
they changed GP Vegas from Standard to Limited for a reason
By not having a GP, it gives a lot more product to send out to suppliers.
This is just a guess but seems reasonable.
Yeah: so they can plug Amonkhet
http://grandprixvegas.com
The first 2 days of spoilers are almost always the best. By Friday people will be *****ing again about the overall content.
they can just reprint nicol bolas as a rare.
pucatrade
big receipts
alpha mox emerald
beta time walk
4 goyfs received
3 liliana of the veil
4 karn liberated
3 force of will
4 grove of the burnwillows
snapcaster mage
3 horizon canopy
2 full art damnation
That card is way below the curve for an 8 mana dragon today. Also it's pre-spark Bolas.
I think the Praetor Cycle would be cool, though I personally don't think they would, mainly because the last time they reprinted any, they only had Elesh Norn.
LOL only if they keep the FTV art.
(W/U)(B/R)GForm of Progenitus, Shape of a Scrubland
BRGJund Tokens with Prossh, the Magic Dragon Foil
URGAnimar, the RUG CleanerFoil
RRRFeldon of the Third Path 2.0 Foil
BG(B/G)Not Another Meren DeckFoil
UR(U/R)Mizzix, Y Control and X Burn Spells
(W/U)(B/R)GHarold Ramos - The 35 Foot Long Twinkie (In +1/+1 counters)
UB(U/B)Dragonlord Silumgar
No love for Reading Rainbow starring Nicol Bolas?
WUBRG Humans
BRW Mardu Pyromancer
UW UW "Control"
UR Blue Moon
(W/U)(B/R)GForm of Progenitus, Shape of a Scrubland
BRGJund Tokens with Prossh, the Magic Dragon Foil
URGAnimar, the RUG CleanerFoil
RRRFeldon of the Third Path 2.0 Foil
BG(B/G)Not Another Meren DeckFoil
UR(U/R)Mizzix, Y Control and X Burn Spells
(W/U)(B/R)GHarold Ramos - The 35 Foot Long Twinkie (In +1/+1 counters)
UB(U/B)Dragonlord Silumgar
Modern Masters 2017, more like fetchlands 2017.
Modern:
DredgeVine
EDH:
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Anima
Standard:
I wouldn't count them out just yet-
they're clearly stuffing a lot of value in the Rare slot,
so the Mythics may be toned down as a result.
They had the Kamigawa Dragons in MM1, and I could see the Praetors filling a similar role here,
especially since literally all of them are popular in EDH.
Reprint Stasis!
Control needs more love.
EDH:
Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
Melek, Izzet Paragon
Oona, Queen of the Fae
Bruna, Light of Alabaster
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Rhys the Redeemed
Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Sen Triplets
The Mimeoplasm
WUBRGSliver OverlordGRBUW
WUBRGSliver Hivelord(Superfriends)GRBUW
I was referring only to the Praetors with the EDH popularity comment. Sorry if that was unclear.
Reprint Stasis!
Control needs more love.
EDH:
Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
Melek, Izzet Paragon
Oona, Queen of the Fae
Bruna, Light of Alabaster
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Rhys the Redeemed
Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Sen Triplets
The Mimeoplasm
WUBRGSliver OverlordGRBUW
WUBRGSliver Hivelord(Superfriends)GRBUW
They can afford to print more high value stuff at Mythic than you might think; keep in mind that each Mythic only occurs .2 times per box, so even with 2-4 Mythics in the $40-90+ range (think LotV, Snappy, Cavern, etc.) and the rest in the $2-25 range, they wouldn't even be adding a fifth of the value of the box. EMA had some ridiculous EV at mythic that was all $75-150+ before printing: Karakas ($150), Force of Will ($100), Mana Crypt ($175), JTMS ($85), plus some $25-50 stuff: Vampiric Tutor ($30), Natural Order ($35), Sneak Attack ($40), Dack Fayden ($25).
Even then, lots of value at rare too: Wasteland ($60 pre-EMA), Sensei's Divining Top ($30), Gamble ($30), Entomb ($30), Sinkhole ($25), Necropotence ($12), Toxic Deluge ($15) Shardless Agent ($20), Enlightened Tutor ($15), Heritage Druid ($12).
Obviously you're not going to see anything as crazy as Karakas or Mana Crypt in MM17--Tarmagoyf is really the only modern-legal card in that price range away--but ostensibly MM17 is going to have the same EV as EMA, which means they actually still have s ton of room to cram a bunch of EV into the set at Mythic. Keep in mind two of the more desired reprints that are likely to be at Mythic--Cavern of Souls and Snapcaster Mage--can both be had for no more than $40. The only two big ticket Mythics over $50 that might show up are Goyf and LotV.
Tl;dr: my guess is you're right that the Mythics won't be as good as say EMA, just because there aren't that many insane Mythic Rares to print, but it's not like Wizards is going to need to reprint the Kamigawa Dragons to stay at EV either.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
(W/U)(B/R)GForm of Progenitus, Shape of a Scrubland
BRGJund Tokens with Prossh, the Magic Dragon Foil
URGAnimar, the RUG CleanerFoil
RRRFeldon of the Third Path 2.0 Foil
BG(B/G)Not Another Meren DeckFoil
UR(U/R)Mizzix, Y Control and X Burn Spells
(W/U)(B/R)GHarold Ramos - The 35 Foot Long Twinkie (In +1/+1 counters)
UB(U/B)Dragonlord Silumgar
We know we aren't seeing Horizon Canopy, but the competition around the Cavern of Souls slot isn't too bad.
Checked the list and looks like no horizon canopy. Gruul Guildgate is #236 and Izzet Guildgate is 237
(W/U)(B/R)GForm of Progenitus, Shape of a Scrubland
BRGJund Tokens with Prossh, the Magic Dragon Foil
URGAnimar, the RUG CleanerFoil
RRRFeldon of the Third Path 2.0 Foil
BG(B/G)Not Another Meren DeckFoil
UR(U/R)Mizzix, Y Control and X Burn Spells
(W/U)(B/R)GHarold Ramos - The 35 Foot Long Twinkie (In +1/+1 counters)
UB(U/B)Dragonlord Silumgar
Hypothetically, they could print it in a set based on tribes, like innistrad. The name doesn't have a plane-based term to fix it to any one block.
EV is pretty evident with fetches. LOL Domri Rade doesn't really help to agree with you on some level tho.
(W/U)(B/R)GForm of Progenitus, Shape of a Scrubland
BRGJund Tokens with Prossh, the Magic Dragon Foil
URGAnimar, the RUG CleanerFoil
RRRFeldon of the Third Path 2.0 Foil
BG(B/G)Not Another Meren DeckFoil
UR(U/R)Mizzix, Y Control and X Burn Spells
(W/U)(B/R)GHarold Ramos - The 35 Foot Long Twinkie (In +1/+1 counters)
UB(U/B)Dragonlord Silumgar
Wow, I didn't even catch that when I wrote it.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!