Linvala becomes a conditional Thragtusk ... I'm really not sold on this for standard beyond at best as a 1-2 of (maybe in SB) in a Wx midrange/control deck of some sort. For EDH though i'm a big fan and can't wait to hunt down a foil copy for my Captain Sisay deck.
I don't wanna mislead wizards, but if they are gonna do boring mythics across the board and make commons, uncommons and rares great I welcome this change. I don't want any freaking corporate magic company to overprice an item just because it's a mythic.
Report them in your surveys, and keep telling MaRo this is definitely ok!
Hrrrm, I feel like the playable mythics could fetch a very high price if the majority of them end up being really weak. If you've got an equal chance to pull this or a Kozilek's Return, and there's only one Return for every 10 Linvala's, the Return ends up eating all the value. That's basically what happened with Gideon last time (I know the Expeditions complicate this a lot, but still).
Well, life payment and creature sacrifice are likely to be themes by the time SOI rolls around. In a flicker deck using cards like Venser, the Sojourner or Roon of the Hidden Realm, Linvala might have some potential.
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MTGS Wikia Article about "New World Order"
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
PSA to everyone who keeps forgetting about the Reserved List:
You're on a website dedicated to talking about MtG. You're only a few keystrokes away from finding out what cards are on the Reserved List. You're also only a few keystrokes away from finding out why some cards on the Reserved List got foil printings in FtV, as Judge promos, or whatnot, as well as why that won't happen again. Stop doing this.
I think people vastly underestimate the magical 4 words: mythic Legendary Creature - Angel. With that art it does not really matter if it was a 5/5 for 6 with WWWWW,T: put a 0/1 flying peach pudding with haste, it'll STILL be well-received. Seriously! Wizards know just how popular of a tribe angels are, and they also know it has been too long since they printed a legendary one for us.
The intended target for this card is not the people who are concerned with "playability", it is those like me who say "I will find a way to make it work, doesn't matter if it's tier 3.5 -- that staff is bashing someone over the head till dead". And you know what, she's not even THAT unreasonable. 5 life is close to what you need to survive an extra turn, body is reasonable, extra body is gravy. 8 flying power isn't something people can easily ignore.
If you are going to complain about mythics, do so about the other ones. Just accept that most sets will have at least one angel and dragon at most likely higher rarity. You may not like it from a tournament perspective, but the target audience for those cards is simply not you. *insert deal_with_it.gif here*
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G Azusa, Lost but Seeking G UG Tishana, Voice of Thunder GU UBW Sen Triplets WBU WUBGAtraxa, Praetors' Voice GBUW WUBRGJodah, Archmage Eternal GRBUW GWR Mayael the Anima RWG RWB Edgar Markov BWR WG Gaddok Teeg GW W Oketra the True W
--- My Decklist Folder
The card has all of the value, and as far as the "control doesn't want to tap out for a 6drop without hexproof" thing I'm really not sure why you think a control deck would care to drop it that soon anyway. I'm fine waiting for 8 and holding up mana to interact.
All that bothers me is that the token is a 3/3. I understand a 4/4 token would be too good, it's just awkward when all the other angel tokens I've seen have been at 4
I don't wanna mislead wizards, but if they are gonna do boring mythics across the board and make commons, uncommons and rares great I welcome this change. I don't want any freaking corporate magic company to overprice an item just because it's a mythic.
Report them in your surveys, and keep telling MaRo this is definitely ok!
Definitely agree but the problem is Wizards has created a situation where certain cards (namely Planeswalkers and big important story characters like Eldrazi titans) will ALWAYS be mythic rare. I'd love for all Mythic rares to be junk or casual fodder while the playable stuff is at lower rarity, but if that's the case you're always going to have the majority of sets having one or two really good, just have mythics that end up being $40. Would be better if they just got rid of the mythic rarity but I know that's not going to happen.
W has the most beautiful arts on Cards & this one Showcases it proudly.
The Card is just fair. If youre behind, for 6 Mana you get a 5/5 Flyer, a 3/3 Flyer & 5 Life. That is A LOT for that Price, but even then, it might not safe you necceseraiy. If you dont Need her neccesarily, a 5/5 Flyer is still a Finisher. Good Card. nothing Special for a Mythic unfortunately.
Why doesn't she use normal angel token btw? This is the first time an white angel token is 3/3 and not 4/4 I think.
Edit: There's Haunted Angel but those are black.
I thought Angels were pretty much a solid 4/4 as a throwback to Serra Angel. I can understand Haunted Angel token being smaller in size since it came from the shadow of the former angel. But why is Linvala's weaker? I guess to show superiority? Pretty much Iona and Linvala are the only angels with halos blinding their eyes (well I think Deathless Angel lost her halo).
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To the people that say that a card needs to be a higher rarity because of Limited... I hate you guys so much. I present to you with this.
The art is hot garbage. Her legs are twice as long as her torso and her spine is bent in a 45 degree angle, not to mention the awful color blurring thing going on. Fire this terrible artist.
Her ability is very cool and she is certainly aptly named. However, I see many games where this card literally reads: 5/5 Flyer for 4WW (and neither trigger). Thragtusk never read that way anytime you play it.
It seems like a phenomenal stabilizer when you top-deck it so I can't call it a terrible card, either.
This art is certainly not one of my favorites though.
Her ability is very cool and she is certainly aptly named. However, I see many games where this card literally reads: 5/5 Flyer for 4WW (and neither trigger). Thragtusk never read that way anytime you play it.
It seems like a phenomenal stabilizer when you top-deck it so I can't call it a terrible card, either.
This art is certainly not one of my favorites though.
That's my problem with it. It's legendary, mythic, it's casting cost is higher and requires more colored mana.
Thragtusk didn't care what your life total or board state looked like when it entered/left the battlefield. This is a decidedly worse card.
And the people saying stuff along the lines of there being other cards that can make this playable.....yeah yeah, and gray ogre is playable if it's enchanted with eldrazi conscription
That's my problem with it. It's legendary, mythic, it's casting cost is higher and requires more colored mana.
Thragtusk didn't care what your life total or board state looked like when it entered/left the battlefield. This is a decidedly worse card.
And the people saying stuff along the lines of there being other cards that can make this playable.....yeah yeah, and gray ogre is playable if it's enchanted with eldrazi conscription
You're not understanding this. You have two points, that are both either misguided or wrong. First Thragtusk was unquestionably the best card in Standard for a year. The fact that this card isn't as good as Thragtusk (which it is not) doesn't really mean anything, since there's a huge gap between Thragtusk, and cards that are good in standard. The fact that this card is not as good as Thragtusk does not mean this card is not good. Your comparison doesn't really hold any water because it is meaningless.
Also are no cards that are needed to make this card good, its just not universally good in every white deck. You need to be playing a certain kind of deck (read: not an aggressive deck) against another certain kind of deck (read: not a slower control deck) in order for her to be good. That's it. If its not good in these match ups that means you're winning. You don't have to play any cards to make it good, only it only works in specific strategies (like almost every other magic card). What you're saying is basically "Linvala sucks because you need to be playing the kind of decks its good in for it to be good."
WB seems good for her since B runs some Life costing cards and mentioned before a good reanimation target for stabilization. I would like to try a Spell Mastery Necromantic Summons on her.
Linvala, the Preserver4WW Legendary Creature - Angel (M)
Flying
When ~ enters the battlefield, if an opponent has more life than you, you gain 5 life.
When ~ enters the battlefield, if an opponent controls more creatures than you, put a 3/3 white Angel creature token with flying onto the battlefield.
5/5
So basically, a junk mythic that might go for $3? It's the mythic you don't want to open.
this isn't a junk mythic as far as standard is concerned. wingmate roc filled an important role as "midrange value finisher" and this probably will too. standard players will begrudgingly play it
So basically, a junk mythic that might go for $3? It's the mythic you don't want to open.
If *this* is the "junk mythic", then this is a good set. lol.
I didn't say "the", I said "a", as in multiple mythics are "meh", OGW is shaping up to be very lackluster. Just watch them spin the poor sales on the evil leakers.
That's my problem with it. It's legendary, mythic, it's casting cost is higher and requires more colored mana.
Thragtusk didn't care what your life total or board state looked like when it entered/left the battlefield. This is a decidedly worse card.
And the people saying stuff along the lines of there being other cards that can make this playable.....yeah yeah, and gray ogre is playable if it's enchanted with eldrazi conscription
You're not understanding this. You have two points, that are both either misguided or wrong. First Thragtusk was unquestionably the best card in Standard for a year. The fact that this card isn't as good as Thragtusk (which it is not) doesn't really mean anything, since there's a huge gap between Thragtusk, and cards that are good in standard. The fact that this card is not as good as Thragtusk does not mean this card is not good. Your comparison doesn't really hold any water because it is meaningless.
Also are no cards that are needed to make this card good, its just not universally good in every white deck. You need to be playing a certain kind of deck (read: not an aggressive deck) against another certain kind of deck (read: not a slower control deck) in order for her to be good. That's it. If its not good in these match ups that means you're winning. You don't have to play any cards to make it good, only it only works in specific strategies (like almost every other magic card). What you're saying is basically "Linvala sucks because you need to be playing the kind of decks its good in for it to be good."
Why would a deck want to play this over Dragonlord Dromoka? She has an inferior body and the token clause will be a rare trigger, which makes a 3/3....in a standard where a 3/3 is pretty insignificant. If Dromoka connnects ONCE she's already on par with the lifegain trigger of Linvala IF she manages to even get it.
6cc is too slow against atarka red, and her 5 toughness means she dies in combat to a lot of the fliers in standard right now. If you're speculating about a post rotation standard...how is she going to compete with Sire of Stagnation and such?
That's my problem with it. It's legendary, mythic, it's casting cost is higher and requires more colored mana.
Thragtusk didn't care what your life total or board state looked like when it entered/left the battlefield. This is a decidedly worse card.
And the people saying stuff along the lines of there being other cards that can make this playable.....yeah yeah, and gray ogre is playable if it's enchanted with eldrazi conscription
You're not understanding this. You have two points, that are both either misguided or wrong. First Thragtusk was unquestionably the best card in Standard for a year. The fact that this card isn't as good as Thragtusk (which it is not) doesn't really mean anything, since there's a huge gap between Thragtusk, and cards that are good in standard. The fact that this card is not as good as Thragtusk does not mean this card is not good. Your comparison doesn't really hold any water because it is meaningless.
Also are no cards that are needed to make this card good, its just not universally good in every white deck. You need to be playing a certain kind of deck (read: not an aggressive deck) against another certain kind of deck (read: not a slower control deck) in order for her to be good. That's it. If its not good in these match ups that means you're winning. You don't have to play any cards to make it good, only it only works in specific strategies (like almost every other magic card). What you're saying is basically "Linvala sucks because you need to be playing the kind of decks its good in for it to be good."
Why would a deck want to play this over Dragonlord Dromoka? She has an inferior body and the token clause will be a rare trigger, which makes a 3/3....in a standard where a 3/3 is pretty insignificant. If Dromoka connnects ONCE she's already on par with the lifegain trigger of Linvala IF she manages to even get it.
6cc is too slow against atarka red, and her 5 toughness means she dies in combat to a lot of the fliers in standard right now. If you're speculating about a post rotation standard...how is she going to compete with Sire of Stagnation and such?
Why play siege rhino if you can play woodland wondered, if it connects it does more damage. The answer is, because it doesn't need to connect to do anything.
That's my problem with it. It's legendary, mythic, it's casting cost is higher and requires more colored mana.
Thragtusk didn't care what your life total or board state looked like when it entered/left the battlefield. This is a decidedly worse card.
And the people saying stuff along the lines of there being other cards that can make this playable.....yeah yeah, and gray ogre is playable if it's enchanted with eldrazi conscription
You're not understanding this. You have two points, that are both either misguided or wrong. First Thragtusk was unquestionably the best card in Standard for a year. The fact that this card isn't as good as Thragtusk (which it is not) doesn't really mean anything, since there's a huge gap between Thragtusk, and cards that are good in standard. The fact that this card is not as good as Thragtusk does not mean this card is not good. Your comparison doesn't really hold any water because it is meaningless.
Also are no cards that are needed to make this card good, its just not universally good in every white deck. You need to be playing a certain kind of deck (read: not an aggressive deck) against another certain kind of deck (read: not a slower control deck) in order for her to be good. That's it. If its not good in these match ups that means you're winning. You don't have to play any cards to make it good, only it only works in specific strategies (like almost every other magic card). What you're saying is basically "Linvala sucks because you need to be playing the kind of decks its good in for it to be good."
Why would a deck want to play this over Dragonlord Dromoka? She has an inferior body and the token clause will be a rare trigger, which makes a 3/3....in a standard where a 3/3 is pretty insignificant. If Dromoka connects ONCE she's already on par with the lifegain trigger of Linvala IF she manages to even get it.
6cc is too slow against atarka red, and her 5 toughness means she dies in combat to a lot of the fliers in standard right now. If you're speculating about a post rotation standard...how is she going to compete with Sire of Stagnation and such?
3/3 is not insignificant, nor is it difficult to trigger, since all Linvala asks you to do is have your opponent play a normal game of magic (meaning they play creatures and attack), and be losing slightly. And if your game plan is to get to your 6 drop, you probably are losing slightly until you drop your six drop.
Connecting with Dromoka is much harder in today's standard than having less, (since you have to survive a whole turn cycle with your opponent not having any removal spell) creatures than your opponent, or having less life than your opponent. You can engineer that easily, and if you can't you're already winning. Linvala doesn't get 1 for 1ed by removal. (Like Dromoka, like Silumgar, like Sire of Stagnation.) And she definitely does not die in combat to a lot of files, she trades ("Trades" because you're still left with a 3/3, so you win the trade) or eats every relevant flyer, besides Dromoka and Atarka, so that's just false.
She doesn't even really play the same role as Sire of Stagnation anyways. Sire dies to removal and is much worse at stabilizing the board. Getting advantage from that card is 100% based on your opponent letting you. (You control whether or not Linvala gets you advantage, since she punishes them for literally trying to play the fundamentals of the game). In exchange, Sire gives you raw card advantage, if your opponent lets you and it survives. Regardless, Sire isn't as good as Linvala anyways, and I would play it over Sire every day.
Yes, this card is too slow against hyper aggressive Atarka Red strategies, but its great against anything slower than that and faster than Esper Dragons. And in reality it kind of isn't, since a 5/5 flyer and 5 life (ignoring the 3/3) will probably win the game provided you're a little bit stabilized beforehand. Its not excellent, but its certainly not dead weight.
Gcsmith's comparison is correct. The reason that Woodland Wanderer is a bad card and Siege Rhino has won multiple Pro Tours, is that Woodland Wanderer just dies to Doom Blade. Siege Rhino (and Linvala) do not.
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Hrrrm, I feel like the playable mythics could fetch a very high price if the majority of them end up being really weak. If you've got an equal chance to pull this or a Kozilek's Return, and there's only one Return for every 10 Linvala's, the Return ends up eating all the value. That's basically what happened with Gideon last time (I know the Expeditions complicate this a lot, but still).
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
The intended target for this card is not the people who are concerned with "playability", it is those like me who say "I will find a way to make it work, doesn't matter if it's tier 3.5 -- that staff is bashing someone over the head till dead". And you know what, she's not even THAT unreasonable. 5 life is close to what you need to survive an extra turn, body is reasonable, extra body is gravy. 8 flying power isn't something people can easily ignore.
If you are going to complain about mythics, do so about the other ones. Just accept that most sets will have at least one angel and dragon at most likely higher rarity. You may not like it from a tournament perspective, but the target audience for those cards is simply not you. *insert deal_with_it.gif here*
UG Tishana, Voice of Thunder GU
UBW Sen Triplets WBU
WUBGAtraxa, Praetors' Voice GBUW
WUBRGJodah, Archmage Eternal GRBUW
GWR Mayael the Anima RWG
RWB Edgar Markov BWR
WG Gaddok Teeg GW
W Oketra the True W
---
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All that bothers me is that the token is a 3/3. I understand a 4/4 token would be too good, it's just awkward when all the other angel tokens I've seen have been at 4
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Definitely agree but the problem is Wizards has created a situation where certain cards (namely Planeswalkers and big important story characters like Eldrazi titans) will ALWAYS be mythic rare. I'd love for all Mythic rares to be junk or casual fodder while the playable stuff is at lower rarity, but if that's the case you're always going to have the majority of sets having one or two really good, just have mythics that end up being $40. Would be better if they just got rid of the mythic rarity but I know that's not going to happen.
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she'll see play in standard, and tons of play in everyone's 400 card angel deck. and thats about it.
The Card is just fair. If youre behind, for 6 Mana you get a 5/5 Flyer, a 3/3 Flyer & 5 Life. That is A LOT for that Price, but even then, it might not safe you necceseraiy. If you dont Need her neccesarily, a 5/5 Flyer is still a Finisher. Good Card. nothing Special for a Mythic unfortunately.
It is kinda annoying that they keep changing that. Dragon tokens are either 4/4's Sarkhan the Mad, 2/2's Dragon Egg, 5/5's Dragon Roost or .Utvara Hellkite 6/6's.
I thought Angels were pretty much a solid 4/4 as a throwback to Serra Angel. I can understand Haunted Angel token being smaller in size since it came from the shadow of the former angel. But why is Linvala's weaker? I guess to show superiority? Pretty much Iona and Linvala are the only angels with halos blinding their eyes (well I think Deathless Angel lost her halo).
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SY8h2vp5Xis
It seems like a phenomenal stabilizer when you top-deck it so I can't call it a terrible card, either.
This art is certainly not one of my favorites though.
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That's my problem with it. It's legendary, mythic, it's casting cost is higher and requires more colored mana.
Thragtusk didn't care what your life total or board state looked like when it entered/left the battlefield. This is a decidedly worse card.
And the people saying stuff along the lines of there being other cards that can make this playable.....yeah yeah, and gray ogre is playable if it's enchanted with eldrazi conscription
You're not understanding this. You have two points, that are both either misguided or wrong. First Thragtusk was unquestionably the best card in Standard for a year. The fact that this card isn't as good as Thragtusk (which it is not) doesn't really mean anything, since there's a huge gap between Thragtusk, and cards that are good in standard. The fact that this card is not as good as Thragtusk does not mean this card is not good. Your comparison doesn't really hold any water because it is meaningless.
Also are no cards that are needed to make this card good, its just not universally good in every white deck. You need to be playing a certain kind of deck (read: not an aggressive deck) against another certain kind of deck (read: not a slower control deck) in order for her to be good. That's it. If its not good in these match ups that means you're winning. You don't have to play any cards to make it good, only it only works in specific strategies (like almost every other magic card). What you're saying is basically "Linvala sucks because you need to be playing the kind of decks its good in for it to be good."
So basically, a junk mythic that might go for $3? It's the mythic you don't want to open.
My current trade binder.
"People most likely to cry "troll" are those who can't fathom holding a position for reasons unrelated to how they want to be perceived"
If *this* is the "junk mythic", then this is a good set. lol.
I didn't say "the", I said "a", as in multiple mythics are "meh", OGW is shaping up to be very lackluster. Just watch them spin the poor sales on the evil leakers.
My current trade binder.
"People most likely to cry "troll" are those who can't fathom holding a position for reasons unrelated to how they want to be perceived"
Why would a deck want to play this over Dragonlord Dromoka? She has an inferior body and the token clause will be a rare trigger, which makes a 3/3....in a standard where a 3/3 is pretty insignificant. If Dromoka connnects ONCE she's already on par with the lifegain trigger of Linvala IF she manages to even get it.
6cc is too slow against atarka red, and her 5 toughness means she dies in combat to a lot of the fliers in standard right now. If you're speculating about a post rotation standard...how is she going to compete with Sire of Stagnation and such?
Why play siege rhino if you can play woodland wondered, if it connects it does more damage. The answer is, because it doesn't need to connect to do anything.
3/3 is not insignificant, nor is it difficult to trigger, since all Linvala asks you to do is have your opponent play a normal game of magic (meaning they play creatures and attack), and be losing slightly. And if your game plan is to get to your 6 drop, you probably are losing slightly until you drop your six drop.
Connecting with Dromoka is much harder in today's standard than having less, (since you have to survive a whole turn cycle with your opponent not having any removal spell) creatures than your opponent, or having less life than your opponent. You can engineer that easily, and if you can't you're already winning. Linvala doesn't get 1 for 1ed by removal. (Like Dromoka, like Silumgar, like Sire of Stagnation.) And she definitely does not die in combat to a lot of files, she trades ("Trades" because you're still left with a 3/3, so you win the trade) or eats every relevant flyer, besides Dromoka and Atarka, so that's just false.
She doesn't even really play the same role as Sire of Stagnation anyways. Sire dies to removal and is much worse at stabilizing the board. Getting advantage from that card is 100% based on your opponent letting you. (You control whether or not Linvala gets you advantage, since she punishes them for literally trying to play the fundamentals of the game). In exchange, Sire gives you raw card advantage, if your opponent lets you and it survives. Regardless, Sire isn't as good as Linvala anyways, and I would play it over Sire every day.
Yes, this card is too slow against hyper aggressive Atarka Red strategies, but its great against anything slower than that and faster than Esper Dragons. And in reality it kind of isn't, since a 5/5 flyer and 5 life (ignoring the 3/3) will probably win the game provided you're a little bit stabilized beforehand. Its not excellent, but its certainly not dead weight.
Gcsmith's comparison is correct. The reason that Woodland Wanderer is a bad card and Siege Rhino has won multiple Pro Tours, is that Woodland Wanderer just dies to Doom Blade. Siege Rhino (and Linvala) do not.