I'm also suspicious of the print run because wizards hasn't said anything about the set being wpn only and the distributors are openly allowing non-wpn locations to get allocations. Those two facts give support to the rumor of a large print run.
Just from what I heard from a source but distributors are practically begging LGS owners to take a good and large chunk this time around.
I'd be really happy if they just killed the entire WPN network idea and made all products fair game for all sellers. If the goal is to make and keep the game affordable while also avoiding the issues of having investors try to stockpile half of an entire release for their own profit margins it's probably the only way to really do it. If they release more modern and eternal focused sets at 120 - 150 msrp and do large scale print runs we are probably set for a modern and eternal with the staples hovering in the 30s instead of the wide variance of 15-100 usd.
What they should be doing for LGS is sending them support directly by providing better promotional items and prize packs. I love the saturday showdown they did and it would be really good if they could just cut the randomization of the cards down and only reward the top cream of the crop cards in the prize packs.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
Melek, Izzet Paragon
Oona, Queen of the Fae
Bruna, Light of Alabaster
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Rhys the Redeemed
Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Sen Triplets
The Mimeoplasm WUBRGSliver OverlordGRBUW WUBRGSliver Hivelord(Superfriends)GRBUW
Value is good. But Dredgevine isn't supposed to be about value. It's supposed to be about V-8; 2000 pounds of nitro boosted war vegetables. The more velocity, the better.
Modern:
DredgeVine EDH:
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Anima Standard:
If they're going to print so much of MM2017,
they should have made a Fat Pakerrrr... Bundle for it
Well, given someone over in the modern forum just said that they are reprinting fetches in it, that could explain a large print run. Unfortunately, if they are doing that it would be something that people didn't want to happen in the sense that they wanted the fetches reprinted through standard.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
If they're going to print so much of MM2017,
they should have made a Fat Pakerrrr... Bundle for it
Well, given someone over in the modern forum just said that they are reprinting fetches in it, that could explain a large print run. Unfortunately, if they are doing that it would be something that people didn't want to happen in the sense that they wanted the fetches reprinted through standard.
They're not putting fetches in, they've been very clear on several occasions that they do not want to reprint them in a supplemental product.
I'll remain hopeful throughout the next couple weeks, all signs are pointing towards a bad set and regardless of any conspiracy theories out there, at the end of the day I think Wizards will put enough value to get boxes to about msrp of 240 bucks. If they've learned anything from prior history I feel like the value will be somewhere between 2013 and 2015.
That being said, I couldn't help but jump at the preorder price of $174.50 a box, that seems like the lowest possible floor for a product like this and I have to think that at this price point, you will at worst break even.
Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
Melek, Izzet Paragon
Oona, Queen of the Fae
Bruna, Light of Alabaster
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Rhys the Redeemed
Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Sen Triplets
The Mimeoplasm WUBRGSliver OverlordGRBUW WUBRGSliver Hivelord(Superfriends)GRBUW
I'll remain hopeful throughout the next couple weeks, all signs are pointing towards a bad set and regardless of any conspiracy theories out there, at the end of the day I think Wizards will put enough value to get boxes to about msrp of 240 bucks. If they've learned anything from prior history I feel like the value will be somewhere between 2013 and 2015.
That being said, I couldn't help but jump at the preorder price of $174.50 a box, that seems like the lowest possible floor for a product like this and I have to think that at this price point, you will at worst break even.
Regardless of value, there's only two reasons to buy sealed card product as a player:
1) You want to draft with friends or play limited with the set.
2) You feel like having some fun with pack wars and enjoy the lottery aspect of the game. Cracking packs can be fun in it's own right and sometimes you end up with some cards you end up never knowing you'd like.
The prices are the way they are right now because investors are not buying at all right now. I'm guessing they probably consumed about a third to a half of all printed product given how we can still see boxes floating around of prior sets dating back as far as Lorwyn / Elwyn or Time Spiral, and there still are boxes of MM2013 on the market at around 400 msrp.
If the set is really good expect them to swoop back in and buy freight trucks of them because the "oh we will do a reprint later" trick is only going to work so many times. Eventually they aren't going to be printing the 2017 set and that's all that matters to them. The only way to really make things work and keep investors out of the purchasing process is to reprint high demand cards repeatedly across multiple products on large enough runs that the runs last until the next major print run happens. If they really are printing 5x the amount of MM2017 than it is very likely they are trying to do this, which is good. The question then becomes if and when they are planning the next run of the same cards.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
That one card needs reprinting so badly it's crazy. If anyone wanted proof that casual magic is alive and well that card is the poster child of it being at 50+ usd and really only seeing major play in Atraxa commander decks and the oddball fringe modern deck.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
I just hope the reprints are good starting Monday.
What makes me sad is that the box pre-order price likely wont survive once the spoilers start. I think 150-180 is a better price point for modern masters than an MSRP 240. The fact is that times are changing and the way most TCGs are being printed now are player oriented rather than collector oriented. Given the changes in print run size we are heading towards that age in magic.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
I just hope the reprints are good starting Monday.
What makes me sad is that the box pre-order price likely wont survive once the spoilers start. I think 150-180 is a better price point for modern masters than an MSRP 240. The fact is that times are changing and the way most TCGs are being printed now are player oriented rather than collector oriented. Given the changes in print run size we are heading towards that age in magic.
Still pulling baseless statements out your ass, I see.
I think we are safe from that fate. I'd say Tamiyo, The Moonsage would be the likely misstep.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
I just hope the reprints are good starting Monday.
What makes me sad is that the box pre-order price likely wont survive once the spoilers start. I think 150-180 is a better price point for modern masters than an MSRP 240. The fact is that times are changing and the way most TCGs are being printed now are player oriented rather than collector oriented. Given the changes in print run size we are heading towards that age in magic.
Still pulling baseless statements out your ass, I see.
Well, ignoring the rudeness of your post, while Wizards is including inventions to increase pack openings and those cards are targeting collectors, in the end I'd say they are there to make the game cheaper for players by encouraging more box and pack openings. On top of that, they have increased the print runs drastically post Innistrad and are continuing this trend into Modern Masters 2017 and even WPN products like Planechase Anthologies. So it isn't baseless. They are going player oriented at the cost of the LGS and investors.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
LGS's do not lose out due to larger print runs, and collectors do not lose out due to Masterpieces. Both promote the continued opening of product, getting bodies into the stores.
So again, what are you saying? I swear man, 75% of your posts contradict themselves.
They are not going to cut off either the collector base (Reserved List and *****) or especially the STORES which actually keep the product flowing.
I just hope the reprints are good starting Monday.
What makes me sad is that the box pre-order price likely wont survive once the spoilers start. I think 150-180 is a better price point for modern masters than an MSRP 240. The fact is that times are changing and the way most TCGs are being printed now are player oriented rather than collector oriented. Given the changes in print run size we are heading towards that age in magic.
Still pulling baseless statements out your ass, I see.
Well, ignoring the rudeness of your post, while Wizards is including inventions to increase pack openings and those cards are targeting collectors, in the end I'd say they are there to make the game cheaper for players by encouraging more box and pack openings. On top of that, they have increased the print runs drastically post Innistrad and are continuing this trend into Modern Masters 2017 and even WPN products like Planechase Anthologies. So it isn't baseless. They are going player oriented at the cost of the LGS and investors.
K. Fortunately, I was just informed that it's possible to ignore users, so you can now proceed with your nonsensical babbling and not have to worry about any of my blunt honesty rudeness anymore. Remember: All you have to do is click your heels three times whenever you're ready to leave fantasy land.
Except the cutoff is at nothing later than Magic 2014.
Opportunity lost.
WBC Eldrazi & Taxes CBW
UR Keep on Cantripin' (UR Phoenix) RU
WU Surprise! It's not UW Control! (UW Midrange) UW
BG The Rock, Straight BG
U Mono-Blue Fish U
RBW Mardu Pyromancer BWR
RG Rabble! Rabble! (GR Blood Moon Aggro) GR
Legacy
W Death & Taxes W
What they should be doing for LGS is sending them support directly by providing better promotional items and prize packs. I love the saturday showdown they did and it would be really good if they could just cut the randomization of the cards down and only reward the top cream of the crop cards in the prize packs.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
they should have made a Fat Pakerrrr... Bundle for it
Reprint Stasis!
Control needs more love.
EDH:
Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
Melek, Izzet Paragon
Oona, Queen of the Fae
Bruna, Light of Alabaster
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Rhys the Redeemed
Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Sen Triplets
The Mimeoplasm
WUBRGSliver OverlordGRBUW
WUBRGSliver Hivelord(Superfriends)GRBUW
Considering I don't think it sees play anywhere in modern and would be completely dead in sealed I would say not interested.
Modern:
DredgeVine
EDH:
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Anima
Standard:
Well, given someone over in the modern forum just said that they are reprinting fetches in it, that could explain a large print run. Unfortunately, if they are doing that it would be something that people didn't want to happen in the sense that they wanted the fetches reprinted through standard.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
They're not putting fetches in, they've been very clear on several occasions that they do not want to reprint them in a supplemental product.
That being said, I couldn't help but jump at the preorder price of $174.50 a box, that seems like the lowest possible floor for a product like this and I have to think that at this price point, you will at worst break even.
I've thought about it, and I decided to go ahead and buy them.
Omniscience is not a Modern card.
It's definitely an EDH card, though, and that puts it in the pool of possibilities.
However, I wouldn't hold your breath,
as the following Blue Mythics are more likely, IMO:
Snapcaster Mage(?)
Vendilion Clique(?)
Ancestral Vision
Time Warp
Consecrated Sphinx
Jin-Gitaxias, Core Augur
Venser, Shaper Savant (upshifted)
Venser, the Sojourner (half counts)
Tezzeret, Agent of Bolas (half counts)
Sphinx's Revelation (ditto)
Keranos, God of Storms (")
Sen Triplets (jeez)
Reprint Stasis!
Control needs more love.
EDH:
Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
Melek, Izzet Paragon
Oona, Queen of the Fae
Bruna, Light of Alabaster
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Rhys the Redeemed
Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Sen Triplets
The Mimeoplasm
WUBRGSliver OverlordGRBUW
WUBRGSliver Hivelord(Superfriends)GRBUW
Not that you don't have a point how they do put EDH cards in, but to be fair neither is Comet Storm (and also shouldn't have been mythic in MM2), Progenitus, Vedalken Shackles, Kozilek, Tezzeret, Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre , nor the Kamigawa Dragons. Oh and Domri Rade.
Regardless of value, there's only two reasons to buy sealed card product as a player:
1) You want to draft with friends or play limited with the set.
2) You feel like having some fun with pack wars and enjoy the lottery aspect of the game. Cracking packs can be fun in it's own right and sometimes you end up with some cards you end up never knowing you'd like.
The prices are the way they are right now because investors are not buying at all right now. I'm guessing they probably consumed about a third to a half of all printed product given how we can still see boxes floating around of prior sets dating back as far as Lorwyn / Elwyn or Time Spiral, and there still are boxes of MM2013 on the market at around 400 msrp.
If the set is really good expect them to swoop back in and buy freight trucks of them because the "oh we will do a reprint later" trick is only going to work so many times. Eventually they aren't going to be printing the 2017 set and that's all that matters to them. The only way to really make things work and keep investors out of the purchasing process is to reprint high demand cards repeatedly across multiple products on large enough runs that the runs last until the next major print run happens. If they really are printing 5x the amount of MM2017 than it is very likely they are trying to do this, which is good. The question then becomes if and when they are planning the next run of the same cards.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Well to remind you modern masters does print cards better for edh than modern. But still modern playable.
Take Doubling season for example.
That one card needs reprinting so badly it's crazy. If anyone wanted proof that casual magic is alive and well that card is the poster child of it being at 50+ usd and really only seeing major play in Atraxa commander decks and the oddball fringe modern deck.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
What makes me sad is that the box pre-order price likely wont survive once the spoilers start. I think 150-180 is a better price point for modern masters than an MSRP 240. The fact is that times are changing and the way most TCGs are being printed now are player oriented rather than collector oriented. Given the changes in print run size we are heading towards that age in magic.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Still pulling baseless statements out your ass, I see.
Link to Discord server where anybody from MTGS can keep up with thread topics while everything is being sorted out with the new site.
I think we are safe from that fate. I'd say Tamiyo, The Moonsage would be the likely misstep.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
Well, ignoring the rudeness of your post, while Wizards is including inventions to increase pack openings and those cards are targeting collectors, in the end I'd say they are there to make the game cheaper for players by encouraging more box and pack openings. On top of that, they have increased the print runs drastically post Innistrad and are continuing this trend into Modern Masters 2017 and even WPN products like Planechase Anthologies. So it isn't baseless. They are going player oriented at the cost of the LGS and investors.
1. (Ravnica Allegiance): You can't keep a good esper control deck down... Or Wilderness Reclamation... or Gates...
2. (War of the Spark): Guys, I know what we need! We need a cycle of really idiotic flavor text victory cards! Jace's Triumph...
3. (War of the Spark): Lets make the format with control have even more control!
So again, what are you saying? I swear man, 75% of your posts contradict themselves.
They are not going to cut off either the collector base (Reserved List and *****) or especially the STORES which actually keep the product flowing.
Spirits
K. Fortunately, I was just informed that it's possible to ignore users, so you can now proceed with your nonsensical babbling and not have to worry about any of my
blunt honestyrudeness anymore. Remember: All you have to do is click your heels three times whenever you're ready to leave fantasy land.Link to Discord server where anybody from MTGS can keep up with thread topics while everything is being sorted out with the new site.
If they ever put him in a set with reprints like Masters or Conspiracy I'm sure he could show up at rare.