Ugh. They really front-loaded all the exciting cards. Not a single chase rare/mythic or value uncommon in the entirety of what was spoiled today. And there are now just completely unforgivable rarity upshifts. Imperious perfect? Serendib efreet? Fine if you're upshifting in a normal set for limited concerns, but not in a set that's ******* $10 a pack. Jesus. I was defending the shardless and strix "upshifts" before, but these are just bull*****. Also way, way WAY too many filler rares spoiled today. Let's see how many rares and mythics are under $2 (or are so close they certainly will be after this set) -
Balance
Jareth
Karmic Guide
Unexpectedly Absent
Arcanis the Omnipotent
Control Magic
Diminishing Returns
Future Sight
Inkwell
Serendib
Braids
Malicious Affliction
Viasara
Crater Hellion
Dualcaster Mage
pyrokinesis
Rorix Bladewing
Siege-Gang Commander
Sulfuric Vortex
Worldgorger Dragon
Imperious Perfect
Silvos
Xantid Swarm
Brago, King Eternal
Glare of Subdual
Goblin Trenches
Sphinx of the Steel Wind
Void
Call the Skybreaker
Giant Solifuge
Nevinyrral's Disk
And that's cards under $2 - there are a TON in the $2-$10 range. This is absolutely unacceptable for a set with a $10 MSRP. Your EV from a pack may be more than $10, but the median value is going to be like $1.50. Terrible.
So less than half of the rares and mythics are worth less than $2? Awesome!
EDH/Commander is a social format, right? So why don't people use their social skills to discuss what they like and don't like, instead of adopting a list with 60+ banned cards?
Ugh. They really front-loaded all the exciting cards. Not a single chase rare/mythic or value uncommon in the entirety of what was spoiled today. And there are now just completely unforgivable rarity upshifts. Imperious perfect? Serendib efreet? Fine if you're upshifting in a normal set for limited concerns, but not in a set that's ******* $10 a pack. Jesus. I was defending the shardless and strix "upshifts" before, but these are just bull*****. Also way, way WAY too many filler rares spoiled today. Let's see how many rares and mythics are under $2 (or are so close they certainly will be after this set) -
Balance
Jareth
Karmic Guide
Unexpectedly Absent
Arcanis the Omnipotent
Control Magic
Diminishing Returns
Future Sight
Inkwell
Serendib
Braids
Malicious Affliction
Viasara
Crater Hellion
Dualcaster Mage
pyrokinesis
Rorix Bladewing
Siege-Gang Commander
Sulfuric Vortex
Worldgorger Dragon
Imperious Perfect
Silvos
Xantid Swarm
Brago, King Eternal
Glare of Subdual
Goblin Trenches
Sphinx of the Steel Wind
Void
Call the Skybreaker
Giant Solifuge
Nevinyrral's Disk
And that's cards under $2 - there are a TON in the $2-$10 range. This is absolutely unacceptable for a set with a $10 MSRP. Your EV from a pack may be more than $10, but the median value is going to be like $1.50. Terrible. Basically half of the rares and mythics are worthless.
isn't that how every set is? Sometimes you get an Expedition or Money Mythic, other times you get a bulk rare like Lantern Scout
I didn't think Goblin Guide would be on the list (I feel that wizards like to see the card hit 100 dollars). But I'm shocked that Stasis and Goblin Lackey didn't make the cut.
I think the set is similar to modern masters so I'll be buying singles. It doesnt seem worth 10 dollars when I have a good change in pulling 2 dollars worth of reprints...
I do think it would be a good booster pack to buy or give as a gift to a new player (but I wouldn't buy more then 3 packs).
Now this was bound to happen to some extent. But Eternal Masters basically took all the things that have been flooded via vma, promo, or pz1 and just threw them back in. Meanwhile chase cards that are in low circulation (and hence high value) that could have easily been put in this set like Port, Misdirection, Show and Tell were left out.
Misdirection was reprinted in Conspiracy, and it's currently not a overly expensive cards at the moment. Did you mean another card?
I have calmed down a bit. Overall the set looks fine. I am disappointed in Sphinx of the Steel Wind being a mythic and am also disappointed in the gainlands and a few other things. I will draft it...once. I will not be purchasing a box, though Wizards has my praise for several of its reprints. I do wish they had pushed the envelope a bit more by putting Worldly Tutor in, for example and less stuff like Emmessi Tome and Avarax.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
The "Crazy One", playing casual magic and occasionally dipping his toes into regular play since 1994.
Currently focusing on Pre-Modern (Mono-Black Discard Control) and Modern (Azorious Control, Temur Rhinos).
Find me at the Wizard's Tower in Ottawa every second Saturday afternoons.
Ugh. They really front-loaded all the exciting cards. Not a single chase rare/mythic or value uncommon in the entirety of what was spoiled today. And there are now just completely unforgivable rarity upshifts. Imperious perfect? Serendib efreet? Fine if you're upshifting in a normal set for limited concerns, but not in a set that's ******* $10 a pack. Jesus. I was defending the shardless and strix "upshifts" before, but these are just bull*****. Also way, way WAY too many filler rares spoiled today. Let's see how many rares and mythics are under $2 (or are so close they certainly will be after this set) -
Balance
Jareth
Karmic Guide
Unexpectedly Absent
Arcanis the Omnipotent
Control Magic
Diminishing Returns
Future Sight
Inkwell
Serendib
Braids
Malicious Affliction
Viasara
Crater Hellion
Dualcaster Mage
pyrokinesis
Rorix Bladewing
Siege-Gang Commander
Sulfuric Vortex
Worldgorger Dragon
Imperious Perfect
Silvos
Xantid Swarm
Brago, King Eternal
Glare of Subdual
Goblin Trenches
Sphinx of the Steel Wind
Void
Call the Skybreaker
Giant Solifuge
Nevinyrral's Disk
And that's cards under $2 - there are a TON in the $2-$10 range. This is absolutely unacceptable for a set with a $10 MSRP. Your EV from a pack may be more than $10, but the median value is going to be like $1.50. Terrible. Basically half of the rares and mythics are worthless.
isn't that how every set is? Sometimes you get an Expedition or Money Mythic, other times you get a bulk rare like Lantern Scout
Not every set is limited and $10 a pack retail though.
Most sets sells packs a retail with an unlimited supply while in print. These packs are going to $15 and there are going to be a lot of feel bads, rill bad.
isn't that how every set is? Sometimes you get an Expedition or Money Mythic, other times you get a bulk rare like Lantern Scout
Every set is NOT $10 msrp and limited print run (meaning jacked up prices and Wizards knows it).
There are like 18 rares and mythics that can reasonably get you back the price of the pack (obviously some of these will get you substantially more than the price of the pack). That's pretty bad in what's being billed as a premium set.
Now this was bound to happen to some extent. But Eternal Masters basically took all the things that have been flooded via vma, promo, or pz1 and just threw them back in. Meanwhile chase cards that are in low circulation (and hence high value) that could have easily been put in this set like Port, Misdirection, Show and Tell were left out.
Misdirection was reprinted in Conspiracy, and it's currently not a overly expensive cards at the moment. Did you mean another card?
Aware it had shown up in conspiracy. Was speaking strictly about MTGO. Where it has yet to see a reprint, promo, or anything other than its original mm release. Its currently the 4th most expensive card online. Behind Port, Black Lotus, and Liliana of the Veil.
I have a pre order of a booster box on 200$, should i open it, draft it, save it, cancel it?. Right now i dont know what to do with it, i dont feel i will get my money back on the singles
Now this was bound to happen to some extent. But Eternal Masters basically took all the things that have been flooded via vma, promo, or pz1 and just threw them back in. Meanwhile chase cards that are in low circulation (and hence high value) that could have easily been put in this set like Port, Misdirection, Show and Tell were left out.
Misdirection was reprinted in Conspiracy, and it's currently not a overly expensive cards at the moment. Did you mean another card?
Conspiracy was not printed for MTGO, so Misdirection is sitting at about 85 tix.
I gotta say, I'm getting really tired of all this incessant whining. Yeah, the median value is super low; it has been for every set like this. Wizards isn't going to make the dream set where median value equals MSRP. There are things they could have done better, but there's a lot of good reprints and wizards is at least showing that they care about eternal formats.
Now this was bound to happen to some extent. But Eternal Masters basically took all the things that have been flooded via vma, promo, or pz1 and just threw them back in. Meanwhile chase cards that are in low circulation (and hence high value) that could have easily been put in this set like Port, Misdirection, Show and Tell were left out.
Misdirection was reprinted in Conspiracy, and it's currently not a overly expensive cards at the moment. Did you mean another card?
Conspiracy was not printed for MTGO, so Misdirection is sitting at about 85 tix.
Ah, thanks for that information. I didn't realize Conspiracy was a paper only release.
Has anyone not noticed it is a really big deal that Pauper is getting Night's Whisper and Desperate Ravings? I'm excited to be able to play Night's Whisper in back control decks instead of Sign in Blood. Also, mono black decks get way better with 7-8 Sign in Blood effects.
Overall, sure, they had to balance the set for limited and some of the rarity-upshifts are a little weird. The problem is, we don't know what it would be like to draft this format and can't comprehend the rarity upgrades/downgrades without actually playing it ourselves.
Well what a trainwreck this set is on mtgo. I get that in paper there are several big money pulls and there is reasonable excitement for those of you opening packs in person (which from what I gather is majority on this forum. But I did want to break stride and give a voice to mtgo players). But those same big money pulls are worthless online (for reference- crypt - $3 on mtgo, karakas - 39 cents on mtgo , vampiric tutor -22 cents on mtgo, etc etc).
Now this was bound to happen to some extent. But Eternal Masters basically took all the things that have been flooded via vma, promo, or pz1 and just threw them back in. Meanwhile chase cards that are in low circulation (and hence high value) that could have easily been put in this set like Port, Misdirection, Show and Tell were left out. I sold out of my ports last year thinking they would have to see a reprint. Then they announced Eternal Masters and I thought bingo. Guess I lost that bet. Never expected all of them to make it in. But none of the cards on mtgo worth more than $25 other than wasteland (from the set announcement none the less) making it in is a huge surprise.
On modo the set should be called "Eternal Masters: A high five to pauper players, A low five to uncommons" cause the only eternal help to the market is tanking pauper stuff like ancestral mask, hydroblast/pyroblast, firebolt and legacy uncommons in daze and therapy. For the rest of players you are praying you crack a wasteland. As thats the only way you live the finish up in pack value dream.
Really blown away at how little consideration must have been given to the mtgo marketplace when this set was created.
This is a really good point, especially given that this set is pushing Legacy/Vintage entry, and MTGO is (financially) the best place to play those formats because no reserved list.
I'd be really interested to see a fully calculated MTGO expected pack value using current prices. It's got to be way under $10.
So would it be worth it if you could get a box at MSRP? ($240) I'm mostly a casual/commander/pre release player, so I would be trading off most of the big ticket items and keeping the smaller stuff for my collection.
Only cards that I was surprised by that weren't spoiled before today were Wall of Omens and Duplicant. After that the rest of this is filled with a bunch of single type stuff to buy. The land cycle pisses me off so much though. They could have done vivids at common and then had spots for lands that aren't useless.
Overall this set is better than MM2, which wasn't going to be hard, but I'm having trouble saying whether or not it is better than MM1, maybe they are about the same? I did preorder a box, but this set is making me want to cancel it, but I like the idea of waiting 5 years for it to increase in value and get like $450 out of it, but even then that doesn't seem enjoyable. I will have a lot more fun getting $50 worth of singles out of this than a box. My box is $230 and even that doesn't seem worth it for what is in the set, plus my luck is pretty ***** with pulling anything good out of boxes.
With most of the rarity upshifts not being for the greater good but to make sure people have their money, even though this set is to make sure they get less expensive and get as many out there, in conjunction with the MM1 esque level of of print run, the $10 packs, the terrible common land cycle, and more often than not not going to get your moneys worth from this, minus extremely lucky cases, this set just isn't very good. Now if it wasn't so limited and the packs were $7 then we could be talking about this being a pretty good set. That isn't to say it doesn't do some good, the cards that are here, that needed a reprint, are going down, which is nice, and this does give us plenty of foils for cards that never had them, as well as modern borders, plus the tokens that never existed previously there are some things to say, but unfortunately the bad outweighs the good on this one.
TLDR - Better than MM2, but this set could still have been a lot better in many different areas.
Set looks random to me. Rarity shifts because of secondary market, not draft. Drafting this doesn't look like it will be anything special. So many cards with nothing ''eternal'' about them. But I guess we need to save them for the inevitable Eternal masters 2. Where you can waste more money on gambling.
Every set is NOT $10 msrp and limited print run (meaning jacked up prices and Wizards knows it).
There are like 18 rares and mythics that can reasonably get you back the price of the pack (obviously some of these will get you substantially more than the price of the pack). That's pretty bad in what's being billed as a premium set.
If you just look at the preorder prices of the most expensive rares, Wasteland ($75) and Entomb ($55), they basically dictate that there have to be 11 worthless rares (like cents value). If you want rares to be worth at least $4 a piece, it takes 18 such rares at $4.
That's just off the two most expensive rares, ignoring all mythics. How do you expect a median=average value of $10 a pack?
Do people just not want those cards printed? Would we have a happier topic today if they didn't reprint Mana Vault, Karakas, Jace, Force of Will, Wasteland, etc. ?
Premium doesn't mean "more pack are worth their EV". It's premium because the packs are worth more. If you made this a $4 pack, you would have 30 rares and mythics that paid for the pack with many of those paying for well more than one pack, and you would have uncommons that would also pay for the entire pack. That's all but three of the rares/mythics (the other ones haven't been put on MTGGoldfish yet).
~10% of the rares from Shadows over Innistrad pay for the pack.
I'm liking the uncommons. swords, relic of progenitus, bloodbraid, wall of omens, cabal therapy, hymn to tourach, chain lightning, price of progress, young pyromancer, rancor. i'll definitely order singles
Every set is NOT $10 msrp and limited print run (meaning jacked up prices and Wizards knows it).
There are like 18 rares and mythics that can reasonably get you back the price of the pack (obviously some of these will get you substantially more than the price of the pack). That's pretty bad in what's being billed as a premium set.
If you just look at the preorder prices of the most expensive rares, Wasteland ($75) and Entomb ($55), they basically dictate that there have to be 11 worthless rares (like cents value). If you want rares to be worth at least $4 a piece, it takes 18 such rares at $4.
That's just off the two most expensive rares, ignoring all mythics. How do you expect a median=average value of $10 a pack?
Do people just not want those cards printed? Would we have a happier topic today if they didn't reprint Mana Vault, Karakas, Jace, Force of Will, Wasteland, etc. ?
Premium doesn't mean "more pack are worth their EV". It's premium because the packs are worth more. If you made this a $4 pack, you would have 30 rares and mythics that paid for the pack with many of those paying for well more than one pack, and you would have uncommons that would also pay for the entire pack. That's all but three of the rares/mythics (the other ones haven't been put on MTGGoldfish yet).
~10% of the rares from Shadows over Innistrad pay for the pack.
Entomb is preordering for $16
The second most expensive rare after wasteland I think is top preordering for ~$25
So less than half of the rares and mythics are worth less than $2? Awesome!
isn't that how every set is? Sometimes you get an Expedition or Money Mythic, other times you get a bulk rare like Lantern Scout
Especially considering most stores will charge above $10 MSRP. I asked a few store around me and they will be selling packs for $15.
none
Modern
UBG B/U/G control
BBB MBC
WUR Control
WWW Prison
RRR Goblins
Legacy
BBB Pox
UBG B/U/G Control
UWU StoneBlade
UW Miracle Control
I think the set is similar to modern masters so I'll be buying singles. It doesnt seem worth 10 dollars when I have a good change in pulling 2 dollars worth of reprints...
I do think it would be a good booster pack to buy or give as a gift to a new player (but I wouldn't buy more then 3 packs).
In his Second 100 days - Yawgmoth's Bargain is unrestricted in Vintage.
What is going to happen in the Next 100 days!!!
Misdirection was reprinted in Conspiracy, and it's currently not a overly expensive cards at the moment. Did you mean another card?
Currently focusing on Pre-Modern (Mono-Black Discard Control) and Modern (Azorious Control, Temur Rhinos).
Find me at the Wizard's Tower in Ottawa every second Saturday afternoons.
Not every set is limited and $10 a pack retail though.
Most sets sells packs a retail with an unlimited supply while in print. These packs are going to $15 and there are going to be a lot of feel bads, rill bad.
Every set is NOT $10 msrp and limited print run (meaning jacked up prices and Wizards knows it).
There are like 18 rares and mythics that can reasonably get you back the price of the pack (obviously some of these will get you substantially more than the price of the pack). That's pretty bad in what's being billed as a premium set.
375 unpowered cube - https://cubecobra.com/cube/list/601ac624832cdf1039947588
Aware it had shown up in conspiracy. Was speaking strictly about MTGO. Where it has yet to see a reprint, promo, or anything other than its original mm release. Its currently the 4th most expensive card online. Behind Port, Black Lotus, and Liliana of the Veil.
Steve's Comic Relief?
Most sets don't have artificial scarcity due to a low print run driving up an already high MSRP of $10.
Conspiracy was not printed for MTGO, so Misdirection is sitting at about 85 tix.
UR Blue-Red Control
Modern:
UBR Grixis Control
UWR Jeskai Control
Ah, thanks for that information. I didn't realize Conspiracy was a paper only release.
Overall, sure, they had to balance the set for limited and some of the rarity-upshifts are a little weird. The problem is, we don't know what it would be like to draft this format and can't comprehend the rarity upgrades/downgrades without actually playing it ourselves.
This is a really good point, especially given that this set is pushing Legacy/Vintage entry, and MTGO is (financially) the best place to play those formats because no reserved list.
I'd be really interested to see a fully calculated MTGO expected pack value using current prices. It's got to be way under $10.
Club Flamingo Wins: 1!
Overall this set is better than MM2, which wasn't going to be hard, but I'm having trouble saying whether or not it is better than MM1, maybe they are about the same? I did preorder a box, but this set is making me want to cancel it, but I like the idea of waiting 5 years for it to increase in value and get like $450 out of it, but even then that doesn't seem enjoyable. I will have a lot more fun getting $50 worth of singles out of this than a box. My box is $230 and even that doesn't seem worth it for what is in the set, plus my luck is pretty ***** with pulling anything good out of boxes.
With most of the rarity upshifts not being for the greater good but to make sure people have their money, even though this set is to make sure they get less expensive and get as many out there, in conjunction with the MM1 esque level of of print run, the $10 packs, the terrible common land cycle, and more often than not not going to get your moneys worth from this, minus extremely lucky cases, this set just isn't very good. Now if it wasn't so limited and the packs were $7 then we could be talking about this being a pretty good set. That isn't to say it doesn't do some good, the cards that are here, that needed a reprint, are going down, which is nice, and this does give us plenty of foils for cards that never had them, as well as modern borders, plus the tokens that never existed previously there are some things to say, but unfortunately the bad outweighs the good on this one.
TLDR - Better than MM2, but this set could still have been a lot better in many different areas.
If you just look at the preorder prices of the most expensive rares, Wasteland ($75) and Entomb ($55), they basically dictate that there have to be 11 worthless rares (like cents value). If you want rares to be worth at least $4 a piece, it takes 18 such rares at $4.
That's just off the two most expensive rares, ignoring all mythics. How do you expect a median=average value of $10 a pack?
Do people just not want those cards printed? Would we have a happier topic today if they didn't reprint Mana Vault, Karakas, Jace, Force of Will, Wasteland, etc. ?
Premium doesn't mean "more pack are worth their EV". It's premium because the packs are worth more. If you made this a $4 pack, you would have 30 rares and mythics that paid for the pack with many of those paying for well more than one pack, and you would have uncommons that would also pay for the entire pack. That's all but three of the rares/mythics (the other ones haven't been put on MTGGoldfish yet).
~10% of the rares from Shadows over Innistrad pay for the pack.
That's pretty much all what we need to know about this set.
Entomb is preordering for $16
The second most expensive rare after wasteland I think is top preordering for ~$25
This. It would have been great if they have Mirage fetches. Synergy with Brainstorm and Deathrite Shaman for draft. Naw...
Thanks for spiderboy4 of High~Light_Studios for the kick ass avatar.
Thanks for DarkNightCavalier of HotPS for the exceptional signature.