I can definitely see them do five mono- or two-colored commanders with abilities in the remaining colors. Heavier emphasis on certain colors in each deck will make the different sets more different, and the mana base far less clunky. Remember that these decks come with budget-y mana bases, so getting to cast your commander even if you don`t have all of your four colors will make things play a lot easier. If not, I can see this going Commander 2016: All Lands ETBT, and besides, the decks might feel devoid of identity if they are full-on four-color.
So something like one deck centered around each allied color pair, where the white/green commanders are like:
Name Nameson, Important Person - 4WG Legendary Creature - Fish Monkey R: Do something very good, but non-crucial U: Do something that`s alright, but mostly a bonus feature
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When I hit my 3000 post mark, I'm gone for good.
Stay reasonable, be mindful of your expectations and don't feed the trolls.
They could make them like the volvers from Apocalypse or the hybrid cards like firespout. That they do something else depending on the colors of mana used to cast them.
1UWRB/G
Enters the battlefield with Menace if B was used to cast this or trample if Gwas used.
That's a five color card. Remove one mana symbol and we can talk!
Oops, got carried away with the mana symbols there
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Thanks to SpiderBoy4 @ High-Light Studio's for the awesome banner
“I once had an entire race killed just to listen to the rattling of their dried bones as I waded through them.” —Volrath
I can definitely see them do five mono- or two-colored commanders with abilities in the remaining colors. Heavier emphasis on certain colors in each deck will make the different sets more different, and the mana base far less clunky. Remember that these decks come with budget-y mana bases, so getting to cast your commander even if you don`t have all of your four colors will make things play a lot easier. If not, I can see this going Commander 2016: All Lands ETBT, and besides, the decks might feel devoid of identity if they are full-on four-color.
So something like one deck centered around each allied color pair, where the white/green commanders are like:
Name Nameson, Important Person - 4WG Legendary Creature - Fish Monkey R: Do something very good, but non-crucial U: Do something that`s alright, but mostly a bonus feature
If I had a choice, I would work with enemy colored pairs, as there are far fewer of those than ally colored pairs. Start with an ability that fits in those two colors, then fit in two separate abilities that each include one other color identity. So in total, each of the commanders of this cycle can be run as 2, 3, or 4 colored decks at your discretion.
Of course, this is my opinion.
They could make them like the volvers from Apocalypse or the hybrid cards like firespout. That they do something else depending on the colors of mana used to cast them.
1UWRB/G
Enters the battlefield with Menace if B was used to cast this or trample if Gwas used.
That's a five color card. Remove one mana symbol and we can talk!
Oops, got carried away with the mana symbols there
You make a hybrid like this
:sym wu:
but without the space. So .
But really, even 3 color + the other 2 hybrid is still 5 color identity.
EDIT: Hey why does this not work anymore? EDIT 2: gotcha. No text after the symbol.
We will be getting three (or possibly only two) four colored commanders in each deck, because that is what people are expecting, and have been asking for ever since they printed the Nephilim. There is zero reason to even entertain the idea that this is not the case, and discussing the possibility that it isn't so is an exercise in futility and a waste of everyone's time.
We would be using or time much more creatively by discussing what themes the decks may have.
For example, I posit that the nonred deck will have an exalted (sub)theme, because it is a mechanic that exists in all color except red, and a viable commander for a four color exalted deck is a good idea.
How could it ever really be better than Rafiq of the Many? Your manabase becomes a lot more complicated for not a whole lot of payoff.
Because Rafiq can't be used with black creatures, obviously. >.<
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It's about time for the reserved list to die, for the sake of Vintage and Legacy (And Commander).
manabase becomes a lot more complicated for not a whole lot of payoff.
Because Rafiq can't be used with black creatures, obviously. >.<
Because black has enchantments the reward having only one creature and/or has enchantments that punish you for swinging with multiples like Hissing Miasma.
No, because there is a number of black cards with exalted, for example:
Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
Melek, Izzet Paragon
Oona, Queen of the Fae
Bruna, Light of Alabaster
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Rhys the Redeemed
Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Sen Triplets
The Mimeoplasm WUBRGSliver OverlordGRBUW WUBRGSliver Hivelord(Superfriends)GRBUW
I'm hoping for one four mana cost commander in each set (ah-la Nephilim) as the main general. Then a bunch of dual cost commanders with color identity abilities in their text box. The volver idea is also something i love, especially if they choose to do multikicker
I run a Lady Evangela deck that focuses on exalted as the main attacking mechanic, and the deck is really seeing it's share of being the threat on the table. The right cards in conjunction just make it overwhelming for other players sometimes.
I run a Lady Evangela deck that focuses on exalted as the main attacking mechanic, and the deck is really seeing it's share of being the threat on the table. The right cards in conjunction just make it overwhelming for other players sometimes.
I don't know if you could pull that off in my current playgroup.
It's difficult to keep more than two nonland permanents on the board at a time,
so Exalted (or any strategy that requires a significant board presence) doesn't work so well here.
Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
Melek, Izzet Paragon
Oona, Queen of the Fae
Bruna, Light of Alabaster
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Rhys the Redeemed
Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Sen Triplets
The Mimeoplasm WUBRGSliver OverlordGRBUW WUBRGSliver Hivelord(Superfriends)GRBUW
I run a Lady Evangela deck that focuses on exalted as the main attacking mechanic, and the deck is really seeing it's share of being the threat on the table. The right cards in conjunction just make it overwhelming for other players sometimes.
I don't know if you could pull that off in my current playgroup.
It's difficult to keep more than two nonland permanents on the board at a time,
so Exalted (or any strategy that requires a significant board presence) doesn't work so well here.
It is very much a political intrigue styled deck, but it picks up a board presence quickly after wipes.
It has it's answers though.
I mainly play at a LGS which has a wide variety of decks and skills show up on edh nights.
Re: "If (Color) was used to Cast ~, do X." concepts.
I don't see them using that with Hybrid (mostly because Wizards has repeatedly stated that is a little harder to read/remember than matched Hybrids) but I can see Twobrid making a comeback (which does nothing for Tiny Leader but are they really a priority?)
Costed second or third general seems like the sort of choice they could justify, especially with the depressing manabase that will be these decks off the shelf. Which would open up some space for how to make that play well in the deck, especially if they weigh/balance the effects based on the Converted Mana Cost (8) instead of the color mana cost (4).
We will be getting three (or possibly only two) four colored commanders in each deck, because that is what people are expecting, and have been asking for ever since they printed the Nephilim. There is zero reason to even entertain the idea that this is not the case, and discussing the possibility that it isn't so is an exercise in futility and a waste of everyone's time.
We would be using or time much more creatively by discussing what themes the decks may have.
For example, I posit that the nonred deck will have an exalted (sub)theme, because it is a mechanic that exists in all color except red, and a viable commander for a four color exalted deck is a good idea.
How could it ever really be better than Rafiq of the Many? Your manabase becomes a lot more complicated for not a whole lot of payoff.
Because Rafiq can't be used with black creatures, obviously. >.<
What I meant is that Rafiq already kind of usurps the design space of being the exalted commander and is already very good. I'm probably not creative enough to think of a 4 colour version of that which is worth it and more powerful than Rafiq.
And he still locks you out of playing all four colors the mechanic exists in. Using your logic we would have been fine with one of the two two-color legendary ally creatures in BFZ as an Ally commander, and not have gotten any of the others, including Tazri whom is a necessity to play a themed five color commander deck. >.<
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It's about time for the reserved list to die, for the sake of Vintage and Legacy (And Commander).
The closer we're getting to this release, the more excited I am for what must be either some really epic or really strange commander concepts and identities. It seems like each deck could be centered around major cluster f's in magic's history (the conflux, kami war, dominarian apocalypse, the brothers war), or great multiversal empires like the thran, elder dragon era, the iquati, consolidated new phyrexia. I wonder if wizards will stick to tight themes with these decks, or just the usual pan-planar stuff we saw in commander 2011-2015.
How could it ever really be better than Rafiq of the Many? Your manabase becomes a lot more complicated for not a whole lot of payoff.
Because Rafiq can't be used with black creatures, obviously. >.<
What I meant is that Rafiq already kind of usurps the design space of being the exalted commander and is already very good. I'm probably not creative enough to think of a 4 colour version of that which is worth it and more powerful than Rafiq.
And he still locks you out of playing all four colors the mechanic exists in. Using your logic we would have been fine with one of the two two-color legendary ally creatures in BFZ as an Ally commander, and not have gotten any of the others, including Tazri whom is a necessity to play a themed five color commander deck. >.<
Your slippery slope argument is kind of silly and it's not at all how logic works. All I'm saying is I lack the imagination of what they could do to not make it a Rafiq knock-off.
No-one is asking for a Rafiq knockoff. The legendary Exalted Demon isn't a Rafiq knockoff, why would a four color exalted legendary creature be? Your argument is flawed from its inception.
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It's about time for the reserved list to die, for the sake of Vintage and Legacy (And Commander).
The closer we're getting to this release, the more excited I am for what must be either some really epic or really strange commander concepts and identities. It seems like each deck could be centered around major cluster f's in magic's history (the conflux, kami war, dominarian apocalypse, the brothers war), or great multiversal empires like the thran, elder dragon era, the iquati, consolidated new phyrexia. I wonder if wizards will stick to tight themes with these decks, or just the usual pan-planar stuff we saw in commander 2011-2015.
I don't see how or why these decks would have tight themes. Even the mono color commander decks were scattershot in mechanics, play style, and flavor. Each deck had very, very loosely defined themes and strategies. Why people think these will be any different is beyond explaining.
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MTGSalvation; Where the whining is a time honored tradition, and enjoying the game is trolling.
If they implemented co-commanders in place of secondary legends and made all the co-commanders 2-3 cmc, then you could run four color even in Tiny Leaders.
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MTGS Wikia Article about "New World Order"
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
PSA to everyone who keeps forgetting about the Reserved List:
You're on a website dedicated to talking about MtG. You're only a few keystrokes away from finding out what cards are on the Reserved List. You're also only a few keystrokes away from finding out why some cards on the Reserved List got foil printings in FtV, as Judge promos, or whatnot, as well as why that won't happen again. Stop doing this.
If they implemented co-commanders in place of secondary legends and made all the co-commanders 2-3 cmc, then you could run four color even in Tiny Leaders.
I really, really hope they do not do this. I want an actual 4-color general, not two co-generals.
If they implemented co-commanders in place of secondary legends and made all the co-commanders 2-3 cmc, then you could run four color even in Tiny Leaders.
I really, really hope they do not do this. I want an actual 4-color general, not two co-generals.
I think people are just dreaming. I don't think there's the slightest chance of it actually happening.
If they implemented co-commanders in place of secondary legends and made all the co-commanders 2-3 cmc, then you could run four color even in Tiny Leaders.
I really, really hope they do not do this. I want an actual 4-color general, not two co-generals.
As I said, in place of secondary legends. I fully expect the face card of the deck to be a solid gold with four color symbols in the cost. This is what I'm proposing:
Quad face legend
Ally co-commander
Enemy co-commander
This way, we get the cycle of four-color legends we've all wanted as well as neat secondary options that can be mixed together to create any three or four color combination, and if the cmcs are all 3 or less, including in Tiny Leaders. If each deck focuses on one ally pair and one enemy pair like I suspect, the co-commanders help headline that theme. So if the RGWU deck focuses on UR and GW, we get a UR legend and a GW legend each with the co-commander ability. It adds a new level of modularity to Commander deckbuilding. And if format balance is an issue, the individual co-commanders can be made a little weaker or more simplistic in comparison to other Legends to keep them from dominating the format.
MTGS Wikia Article about "New World Order"
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
PSA to everyone who keeps forgetting about the Reserved List:
You're on a website dedicated to talking about MtG. You're only a few keystrokes away from finding out what cards are on the Reserved List. You're also only a few keystrokes away from finding out why some cards on the Reserved List got foil printings in FtV, as Judge promos, or whatnot, as well as why that won't happen again. Stop doing this.
If they implemented co-commanders in place of secondary legends and made all the co-commanders 2-3 cmc, then you could run four color even in Tiny Leaders.
I really, really hope they do not do this. I want an actual 4-color general, not two co-generals.
As I said, in place of secondary legends. I fully expect the face card of the deck to be a solid gold with four color symbols in the cost. This is what I'm proposing:
Quad face legend
Ally co-commander
Enemy co-commander
This way, we get the cycle of four-color legends we've all wanted as well as neat secondary options that can be mixed together to create any three or four color combination, and if the cmcs are all 3 or less, including in Tiny Leaders. If each deck focuses on one ally pair and one enemy pair like I suspect, the co-commanders help headline that theme. So if the RGWU deck focuses on UR and GW, we get a UR legend and a GW legend each with the co-commander ability. It adds a new level of modularity to Commander deckbuilding. And if format balance is an issue, the individual co-commanders can be made a little weaker or more simplistic in comparison to other Legends to keep them from dominating the format.
I did not know Tiny Leaders was still a thing? It never took off where I live...
And we already have a lot of two color legends. I'd much prefer more real four-color ones.
No leak nothing ?
No news about the 4 colors commander decks yet ?
Yep. Anticipation will build and expectations continue to climb. Let's see if these will live up to half of it. My guess is they will not. Way to market. Reveals a week or two before this drops is lame and I suspect will backfire, too. Like C15 did.
Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
Melek, Izzet Paragon
Oona, Queen of the Fae
Bruna, Light of Alabaster
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Rhys the Redeemed
Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Sen Triplets
The Mimeoplasm WUBRGSliver OverlordGRBUW WUBRGSliver Hivelord(Superfriends)GRBUW
No leak nothing ?
No news about the 4 colors commander decks yet ?
No, and I'm not sure this drought of news is good for them—
I've never seen MTGS this dead before
Yeah, they're not maintaining any momentum. Oh well. When this happens I just become an even harsher critic because I expect the wait to deliver something worthwhile. For a product that only occurs once a year, I expect something good from the get-go. Especially when it comes to past characters getting cards, or things like Enchantment Lands that can only be done, according to Maro, in supplemental products, especially Commander.
But if this just ends up being bulk rares with 4-color random basic uninspired legends from generic planes we don't know because!4color then expect me to skip this release.
So something like one deck centered around each allied color pair, where the white/green commanders are like:
Stay reasonable, be mindful of your expectations and don't feed the trolls.
Doomsdayin'
Oops, got carried away with the mana symbols there
“I once had an entire race killed just to listen to the rattling of their dried bones as I waded through them.”
—Volrath
If I had a choice, I would work with enemy colored pairs, as there are far fewer of those than ally colored pairs. Start with an ability that fits in those two colors, then fit in two separate abilities that each include one other color identity. So in total, each of the commanders of this cycle can be run as 2, 3, or 4 colored decks at your discretion.
Of course, this is my opinion.
You make a hybrid like this
but without the space. So .
But really, even 3 color + the other 2 hybrid is still 5 color identity.
EDIT:
Hey why does this not work anymore?EDIT 2: gotcha. No text after the symbol.
( 0.0 )
=O ((U/R)) O=
(")(")
I'm an AI making Magic cards.
http://www.staalmedia.nl/nexus/#generate
Because Rafiq can't be used with black creatures, obviously. >.<
---
Numquam evolutioni obstes. Solum conculceris.
Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.
You can use the "Smiley" button on the toolbar, it's between "quote" and "dice", it will open a small window go to the "MTG" tab and select page 2.
eg.
Modern: UB Zombie hunt UB - WR Boros tokens WR - BGW Treefolk tribal BGW
Commander: UR Mizzix, a Storm of spells UR (Decklist)
No, because there is a number of black cards with exalted, for example:
Servant of Nefarox
Duskmantle Prowler
Nefarox, Overlord of Grixis
---
Numquam evolutioni obstes. Solum conculceris.
Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.
(multiple players plus constant boardwipes = tough to get Exalted going).
I personally would freaking *hate* it if they wasted my favorite color quad on such a limited mechanic.
Reanimation is a much more tenable strategy those colors share.
Reprint Stasis!
Control needs more love.
EDH:
Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
Melek, Izzet Paragon
Oona, Queen of the Fae
Bruna, Light of Alabaster
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Rhys the Redeemed
Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Sen Triplets
The Mimeoplasm
WUBRGSliver OverlordGRBUW
WUBRGSliver Hivelord(Superfriends)GRBUW
UBU/B Tezz ControlUB
WTempered SteelW
EDH
BWTeysa, Orzhov ScionBW
RUJhoira of the GhituRU
RGWMayael the AnimaRGW
Wow, she doesn't even have access to Rafiq of the Many or Finest Hour-
that must be a challenge!
I don't know if you could pull that off in my current playgroup.
It's difficult to keep more than two nonland permanents on the board at a time,
so Exalted (or any strategy that requires a significant board presence) doesn't work so well here.
Reprint Stasis!
Control needs more love.
EDH:
Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
Melek, Izzet Paragon
Oona, Queen of the Fae
Bruna, Light of Alabaster
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Rhys the Redeemed
Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Sen Triplets
The Mimeoplasm
WUBRGSliver OverlordGRBUW
WUBRGSliver Hivelord(Superfriends)GRBUW
It is very much a political intrigue styled deck, but it picks up a board presence quickly after wipes.
It has it's answers though.
I mainly play at a LGS which has a wide variety of decks and skills show up on edh nights.
I don't see them using that with Hybrid (mostly because Wizards has repeatedly stated that is a little harder to read/remember than matched Hybrids) but I can see Twobrid making a comeback (which does nothing for Tiny Leader but are they really a priority?)
Costed second or third general seems like the sort of choice they could justify, especially with the depressing manabase that will be these decks off the shelf. Which would open up some space for how to make that play well in the deck, especially if they weigh/balance the effects based on the Converted Mana Cost (8) instead of the color mana cost (4).
And he still locks you out of playing all four colors the mechanic exists in. Using your logic we would have been fine with one of the two two-color legendary ally creatures in BFZ as an Ally commander, and not have gotten any of the others, including Tazri whom is a necessity to play a themed five color commander deck. >.<
---
Numquam evolutioni obstes. Solum conculceris.
Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.
"Personally I love high-riak, low-reqars gambles. Life's best with a decent amount of riak. And f*** reqars."
No-one is asking for a Rafiq knockoff. The legendary Exalted Demon isn't a Rafiq knockoff, why would a four color exalted legendary creature be? Your argument is flawed from its inception.
---
Numquam evolutioni obstes. Solum conculceris.
Pascite draconem, evolvite aut morimini.
I don't see how or why these decks would have tight themes. Even the mono color commander decks were scattershot in mechanics, play style, and flavor. Each deck had very, very loosely defined themes and strategies. Why people think these will be any different is beyond explaining.
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
I really, really hope they do not do this. I want an actual 4-color general, not two co-generals.
As I said, in place of secondary legends. I fully expect the face card of the deck to be a solid gold with four color symbols in the cost. This is what I'm proposing:
Quad face legend
Ally co-commander
Enemy co-commander
This way, we get the cycle of four-color legends we've all wanted as well as neat secondary options that can be mixed together to create any three or four color combination, and if the cmcs are all 3 or less, including in Tiny Leaders. If each deck focuses on one ally pair and one enemy pair like I suspect, the co-commanders help headline that theme. So if the RGWU deck focuses on UR and GW, we get a UR legend and a GW legend each with the co-commander ability. It adds a new level of modularity to Commander deckbuilding. And if format balance is an issue, the individual co-commanders can be made a little weaker or more simplistic in comparison to other Legends to keep them from dominating the format.
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
I did not know Tiny Leaders was still a thing? It never took off where I live...
And we already have a lot of two color legends. I'd much prefer more real four-color ones.
|| UW Jace, Vyn's Prodigy UW || UG Kenessos, Priest of Thassa (feat. Arixmethes) UG ||
Cards I still want to see created:
|| Olantin, Lost City || Pavios and Thanasis || Choryu ||
No, and I'm not sure this drought of news is good for them—
I've never seen MTGS this dead before
Reprint Stasis!
Control needs more love.
EDH:
Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
Melek, Izzet Paragon
Oona, Queen of the Fae
Bruna, Light of Alabaster
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Rhys the Redeemed
Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Sen Triplets
The Mimeoplasm
WUBRGSliver OverlordGRBUW
WUBRGSliver Hivelord(Superfriends)GRBUW
But if this just ends up being bulk rares with 4-color random basic uninspired legends from generic planes we don't know because!4color then expect me to skip this release.
|| UW Jace, Vyn's Prodigy UW || UG Kenessos, Priest of Thassa (feat. Arixmethes) UG ||
Cards I still want to see created:
|| Olantin, Lost City || Pavios and Thanasis || Choryu ||