I have a feeling that DFCs were foreshadowed in Maro's article from last week. even though Laurel wasn't the codename for this block, i had a hunch the DFC comment actually meant something. really excited to see what they come u pwith this time
Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
Melek, Izzet Paragon
Oona, Queen of the Fae
Bruna, Light of Alabaster
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Rhys the Redeemed
Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Sen Triplets
The Mimeoplasm WUBRGSliver OverlordGRBUW WUBRGSliver Hivelord(Superfriends)GRBUW
The youtube trailer reminded me of bloodborne, so I really hope so. It would be interesting to see an eldrazi manifesting itself in a more subtle and horror-like way.
Called it called it calling it called it calling it calling it calling it called it
Oh god please shut up. Except for hhooven4, because that was funny.
As for the set, I just kind of...don't care anymore. You guys have fun. I've been focusing more on old-frame-only decks. Magic: the Gathering isn't made for guys like me anymore. Call me when we have a return to Time Spiral style development.
So here's a thought spurred forth by mentions of reprinting Delver: these sets are, more or less, temporally sequential. So it wouldn't make a whole lot of sense to reprint the front side of delver. and since that character, despite not being legendary, seemed to be intended to be unique, what if the printed a single sides legendary to represent Insectile Abberation?
As for all the *****ing: Stop being so ridiculous. You want things that aren't going to happen because you sit there and compare one set to another based on absurdly powerful cards. Not every block should have a JtMS or Snapcaster level card in it. People talk down on Theros but it was the hinge on which the crazy high power format that was INN-RTR turned into the awful RTR-THS devotion format which then changed with the high power RTR being pushed out and THS-KTK was one of the best standards we've had in a good while. All sets are designed for draft and standard. They are NOT designed for modern or legacy. If you want modern level cards every set you're out of luck and that's a good thing. BFZ was fine. Admittedly it's not my favorite and there were things I think could have been better but it was fine overall. Disliking its is more than anything I've seen a result of absurd expectations. If you think the set is parasitic you don't know what the term means. Sure, there are no snapcasters or Seige Rhinos but like I said, not every set canhave that it the power creep spirals out of control and you end up with Pokemon.
I find all the complaining weird, honestly, as new decks are still popping up utilizing BFZ cards. Even the pro tour had a lot of interesting decks utilizing new cards, it's just that the ones that made it out on top basically just used the lands and gideon. I think part of that is that the beginning of a new meta is usually where the more aggressive decks shine, and BFZ did not lend itself well to aggressive decks, with really only a couple of the landfall cards being aggressive at all. Now that people have worked around the aggression, other decks like ramp are starting to do a little better. Even modern got a couple of interesting cards, with the Reliquary Retreat combo deck being the most interesting thing to come out of it.
On top of that, BFZ has been an absolute blast to draft. Most fun I've had drafting since Innistrad. I think the biggest complaints are coming from people who were expecting Zendikar 2.0 with hyper aggressive landfall stuff and Adventure World theme, when what we got is closer to Rise of the Eldrazi 2.0 (which makes sense to me, really, as the story left off with ROE not ZEN).
Agreed on all counts.
People who care about the game know that BFZ is fine because they draft and look at more than just the top 8 of the PT. It isn't the greatest set for value this is true but not every set can be a homerun on that count.
I'd wager a strong plurality of posters on this subforum are netdeckers-only so I enjoy seeing them rage. People who only netdeck are far worse for the game than collectors or the reserve list, we should all revel in their misfortune.
I care about the game, and I don't find BFZ fine. The drafting is about average, but I find the deck themes too be a little too restrictive. Very few of the Eldrazi are limited decent on their own and require a large amount of other Eldrazi to function properly; allowing for some crippling hate drafting. As for value, my LGS's drafting has slowly been shrinking more and more and I myself am no longer going to draft. The card value in the set is so abysmal you rarely even break even on the draft with the prize support included.
As for standard and other formats, the value is lacking, even Commander didn't get many decent cards. Overall Wizards KNEW the set wasn't going to sell on its own cards and threw in the Expeditions to move boxes. So given all of that, yes I am worried about Innistrad and any sensible person who wants some value for their money is going to be concerned as well.
Look at recent sets:
RtR was okay, not as great as the original, but not as terrible as the follow-up set
Theros was bad, boring and weak
KoT was above average
BfZ is bad, weak and boring again
Not the best recent track record, so I can see people being worried(as I am). Just passing us off as net-decking whiners is stupid. I guarantee you if sets lost enough value and people stopped playing standard, the whole game would be affected. With no one to sell/trade their cards too, drafters would stop paying to draft 1-2 times a week.The cards would be worthless and paying $15 for something you throw in the trash after a few hours, doesn't sound like something I want to spend money on.
So go ahead and keep buying whatever Wizards puts out, if you have that much disposible income then fine, but as for me I want to make a decent investment and won't spend money on sets that continue along the lines of BfZ.
Magic is a game not the stock market. If you want to play stock market then go ahead and invest in actual stocks, complaining that Magic isn't a stock market is silly: I pay 15$ to have fun and a shot at making my money back through opening value in my draft packs or winning packs which I can trade-in for more drafts.
It's beyond ridiculous that people ***** and moan about card prices but as soon as a set has value more evenly spread out (my buddy opened a box and got 190$ value without an expedition or a Gideon) people **** and moan about the lack of value which is exactly what needs to happen for deck prices to be reasonable and a meta to be diverse.
The very same "netdeckers" are a major part of the reason you have a chance at "opening value" in your draft packs to begin with. If the only way Magic could be played was Limited, which you seem to be OK with given your disdain for the opinions of people who don't draft, the cards would be valueless once the pack was opened. Without Constructed players to shaft, who would the #mtgfinance speculators sell to? Collectors alone couldn't possibly drive prices of anything outside of the Reserved List, not at present-day print run sizes.
There are plenty of people who might not draft but are stakeholders of the game...collectors, speculators, casuals of all stripes, Constructed players, and yes, netdeckers. Heck, Wizards even markets to some of them directly! I think there are plenty of issues with BFZ design beyond just power level or value, like parasitism and lack of originality. Just because those issues might not affect draft, doesn't make them any less valid. And I think it's perfectly reasonable that people who have those issues with BFZ would be afraid of more of the same for Shadows over Innistrad; I certainly am.
Netdecking is part of the game, nothing wrong with it at a conceptual level. If you take the time to read my posts you'll see that I made a specification "people who only netdeck" because those people are the ones who complain about pulling a 4 dollar rare (of which there are plenty in this set) because what they want are the cards that made the PT top 8.
As far as complaining about lack of originality that is complete hogwash: please point out to me the last set that had an exile zone matters theme (suspend doesn't count), go right ahead. That ingest is parasitic (and to a lesser degree Devoid but it's not really a mechanic) is unfortunately a side effect of the fact that no set has ever cared about the exile zone so while the idea that the set has parasitic mechanics is certainly valid that you could leverage it as criticism in the same sentence as complaining about lack of originality (which is complete bogus) means you don't understand what you are talking about.
Hell the set barely has any +1/+1 counters and that was the flavour of month from the "herpasherpa I complain about stuff I don't have a grasp on" crowd.
In your opinion. I've found this standard much more fun to play than THS-KTK.
It's a pretty popular opinion. Most of the pros as well as many of the usual negative people on here enjoyed how wide open it was.
Also: no, really, nothing in this set is parasitic. The term means that the mechanic relies on something that is exclusive or almost exclusive to the block. Splice into Arcane is parasitic because the only arcane spells were in Kamigawa block. None of the mechanics in BFZ rely on something else within the set. Devoid and ingest literally can't be parasitic because they don't actually rely on anything else. Besides there are plenty of cards outside of BFZ that care about colorless-news. Converge and Awaken are just about mana. And the processor mechanic can literally get anything; delved cards, guys hit by oring or path, Tormod's crypt, Rest in Peace, Bojuka Bog the list goes on. Literally nothing about this set is parasitic. It would be like calling Prowess a parasitic mechanic.
I've never heard of a set people wanted to revisit more than Innistrad, and then when it comes, wow, so much complaining.
It's an effect of Battle for Zendikar. We love Innistrad, but our faith in WotC has been shaken by the current terrible "return to..." set. People don't want to see something they love get screwed up.
It's an effect of Battle for Zendikar. We love Innistrad, but our faith in WotC has been shaken by the current terrible "return to..." set. People don't want to see something they love get screwed up.
Thing about that is they're not screwing it up. It's not as if making a bad return set makes the original worse somehow. BFZ has no bearing on Zendikar block. There is really no reason for the complaining. We know the name of the set. That's it. You people are just ridiculous.
Anyway, big....Eldrazi-y shadows over innistrad? (Plz no)
And what's the connection to Innistrad that Nahiri has that many seem to be on to?
Last we saw her she had left Zendikar to look for Sorin. The logical place to look would be Innistrad. Thing is that was a long, long time ago and that should be the first place one should have looked.
This is a return to Gothic Horror world. Not a reprint set for modern staples. It's disappointing to me that people's expectations for this new set would be reprints of things from the past rather than anticipating future designs or flavor home runs that originally made Innistrad as popular as it was. And prompted this return to it. As if cards like LOTV and Snapcaster would even exist if every set's selling point was reprints?
And Theros, bad? Seriously? I'm over this Yugioh attitude some people here have.
Yes, Theros was weak, parasitic, boring and underdeveloped. Only the most versatile or extra-block synergistic cards saw play, the rest was all Thoughtseize, Elspetha and RTR/KTK.
And there is no reason to get exited for anything other than good reprints and OP mythics because BFZ is utter crap. Weak, parasitic, boring and underdeveloped with an extra *****ty aftertaste of getting rid of all the adventure and exploration flavor from the original Zendikar.
What do I expect from SOI? Removal and counterspells to get worse, dumb green creatures to get better, interactions to be halfassed, zero gothic horror because that's getting overwhelmed by the meme-est memes of "lovecraftian" tropes, and returning mechanics to be ruined with overcosting because they now add a +1/+1 counter to a creature when you cast the card.
If you actually liked Innistrad you shoulnd't be exited at all about this because not even Voorthos is as blind to say Homelands, Mercadian and Kamigawa wouldn't have been better if the cards were actually playable and it wasn't just a bunch of nicely drawn pieces of notthing.
Power-down Magic sucks.
Devoid ands ingest are more bland and udnerpowered then anything.Wizards din't explroed the cocnept enough to make it interesting.
Devoid has no benefit what so ever, its actually pointless and is sued more as a restriction like requiring a colorless card so another card doesn't suck.Devoid would be mutch better if there were more cards that interacted with colors more like protection or specific hate agaisnt colors.
Ingest is practically a limited mechanic because exiling only one card per attack that need to hit the oponent is really udnerpowered.I know their point if to fuel the processors but the eldrazi processors are the worst thing in BFZ.
Wizards were afraid to an extend of interaction to exield cards that they probably enrfed the cards so it was better this interaction never existed because we got weak effects with litle payoff and we brought back a card for the oponent to use again.I hate the processors not just mechanically but flavor aswelll, they are lame IMO they don't give the feel of BIG BAD ELDRAZI that what eldrazis are mean't to be or just drones that helped fuel the big eldrazis with Scions.Yes alot of them create eldrazi scions but i rather have the oens that don't need to jump alot of hoops jsut to make a scion.The processors aren't Big like the eldrazis or swarm like the drones and scions they are just midle ground with weird abilities that aren't that memorable or good.I really hate them.
People who care about the game know that BFZ is fine because they draft and look at more than just the top 8 of the PT. It isn't the greatest set for value this is true but not every set can be a homerun on that count.
I'd wager a strong plurality of posters on this subforum are netdeckers-only so I enjoy seeing them rage. People who only netdeck are far worse for the game than collectors or the reserve list, we should all revel in their misfortune.
I care about the game, and I don't find BFZ fine. The drafting is about average, but I find the deck themes too be a little too restrictive. Very few of the Eldrazi are limited decent on their own and require a large amount of other Eldrazi to function properly; allowing for some crippling hate drafting. As for value, my LGS's drafting has slowly been shrinking more and more and I myself am no longer going to draft. The card value in the set is so abysmal you rarely even break even on the draft with the prize support included.
As for standard and other formats, the value is lacking, even Commander didn't get many decent cards. Overall Wizards KNEW the set wasn't going to sell on its own cards and threw in the Expeditions to move boxes. So given all of that, yes I am worried about Innistrad and any sensible person who wants some value for their money is going to be concerned as well.
Look at recent sets:
RtR was okay, not as great as the original, but not as terrible as the follow-up set
Theros was bad, boring and weak
KoT was above average
BfZ is bad, weak and boring again
Not the best recent track record, so I can see people being worried(as I am). Just passing us off as net-decking whiners is stupid. I guarantee you if sets lost enough value and people stopped playing standard, the whole game would be affected. With no one to sell/trade their cards too, drafters would stop paying to draft 1-2 times a week.The cards would be worthless and paying $15 for something you throw in the trash after a few hours, doesn't sound like something I want to spend money on.
So go ahead and keep buying whatever Wizards puts out, if you have that much disposible income then fine, but as for me I want to make a decent investment and won't spend money on sets that continue along the lines of BfZ.
Magic is a game not the stock market. If you want to play stock market then go ahead and invest in actual stocks, complaining that Magic isn't a stock market is silly: I pay 15$ to have fun and a shot at making my money back through opening value in my draft packs or winning packs which I can trade-in for more drafts.
It's beyond ridiculous that people ***** and moan about card prices but as soon as a set has value more evenly spread out (my buddy opened a box and got 190$ value without an expedition or a Gideon) people **** and moan about the lack of value which is exactly what needs to happen for deck prices to be reasonable and a meta to be diverse.
The very same "netdeckers" are a major part of the reason you have a chance at "opening value" in your draft packs to begin with. If the only way Magic could be played was Limited, which you seem to be OK with given your disdain for the opinions of people who don't draft, the cards would be valueless once the pack was opened. Without Constructed players to shaft, who would the #mtgfinance speculators sell to? Collectors alone couldn't possibly drive prices of anything outside of the Reserved List, not at present-day print run sizes.
There are plenty of people who might not draft but are stakeholders of the game...collectors, speculators, casuals of all stripes, Constructed players, and yes, netdeckers. Heck, Wizards even markets to some of them directly! I think there are plenty of issues with BFZ design beyond just power level or value, like parasitism and lack of originality. Just because those issues might not affect draft, doesn't make them any less valid. And I think it's perfectly reasonable that people who have those issues with BFZ would be afraid of more of the same for Shadows over Innistrad; I certainly am.
Netdecking is part of the game, nothing wrong with it at a conceptual level. If you take the time to read my posts you'll see that I made a specification "people who only netdeck" because those people are the ones who complain about pulling a 4 dollar rare (of which there are plenty in this set) because what they want are the cards that made the PT top 8.
As far as complaining about lack of originality that is complete hogwash: please point out to me the last set that had an exile zone matters theme (suspend doesn't count), go right ahead. That ingest is parasitic (and to a lesser degree Devoid but it's not really a mechanic) is unfortunately a side effect of the fact that no set has ever cared about the exile zone so while the idea that the set has parasitic mechanics is certainly valid that you could leverage it as criticism in the same sentence as complaining about lack of originality (which is complete bogus) means you don't understand what you are talking about.
Hell the set barely has any +1/+1 counters and that was the flavour of month from the "herpasherpa I complain about stuff I don't have a grasp on" crowd.
For some reason you always make things ad hominem instead of just addressing the arguments themselves; it's not enough for you that yours is the correct opinion (itself an invalid concept), but those who disagree with you are not only wrong but also incapable of intelligent thought.
Please explain why Suspend doesn't count as an "exile zone matters" mechanic, because in terms of putting cards in the exile zone where they generally can't be interacted with until they do something that benefits you, it seems to have quite a few parallels with Ingest, and Ingest can actually interact with Suspended cards.
Ingest is plenty original, but it is parasitic. Of the 227 non-land cards in BFZ, a grand total of 11 give you some benefit to having cards in your opponent's exile zone, and another 34 (including 10 Ingest cards) support them by exiling things.
I also know that Magic designers are capable of making original mechanics that are not parasitic: Suspend, Haunt, Evoke, Fateful hour, arguably Delve, etc. There are also plenty of cards in BFZ that are not parasitic but also unoriginal, and some of them have lower-costed options in the same Standard: Planar Outburst, Stasis Snare, just about every Devoid card has a colored analogue, just about every Awaken card has a lower-costed non-Awaken version.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Veteran Lurker, Noob Poster (TM)
Modern: 1WUR(B/P) Affinity
Legacy: R Burn, W Ascension
Multiplayer: 1U Grand Post
EDH: 1R Daretti
That ingest is parasitic (and to a lesser degree Devoid but it's not really a mechanic) is unfortunately a side effect of the fact that no set has ever cared about the exile zone so while the idea that the set has parasitic mechanics is certainly valid that you could leverage it as criticism in the same sentence as complaining about lack of originality (which is complete bogus) means you don't understand what you are talking about.
I don't think devoid is parasitic at all. There have been colorless cards since the game started. Ingest and processors are actually a lot less parasitic than first glance, since exiling from the top of the library is sorta like milling and there lots of way to exile things in the game. I like the use of exile design space in BFZ and some of the new interactions to be had in EDH.
A return to a fan-favorite plane that will probably sell exceptionally well based on nostalgia alone? I can't possibly imagine how this could fail; there's no way they would make a half-assed set devoid of needed reprints and expect it to sell itself....
A return to a fan-favorite plane that will probably sell exceptionally well based on nostalgia alone? I can't possibly imagine how this could fail; there's no way they would make a half-assed set devoid of needed reprints and expect it to sell itself....
To be fair, they were probably expecting the Expeditions and battle lands to do most of the heavy lifting. So at this rate we can expect Shadows over Innistrad to have SDCC-blackout-style Liliana of the Veil, Sorin, and Nahiri in one per every 400 packs or something, and no other reprints or tournament staples.
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Modern: 1WUR(B/P) Affinity
Legacy: R Burn, W Ascension
Multiplayer: 1U Grand Post
EDH: 1R Daretti
Seriously, Lili has no reason to be on Innistrad. She accomplished her goals their, and for her to stay would be a massive flavor fail. Shes got ***** to do, and its not on Innistrad.
Personally ive been more interested in seeing that tale wrap up then the Innistrad sequel. But if it goes the Eldrazi direction, that would be cool, with an end of year climax on New Phyrexia.
I hope we get another round of transform cards. It would be the obvious first choice for a returning mechanic, and I think they could give the design a twist, like maybe a third side to the card (A token that looks like a card, which can only be accessed after flipping the first card.) Okay, that might be a little to pokemon-y, but at least we get another shot at a legendary werewolf, which is actually a missing part of a cycle.
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My favorite flavor text: Time of Heroes
Feel free to tell me yours!
I can't imagine a universe where Snapcaster Mage gets reprinted in a standard legal expansion. LotV is at least possible, but I'm not holding my breathe.
Overall, I don't totally know what to expect. Monsters, obviously. Maybe this will be a fully tribal format? By the time SOI comes out it will have been more than EIGHT years since Lorwyn. It's about time.
As far as individual mechanics, I give them the following % chance of returning
DFCs: 97%
Morbid: 65%
Flashback: 40% (I'm prepared to be wrong on this one. I'm just not sure this will be a graveyard set, but maybe I'm way off base)
Soulbond: 25%
Undying: 20%
Fateful Hour: 2%
Miracle: 1%
Also, am I the only one who think Innistrad limited was overrated? It's obviously great, but it just barely squeaks into my top 5 draft formats.
Another thought is despite how bad BFZ may have been, realistically it's profit is probably absurdly high because the stuffed full art lands in fat packs and collectors digging for Expedition stuff. Oath will probably be the same. I can't find any fat packs in the physical market and I'm probably going to get two Oath fat packs for full arts unless the set is actually good enough to warrant buying a booster box.
IMO it'll be interesting come SOI once Tarkir rotates out.
enchanting Witchstalker with Raised by Wolves
Has Emrakul found a bloody new meal?
Reprint Stasis!
Control needs more love.
EDH:
Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
Melek, Izzet Paragon
Oona, Queen of the Fae
Bruna, Light of Alabaster
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Rhys the Redeemed
Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Sen Triplets
The Mimeoplasm
WUBRGSliver OverlordGRBUW
WUBRGSliver Hivelord(Superfriends)GRBUW
Oh god please shut up. Except for hhooven4, because that was funny.
As for the set, I just kind of...don't care anymore. You guys have fun. I've been focusing more on old-frame-only decks. Magic: the Gathering isn't made for guys like me anymore. Call me when we have a return to Time Spiral style development.
As for all the *****ing: Stop being so ridiculous. You want things that aren't going to happen because you sit there and compare one set to another based on absurdly powerful cards. Not every block should have a JtMS or Snapcaster level card in it. People talk down on Theros but it was the hinge on which the crazy high power format that was INN-RTR turned into the awful RTR-THS devotion format which then changed with the high power RTR being pushed out and THS-KTK was one of the best standards we've had in a good while. All sets are designed for draft and standard. They are NOT designed for modern or legacy. If you want modern level cards every set you're out of luck and that's a good thing. BFZ was fine. Admittedly it's not my favorite and there were things I think could have been better but it was fine overall. Disliking its is more than anything I've seen a result of absurd expectations. If you think the set is parasitic you don't know what the term means. Sure, there are no snapcasters or Seige Rhinos but like I said, not every set canhave that it the power creep spirals out of control and you end up with Pokemon.
In your opinion. I've found this standard much more fun to play than THS-KTK.
UR Blue-Red Control
Modern:
UBR Grixis Control
UWR Jeskai Control
Netdecking is part of the game, nothing wrong with it at a conceptual level. If you take the time to read my posts you'll see that I made a specification "people who only netdeck" because those people are the ones who complain about pulling a 4 dollar rare (of which there are plenty in this set) because what they want are the cards that made the PT top 8.
As far as complaining about lack of originality that is complete hogwash: please point out to me the last set that had an exile zone matters theme (suspend doesn't count), go right ahead. That ingest is parasitic (and to a lesser degree Devoid but it's not really a mechanic) is unfortunately a side effect of the fact that no set has ever cared about the exile zone so while the idea that the set has parasitic mechanics is certainly valid that you could leverage it as criticism in the same sentence as complaining about lack of originality (which is complete bogus) means you don't understand what you are talking about.
Hell the set barely has any +1/+1 counters and that was the flavour of month from the "herpasherpa I complain about stuff I don't have a grasp on" crowd.
I would have liked to see Magic Origins revisited, those were the days...
It's a pretty popular opinion. Most of the pros as well as many of the usual negative people on here enjoyed how wide open it was.
Also: no, really, nothing in this set is parasitic. The term means that the mechanic relies on something that is exclusive or almost exclusive to the block. Splice into Arcane is parasitic because the only arcane spells were in Kamigawa block. None of the mechanics in BFZ rely on something else within the set. Devoid and ingest literally can't be parasitic because they don't actually rely on anything else. Besides there are plenty of cards outside of BFZ that care about colorless-news. Converge and Awaken are just about mana. And the processor mechanic can literally get anything; delved cards, guys hit by oring or path, Tormod's crypt, Rest in Peace, Bojuka Bog the list goes on. Literally nothing about this set is parasitic. It would be like calling Prowess a parasitic mechanic.
It's an effect of Battle for Zendikar. We love Innistrad, but our faith in WotC has been shaken by the current terrible "return to..." set. People don't want to see something they love get screwed up.
Bring her back Wizards!!!
EDH:
Niv-Mizzet
Legacy:
The Rack
Modern
Venser, the Sojourner Control
Thing about that is they're not screwing it up. It's not as if making a bad return set makes the original worse somehow. BFZ has no bearing on Zendikar block. There is really no reason for the complaining. We know the name of the set. That's it. You people are just ridiculous.
Anyway, big....Eldrazi-y shadows over innistrad? (Plz no)
And what's the connection to Innistrad that Nahiri has that many seem to be on to?
Last we saw her she had left Zendikar to look for Sorin. The logical place to look would be Innistrad. Thing is that was a long, long time ago and that should be the first place one should have looked.
Yes, Theros was weak, parasitic, boring and underdeveloped. Only the most versatile or extra-block synergistic cards saw play, the rest was all Thoughtseize, Elspetha and RTR/KTK.
And there is no reason to get exited for anything other than good reprints and OP mythics because BFZ is utter crap. Weak, parasitic, boring and underdeveloped with an extra *****ty aftertaste of getting rid of all the adventure and exploration flavor from the original Zendikar.
What do I expect from SOI? Removal and counterspells to get worse, dumb green creatures to get better, interactions to be halfassed, zero gothic horror because that's getting overwhelmed by the meme-est memes of "lovecraftian" tropes, and returning mechanics to be ruined with overcosting because they now add a +1/+1 counter to a creature when you cast the card.
If you actually liked Innistrad you shoulnd't be exited at all about this because not even Voorthos is as blind to say Homelands, Mercadian and Kamigawa wouldn't have been better if the cards were actually playable and it wasn't just a bunch of nicely drawn pieces of notthing.
Power-down Magic sucks.
Devoid has no benefit what so ever, its actually pointless and is sued more as a restriction like requiring a colorless card so another card doesn't suck.Devoid would be mutch better if there were more cards that interacted with colors more like protection or specific hate agaisnt colors.
Ingest is practically a limited mechanic because exiling only one card per attack that need to hit the oponent is really udnerpowered.I know their point if to fuel the processors but the eldrazi processors are the worst thing in BFZ.
Wizards were afraid to an extend of interaction to exield cards that they probably enrfed the cards so it was better this interaction never existed because we got weak effects with litle payoff and we brought back a card for the oponent to use again.I hate the processors not just mechanically but flavor aswelll, they are lame IMO they don't give the feel of BIG BAD ELDRAZI that what eldrazis are mean't to be or just drones that helped fuel the big eldrazis with Scions.Yes alot of them create eldrazi scions but i rather have the oens that don't need to jump alot of hoops jsut to make a scion.The processors aren't Big like the eldrazis or swarm like the drones and scions they are just midle ground with weird abilities that aren't that memorable or good.I really hate them.
For some reason you always make things ad hominem instead of just addressing the arguments themselves; it's not enough for you that yours is the correct opinion (itself an invalid concept), but those who disagree with you are not only wrong but also incapable of intelligent thought.
Please explain why Suspend doesn't count as an "exile zone matters" mechanic, because in terms of putting cards in the exile zone where they generally can't be interacted with until they do something that benefits you, it seems to have quite a few parallels with Ingest, and Ingest can actually interact with Suspended cards.
Ingest is plenty original, but it is parasitic. Of the 227 non-land cards in BFZ, a grand total of 11 give you some benefit to having cards in your opponent's exile zone, and another 34 (including 10 Ingest cards) support them by exiling things.
I also know that Magic designers are capable of making original mechanics that are not parasitic: Suspend, Haunt, Evoke, Fateful hour, arguably Delve, etc. There are also plenty of cards in BFZ that are not parasitic but also unoriginal, and some of them have lower-costed options in the same Standard: Planar Outburst, Stasis Snare, just about every Devoid card has a colored analogue, just about every Awaken card has a lower-costed non-Awaken version.
Modern: 1WUR(B/P) Affinity
Legacy: R Burn, W Ascension
Multiplayer: 1U Grand Post
EDH: 1R Daretti
I don't think devoid is parasitic at all. There have been colorless cards since the game started. Ingest and processors are actually a lot less parasitic than first glance, since exiling from the top of the library is sorta like milling and there lots of way to exile things in the game. I like the use of exile design space in BFZ and some of the new interactions to be had in EDH.
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To be fair, they were probably expecting the Expeditions and battle lands to do most of the heavy lifting. So at this rate we can expect Shadows over Innistrad to have SDCC-blackout-style Liliana of the Veil, Sorin, and Nahiri in one per every 400 packs or something, and no other reprints or tournament staples.
Modern: 1WUR(B/P) Affinity
Legacy: R Burn, W Ascension
Multiplayer: 1U Grand Post
EDH: 1R Daretti
Personally ive been more interested in seeing that tale wrap up then the Innistrad sequel. But if it goes the Eldrazi direction, that would be cool, with an end of year climax on New Phyrexia.
EDH:
Niv-Mizzet
Legacy:
The Rack
Modern
Venser, the Sojourner Control
Feel free to tell me yours!
Overall, I don't totally know what to expect. Monsters, obviously. Maybe this will be a fully tribal format? By the time SOI comes out it will have been more than EIGHT years since Lorwyn. It's about time.
As far as individual mechanics, I give them the following % chance of returning
DFCs: 97%
Morbid: 65%
Flashback: 40% (I'm prepared to be wrong on this one. I'm just not sure this will be a graveyard set, but maybe I'm way off base)
Soulbond: 25%
Undying: 20%
Fateful Hour: 2%
Miracle: 1%
Also, am I the only one who think Innistrad limited was overrated? It's obviously great, but it just barely squeaks into my top 5 draft formats.
IMO it'll be interesting come SOI once Tarkir rotates out.
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