Outside of there being no dual lands, the uncommon megamorph dragon cycle, and there being no dragons at common, I actually like this set. It has a lot of cards that will be Standard and even Modern playable.
The problem with the set is the goal of the set. This set is like, the definition of your mileage may vary.
I agree wholeheartedly with this statement. Dragons of Tarkir's focus/slash goal is so narrow that it has failed to appeal to a large portion of the magic the gathering community base.
I applaud the design team for talking a risk an narrowing their focus so dramatically, however, I feel that based on what has been spoiled so far this set is a bit underwhelming.
This is not about fetches. It's about the fact that for the most part they are betting on the fact that they can sell a mediocre set as long as it's wrapped in a "PRETTY DRAGON SKIN PACKAGE".
Wizards took absolutely no risk at all in their approach to designing the actual DRAGONS in the set. You can make arguments all you want about the amount of "design space" available for dragons, but in my opinion they didn't even really try.
I get it. DRAGONS of Tarkir is a set for people who absolutely love DRAGONS.
But, I ask you, what about the people who, like myself, are not dragon lovers? Wizards had given us absolutely no reason at all to "fall in love" with the DRAGONS in DRAGONS of Tarkir.
I LOVE DRAGONS. I'm underwhelmed with this set. I don't want to see a six drop megamorph 3/3 anymore than anyone else does. I don't want generic cycles filled with lackluster abilities. This world would have been much better if dragons were in red exclusively or bled into black and green a little. A tribal element missing in the first set that makes a return in the middle set and has a hey day in the final set would have been doable. Five clans could exist like they did, then they could have been somewhat different in the middle set, then they could have dropped enemy colors in the last set for various, realistic reasons. Two or three of the clans could have converted to the dragon side and the dragons could have been born from eggs. Bam, I wrote a story and it sounds better than what we were given.
I feel like dragons should have received the same sort of design enthusiasm and wholeness that warriors received during the block. You can tell by the warrior designs that they want that tribe to be a contender. I don't get that impression from the dragons at all. None of the dragons in this set come close to stormbreath, when they really should have had some surpass its power. The upcoming "dragon deck" is usually going to be the usual ramp stompy, but into worse targets than usual. It feels really off to me.
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People, please try to limit this thread to discussing number crunching, and not your opinions about the quality of the set. If you would like to discuss that, the New Card Discussion Forum is the appropriate place.
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The was a comment on twitter last night that we would have the spoiler in under 24 hours. I belive it was floating from official sources. No surprise but we'll get there today
So, I didn't pay much attention on the sequence in which the cards were spoiled in the last two sets. Did any of the last day bulk spoilers of FRF or KTK made it into constructed?
Can't remember either but for what it's worth there are way more unspoiled cards than usually. I think it was about 80 in most other big sets, now its 137!
So, I didn't pay much attention on the sequence in which the cards were spoiled in the last two sets. Did any of the last day bulk spoilers of FRF or KTK made it into constructed?
The only case of this that I recall was the spoiling of Boros Reckoner in Gatecrash.
I must admit that I do not remember lacking 11 rares on the last day. We can hope for something interesting.
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but something to give mana fixing to the post KTK/FRF standard would have been appreciated.
This thinking makes absolutely NO sense.
If anything the set needs dual lands for fixing within a limited environment, not standard. We have essentially a perfect mana base right now. We have AGGRESSIVE 3 color decks in standard, yes it might cost you some life from confluence, or if you're playing a tempo game you have to set up your come into play tap lands, but right now the mana base is essentially perfect, even if it's not "clean cycles".
Also when we have 2 and 3 color decks running devotion shenanigans with Nykthos, there is no reason for more dual lands in standard right now, all that will do is speed up the 5 color decks, and then the meta would be all 5 color good stuff. Do you really want that?
Second part about your statement which makes no sense is the part about AFTER KTK/FRF. When does that rotate without Dragons? They all rotate at the same time, and they rotate after the following sets:
Magic: Origins
Battle for Zendikar
Zendikar set #2
The next block
THEN THEY ROTATE
That leaves at least 3 sets to print cycles of duals and/or finish some cycles currently in standard. For example, it's fairly obvious that we're going to get Enemy Fetches reprinted in BFZ. Stranger things have occurred, but my guess is Wizards want's to pay off it's fans by having a standard format with all 10 fetches in it for the first time in magic history. This is also allowing for nearly perfect mana. Mana confluence will rotate, but Dragons is a single color block, and Zen is probably gonna be focused on mono colors too like last, so Mana Confluence isn't going to be needed.
Anyways I'm going to end it here, your logic makes zero sense. I can understand from a financial and excitement point of view, Wizards upset some people, but this is offset by the most popular casual creature type and some seriously pushed power level cards. Not to mention we're already seeing some majorly exciting cards from Magic Origins (and we've only seen 1 card).
Everyone needs to take a step back and chill the heck out.
To begin, I never said anything about the mana fixing in the current standard environment. It's very good and doesn't need additional fixing.
Before questioning my logic on the actual contents of my post, perhaps you should look at how rotation will be handled going forward? Khans of Tarkir and Fate Reforged rotate out separately from Dragons of Tarkir. DTK forms a pseudo block with Magic Origins. It would have made sense to form a land cycle between those two sets to transition into the 2-set block structure.
The post KTK/FRF standard will consist of:
Dragons of Tarkir (no mana fixing)
Magic Origins (ally painlands?)
Battle For Zendikar (enemy fetches?)
"Sweat" (?)
"Tears" (?)
In environments without shocks/ABUR duals, Fetchlands are not great at mana fixing. So, yes, I think it was reasonable and logical to expect mana fixing in DTK.
I still think you're off your rocker. You are saying that 4 sets is not enough to create a stable base of mana?
Please note that KTK doesn't have a dual land cycle for the current standard. So obviously based on your opinion of how much we're lacking mana fixing for the future, we should be screwed right now.
Side note: I doubt we're gonna get allied pain lands in Magic Origins. My guess is the 10 cycle of checklands (since they go really well with a turn 1 fetch).
I still think you're off your rocker. You are saying that 4 sets is not enough to create a stable base of mana?
Please note that KTK doesn't have a dual land cycle for the current standard. So obviously based on your opinion of how much we're lacking mana fixing for the future, we should be screwed right now.
Side note: I doubt we're gonna get allied pain lands in Magic Origins. My guess is the 10 cycle of checklands (since they go really well with a turn 1 fetch).
I'm saying it would have been easiest to provide mana fixing in DTK. If your solution is to put 10 rare lands in Origins, that works too. However, it's atypical. When was the last time we got a full 10 land cycle in one large set? Was it Tenth Edition? You're telling me that makes more sense than to just expect a 5 land cycle in a large set?
And I don't have any idea what you're talking about in regards to KTK. It has 5 rare dual lands, 5 uncommon trilands, and 10 common dual lands.
but something to give mana fixing to the post KTK/FRF standard would have been appreciated.
This thinking makes absolutely NO sense.
If anything the set needs dual lands for fixing within a limited environment, not standard. We have essentially a perfect mana base right now. We have AGGRESSIVE 3 color decks in standard, yes it might cost you some life from confluence, or if you're playing a tempo game you have to set up your come into play tap lands, but right now the mana base is essentially perfect, even if it's not "clean cycles".
Also when we have 2 and 3 color decks running devotion shenanigans with Nykthos, there is no reason for more dual lands in standard right now, all that will do is speed up the 5 color decks, and then the meta would be all 5 color good stuff. Do you really want that?
Second part about your statement which makes no sense is the part about AFTER KTK/FRF. When does that rotate without Dragons? They all rotate at the same time, and they rotate after the following sets:
Magic: Origins
Battle for Zendikar
Zendikar set #2
The next block
THEN THEY ROTATE
That leaves at least 3 sets to print cycles of duals and/or finish some cycles currently in standard. For example, it's fairly obvious that we're going to get Enemy Fetches reprinted in BFZ. Stranger things have occurred, but my guess is Wizards want's to pay off it's fans by having a standard format with all 10 fetches in it for the first time in magic history. This is also allowing for nearly perfect mana. Mana confluence will rotate, but Dragons is a single color block, and Zen is probably gonna be focused on mono colors too like last, so Mana Confluence isn't going to be needed.
Anyways I'm going to end it here, your logic makes zero sense. I can understand from a financial and excitement point of view, Wizards upset some people, but this is offset by the most popular casual creature type and some seriously pushed power level cards. Not to mention we're already seeing some majorly exciting cards from Magic Origins (and we've only seen 1 card).
Everyone needs to take a step back and chill the heck out.
To begin, I never said anything about the mana fixing in the current standard environment. It's very good and doesn't need additional fixing.
Before questioning my logic on the actual contents of my post, perhaps you should look at how rotation will be handled going forward? Khans of Tarkir and Fate Reforged rotate out separately from Dragons of Tarkir. DTK forms a pseudo block with Magic Origins. It would have made sense to form a land cycle between those two sets to transition into the 2-set block structure.
The post KTK/FRF standard will consist of:
Dragons of Tarkir (no mana fixing)
Magic Origins (ally painlands?)
Battle For Zendikar (enemy fetches?)
"Sweat" (?)
"Tears" (?)
In environments without shocks/ABUR duals, Fetchlands are not great at mana fixing. So, yes, I think it was reasonable and logical to expect mana fixing in DTK.
I still think you're off your rocker. You are saying that 4 sets is not enough to create a stable base of mana?
Please note that KTK doesn't have a dual land cycle for the current standard. So obviously based on your opinion of how much we're lacking mana fixing for the future, we should be screwed right now.
Side note: I doubt we're gonna get allied pain lands in Magic Origins. My guess is the 10 cycle of checklands (since they go really well with a turn 1 fetch).
LOL at someone rage commenting and being wrong.
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Storm Crow is strictly worse than Seacoast Drake.
The set isn't even out yet. You cannot make that claim. It's reasons like this which allowed me to pick up my Boros Reckoners for $2 at release.
I feel like dragons should have received the same sort of design enthusiasm and wholeness that warriors received during the block. You can tell by the warrior designs that they want that tribe to be a contender. I don't get that impression from the dragons at all. None of the dragons in this set come close to stormbreath, when they really should have had some surpass its power. The upcoming "dragon deck" is usually going to be the usual ramp stompy, but into worse targets than usual. It feels really off to me.
Feel free to tell me yours!
They specifically stated the exact amount of dragons, including rarities and cycles. There won't be a WUBRG dragon.
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Also I think the Taigam artwork will be for a new Quiet Contemplation, also based on that I think we will see a new cycle to mirror the one in Khans.
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I believe so. They've been giving us the full set on the last Friday. We will likely see it in an hour or so.
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I hope so. With over 100 cards left to be spoiled I hope we will see some more goodies
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Can't remember either but for what it's worth there are way more unspoiled cards than usually. I think it was about 80 in most other big sets, now its 137!
The only case of this that I recall was the spoiling of Boros Reckoner in Gatecrash.
I must admit that I do not remember lacking 11 rares on the last day. We can hope for something interesting.
Let this great clan rest in peace (2001-2011)
I still think you're off your rocker. You are saying that 4 sets is not enough to create a stable base of mana?
Please note that KTK doesn't have a dual land cycle for the current standard. So obviously based on your opinion of how much we're lacking mana fixing for the future, we should be screwed right now.
Side note: I doubt we're gonna get allied pain lands in Magic Origins. My guess is the 10 cycle of checklands (since they go really well with a turn 1 fetch).
( 0.0 )
=O ((U/R)) O=
(")(")
I'm an AI making Magic cards.
http://www.staalmedia.nl/nexus/#generate
I'm saying it would have been easiest to provide mana fixing in DTK. If your solution is to put 10 rare lands in Origins, that works too. However, it's atypical. When was the last time we got a full 10 land cycle in one large set? Was it Tenth Edition? You're telling me that makes more sense than to just expect a 5 land cycle in a large set?
And I don't have any idea what you're talking about in regards to KTK. It has 5 rare dual lands, 5 uncommon trilands, and 10 common dual lands.
UR Blue-Red Control
Modern:
UBR Grixis Control
UWR Jeskai Control
LOL at someone rage commenting and being wrong.