As always, please feel free to make any suggestions for improvements. Also, if you notice any errors with spelling/rarity/color etc, please let me know. There are not yet enough commons spoiled for this to be terribly useful, but if you want to see a few SOI pools it can be fun.
I've been using your sealed pool generator in preparation for the last sets releases and I think it's time to thank you, you've done a great service in the Magic community.
Thank very much for your work.
I noticed that with every few packs, there was either a rare or mythic flipped card replacing the rare or no flip card. I dont know if they are doing the same thing as in Innistrad, but ver pack should contain a flip card if the generator is suppose to be legit
I think the script for DFC is not compeated, on a pre release pool there was like 9 DFC. Assuming that they will have a separated slot in Boosters ( like original innistrad had) i guess it needs some rebuild
It was mentioned somewhere that every SOI pack has one guaranteed flip card slot, with a chance for a second; but I don't think we know what the percentages are or what they replace.
It was mentioned somewhere that every SOI pack has one guaranteed flip card slot, with a chance for a second; but I don't think we know what the percentages are or what they replace.
I think it's more that every pack will have one DFC on average. MaRo said the as-fan was a bit over 1.
I got one mythic (Sorin, Grim Nemesis), and three rares (Angel of Deliverance, Bygone Bishop, Slayer's Plate). That's only four rare slots out of six.
I also got a foil rare (Cryptolith Rite), and two rare DFC cards (Elusive Tormentor, Geier Reach Bandit). The rare DFC cards should be part of the DFC slot, not the Rare/Mythic slot.
EDIT: Unless I'm miscounting, I only got 5 DFC cards also, there should be at least six.
I shouldn't complain, though, that's a hell of a pool.
I got one mythic (Sorin, Grim Nemesis), and three rares (Angel of Deliverance, Bygone Bishop, Slayer's Plate). That's only four rare slots out of six.
I also got a foil rare (Cryptolith Rite), and two rare DFC cards (Elusive Tormentor, Geier Reach Bandit). The rare DFC cards should be part of the DFC slot, not the Rare/Mythic slot.
EDIT: Unless I'm miscounting, I only got 5 DFC cards also, there should be at least six.
I shouldn't complain, though, that's a hell of a pool.
It's possible I have a non-rare card marked rare. I will look into it. Thanks!
I got one mythic (Sorin, Grim Nemesis), and three rares (Angel of Deliverance, Bygone Bishop, Slayer's Plate). That's only four rare slots out of six.
I also got a foil rare (Cryptolith Rite), and two rare DFC cards (Elusive Tormentor, Geier Reach Bandit). The rare DFC cards should be part of the DFC slot, not the Rare/Mythic slot.
EDIT: Unless I'm miscounting, I only got 5 DFC cards also, there should be at least six.
I shouldn't complain, though, that's a hell of a pool.
OK I see what the problem is.... I don't have a DFC slot specified. It just generates the pool based on card rarities. I will work on a solution.
I got one mythic (Sorin, Grim Nemesis), and three rares (Angel of Deliverance, Bygone Bishop, Slayer's Plate). That's only four rare slots out of six.
I also got a foil rare (Cryptolith Rite), and two rare DFC cards (Elusive Tormentor, Geier Reach Bandit). The rare DFC cards should be part of the DFC slot, not the Rare/Mythic slot.
EDIT: Unless I'm miscounting, I only got 5 DFC cards also, there should be at least six.
I shouldn't complain, though, that's a hell of a pool.
It's possible I have a non-rare card marked rare. I will look into it. Thanks!
A normal pack will contain a common or uncommon double-faced card, which is already pretty cool. Approximately one in every eight packs will also contain a rare or mythic double-faced card in addition to a normal rare or mythic rare (the rare or mythic rare double-faced card will replace a common). These packs will have two double-faced cards, the common/uncommon and the rare/mythic rare.
And that's before we even start considering foils.
So while it doesn't mention what foils will be like, I'd assume they also replace a common, and have a chance of being either DFC's or not.
I've noticed that currently when I ask for 1 pack to be generated there will sometimes be 4 non DFC commons of a single color in the pack, which is disallowed by Wizards' pseudorandom collating procedures. My understanding is that the non DFC commons of a pack will at default constitute 9 cards. However, of those 9 commons, there will be a maximum of two per color. For example, there may be WUBRG followed by artifact&UBR or WUlandRG & GWUB within a pack of 9common, 3 uncommon, 1 rare, 1 DFC(at common or uncommon), and 1 land. The rare or mythic DFC cards will occur in one out of eight packs and will displace a non DFC common. This occurs independently of the insertion of foil cards, which themselves displace a common non DFC card. This makes it possible to open three rares in one pack, as in the original Innistrad. Now packs with at least two rares where one of the rares is a DFC will contain two DFC cards: a rare and a common or uncommon.
I've noticed that currently when I ask for 1 pack to be generated there will sometimes be 4 non DFC commons of a single color in the pack, which is disallowed by Wizards' pseudorandom collating procedures. My understanding is that the non DFC commons of a pack will at default constitute 9 cards. However, of those 9 commons, there will be a maximum of two per color. For example, there may be WUBRG followed by artifact&UBR or WUlandRG & GWUB within a pack of 9common, 3 uncommon, 1 rare, 1 DFC(at common or uncommon), and 1 land. The rare or mythic DFC cards will occur in one out of eight packs and will displace a non DFC common. This occurs independently of the insertion of foil cards, which themselves displace a common non DFC card. This makes it possible to open three rares in one pack, as in the original Innistrad. Now packs with at least two rares where one of the rares is a DFC will contain two DFC cards: a rare and a common or uncommon.
I'm guessing foil DFCs are lumped in with non-DFC foils such that although the cards are printed on different sheets they are scrambled at some ratio. If so, a foil rare might be a DFC, making three DFC possible per pack in instances where a rare DFC is already in the pack and the foil is also a DFC. It would be odd and I think unlikely for a pack to contain two foils (a DFC and a non DFC) or for a rare foil DFC to displace a rare non-foil DFC.
Do we have any info on whether or not there should only be 1 DFC per pack? Right now I just have it generating randomnly.
Packs have the following structure:
Guaranteed:1 normal rare/mythic slot, 3 normal uncommon slots, 1 uncommon/common DFC slot, 7 normal common slots
1 slot that is either a normal common or a non-DFC foil (same as every other set)
1 slot that is either a normal common or a rare/mythic DFC (contains a DFC with probability 1/8)
Foil (un)common DFCs take the (un)common DFC slot. Foil higher rarity DFCs take the higher rarity DFC slot. All random events are independent, except that having a foil higher rarity DFC obviously requires having a higher rarity DFC in the first place.
Unfortunately the relative distributions of uncommon:common DFCs and rare:mythic DFCs has not yet been released. However, Innistrad has a rarity distribution of 1:2:6:11 for DFCs, and DKA had 1:2:6:12. Both corresponded extremely closely to the ratios for non-DFCs. Therefore it seems reasonable to model rare:mythic as 2:1 on an individual card basis, meaning 1/15 for any specific mythic DFC and 2/15 for any specific rare DFC (conditional on the pack having a higher rarity DFC). The modern uncommon:common ratio is 4.5:12 instead of 6:12, since they switched from 60 to 80 uncommons. Since SOI has 20 DFC uncommons and 4 DFC commons, the print sheet probably has 4 each for uncommons and 10 each for commons. Therefore I would say with high probability that the ratio between individual uncommon and common DFCs is 4:10, giving a probability of 4/120=1/30 for each individual uncommon DFC, and 10/120=1/12 for each individual common DFC.
Packs have the following structure:
Guaranteed:1 normal rare/mythic slot, 3 normal uncommon slots, 1 uncommon/common DFC slot, 7 normal common slots
1 slot that is either a normal common or a non-DFC foil (same as every other set)
1 slot that is either a normal common or a rare/mythic DFC (contains a DFC with probability 1/8)
Foil (un)common DFCs take the (un)common DFC slot. Foil higher rarity DFCs take the higher rarity DFC slot. All random events are independent, except that having a foil higher rarity DFC obviously requires having a higher rarity DFC in the first place.
Unfortunately the relative distributions of uncommon:common DFCs and rare:mythic DFCs has not yet been released. However, Innistrad has a rarity distribution of 1:2:6:11 for DFCs, and DKA had 1:2:6:12. Both corresponded extremely closely to the ratios for non-DFCs. Therefore it seems reasonable to model rare:mythic as 2:1 on an individual card basis, meaning 1/15 for any specific mythic DFC and 2/15 for any specific rare DFC (conditional on the pack having a higher rarity DFC). The modern uncommon:common ratio is 4.5:12 instead of 6:12, since they switched from 60 to 80 uncommons. Since SOI has 20 DFC uncommons and 4 DFC commons, the print sheet probably has 4 each for uncommons and 10 each for commons. Therefore I would say with high probability that the ratio between individual uncommon and common DFCs is 4:10, giving a probability of 4/120=1/30 for each individual uncommon DFC, and 10/120=1/12 for each individual common DFC.
where did you get this detailed information? This is great stuff if true, even if I have to read it a few times to comprehend it
Is there a way to flip the DFCs to read the other side, while building the deck? It's kind of annoying to have to flip back and forth between this and the spoiler.
I'm starting to get concerned over the limited for this set, if this generator is accurate. The rate I'm hitting big, threatening creatures, including evasive ones, that _need_ removal seems _much_ higher than the rate I'm hitting removal, even including weak removal that only gets rid of smaller, less threatening targets, and even the number of big blockers doesn't seem to make up for that. The pools seem to heavily favor whoever hits their rare and uncommon bomb(s) first, and be very painful for those that don't get as many bombs concentrated in appropriate colors, or have them too spread out across multiple colors to play multiple.
There also doesn't seem to be enough lockdown or exile type removal relative to the number of extremely recursive threats in the set. Such removal exists, but not at a rate that doesn't make it so that whomever draws one of the (often rare or mythic) highly recursive threats has an unreasonable advantage, with others having poor odds of having removal that can deal with such things.
The set seems to have done well in making it so that the set mechanics turn up regularly, including enablers for delerium and madness, although not as much for madness enablers, they still at least turn up so that you have better odds of playing a madness card in that mode in game that having appropriate removal for threats, from the look of the pools I've been generating.
Because of the rarities involved, and the issues with the pool of removal, it looks like one of the common all-stars of the set may be Watcher in the Web, which will save a lot of people lacking appropriate removal while facing either flying or normal bombs or flying or normal recursive threats.
I'd also warn that the rate of color fixing seems too low to rely on for most people, it's unlikely you'll get color fixing appropriate to the colors you'll be playing due to the rest of your pool.
In short, I don't like how swingy and luck-based these pools seem, rather than interactive. It feels like aggro decks and bombs will be big, but get blown out when someone _does_ have the rarely seen appropriate responses to such, because many of those responses are relatively strong and reliable compared to some more recent limited environments.
It looks like a wild and highly unpredictable environment that is far more luck based than an optimum limited environment should be, while still giving you the chance to play around with set mechanics. Too many ways to hugely blow out opponents, but not quite enough of those to be sure even half the players will even have such options in their pools, meaning games seem like they'll be more determined by what packs you get than what your deckbuilding or playing skills are.
You'll get to play around with fun new mechanics for sure, but there will be lots of 'feel bad' situations with many players getting blown out by things they can't handle with their pool, even if they drew perfectly. It feels like players will always have something interesting to do, but that those interesting things to do will often be the _wrong_ things to do unless you got really lucky opening packs.
Edit: Looking at the full spoiler again, it looks like I'm just getting really bad luck with the generator.
1:8 rare/mythic DFC means a given DFC rare appears one every 50 packs.
That is significantly more than other rares.
Is it?
There are 6 rares and 3 mythics, assuming the usual 2:1 R:M ratio, that's 15 RMs (2 copies of each rare and 1 of each mythic) per (15x8=) 120 packs. Or one of each specific rare per 60 packs.
For the regular rare slot, we've got the usual 53x2+15 or 2 copies of each specific rare per 121 packs.
Barring how foils figure into things, it looks virtually identical. Each rare DFC will be ever-so-marginally more frequent than each rare nonDFC, appearing 2 times per 120 (1.667%) packs rather than 2 times per 121 (1.653%).
Thatmarkguy's math is correct. If we assume that individual rares to individual Mystics is 2:1, and a higher rarity card appears in 1/8 packs, then each mythic is 1/120 and each rare is 2/120, compared to 1/121 and 2/121 for non DFCs. However, I'll note that the source for 1/8 says "approximately one in every eight" -- I suspect the real frequency is 15/121 packs have a higher rarity DFC, making mythics and rares available in the exact same supply whether they are DFC or not.
Assuming a 4:10 ratio, unique DFC uncommons appear once per 30 packs, as you say. That's compared to 1/26.67 for non DFC rares, which is pretty close. And DFC common would appear 1/12 packs, compared to 1/10.1 for non DFC commons.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I primarily play limited, so most of my spoiler season comments view cards through that lens.
As always, please feel free to make any suggestions for improvements. Also, if you notice any errors with spelling/rarity/color etc, please let me know. There are not yet enough commons spoiled for this to be terribly useful, but if you want to see a few SOI pools it can be fun.
Thank very much for your work.
Modern: UB Zombie hunt UB - WR Boros tokens WR - BGW Treefolk tribal BGW
Commander: UR Mizzix, a Storm of spells UR (Decklist)
Currently Playing
Modern
Mono Black Infect
:symu::symb::symr: Grixis Control :symu::symb::symr:
I got one mythic (Sorin, Grim Nemesis), and three rares (Angel of Deliverance, Bygone Bishop, Slayer's Plate). That's only four rare slots out of six.
I also got a foil rare (Cryptolith Rite), and two rare DFC cards (Elusive Tormentor, Geier Reach Bandit). The rare DFC cards should be part of the DFC slot, not the Rare/Mythic slot.
EDIT: Unless I'm miscounting, I only got 5 DFC cards also, there should be at least six.
I shouldn't complain, though, that's a hell of a pool.
It's possible I have a non-rare card marked rare. I will look into it. Thanks!
OK I see what the problem is.... I don't have a DFC slot specified. It just generates the pool based on card rarities. I will work on a solution.
I also only noted three DFCs in this pool, instead of at least six: http://www.magicdrafting.com/savedpools/22665.
Thanks for looking into it, I love the generator!
I made a cube. It's called 'babe cube' because all the cards have babes on them. http://www.cubetutor.com/draft/58369
I'm guessing foil DFCs are lumped in with non-DFC foils such that although the cards are printed on different sheets they are scrambled at some ratio. If so, a foil rare might be a DFC, making three DFC possible per pack in instances where a rare DFC is already in the pack and the foil is also a DFC. It would be odd and I think unlikely for a pack to contain two foils (a DFC and a non DFC) or for a rare foil DFC to displace a rare non-foil DFC.
I made a cube. It's called 'babe cube' because all the cards have babes on them. http://www.cubetutor.com/draft/58369
Packs have the following structure:
Guaranteed:1 normal rare/mythic slot, 3 normal uncommon slots, 1 uncommon/common DFC slot, 7 normal common slots
1 slot that is either a normal common or a non-DFC foil (same as every other set)
1 slot that is either a normal common or a rare/mythic DFC (contains a DFC with probability 1/8)
Foil (un)common DFCs take the (un)common DFC slot. Foil higher rarity DFCs take the higher rarity DFC slot. All random events are independent, except that having a foil higher rarity DFC obviously requires having a higher rarity DFC in the first place.
Unfortunately the relative distributions of uncommon:common DFCs and rare:mythic DFCs has not yet been released. However, Innistrad has a rarity distribution of 1:2:6:11 for DFCs, and DKA had 1:2:6:12. Both corresponded extremely closely to the ratios for non-DFCs. Therefore it seems reasonable to model rare:mythic as 2:1 on an individual card basis, meaning 1/15 for any specific mythic DFC and 2/15 for any specific rare DFC (conditional on the pack having a higher rarity DFC). The modern uncommon:common ratio is 4.5:12 instead of 6:12, since they switched from 60 to 80 uncommons. Since SOI has 20 DFC uncommons and 4 DFC commons, the print sheet probably has 4 each for uncommons and 10 each for commons. Therefore I would say with high probability that the ratio between individual uncommon and common DFCs is 4:10, giving a probability of 4/120=1/30 for each individual uncommon DFC, and 10/120=1/12 for each individual common DFC.
Interested in Custom Card Creation.
My Cube:Cardinal Custom Cube
A custom version of a third modern masters: MM2019
(filter->rarity to see in set rarity).
The Deep Ones
Cyborg Huey's Bosh, Iron Golem Deck
Cyborg Huey's Rosheen Meander Deck
BUGThe Dunwich Horror and Other Lovecraftian TalesBUG
There also doesn't seem to be enough lockdown or exile type removal relative to the number of extremely recursive threats in the set. Such removal exists, but not at a rate that doesn't make it so that whomever draws one of the (often rare or mythic) highly recursive threats has an unreasonable advantage, with others having poor odds of having removal that can deal with such things.
The set seems to have done well in making it so that the set mechanics turn up regularly, including enablers for delerium and madness, although not as much for madness enablers, they still at least turn up so that you have better odds of playing a madness card in that mode in game that having appropriate removal for threats, from the look of the pools I've been generating.
Because of the rarities involved, and the issues with the pool of removal, it looks like one of the common all-stars of the set may be Watcher in the Web, which will save a lot of people lacking appropriate removal while facing either flying or normal bombs or flying or normal recursive threats.
I'd also warn that the rate of color fixing seems too low to rely on for most people, it's unlikely you'll get color fixing appropriate to the colors you'll be playing due to the rest of your pool.
In short, I don't like how swingy and luck-based these pools seem, rather than interactive. It feels like aggro decks and bombs will be big, but get blown out when someone _does_ have the rarely seen appropriate responses to such, because many of those responses are relatively strong and reliable compared to some more recent limited environments.
It looks like a wild and highly unpredictable environment that is far more luck based than an optimum limited environment should be, while still giving you the chance to play around with set mechanics. Too many ways to hugely blow out opponents, but not quite enough of those to be sure even half the players will even have such options in their pools, meaning games seem like they'll be more determined by what packs you get than what your deckbuilding or playing skills are.
You'll get to play around with fun new mechanics for sure, but there will be lots of 'feel bad' situations with many players getting blown out by things they can't handle with their pool, even if they drew perfectly. It feels like players will always have something interesting to do, but that those interesting things to do will often be the _wrong_ things to do unless you got really lucky opening packs.
Edit: Looking at the full spoiler again, it looks like I'm just getting really bad luck with the generator.
Is it?
There are 6 rares and 3 mythics, assuming the usual 2:1 R:M ratio, that's 15 RMs (2 copies of each rare and 1 of each mythic) per (15x8=) 120 packs. Or one of each specific rare per 60 packs.
For the regular rare slot, we've got the usual 53x2+15 or 2 copies of each specific rare per 121 packs.
Barring how foils figure into things, it looks virtually identical. Each rare DFC will be ever-so-marginally more frequent than each rare nonDFC, appearing 2 times per 120 (1.667%) packs rather than 2 times per 121 (1.653%).
Assuming a 4:10 ratio, unique DFC uncommons appear once per 30 packs, as you say. That's compared to 1/26.67 for non DFC rares, which is pretty close. And DFC common would appear 1/12 packs, compared to 1/10.1 for non DFC commons.
Interested in Custom Card Creation.
My Cube:Cardinal Custom Cube
A custom version of a third modern masters: MM2019
(filter->rarity to see in set rarity).
RIP Batman guy. I hope somebody picks up the slack now that you are gone. Sick children need their Batman.