What story does her ability tell? Creature Chandra's abilities seem more bottom-up than top-down. That's my biggest doubt about this, though they could potentially put out some more story that makes this make sense.
This is just hilarious. Staff locking threads just because a few pixels are off, despite how perfect the card otherwise is. Wizards are allowed to change their templating rules.
Nobody even bothered to look at Eric's art for comparison? More paranoia please, it's funny.
Get off your high horse. There are people here, veterans of over ten years (more than 40 rumor seasons), who know what they are doing and many mockups were correctly disproved over the years because of slight errors.
Seeing that you joined less than year ago, please reconsider how you might come across by saying such things and intentionally mocking somebody.
Thank you.
However, this is not the first time an actual leak has been deemed fake and locked. This is a forum to discuss rumours, and for that, I believe it is better to keep up threads to discuss the leaks, so that the players can discuss it and make up their minds for themselves. The one exception is when the leak is glaringly fake, which this one never was. After all, they say "It is better to let nine guilty men free than to convict one innocent man."
This looks like a low-res screencap taken straight from the godbook.
Anyway, the card appears to be pretty decent. The line of "swing with Chandra, burn away their creature before blocks and untap Chandra, connect for 2, then ping their face and flip her" seems reasonable enough to happen on a consistent basis.
The problem with defining this format by what is "fun" is that everyone seems to define fun as what they don't lose to. If you keep losing to easily answered cards, that means you should improve your deck. If you don't want to improve your deck, then you should come to peace with the idea that you are going to lose because you chose to not interact with better strategies.
Looking back at the shoddy quality of the JPGing on the card, I could absolutely see it being seen as either 2014 or 2015. Funny how that minor JPG glitch caused this entire snafu lol
But I'm glad that this seems to mostly be cleared up. Now, the real question: Did WotC plant this spoiler, with the shoddy JPGdom and everything, in order for Rumor Mills like ours to shoot it down before new information popped up?
Given that Chandra, Roaring Flame has the correct date, I think it's possible that the unflipped side is a fake or a mockup and the flipped side is real.
Edit: Why are people saying that the "2014" is a JPG error? Zoom in... It's definitely a 4...
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YMTC: We need a spikey red enchantment. My creations:
RR
Whenever a player taps a nonbasic land, [Card] deals 2 damage to them.
-or-
R
Whenever a player would gain life, flip a coin. If heads, that player loses that much life instead. If tails sacrifice [card] and that player gains that life as per usual.
Agreed that with the confirmation of the plane, this card became plausible enough to warrant discussion.
On-curve in an aggro deck this is VERY strong if you can get it past blockers. Drop it t3, and all you have to do is successfully attack and play a single spell on t4 for her to do 5 damage (and if you're an aggro deck and can't play anything t4 you probably lost anyways). I see it as comparing pretty well to Goblin Rabblemaster (3 drop with 2 power but that does lots of damage if allowed to attack), except a bit less explosive and more resilient.
It's disadvantage to Rabblemaster is that she isn't as explosive against an open field Rabble can deal a total of 8 by t4, while she can only deal 5, and the disparity only gets great from there. However, if you can play two red spells t4 (far from unreasonable), she can do that 5 damage without attacking, and can do it spread over several creatures.
If you're an aggro deck and you waste your turn 3 on a 2/2 that does nothing immediately and very little on it's own, i'd say you probably lost, too. You want to be doing damage every turn. dropping a Gray Ogre on turn 3 isn't aggressive enough outside of limited. I feel like it's true home would be a hybrid combo shell built around it, but at that point, why not just run a better/more resilient combo (if we're strictly speaking in competitive terms)?
It's disadvantage to Rabblemaster is that it relies on having more spells to trigger it in order to become moderately useful. Rabblemaster isn't dependent on having more (specific) cards in hand, even if it gets bonkers if you add more goblins. Off the top of your deck mid/late-game, this is a 3 mana 2/2 that you hope survives a turn to...start pinging for 1 per turn without additional help.
In a deck built to exploit it, it has potential, sure. But it still seems weaker than it's competition in basic burn/aggro decks.
Is it possible that, while this is the basic concept of the card, the final Chandra will be different in some way?
No, not really. WotC doesn't make a habit of mocking up real-looking cards until they're ready to actually print them. Their playtest cards, even the ones made to look like real cards, are clearly identified as such. They also wouldn't make functional changes to a card late in the production process unless it was absolutely necessary (for example, something slipped through the editing process that could be offensive). They learned that lesson with Umezawa's Jitte. Either this is fake, and the faker acquired knowledge of Chandra's home plane and the artwork through unknown means, or it is the final version. There isn't any other realistic option.
Also, would it be possible to edit the original post to reflect the current official position on the veracity of this card? People who encounter this thread for the first time should be aware that it was originally thought to be fake but that the appearance of "Kaladesh" in official sources called this into question. Most people looking for spoilers will not read much past the first post and it would help to consolidate all we know about this leak there.
As interesting as she comes out to be, I'd still run Jaya Ballard, Task Mage over her. This chandra just seems worse. Running Jaya as my commander in my monored edh deck is awesome cause she can remove large threats easily and her second ability targets both creatures and players. I might run her in the deck but wouldn't run this chandra as a commander.
Shaman has a helluva lot more tribal support than Spellshaper. Chandra works with aggro/burn (she benefits from pump spells) while Jaya works with board control and graveyards (Phoenix's)
[numlist]
[*] Mass Hysteria
[*] Simian Spirit Guide
Chandra, Fire of Kaladesh
*ping*
[*]
*swing* Lightning Bolt (on stack)
*ping* Lava Spike (on stack)
*ping* Gut Shot (on stack)
*ping*
stack and combat resolve
+1 for 2
[/list]
[/numlist]
So if you're lucky and on the play, that's 15 damage in effect while your opponent is sitting there with an Island. Maybe 3 of it gets Dispelled, and you need more craetures in the deck that can take advantage of Mass Hysteria, but I don't see why this isn't a possibility for Modern in the right deck.
List tags are malformed.
[numlist]
[*] Mass Hysteria
[*] Simian Spirit Guide
Chandra, Fire of Kaladesh
*ping*
[*]
*swing* Lightning Bolt (on stack)
*ping* Lava Spike (on stack)
*ping* Gut Shot (on stack)
*ping*
stack and combat resolve
+1 for 2
[/list]
[/numlist]
So if you're lucky and on the play, that's 15 damage in effect while your opponent is sitting there with an Island. Maybe 3 of it gets Dispelled, and you need more craetures in the deck that can take advantage of Mass Hysteria, but I don't see why this isn't a possibility for Modern in the right deck.
This has got to be the most MTGS-esque post I've read in a long time.
Come on, let's hope for Titan Cycle quality: 1 is crap, 3 are EDH-worthy, and 1 is broken.
My hope is that they make them narrow for specific strategies and or shift them to aggro tactics. Walker control is not fun to play against so I would be happy if the creature based walkers are more geared for creature strategies.
I also assume that most of these will be terrible for EDH considering they have conditions to turn into walkers and that walkers usually are not amazing in commander.
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I have officially moved to MTGNexus. I just wanted to let people know as my response time to salvation decks being bumped is very hit or miss.
My hope is that they make them narrow for specific strategies and or shift them to aggro tactics. Walker control is not fun to play against so I would be happy if the creature based walkers are more geared for creature strategies.
I also assume that most of these will be terrible for EDH considering they have conditions to turn into walkers and that walkers usually are not amazing in commander.
Yeah. Chandra looks like turd driving a chariot right now, but Liliana seems reasonable as one of the 99. I play plenty of sac engines in black decks. Although, when you are limited to 99 cards you cut a lot of very strong playable cards for each and every one of those 99. Does this Lili beat out the other Lilianas? Fleshbag Marauder? Necropotence? Some other random 3 drop I can't think of?
Yeah. Chandra looks like turd driving a chariot right now, but Liliana seems reasonable as one of the 99. I play plenty of sac engines in black decks. Although, when you are limited to 99 cards you cut a lot of very strong playable cards for each and every one of those 99. Does this Lili beat out the other Lilianas? Fleshbag Marauder? Necropotence? Some other random 3 drop I can't think of?
Yea, I started thinking like... she could be fun if you Corpse Dance her back and then sac something to rez a three mana creature... then I realized I would already have access to Corpse Dance and a sac outlet and... yea...
I would be fine if they all turn out to be decent. I wouldn't want them to break anything with these and I also hope they don't make them all turd sandwiches. Having specific types of decks that they can be strong in is how I would hope they turn out.
As it stands, I think this flavor of Chandra is ok but not something I see myself playing.
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I have officially moved to MTGNexus. I just wanted to let people know as my response time to salvation decks being bumped is very hit or miss.
Assuming you give her haste, depending on the final exact wording, she could work with Pandemonium effects -- and you could target creatures with these effects, since the ability doesn't care (with the spoiled wording). It could also be some earlier version of the final card we will get. In any case, I don't see her being good enough to be played as a 99 in EDH, maybe as a general for 1v1 (tiny leader?) and obviously in any format where all the 1-cmc red burn spells are played as a mono-red deck (Red Deck Win in Modern, Legacy Burn in Legacy, etc).
My own rules when building a Commander deck:
1) Underrated general that I can build around but the deck must work without him/her too.
2) Every card must be legal in both banlists.
3) No infinite combo that could win (and ruin) instantly a multiplayer game.
4) Synergy at all costs; stay on theme, avoid goodstuff.
What a turd. If this is real I am disappointed in Orgins already. I had high hopes for these flip cards and WOTC let me down again.
To be fair Origins flipwalkers may still be great, but Chandra has always had a history of not so great cards, minus the most recent one. Just not a whole lot you can do with her abilities when they are all straight burn.
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Commander:
R Daretti, Scrap Savant
BR Olivia Voldaren
BRG Shattergang Brothers
GUR Riku of Two Reflections
WBG Karador, Ghost Chieftain
However, this is not the first time an actual leak has been deemed fake and locked. This is a forum to discuss rumours, and for that, I believe it is better to keep up threads to discuss the leaks, so that the players can discuss it and make up their minds for themselves. The one exception is when the leak is glaringly fake, which this one never was. After all, they say "It is better to let nine guilty men free than to convict one innocent man."
I took it to be more like...
WUBRGPauper Battle BoxWUBRG ... and why I am not a fan of Wayne Reynolds' Illustrations.
Anyway, the card appears to be pretty decent. The line of "swing with Chandra, burn away their creature before blocks and untap Chandra, connect for 2, then ping their face and flip her" seems reasonable enough to happen on a consistent basis.
But I'm glad that this seems to mostly be cleared up. Now, the real question: Did WotC plant this spoiler, with the shoddy JPGdom and everything, in order for Rumor Mills like ours to shoot it down before new information popped up?
~Lil Kalki
Proud Disciple of the Church of the Wary
Edit: Why are people saying that the "2014" is a JPG error? Zoom in... It's definitely a 4...
Whenever a player taps a nonbasic land, [Card] deals 2 damage to them.
-or-
R
Whenever a player would gain life, flip a coin. If heads, that player loses that much life instead. If tails sacrifice [card] and that player gains that life as per usual.
Fires Rf Salvation
If you're an aggro deck and you waste your turn 3 on a 2/2 that does nothing immediately and very little on it's own, i'd say you probably lost, too. You want to be doing damage every turn. dropping a Gray Ogre on turn 3 isn't aggressive enough outside of limited. I feel like it's true home would be a hybrid combo shell built around it, but at that point, why not just run a better/more resilient combo (if we're strictly speaking in competitive terms)?
It's disadvantage to Rabblemaster is that it relies on having more spells to trigger it in order to become moderately useful. Rabblemaster isn't dependent on having more (specific) cards in hand, even if it gets bonkers if you add more goblins. Off the top of your deck mid/late-game, this is a 3 mana 2/2 that you hope survives a turn to...start pinging for 1 per turn without additional help.
In a deck built to exploit it, it has potential, sure. But it still seems weaker than it's competition in basic burn/aggro decks.
No, not really. WotC doesn't make a habit of mocking up real-looking cards until they're ready to actually print them. Their playtest cards, even the ones made to look like real cards, are clearly identified as such. They also wouldn't make functional changes to a card late in the production process unless it was absolutely necessary (for example, something slipped through the editing process that could be offensive). They learned that lesson with Umezawa's Jitte. Either this is fake, and the faker acquired knowledge of Chandra's home plane and the artwork through unknown means, or it is the final version. There isn't any other realistic option.
Also, would it be possible to edit the original post to reflect the current official position on the veracity of this card? People who encounter this thread for the first time should be aware that it was originally thought to be fake but that the appearance of "Kaladesh" in official sources called this into question. Most people looking for spoilers will not read much past the first post and it would help to consolidate all we know about this leak there.
Shaman has a helluva lot more tribal support than Spellshaper. Chandra works with aggro/burn (she benefits from pump spells) while Jaya works with board control and graveyards (Phoenix's)
[*]
Mass Hysteria
[*]
Simian Spirit Guide
Chandra, Fire of Kaladesh
*ping*
[*]
*swing*
Lightning Bolt (on stack)
*ping*
Lava Spike (on stack)
*ping*
Gut Shot (on stack)
*ping*
stack and combat resolve
+1 for 2
[/list]
[/numlist]
So if you're lucky and on the play, that's 15 damage in effect while your opponent is sitting there with an Island. Maybe 3 of it gets Dispelled, and you need more craetures in the deck that can take advantage of Mass Hysteria, but I don't see why this isn't a possibility for Modern in the right deck.
List tags are malformed.
This has got to be the most MTGS-esque post I've read in a long time.
List tags are malformed.
WUBRGPauper Battle BoxWUBRG ... and why I am not a fan of Wayne Reynolds' Illustrations.
edit: wow, I do suck...overlooked sorcery, can probably still do something with this
CardboardCreationism
ETSY COUNTERS
My guess is that 3 of them are crap, 1 is OK/EDH worthy, and 1 is broken.
Chandra definitely seems sucky, but we don't know how BFZ/Ori/Khans standard will look.
WUBRGPauper Battle BoxWUBRG ... and why I am not a fan of Wayne Reynolds' Illustrations.
My hope is that they make them narrow for specific strategies and or shift them to aggro tactics. Walker control is not fun to play against so I would be happy if the creature based walkers are more geared for creature strategies.
I also assume that most of these will be terrible for EDH considering they have conditions to turn into walkers and that walkers usually are not amazing in commander.
Signature by Inkfox Aesthetics by Xen
[Modern] Allies
Yeah. Chandra looks like turd driving a chariot right now, but Liliana seems reasonable as one of the 99. I play plenty of sac engines in black decks. Although, when you are limited to 99 cards you cut a lot of very strong playable cards for each and every one of those 99. Does this Lili beat out the other Lilianas? Fleshbag Marauder? Necropotence? Some other random 3 drop I can't think of?
WUBRGPauper Battle BoxWUBRG ... and why I am not a fan of Wayne Reynolds' Illustrations.
Yea, I started thinking like... she could be fun if you Corpse Dance her back and then sac something to rez a three mana creature... then I realized I would already have access to Corpse Dance and a sac outlet and... yea...
I would be fine if they all turn out to be decent. I wouldn't want them to break anything with these and I also hope they don't make them all turd sandwiches. Having specific types of decks that they can be strong in is how I would hope they turn out.
As it stands, I think this flavor of Chandra is ok but not something I see myself playing.
Signature by Inkfox Aesthetics by Xen
[Modern] Allies
Rules Advisor
Pauper decks: Weenie Tokens — Zombies
My own rules when building a Commander deck:
1) Underrated general that I can build around but the deck must work without him/her too.
2) Every card must be legal in both banlists.
3) No infinite combo that could win (and ruin) instantly a multiplayer game.
4) Synergy at all costs; stay on theme, avoid goodstuff.
To be fair Origins flipwalkers may still be great, but Chandra has always had a history of not so great cards, minus the most recent one. Just not a whole lot you can do with her abilities when they are all straight burn.