Man, there are going to be some red faces when people realize this is the highest-pick green common.
(Okay, I'm exaggerating my level of confidence just to be contrary, but that's actually not a ridiculous position. In draft formats where ramping mana is good, 2-cmc mana dorks with upside can easily be top commons; see Golden Hind, Journey into Nyx's best green common and one of the set's top commons overall)
Are people really so focused on the fact that it has defender? That barely matters, it's tapping for mana most every turn, and when you're not doing that, you're probably not sending a 1/2 into battle later in the game. But you will gladly send in a 4/6.
Mana dorks have a huge issue inherent in playing them in that they're dead in the late game, but this doesn't actually have to be. Being able to get a larger creature that's actually relevant in combat after you're done using this to ramp is very relevant, and the fact that it costs 7 mana to transform is fine if that's all you have to do with your mana that turn, which is going to happen.
I think this is overall better than Scorned Villager, as this loses out on the ability to punish awful starts by gaining the ability to have a consistent, relevant impact in the late game, especially in limited.
Man, there are going to be some red faces when people realize this is the highest-pick green common.
(Okay, I'm exaggerating my level of confidence just to be contrary, but that's actually not a ridiculous position. In draft formats where ramping mana is good, 2-cmc mana dorks with upside can easily be top commons; see Golden Hind, Journey into Nyx's best green common and one of the set's top commons overall)
I don't think it's unlikely. This card is very relevant early and late - a classic good card for limited.
That said, I'm fine with the info-dump for the limited-only cards, as someone who plays mostly limited and some EDH. Even though this card will surely have a much bigger impact than any given rare or mythic, it's more fun to fantasize about cracking a Gisela than deal with the nitty-gritty of all the C-range commons, at least during spoiler season. Once I'm actually drafting and have to face the reality of having opened a soul extractor, that's when I want to think about the merits of ulvenwald captive, not so much during spoiler season.
Man, there are going to be some red faces when people realize this is the highest-pick green common.
(Okay, I'm exaggerating my level of confidence just to be contrary, but that's actually not a ridiculous position. In draft formats where ramping mana is good, 2-cmc mana dorks with upside can easily be top commons; see Golden Hind, Journey into Nyx's best green common and one of the set's top commons overall)
Yes, for limited this is perfectly fine, but outside of that people are tired of seeing mana dorks get worse all because Deathmist Raptor was around with Elvish Mystic for a little while.
Man, there are going to be some red faces when people realize this is the highest-pick green common.
(Okay, I'm exaggerating my level of confidence just to be contrary, but that's actually not a ridiculous position. In draft formats where ramping mana is good, 2-cmc mana dorks with upside can easily be top commons; see Golden Hind, Journey into Nyx's best green common and one of the set's top commons overall)
I don't think it's unlikely. This card is very relevant early and late - a classic good card for limited.
That said, I'm fine with the info-dump for the limited-only cards, as someone who plays mostly limited and some EDH. Even though this card will surely have a much bigger impact than any given rare or mythic, it's more fun to fantasize about cracking a Gisela than deal with the nitty-gritty of all the C-range commons, at least during spoiler season. Once I'm actually drafting and have to face the reality of having opened a soul extractor, that's when I want to think about the merits of ulvenwald captive, not so much during spoiler season.
I can appreciate that position. Personally, though, I like getting to imagine and speculate about what the draft format will be like, and my own enjoyment is a lot higher if I get to experience that as a gradual unveiling of information than a giant, hard-to-process lump right at the end.
I hate to break it to you, but there is a nonzero chance that these spoilers are actually supposed to impress us and/or get us excited for the set.
I'm sorry but I don't believe it you when you say that you "hate to". going by your other posts you absolutely LOVE being negative and get a huge kick out of it. You always try to be the first in every thread to be down on every card, pessimistic about what allegedly it means about other unrevealed cards, and speculative about all the ways it exemplifies how Wizards despises players with every fibre of their beings and are intent in causing as much harm and despair to them with each spoiler.
I'm calling it right now- worst rare in the set. Even good limited players will find better bombs at common and uncommon no sweat. Worst. Episode. Ever.
I really do predict this to be our worst rare in set award winner. I'd be happier opening a jar of eyeballs, so I think anything worse is highly unlikely. This card wont just have zero constructed potential, but not be significantly better than a mass of ghouls in a draft.
I like the flavor text. It's like, "Even though nature mounts a defense against unnatural forces, the Eldrazi turn nature itself into an unnatural force."
The problem with defining this format by what is "fun" is that everyone seems to define fun as what they don't lose to. If you keep losing to easily answered cards, that means you should improve your deck. If you don't want to improve your deck, then you should come to peace with the idea that you are going to lose because you chose to not interact with better strategies.
I actually like this card. It has a reasonable body for a mana dork even if it has defender. On top of that it has the potential to become a threat if you flood. I could definitely see this as a card in ramp. The only real down side is that it does to a chandra minus most of the time. Im not sure when you will want to flip it for an extra mana. I guess naybe to cast a newlamog or bring back and cast world breaker. The biggest role I can immagine it having is as an insurance policy against hand hate.
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It's an interesting card. Being able to tap for CC later on could be relevant in a mono-green Eldrazi ramp build that otherwise would have to resort to forcing pain-lands just for colorless.
I hate to break it to you, but there is a nonzero chance that these spoilers are actually supposed to impress us and/or get us excited for the set.
I'm sorry but I don't believe it you when you say that you "hate to". going by your other posts you absolutely LOVE being negative and get a huge kick out of it. You always try to be the first in every thread to be down on every card, pessimistic about what allegedly it means about other unrevealed cards, and speculative about all the ways it exemplifies how Wizards despises players with every fibre of their beings and are intent in causing as much harm and despair to them with each spoiler.
Wow, I just got roasted. I guess I know how these wonderful cards feel now...
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My favorite flavor text: Time of Heroes
Feel free to tell me yours!
This brings out the side of people MaRo often talks about: take a playbale card that people would appreciate, add an extra icing on it that is not cheap and it makes the appreciation of the card go down.
It's a mana dork, at the price MTG now ask for them. With extra toughness. And a late-game upside. Defender? How often did you attack with mana dorks anyway? I'll play it over other 2 CMC mana dorks currently in standard.
What I've noticed is just how criminally antagonistic its iä! side's mana ability is with the cost to transform it. Not as much as Scorned Villager and Lambholt Elder having abilities that help them revert to human, but still...
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Card advantage is not the same thing as card draw. Something for 2B cannot be strictly worse than something for BBB or 3BB. If you're taking out Swords to Plowshares for Plummet, you're a fool. Stop doing these things!
I think a lot of people are simply missing the point when they call this draft chaff. Yeah, defender is annoying, but let's be honest it rarely makes much difference for a dork. Birds don't go out to war with their 0 attack, and Elvish Mystics attacked only very slightly more than Sylvan Caryatids.
Who plays this? Only two possible decks, a werewolf deck that flips it for 0 using Geier Reach Bandit and a RG ramp deck. Since the Geier Reach Bandit deck isn't really a thing, we can look straight to RG ramp. This is functionally almost identical to our three other 2-drop ramp options: Deathcap Cultivator, Leaf Glider, and Ruin in Their Wake. The last can't be killed with a burn spell, but it can't chump block and isn't always active. You can't really make an argument that a 2/1 or 1/2 is a big difference, as they all tend to die pretty quickly and lose in combat.
The only difference is that when you draw nothing but Pilgrimages and dorks and Hedron Archives, you have a much better shot at staying in the game if your worthless dork has a mana sink to be a 4/6. You aren't losing anything to activate the ability, you are getting a 4/6 for "free" because otherwise you'd either have a 1/2, a 2/1, or a 0/0 (ie, nothing). This happens quite often to ramp, as anyone that plays it can attest. Adding more threats doesn't solve the problem, it just means you are likely to get mana screwed than mana flooded. And when you need just a LITTLE more mana to cast your super big threats, your Ulamog's and Emrakul's you can do that as well if you don't have any other ramp cards in hand (or if getting the body as a blocker is worth it).
If you don't have fatties, this guy is the best ramp card in standard. If you don't have ramp, this guy is just as serviceable as any other option. If you have both, congrats you are doing well and casting your turn 4 Atarka or World Breaker and you probably don't care if your 2-drop was a 1/2 defender or a 2/1. This is a completely playable card if people want 2 mana ramp that fits into a pre-existing tier 1 or 2 deck quite nicely and makes it significantly more consistent. And honestly, monstrosity on a dork is both unique and valuable because of that versatility and consistency.
Next we will be coin flipping to see if they produce mana or not
Meh card is meh, but at least it does something late game...
Dunes of Zairo
SHANDALAR
Innistrad - The Darkest Night
~THE RAVNICAN CONSORTIUM~
A Community Set
Commander: Allies & Adversaries
(Okay, I'm exaggerating my level of confidence just to be contrary, but that's actually not a ridiculous position. In draft formats where ramping mana is good, 2-cmc mana dorks with upside can easily be top commons; see Golden Hind, Journey into Nyx's best green common and one of the set's top commons overall)
Mana dorks have a huge issue inherent in playing them in that they're dead in the late game, but this doesn't actually have to be. Being able to get a larger creature that's actually relevant in combat after you're done using this to ramp is very relevant, and the fact that it costs 7 mana to transform is fine if that's all you have to do with your mana that turn, which is going to happen.
I think this is overall better than Scorned Villager, as this loses out on the ability to punish awful starts by gaining the ability to have a consistent, relevant impact in the late game, especially in limited.
That said, I'm fine with the info-dump for the limited-only cards, as someone who plays mostly limited and some EDH. Even though this card will surely have a much bigger impact than any given rare or mythic, it's more fun to fantasize about cracking a Gisela than deal with the nitty-gritty of all the C-range commons, at least during spoiler season. Once I'm actually drafting and have to face the reality of having opened a soul extractor, that's when I want to think about the merits of ulvenwald captive, not so much during spoiler season.
EDH Primers
Phelddagrif - Zirilan
EDH
Thrasios+Bruse - Pang - Sasaya - Wydwen - Feather - Rona - Toshiro - Sylvia+Khorvath - Geth - QMarchesa - Firesong - Athreos - Arixmethes - Isperia - Etali - Silas+Sidar - Saskia - Virtus+Gorm - Kynaios - Naban - Aryel - Mizzix - Kazuul - Tymna+Kraum - Sidar+Tymna - Ayli - Gwendlyn - Phelddagrif 4 - Liliana - Kaervek - Phelddagrif 3 - Mairsil - Scarab - Child - Phenax - Shirei - Thada - Depala - Circu - Kytheon - GrenzoHR - Phelddagrif - Reyhan+Kraum - Toshiro - Varolz - Nin - Ojutai - Tasigur - Zedruu - Uril - Edric - Wort - Zurgo - Nahiri - Grenzo - Kozilek - Yisan - Ink-Treader - Yisan - Brago - Sidisi - Toshiro - Alexi - Sygg - Brimaz - Sek'Kuar - Marchesa - Vish Kal - Iroas - Phelddagrif - Ephara - Derevi - Glissa - Wanderer - Saffi - Melek - Xiahou Dun - Lazav - Lin Sivvi - Zirilan - Glissa
PDH - Drake - Graverobber - Izzet GM - Tallowisp - Symbiote Brawl - Feather - Ugin - Jace - Scarab - Angrath - Vraska - Kumena Oathbreaker - Wrenn&6
Yes, for limited this is perfectly fine, but outside of that people are tired of seeing mana dorks get worse all because Deathmist Raptor was around with Elvish Mystic for a little while.
I'm sorry but I don't believe it you when you say that you "hate to". going by your other posts you absolutely LOVE being negative and get a huge kick out of it. You always try to be the first in every thread to be down on every card, pessimistic about what allegedly it means about other unrevealed cards, and speculative about all the ways it exemplifies how Wizards despises players with every fibre of their beings and are intent in causing as much harm and despair to them with each spoiler.
Okay LSV, let's calm down now
Wow, I just got roasted. I guess I know how these wonderful cards feel now...
Feel free to tell me yours!
It's a mana dork, at the price MTG now ask for them. With extra toughness. And a late-game upside. Defender? How often did you attack with mana dorks anyway? I'll play it over other 2 CMC mana dorks currently in standard.
Worse. It'll have a rhystic.
What I've noticed is just how criminally antagonistic its iä! side's mana ability is with the cost to transform it. Not as much as Scorned Villager and Lambholt Elder having abilities that help them revert to human, but still...
On phasing:
Who plays this? Only two possible decks, a werewolf deck that flips it for 0 using Geier Reach Bandit and a RG ramp deck. Since the Geier Reach Bandit deck isn't really a thing, we can look straight to RG ramp. This is functionally almost identical to our three other 2-drop ramp options: Deathcap Cultivator, Leaf Glider, and Ruin in Their Wake. The last can't be killed with a burn spell, but it can't chump block and isn't always active. You can't really make an argument that a 2/1 or 1/2 is a big difference, as they all tend to die pretty quickly and lose in combat.
The only difference is that when you draw nothing but Pilgrimages and dorks and Hedron Archives, you have a much better shot at staying in the game if your worthless dork has a mana sink to be a 4/6. You aren't losing anything to activate the ability, you are getting a 4/6 for "free" because otherwise you'd either have a 1/2, a 2/1, or a 0/0 (ie, nothing). This happens quite often to ramp, as anyone that plays it can attest. Adding more threats doesn't solve the problem, it just means you are likely to get mana screwed than mana flooded. And when you need just a LITTLE more mana to cast your super big threats, your Ulamog's and Emrakul's you can do that as well if you don't have any other ramp cards in hand (or if getting the body as a blocker is worth it).
If you don't have fatties, this guy is the best ramp card in standard. If you don't have ramp, this guy is just as serviceable as any other option. If you have both, congrats you are doing well and casting your turn 4 Atarka or World Breaker and you probably don't care if your 2-drop was a 1/2 defender or a 2/1. This is a completely playable card if people want 2 mana ramp that fits into a pre-existing tier 1 or 2 deck quite nicely and makes it significantly more consistent. And honestly, monstrosity on a dork is both unique and valuable because of that versatility and consistency.