Seems insane in G/B devotion. Can draw you a bunch of cards or fireball an opponent depending on your needs at the time. Can easily see this killing people out of nowhere or putting the game out of reach. Expecting 4 ofs in G/B devotion, no one expects a black fireball.
This. Deflecting Palm and Prevent Harm do nothing against this type of loss of life. Other than a counterspell, I don't see any other card that stops it in it's tracks... Will be awesome in G/B devo.
First, there was a standard where u/w talkig control did play Mind Spring in Standard. That deck had to worry about its own life total so I don't think you'd see it play this card.
Invoke the Firemind saw play, but that was because it was part of a wacky combo deck that could tutor for cards that cost 3 mana, and it does a lot of what this card wants to do.
This card is likely to see very little play and not be worth much, although I'd hold onto foils for the off chance that it becomes a pricy EDH card.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Rules Advisor as of 4/23/10
Regarding Stoneforge Mystic
Quote from oranges2 »
This guy, would either eat up several turns worth of mana to get a slow permanent that relies on your already have some board presence (after wasting said mana), or dies without generating any advantage.
Turns 1-4: Dead card
Turn 5 until 22 mana: Draw between 3 and 10 cards.
~22 mana (8 devotion, 1 Satyr Wayfinder, 1 Nykthos): Kill Target Opponent
~Infinite Mana (Nykthos, Satyr, 7 devo, Temur Sabertooth, New Surrak formidable'd): Deck target opponent
This all should be pretty easy stuff to do with Mastery of the Unseen in a Green/Abzan Devo Shell.
Playing for the infinite mana, decking effect should absolutely shred G/W Devo.
Who cares how much life they have if they don't have a deck?
Being sorcery speed really kills this thing. It costs four mana to be sign in blood. Skeletal scrying is better than this thing because it costs one less but most importantly it is an instant.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Standard
none
Modern UBG B/U/G control BBB MBC WUR Control WWW Prison RRR Goblins
Legacy BBB Pox UBG B/U/G Control UWU StoneBlade UW Miracle Control
I saw the name and thought did they do it? Are we getting more pacts like the ones in future sight?
Then I saw the card and realized they did not do it...
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Level 1 Judge
Level 2 in progress...
UUU Merfolk UUU "Above the waves you may be mighty indeed, but down here you belong to me."
-Empress Galina
UBR Cruel Control UBR "The essence of every world, every spell, and every thought is power. Nothing else matters, because nothing else exists."
-Nicol Bolas
The thing that bothers me the most about this card is being a sorcery, especially being previewed the same day as Comune with Lava. I mean, OK, blue is the king of drawing and every other color (except white) gets to do it with drawbacks: red has to play whatever it drew within a turn, green has to have creatures, and black has to pay life. Besides that, I don't get why red can do it as instant and black don't. Would it be that powerful?
The thing that bothers me the most about this card is being a sorcery, especially being previewed the same day as Comune with Lava. I mean, OK, blue is the king of drawing and every other color (except white) gets to do it with drawbacks: red has to play whatever it drew within a turn, green has to have creatures, and black has to pay life. Besides that, I don't get why red can do it as instant and black don't. Would it be that powerful?
It's just like how people think random blue spell that draws X is strictly better than Ponder/Preordain/Brainstorm because Commander is a format for big splashy spells.
I have to ask, how hyper competitive is your meta that you are running "draw 2, lose 2 life" spells in EDH? It would seem like those would only be in metas where you die on Turn 5 unless you have Force of Will, in which case 99% of all cards are never going to apply to that.
You missed one very important thing
Draw 2 lose 2 for 2 mana
Much more effecient and much more likely to be able to have mana left over to actually use what you draw off of it
How effecient a spell is is a huge deal
The meta is very, very competitive in fact: animar, derevi, sydri, mimeoplasm etc... all run amok.
Much more effecient and much more likely to be able to have mana left over to actually use what you draw off of it
How effecient a spell is is a huge deal
The meta is very, very competitive in fact: animar, derevi, sydri, mimeoplasm etc... all run amok.
He's suggesting that your meta is more competitive than the average, which it sounds like it is. My impression of the average EDH meta is one where people have a loose, unspoken agreement that everyone gets time to play big flashy spells. Mana efficiency is less important in such a setting.
Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
Melek, Izzet Paragon
Oona, Queen of the Fae
Bruna, Light of Alabaster
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Rhys the Redeemed
Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Sen Triplets
The Mimeoplasm WUBRGSliver OverlordGRBUW WUBRGSliver Hivelord(Superfriends)GRBUW
I don't understand a lot of you guys, especially when commander seems to be the format everyone is referencing.
The comparison of the cheaper black draw spells to this seems a bit misguided. Most of the comments seem to hint that other draw spells are better which I understand, but it's a singleton format, it's not like this is going to replace them, but more so substitute/work as another late game option. Yeah they practically have the same effect, but one can be utilized a lot more effectively late game and the other early game. Yes the card may not be made for all formats, but I definitely find it usable for my playgroup, and I am glad that WoTC doesn't just focus on their competitive crowd. Magic isn't just made up of Johnny's and Spike's.
It is a powerful mill card, my playgroup has a lot of ways of surviving regular mill, but drawing out is a welcomed utility against people that use eldrazi, reminisce, elixir's etc.
It is not damage, it is loss of life which goes around preventive and damage reflective spells.
It is in a color that syphons life from everything, not to mention the art is pretty boss.
I personally love this card.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
In EDH, it is a lot worse than Promise of Power.
Check out Odds//Ends - My articles on Quirky Cards and Oddball Builds
Long-time PucaTrade member and sometime author. Send me cards!
Currently playing Knight of the Reliquary - Retreat to Coralhelm Combo
This. Deflecting Palm and Prevent Harm do nothing against this type of loss of life. Other than a counterspell, I don't see any other card that stops it in it's tracks... Will be awesome in G/B devo.
EDH: UBRJeleva | GURSurrak
Invoke the Firemind saw play, but that was because it was part of a wacky combo deck that could tutor for cards that cost 3 mana, and it does a lot of what this card wants to do.
This card is likely to see very little play and not be worth much, although I'd hold onto foils for the off chance that it becomes a pricy EDH card.
Rules Advisor as of 4/23/10
Regarding Stoneforge Mystic
Turns 1-4: Dead card
Turn 5 until 22 mana: Draw between 3 and 10 cards.
~22 mana (8 devotion, 1 Satyr Wayfinder, 1 Nykthos): Kill Target Opponent
~Infinite Mana (Nykthos, Satyr, 7 devo, Temur Sabertooth, New Surrak formidable'd): Deck target opponent
This all should be pretty easy stuff to do with Mastery of the Unseen in a Green/Abzan Devo Shell.
Playing for the infinite mana, decking effect should absolutely shred G/W Devo.
Who cares how much life they have if they don't have a deck?
EDH: UBRJeleva | GURSurrak
I love the art and i wouldn't mind running this in edh, but i would still run sign in blood and night's whisper and exsanguinate.
My Decks:
All my Decks are budget
EDH:GRWHazezon TamarGRW, RKazuul, Tyrant of the CliffsR, BMikaeus, the UnhallowedB, UTalrand, Sky SummonerU, GRXenagos, God of RevelsGR, BGPharika, God of AfflictionBG
Standard:BMono Black Control(devotion)B- retired
Casual:UWHeroicUW, UGWall tribalUG, BPhylactery LichB
Modern:UBAbyssal PersecutorUB, WKnight TribalW
none
Modern
UBG B/U/G control
BBB MBC
WUR Control
WWW Prison
RRR Goblins
Legacy
BBB Pox
UBG B/U/G Control
UWU StoneBlade
UW Miracle Control
Then I saw the card and realized they did not do it...
Level 2 in progress...
UUU Merfolk UUU
"Above the waves you may be mighty indeed, but down here you belong to me."
-Empress Galina
UBR Cruel Control UBR
"The essence of every world, every spell, and every thought is power. Nothing else matters, because nothing else exists."
-Nicol Bolas
Regarding EDH, I prefer cards that allow me to draw repeatedly, like Erebos, God of the Dead, Greed or Underworld Connections.
I'd say that red does things on a whim, which translates to instants. Black thinks things through (and weighs the costs and benefits), so it's slower.
You missed one very important thing
Draw 2 lose 2 for 2 mana
Much more effecient and much more likely to be able to have mana left over to actually use what you draw off of it
How effecient a spell is is a huge deal
The meta is very, very competitive in fact: animar, derevi, sydri, mimeoplasm etc... all run amok.
EDIT: my bad, I misread!
He's suggesting that your meta is more competitive than the average, which it sounds like it is. My impression of the average EDH meta is one where people have a loose, unspoken agreement that everyone gets time to play big flashy spells. Mana efficiency is less important in such a setting.
I'm dumbstruck.
Reprint Stasis!
Control needs more love.
EDH:
Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
Melek, Izzet Paragon
Oona, Queen of the Fae
Bruna, Light of Alabaster
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Rhys the Redeemed
Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Sen Triplets
The Mimeoplasm
WUBRGSliver OverlordGRBUW
WUBRGSliver Hivelord(Superfriends)GRBUW
The comparison of the cheaper black draw spells to this seems a bit misguided. Most of the comments seem to hint that other draw spells are better which I understand, but it's a singleton format, it's not like this is going to replace them, but more so substitute/work as another late game option. Yeah they practically have the same effect, but one can be utilized a lot more effectively late game and the other early game. Yes the card may not be made for all formats, but I definitely find it usable for my playgroup, and I am glad that WoTC doesn't just focus on their competitive crowd. Magic isn't just made up of Johnny's and Spike's.
It is a powerful mill card, my playgroup has a lot of ways of surviving regular mill, but drawing out is a welcomed utility against people that use eldrazi, reminisce, elixir's etc.
It is not damage, it is loss of life which goes around preventive and damage reflective spells.
It is in a color that syphons life from everything, not to mention the art is pretty boss.
I personally love this card.