So you will buy all my copies of this that I pull then correct at 25 cents each? It is a "good reprint" right? Money talks I will deliver.
We understand all commons aren't going to pull money, its the seemingly randomness of the choices for something that is PREMIUM, not garden-variety Wal-Mart available bulk.
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Playing since 1994: Currently MAGS (HomeBrew),Standard & Pauper (Pioneer and Modern are degenerate trash formats)
STOP using "dude/bro" as a pejorative or insult. Grow up.
Margaret Thatcher: “The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.”
Benjamin Franklin: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
Martin Luther King Jr.: "I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character."
When I think of cards I love to crack in $10 MSRP boosters, my mind immediately jumps to dopey tortoises. Thanks Wizards!
It's a common. Chill out.
Yeah, because rarity totally dictates viability within a given format. I'll be sure to write that down.
They can print any other card in this slot that has seen play in, let's see....the past TWO DECADES?
This is obviously filler for draft decks. Maybe they're seeding a slower archetype that wants early blockers. This isn't in here for it's viability in any format other than EMA draft.
Which is exactly the problem with these sets, screw draft, this is a limited print run product that is supposed to help inject some life into eternal cardpools, it's shouldn't have to worry about draft as a format.
Wow, I absolutely disagree. I, and many others I'm sure, would not buy boosters of this at all if it weren't for draft. Buying boosters is such a horrible lottery that you need actual value (The draft experience) to make it worth it. I'm thankful that WotC puts suboptimal cards in to account for good drafting instead of bending to pressure and slotting in a bunch of limited unplayable money cards.
MMA 1 and 2 were both amazingly fun to draft, and I hope this will be as well.
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Whenever someone claims to hate blue I automatically assume they're a bad player.
For a 4 dollar pack sure thing. For a 10 dollar pack they need to step it up. Better commons can be found.
I don't understand the complaint here. What random early game blue blocker that costs enough to be worth putting in the boosters were you hoping for Wizards to print at common?
Flying Men and Delver of Secrets come to mind right off the top of my head for early game Blue creatures. Give me a few minutes and I'll find some more.
Playing since 1994: Currently MAGS (HomeBrew),Standard & Pauper (Pioneer and Modern are degenerate trash formats)
STOP using "dude/bro" as a pejorative or insult. Grow up.
Margaret Thatcher: “The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.”
Benjamin Franklin: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
Martin Luther King Jr.: "I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character."
I can't wait to get my hands on a box or two of this set! There might actually be a good blue controllish archetype floating around! I still remember pulling these in 4th before draft was a thing. Nowadays... oh yes!
As for the conversation about philosophies between drafting and just putting cards into the card pool, I'm glad Wizards gives us the opportunity to draft. For those of us that were playing when many of these cards first came out it gives another opportunity to enjoy playing them again. Nobody is going to put the Giant Tortoise in a constructed deck, but I'm so looking forward to jamming a control deck I can barely contain myself.
Besides. If Wizards just printed 249 of the most sought after cards in Eternal, what would they do for a follow up? less than 20% of this set has been spoiled and I'm more excited about it than any set I can remember (including the Modern Masters sets) which were awesome.
I'm expecting this set will be a smashing success, leading to Eternal Masters 2 - the quest to take more of my money!
Yeah, because rarity totally dictates viability within a given format. I'll be sure to write that down.
They can print any other card in this slot that has seen play in, let's see....the past TWO DECADES?
This is obviously filler for draft decks. Maybe they're seeding a slower archetype that wants early blockers. This isn't in here for it's viability in any format other than EMA draft.
Which is exactly the problem with these sets, screw draft, this is a limited print run product that is supposed to help inject some life into eternal cardpools, it's shouldn't have to worry about draft as a format.
Wow, I absolutely disagree. I, and many others I'm sure, would not buy boosters of this at all if it weren't for draft. Buying boosters is such a horrible lottery that you need actual value (The draft experience) to make it worth it. I'm thankful that WotC puts suboptimal cards in to account for good drafting instead of bending to pressure and slotting in a bunch of limited unplayable money cards.
MMA 1 and 2 were both amazingly fun to draft, and I hope this will be as well.
There are plenty of sets to draft already in circulation, why should the premium sets suffer in card quality for a format that is already supported by every new set they print?
If this was called draft masters I'd understand, but with a card pool as big as Eternal is I don't expect chaff like this to make it into a pack while wizards hide behind the excuse of "it's for drafts!" and you silly gooses eat it up.
Exactly that, it's a premium set. This allows for more complex draft cards and interactions. We get to draft with mechanics that are "too complicated" to return to standard, or cards that are too powerful to be reprinted. It's not like the set is devoid of value, just that some concessions are made so that drafters are included too.
And guess what, drafters make up a large proportion of sales. And people doing sealed, too. Remember how large the MMA GPs were? The several of them that were held around the world? Can't hold these events (And similar events at LGS) without making the set play well in limited.
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Whenever someone claims to hate blue I automatically assume they're a bad player.
This is one of the only sets that Dualcaster mage could be reprinted in - and its a favorite for commander players. It does crazy work in my Riku deck, for example. Great choice for a reprint.
2 mana 1/4s in a color that is usually on a control strategy are really good in draft. Call backs to really fun cards from way back in the day are perfect for an eternal format. This isn't even filler, the tortoise will probably be a decent (6/7th) pick in draft.
For a 4 dollar pack sure thing. For a 10 dollar pack they need to step it up. Better commons can be found.
I don't understand the complaint here. What random early game blue blocker that costs enough to be worth putting in the boosters were you hoping for Wizards to print at common?
Flying Men and Delver of Secrets come to mind right off the top of my head for early game Blue creatures. Give me a few minutes and I'll find some more.
Not to divert the conversation, but Giant Tortoise is a control player's dream 2 drop. Flying Men would be an awesome reprint though for nostalgia reasons and I'd love to see it too. Delver probably won't make it in because of the DFC thing being incredibly hard to reprint.
I don't understand the complaint here. What random early game blue blocker that costs enough to be worth putting in the boosters were you hoping for Wizards to print at common?
Flying Men and Delver of Secrets come to mind right off the top of my head for early game Blue creatures. Give me a few minutes and I'll find some more.
Those don't fill the stated goal of including Giant Tortoise. They needed an early game blocker. Delver and Flying Men wouldn't do that job.
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Rest in RIP My Signature, I guess. 2015-2016, we hardly knew ye.
Total side note but I like how people are discussing running this over itself.
Well, it has to be said that Kolaghan is clearly better than Kolaghan. Considering what BR decks usually want and how stiff the competition in this guild is, there is no way that I would run Kolaghan over Kolaghan! Kolaghan might make it in as the sixth guild card or so. Kolaghan on the other hand ranks several places below that.
It was so funny to me when they described this as a downgrade to the original Zurgo during the Pax East panel. I was thinking if this is a downgrade, they should really "downgrade" all legendary creatures. Haha.
My deck designing is quite concise at this point:
1. Come up with deck idea
2. Realize this idea is somehow fundamentally similar to another deck I have or that is commonly played in my group
3. Decide I don't want to disassemble one of my existing decks
4. Give up and do nothing
I don't see the point of this new shroud mechanic. It's strictly worse than Hexproof. Threshold is pretty bad too, Delirium is a much better mechanic and probably easier to activate.
Otherwise this card is a pretty neat guy. Dodges removal and grows into a Primal Huntbeast. 3/5
If White/Blue Flyers is an archetype for this set - I SERIOUSLY hope we see a Flying Men reprint. But that doesn't mean the Tortoise isn't also a solid reprint choice.
The question is WHY does there need to be an early game blocker? For draft in a Standard mass market 4 dollar product yes. But in a PREMIUM, constructed format, 10 dollar a pack set that reasoning does not fit. Why am I going to pay extra money to draft something like this when I can get the exact same card in a much cheaper, much more available, Standard draft? Why would I pay 30 to 35 bucks to end up with a deck full of Giant Tortoise and Worldgorger Dragon?
We will have to agree to disagree and move on.
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Playing since 1994: Currently MAGS (HomeBrew),Standard & Pauper (Pioneer and Modern are degenerate trash formats)
STOP using "dude/bro" as a pejorative or insult. Grow up.
Margaret Thatcher: “The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.”
Benjamin Franklin: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
Martin Luther King Jr.: "I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character."
The question is WHY does there need to be an early game blocker? For draft in a Standard mass market 4 dollar product yes. But in a PREMIUM, constructed format, 10 dollar a pack set that reasoning does not fit. Why am I going to pay extra money to draft something like this when I can get the exact same card in a much cheaper, much more available, Standard draft? Why would I pay 30 to 35 bucks to end up with a deck full of Giant Tortoise and Worldgorger Dragon?
We will have to agree to disagree and move on.
Because having a good curve is generally a great way to win in limited? And winning an EMA draft yields more packs of EMA?
Also why are you drafting Worldgorger at all?
You're clearly not someone who plays limited much at all, so it's fine you don't get it.
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Whenever someone claims to hate blue I automatically assume they're a bad player.
Why am I going to pay extra money to draft something like this when I can get the exact same card in a much cheaper, much more available, Standard draft? Why would I pay 30 to 35 bucks to end up with a deck full of Giant Tortoise and Worldgorger Dragon?
We will have to agree to disagree and move on.
I mean, I want to draft EMA because outside of cube I'm not going to even have the chance to draft Worldgorger combo in my life. It's a unique draft environment you won't find in a standard legal set.
But yeah, let's move on, I'm gonna go see how much a foil Giant Tortoise is going to cost me.
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Rest in RIP My Signature, I guess. 2015-2016, we hardly knew ye.
Total side note but I like how people are discussing running this over itself.
Well, it has to be said that Kolaghan is clearly better than Kolaghan. Considering what BR decks usually want and how stiff the competition in this guild is, there is no way that I would run Kolaghan over Kolaghan! Kolaghan might make it in as the sixth guild card or so. Kolaghan on the other hand ranks several places below that.
It was so funny to me when they described this as a downgrade to the original Zurgo during the Pax East panel. I was thinking if this is a downgrade, they should really "downgrade" all legendary creatures. Haha.
My deck designing is quite concise at this point:
1. Come up with deck idea
2. Realize this idea is somehow fundamentally similar to another deck I have or that is commonly played in my group
3. Decide I don't want to disassemble one of my existing decks
4. Give up and do nothing
I don't see the point of this new shroud mechanic. It's strictly worse than Hexproof. Threshold is pretty bad too, Delirium is a much better mechanic and probably easier to activate.
Otherwise this card is a pretty neat guy. Dodges removal and grows into a Primal Huntbeast. 3/5
We are coming from two different angles. We have to agree to disagree and move on. It would be like buying a PREMIUM luxury car and opening the door to find it with cloth seats, 1992 analog radio and lacking power seats, windows or cruise control. My argument is even the commons need to be premium and if they are not available bump certain uncommons to common to make it so. Again, we have to cite our differences and move on.
Playing since 1994: Currently MAGS (HomeBrew),Standard & Pauper (Pioneer and Modern are degenerate trash formats)
STOP using "dude/bro" as a pejorative or insult. Grow up.
Margaret Thatcher: “The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.”
Benjamin Franklin: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
Martin Luther King Jr.: "I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character."
We are coming from two different angles. We have to agree to disagree and move on. It would be like buying a PREMIUM luxury car and opening the door to find it with cloth seats, 1992 digital radio and lacking power seats, windows or cruise control. My argument is even the commons need to be premium and if they are not available bump certain uncommons to common to make it so. Again, we have to cite our differences and move on.
That's a really poor analogy. It's like buying a luxury car only to discover...it drives like a luxury car, because it was designed to be used and they really hit the mark.
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Whenever someone claims to hate blue I automatically assume they're a bad player.
We are coming from two different angles. We have to agree to disagree and move on. It would be like buying a PREMIUM luxury car and opening the door to find it with cloth seats, 1992 digital radio and lacking power seats, windows or cruise control. My argument is even the commons need to be premium and if they are not available bump certain uncommons to common to make it so. Again, we have to cite our differences and move on.
That's a really poor analogy. It's like buying a luxury car only to discover...it drives like a luxury car, because it was designed to be used and they really hit the mark.
No its a PERFECT analogy. Time to move on, let it go. I'm done.
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Playing since 1994: Currently MAGS (HomeBrew),Standard & Pauper (Pioneer and Modern are degenerate trash formats)
STOP using "dude/bro" as a pejorative or insult. Grow up.
Margaret Thatcher: “The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.”
Benjamin Franklin: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
Martin Luther King Jr.: "I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character."
We are coming from two different angles. We have to agree to disagree and move on. It would be like buying a PREMIUM luxury car and opening the door to find it with cloth seats, 1992 digital radio and lacking power seats, windows or cruise control. My argument is even the commons need to be premium and if they are not available bump certain uncommons to common to make it so. Again, we have to cite our differences and move on.
That's a really poor analogy. It's like buying a luxury car only to discover...it drives like a luxury car, because it was designed to be used and they really hit the mark.
No its a PERFECT analogy. Time to move on, let it go. I'm done.
"Nuh uh!"
Well alright then. Ciao.
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Whenever someone claims to hate blue I automatically assume they're a bad player.
uhmmmm....you guys should just buy singles of what you want from the set if you are concerned about not wanting the commons in the pack
Boosters are always a lottery, and if this is anything like modern masters it will probably be even more so.
Buy a box if you want to draft, or you want a lotto ticket. If you want cards for constructed decks, buy the cards as singles.
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The true mind can weather all the lies and illusions without being lost. The true heart can tough the poison of hatred without being harmed. Since beginning-less time, darkness thrives in the void but always yields to purifying light.
I invision a future where one is not mighty when he can silence a crowd with brutality,
but when he leaves them speechless with wisdom.
uhmmmm....you guys should just buy singles of what you want from the set if you are concerned about not wanting the commons in the pack
Boosters are always a lottery, and if this is anything like modern masters it will probably be even more so.
Buy a box if you want to draft, or you want a lotto ticket. If you want cards for constructed decks, buy the cards as singles.
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():
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The true mind can weather all the lies and illusions without being lost. The true heart can tough the poison of hatred without being harmed. Since beginning-less time, darkness thrives in the void but always yields to purifying light.
I invision a future where one is not mighty when he can silence a crowd with brutality,
but when he leaves them speechless with wisdom.
You know, I remember when, back in the time, people used to say thing like: "this is the best mtg expansion ever". They said that with Alliances, Tempest, Invasion, Torment, etc. Even Fallen Empires had its fan base.
But seriously, Eternal Masters looks like the best mtg set ever. And we only have a 10% of the set spoiled.
Wizards sells way more packs when a set is able to be drafted. This isn't really up for debate. As such, they've decided Giant Tortoise is a good include for a limited experience. Plus it's a common - not really going to effect EV all that much.
Based on what's currently spoiled, it's exceeded what I thought they would do. Pretty much the only thing I'm really looking for at this point is that the EV isn't mythic heavy like MM2 was.
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My apologies, children, for I am afraid I cannot save you all.
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We understand all commons aren't going to pull money, its the seemingly randomness of the choices for something that is PREMIUM, not garden-variety Wal-Mart available bulk.
STOP using "dude/bro" as a pejorative or insult. Grow up.
Margaret Thatcher: “The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.”
Benjamin Franklin: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
Martin Luther King Jr.: "I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character."
Wow, I absolutely disagree. I, and many others I'm sure, would not buy boosters of this at all if it weren't for draft. Buying boosters is such a horrible lottery that you need actual value (The draft experience) to make it worth it. I'm thankful that WotC puts suboptimal cards in to account for good drafting instead of bending to pressure and slotting in a bunch of limited unplayable money cards.
MMA 1 and 2 were both amazingly fun to draft, and I hope this will be as well.
For a 4 dollar pack sure thing. For a 10 dollar pack they need to step it up. Better commons can be found.
Flying Men and Delver of Secrets come to mind right off the top of my head for early game Blue creatures. Give me a few minutes and I'll find some more.
STOP using "dude/bro" as a pejorative or insult. Grow up.
Margaret Thatcher: “The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.”
Benjamin Franklin: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
Martin Luther King Jr.: "I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character."
Name one of these fabled common expensive blue blockers, then.
As for the conversation about philosophies between drafting and just putting cards into the card pool, I'm glad Wizards gives us the opportunity to draft. For those of us that were playing when many of these cards first came out it gives another opportunity to enjoy playing them again. Nobody is going to put the Giant Tortoise in a constructed deck, but I'm so looking forward to jamming a control deck I can barely contain myself.
Besides. If Wizards just printed 249 of the most sought after cards in Eternal, what would they do for a follow up? less than 20% of this set has been spoiled and I'm more excited about it than any set I can remember (including the Modern Masters sets) which were awesome.
I'm expecting this set will be a smashing success, leading to Eternal Masters 2 - the quest to take more of my money!
Exactly that, it's a premium set. This allows for more complex draft cards and interactions. We get to draft with mechanics that are "too complicated" to return to standard, or cards that are too powerful to be reprinted. It's not like the set is devoid of value, just that some concessions are made so that drafters are included too.
And guess what, drafters make up a large proportion of sales. And people doing sealed, too. Remember how large the MMA GPs were? The several of them that were held around the world? Can't hold these events (And similar events at LGS) without making the set play well in limited.
2 mana 1/4s in a color that is usually on a control strategy are really good in draft. Call backs to really fun cards from way back in the day are perfect for an eternal format. This isn't even filler, the tortoise will probably be a decent (6/7th) pick in draft.
Custom Set
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1hu9uNBSUt92PwGhvexYlwFvsh6_SJBlEEIUV3H9_XyU/edit?usp=sharing
Not to divert the conversation, but Giant Tortoise is a control player's dream 2 drop. Flying Men would be an awesome reprint though for nostalgia reasons and I'd love to see it too. Delver probably won't make it in because of the DFC thing being incredibly hard to reprint.
Those don't fill the stated goal of including Giant Tortoise. They needed an early game blocker. Delver and Flying Men wouldn't do that job.
Custom Set
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1hu9uNBSUt92PwGhvexYlwFvsh6_SJBlEEIUV3H9_XyU/edit?usp=sharing
We will have to agree to disagree and move on.
STOP using "dude/bro" as a pejorative or insult. Grow up.
Margaret Thatcher: “The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.”
Benjamin Franklin: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
Martin Luther King Jr.: "I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character."
Because having a good curve is generally a great way to win in limited? And winning an EMA draft yields more packs of EMA?
Also why are you drafting Worldgorger at all?
You're clearly not someone who plays limited much at all, so it's fine you don't get it.
I mean, I want to draft EMA because outside of cube I'm not going to even have the chance to draft Worldgorger combo in my life. It's a unique draft environment you won't find in a standard legal set.
But yeah, let's move on, I'm gonna go see how much a foil Giant Tortoise is going to cost me.
I mean.... you'll never see someone say something like "Well, my booster was so-so... opened a Karakas but that Giant Tortoise has really ruined it"
STOP using "dude/bro" as a pejorative or insult. Grow up.
Margaret Thatcher: “The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.”
Benjamin Franklin: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
Martin Luther King Jr.: "I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character."
That's a really poor analogy. It's like buying a luxury car only to discover...it drives like a luxury car, because it was designed to be used and they really hit the mark.
No its a PERFECT analogy. Time to move on, let it go. I'm done.
STOP using "dude/bro" as a pejorative or insult. Grow up.
Margaret Thatcher: “The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.”
Benjamin Franklin: "Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
Martin Luther King Jr.: "I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character."
"Nuh uh!"
Well alright then. Ciao.
Boosters are always a lottery, and if this is anything like modern masters it will probably be even more so.
Buy a box if you want to draft, or you want a lotto ticket. If you want cards for constructed decks, buy the cards as singles.
I invision a future where one is not mighty when he can silence a crowd with brutality,
but when he leaves them speechless with wisdom.
Boosters are always a lottery, and if this is anything like modern masters it will probably be even more so.
Buy a box if you want to draft, or you want a lotto ticket. If you want cards for constructed decks, buy the cards as singles.
I invision a future where one is not mighty when he can silence a crowd with brutality,
but when he leaves them speechless with wisdom.
You know, I remember when, back in the time, people used to say thing like: "this is the best mtg expansion ever". They said that with Alliances, Tempest, Invasion, Torment, etc. Even Fallen Empires had its fan base.
But seriously, Eternal Masters looks like the best mtg set ever. And we only have a 10% of the set spoiled.
3BB
Sorcery
You lose the game.
Based on what's currently spoiled, it's exceeded what I thought they would do. Pretty much the only thing I'm really looking for at this point is that the EV isn't mythic heavy like MM2 was.