@KingOfTheSkep: Welcome to the forums! Unfortunately, the article does state that only 3 of the planeswalkers will be returning characters, including Teferi. So 2 of the characters you listed won't be getting a card. At least, this time around. I'm sure they'll consider continuing to make cards for old characters in more supplementary products.
Something else to keep in mind is that the planeswalker-commander and alternate legendary don't necessarily share much of a theme. There's little synergy between the new Teferi and Geralf, after all.
@Hexcel: Thanks for the warm welcome! You are so right! Taking your point into consideration, I stand by Freyalise since she's a half-elven fire mage (and Wizards spoke of doing different things with the colors for diversity of mono-colored decks). I'll also stick to Slobad both because of his difference to Chandra and because of his notoriety. Finally, Teferi. There are the 3 we know from Magic's past.
I suppose "Nahiri the Lithomancer" fits the "know but maybe not by name" slot the best... White deck, then?
That still leaves the black one... This is the most open-ended one especially if it's "a brand-new character but from a plane we've seen before", so I officially predict: Pinhead, Grander Cenobite (and cousin to Elesh Norn)!!!!!!
We already know Feldon is the red legend and if you want to make an artifact deck, you can just switch him with the red planeswalker. It seems like it would be terrible design to make the red deck an artifact deck, all decks can play artifacts and unless the new cards are specifically only red aligned; like Gauntlet of Might; then any decks can access them. I highly doubt the set wont be color balanced.
Feldon doesn't even mean you want to play with lots of artifacts like Muzzio does, he's basically a sneak attack from the GY and has as much synergy with dragons and other fun red fatties as he does with any artifacts.
If anything; the fact that people are already building Feldon artifact decks should be a sign that Slobad is unlikely to be the red planeswalker; since if we look at last years decks the new commanders seemed poised for different archetypes. (Oloro and Sedri, Roon and Derevi, Nekasaur and Jeleva)
I don't know a lot of the old lore, so I had to look up some of the names and I am seeing an inconsistency. People keep guessing Freyalise for the green walker, but she is referred to as a "fire mage".
Q: I have had no luck asking Maro about this, so maybe it isn't a question for him. How does time flow in the multiverse? Is it independent of each plane, as in if we go back in time in Tarkir it does not effect Ravnica's time, or is it connected, that when we go back in time in one plane, we go back in time in all planes?
A: We’ll have more to say about this closer to the release of Fate Reforged. Because of reasons.
What if the trip to the past to get Ugin allows Sarkhan/Sorin to retrieve Nahiri/Lithomancer from the past of Zendikar? In which case we might get her card in this block or in a theoretical Return to Zendikar block.
Something else from the WotC article (emphasis mine):
Early in development we invited the Magic creative team into the conversation to discuss just who our Planeswalker characters should be. Design had turned over versions of Ajani, Liliana, and Nissa, along with designs for red and blue Planeswalkers that didn't fit existing characters.
So, the White, Black, and Green walkers may be fairly similar to those three. If the White walker was similar to Ajani, that makes me feel it may be Serra. Seems like they share a lot of design choices, just think how perfect Ajani Goldmane would be as a Serra card. I would imagine the Black walker will be a necromancer of some sort due to the Liliana design. And if the Green one shares Nissa's new elementalist path. maybe Freyalise?
All that being said, my bets are on:
Three are characters you'll recognize from Magic's past: Teferi, Serra, Freyalise
One is a character you know but maybe not by name: Black Walker (not sure who though)
One is a brand-new character but from a plane you've seen before: Red Walker from Kaldheim
Anyway, this is fun. These are just pure speculation and wild guesses!
One more clue is in description of Angelic Field Marshal:
"What's more, she's perfect at defending your Planeswalker commander, should you choose to use her."
The "her" can be taken to refer either to Angelic Field Marshal or to "your Planeswalker commander", but I think it's more likely the second option. That means that whoever the white Planeswalker is, she's definitely female.
Well, Serra and Nahiri are both female, so this doesn't really solve anything, but still...
@Zygous: Oloro and Sydri are very different but also operate with the use of life gain. They functionally do different things. Slobad and Feldon can both feel and work differently while still incorporating artifacts. Red likes to sacrifice artifacts, so for Feldon to make an artifact token means that he's a little different from the typical red use of artifacts. Slobad can feel like a planeswalker version of Bosh. Any fire mage will feel like Chandra.
Also, Freyalise is a fire Mage, but she is green-aligned as a half-elf.
And I stand by my black PW being Pinhead, Grander Cenobite.
"Three are characters you'll recognize from Magic's past, one is a character you know but maybe not by name, and one is a brand-new character but from a plane you've seen before."
This returning character who we know but "maybe not by name" could potentially be Grandmother Sengir. Many players may not know she was a planeswalker, but some who follow continuity may remember her name from prerevisionist history or from the "Song for the Plague Rats" short story in The Secrets of Magic as Ravi Sengir. This would give a nod to the popular Sengir Vampire and the Baron himself, who we know has a decent following of fans.
While I believe Leshrac may be the best choice for black, Ravi may fit the bill for someone we know, but maybe not by name.
Granted, the problem with this hypothesis is that the article notes three planeswalkers from history and THEN one we may know but not by name, which suggests that only three are old-walkers. This could discount Ravi, unless the statement's vague nature allows the fourth suggested planeswalker to also be from before the Mending.
Of course, the arguments for Nahiri are also good, but I would hope a major character like that may appear in an actual set if she is still alive (and we seem to be slightly uncertain of what her status is). I suspect that since we keep getting hints of her that she will appear in the "Uncharted Realms" articles, and if that is the case, we'll see her in an actual set rather than a supplementary product.
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Dominian Scholar of the Old Guard, specializing in pre-revisionist (Armada comics) and revisionist (Brothers' War through Apocalypse)history
There are angels in Zendikar as well. Although their halos are at eye level. It remains to be seen but we can't confirm just from one angel spoiler. The art direction could just be a generic angel, with no indication of where the angel's from.
Maybe Wizards might think that Serra would be too powerful to print. She's quite a badass walker too, compared with the likes of Urza, Windgrace, and Freyalise.
However, if they could print Freyalise, there's every possibility Serra's in the running too.
A Planeswalker card does not represent his power, but how much he is willing to help you.
But "too awesome to be print" is a valid argument though. It is hard not to disappoint when hype is too high. Print an Urza or Yawgmoth would be tricky in that sense.
A Planeswalker card does not represent his power, but how much he is willing to help you.
But "too awesome to be print" is a valid argument though. It is hard not to disappoint when hype is too high. Print an Urza or Yawgmoth would be tricky in that sense.
I predict that when they print Yawgmoth, he will be the original Yawgmoth from The Thran. White/black Human Cleric.
I predict that when they print Yawgmoth, he will be the original Yawgmoth from The Thran. White/black Human Cleric.
I really like that idea. The healer with a perverted sense of the ends justifying the means. And speaking of Yawgmoth, it's interesting that he can finally be discussed as a god card thanks to the ideas from Theros. He could be a monoblack indestructible enchantment creature, but he doesn't have to be devotion based. I can't imagine what kind of card could appropriately demonstrate his character though.
I predict that when they print Yawgmoth, he will be the original Yawgmoth from The Thran. White/black Human Cleric.
I really like that idea. The healer with a perverted sense of the ends justifying the means. And speaking of Yawgmoth, it's interesting that he can finally be discussed as a god card thanks to the ideas from Theros. He could be a monoblack indestructible enchantment creature, but he doesn't have to be devotion based. I can't imagine what kind of card could appropriately demonstrate his character though.
Well, there are some funny lines of text that would fit (not all at once, of course).
"<cost>: Gain control of each creature with a +1/+1 counter." -- old Phyrexia was about augmenting flesh and corrupting it. Any opponent's creatures that are augmented are ready to be compleated.
"At the beginning of your upkeep, put a +1/+1 counter on each creature you control and a -1/-1 counter on each creature you don't control" -- Wizards say that they wouldn't put these two types of counters into the same block, but maybe in supplemental products...
"Whenever you sacrifice a nontoken creature, put a 1/1 black Newt creature token onto the battlefield. Whenever you sacrifice a Newt token, return target creature card from your graveyard to your hand."
"Whenever a creature you control dies, exile it. You may cast an instant or sorcery card from your graveyard without paying its mana cost. If a card cast this way would be put into a graveyard this turn, exile it instead."
"Whenever a planeswalker is put into a graveyard from the battlefield, that planeswalker's controller loses the game."
"Whenever Yawgmoth deals combat damage to an opponent, you gain control of that player. (This effect lasts indefinitely.) When you control all of your opponents, you win the game."
Yawgmoth as a god card has crossed my mind. His all creature ability could be infect. As for urza. I could see him as a 4 ability walker too satisfy people with his power level.
Myojin of Nights Reach is not a planeswalker, just a kami who sneaked between planes thanks to Mending time rifts.
Nights Reach is a sentient embodiment of black mana. The reason she can travel is because black mana exists on most all planes and the barrier around Kamigawa was weakened when O-Kagachi had to physically manifest to find the piece of itself Konda had stolen. It had noting to do with the mending.
"Know but not by name" doesn't sound like the Lithomancer. We do know her name as Nahiri. Has anyone compiled a list of all planeswalkers, known and unknown?
This is not confirmed.
Exactly, we only know, there was a planeswalker named Nahiri who USED a Hedron to bind Ob Nixilis.
We do NOT know, this Nahiri is the same person who CREATED the Zendikar Hedrons.
And it is exactly because we oficially don't know that Nahiri is indeed the Lithomancer that she she falls in the category "A planeswalker we know, but not by name". The hints leading to it are pretty strong though.
Heres your problem guys Doug Beyer recently state how stories are now told on the mothership so everyone can freely read them and know what's going on in the story. We had a recent Uncharted Realms about Sorin journey to Tarkir to find out why Ugin didn't show up on Zendikar. Sorin mentions how Nahiri's silence is troubling, but that Ugin should have definitely shown up. It would take an incredibly compelling reason for Sorin to mention a randomly unrelated person to the Eldrazi sealing while on his quest to find out why one of them didn't show up. That is Wizards officially telling us that Nahiri is the Lithomancer. Its to big of a hint to still be pretending vagueness on.
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WOut of the ground,I rise to grace...W BAfter the lights go out on you, after your worthless life is through. I will remember how you scream...B
Heres your problem guys Doug Beyer recently state how stories are now told on the mothership so everyone can freely read them and know what's going on in the story. We had a recent Uncharted Realms about Sorin journey to Tarkir to find out why Ugin didn't show up on Zendikar. Sorin mentions how Nahiri's silence is troubling, but that Ugin should have definitely shown up. It would take an incredibly compelling reason for Sorin to mention a randomly unrelated person to the Eldrazi sealing while on his quest to find out why one of them didn't show up. That is Wizards officially telling us that Nahiri is the Lithomancer. Its to big of a hint to still be pretending vagueness on.
I agree with you, but "a very big hint" is still different from "oficially stating that". While it is pretty safe to assume that Nahiri is indeed the Lithomancer, this information is nowhere to be found. That being said, The Lithomancer could be the planeswalker we know, but not by name, even when everyone is already calling it "Nahiri".
A Planeswalker card does not represent his power, but how much he is willing to help you.
But "too awesome to be print" is a valid argument though. It is hard not to disappoint when hype is too high. Print an Urza or Yawgmoth would be tricky in that sense.
Urza would get artifact-related abilities above all else. He's best known for creating the Legacy Weapon which includes Karn, Silver Golem and Skyship Weatherlight. Artifact tutoring seems like a good start, especially if he's WUB.
Yawgmoth would be a monoblack creature either with tutoring abilities of his own or resource manipulation similar to cards like Yawgmoth's Bargain, Yawgmoth's Will, Phyrexian Reclamation, and Phyrexian Arena. Given his title as "Father of Machines" and his general preference for artifact creatures, it would make sense if he had abilities related to those as well.
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MTGS Wikia Article about "New World Order"
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
PSA to everyone who keeps forgetting about the Reserved List:
You're on a website dedicated to talking about MtG. You're only a few keystrokes away from finding out what cards are on the Reserved List. You're also only a few keystrokes away from finding out why some cards on the Reserved List got foil printings in FtV, as Judge promos, or whatnot, as well as why that won't happen again. Stop doing this.
Myojin of Nights Reach is not a planeswalker, just a kami who sneaked between planes thanks to Mending time rifts.
Nights Reach is a sentient embodiment of black mana. The reason she can travel is because black mana exists on most all planes and the barrier around Kamigawa was weakened when O-Kagachi had to physically manifest to find the piece of itself Konda had stolen. It had noting to do with the mending.
It had everything to do with the mending.
She could travel from Kamigawa to Dominaria specifically because of the rift between the Talon Gates. That rift was much deeper than any other rift because Ravi rang the Apocalypse Chime and cleft the fabric of the world so deep that it reached Kamigawa. You'll note that Night's Reach has only ever manifested at MADARA or Kamigawa.
He essentially preemptively answers people's complaints about characters/planeswalkers not making it. Interestingly, one of his reasons why a character/planeswalker wouldn't be in C14 is "might exist in a similar mechanical design space to a more prominent character." A lot of people have said Jaya is too similar to Chandra to be the red planeswalker, and Doug pretty much confirmed that this is a line of reasoning they have followed when choosing who gets in.
I still think The Raven Man is a planeswalker and could be the "you know of him but not his name" walker commander.
True the black walker could be Leshrac and some other get the 'mystery man/woman' walker but....I have hopes
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Wizards. listen. The Vorthos community will await the consequences of the Eldrazi Titans' deaths/sealing. We will keep the watch.
“The wind whispers, ‘come home,’ but I cannot.”
— Teferi
Something else to keep in mind is that the planeswalker-commander and alternate legendary don't necessarily share much of a theme. There's little synergy between the new Teferi and Geralf, after all.
I suppose "Nahiri the Lithomancer" fits the "know but maybe not by name" slot the best... White deck, then?
That still leaves the black one... This is the most open-ended one especially if it's "a brand-new character but from a plane we've seen before", so I officially predict: Pinhead, Grander Cenobite (and cousin to Elesh Norn)!!!!!!
We already know Feldon is the red legend and if you want to make an artifact deck, you can just switch him with the red planeswalker. It seems like it would be terrible design to make the red deck an artifact deck, all decks can play artifacts and unless the new cards are specifically only red aligned; like Gauntlet of Might; then any decks can access them. I highly doubt the set wont be color balanced.
Feldon doesn't even mean you want to play with lots of artifacts like Muzzio does, he's basically a sneak attack from the GY and has as much synergy with dragons and other fun red fatties as he does with any artifacts.
If anything; the fact that people are already building Feldon artifact decks should be a sign that Slobad is unlikely to be the red planeswalker; since if we look at last years decks the new commanders seemed poised for different archetypes. (Oloro and Sedri, Roon and Derevi, Nekasaur and Jeleva)
Reprint Opt for Modern!!
FREE DIG THOROUGH TIME!
PLAY MORE ROUGE DECKS!
What if the trip to the past to get Ugin allows Sarkhan/Sorin to retrieve Nahiri/Lithomancer from the past of Zendikar? In which case we might get her card in this block or in a theoretical Return to Zendikar block.
Something else from the WotC article (emphasis mine):
So, the White, Black, and Green walkers may be fairly similar to those three. If the White walker was similar to Ajani, that makes me feel it may be Serra. Seems like they share a lot of design choices, just think how perfect Ajani Goldmane would be as a Serra card. I would imagine the Black walker will be a necromancer of some sort due to the Liliana design. And if the Green one shares Nissa's new elementalist path. maybe Freyalise?
All that being said, my bets are on:
Three are characters you'll recognize from Magic's past: Teferi, Serra, Freyalise
One is a character you know but maybe not by name: Black Walker (not sure who though)
One is a brand-new character but from a plane you've seen before: Red Walker from Kaldheim
Anyway, this is fun. These are just pure speculation and wild guesses!
EDH
WWWEight-and-a-Half-TailsWWW
"What's more, she's perfect at defending your Planeswalker commander, should you choose to use her."
The "her" can be taken to refer either to Angelic Field Marshal or to "your Planeswalker commander", but I think it's more likely the second option. That means that whoever the white Planeswalker is, she's definitely female.
Well, Serra and Nahiri are both female, so this doesn't really solve anything, but still...
Also, Freyalise is a fire Mage, but she is green-aligned as a half-elf.
And I stand by my black PW being Pinhead, Grander Cenobite.
This returning character who we know but "maybe not by name" could potentially be Grandmother Sengir. Many players may not know she was a planeswalker, but some who follow continuity may remember her name from prerevisionist history or from the "Song for the Plague Rats" short story in The Secrets of Magic as Ravi Sengir. This would give a nod to the popular Sengir Vampire and the Baron himself, who we know has a decent following of fans.
While I believe Leshrac may be the best choice for black, Ravi may fit the bill for someone we know, but maybe not by name.
Granted, the problem with this hypothesis is that the article notes three planeswalkers from history and THEN one we may know but not by name, which suggests that only three are old-walkers. This could discount Ravi, unless the statement's vague nature allows the fourth suggested planeswalker to also be from before the Mending.
Of course, the arguments for Nahiri are also good, but I would hope a major character like that may appear in an actual set if she is still alive (and we seem to be slightly uncertain of what her status is). I suspect that since we keep getting hints of her that she will appear in the "Uncharted Realms" articles, and if that is the case, we'll see her in an actual set rather than a supplementary product.
Maybe Wizards might think that Serra would be too powerful to print. She's quite a badass walker too, compared with the likes of Urza, Windgrace, and Freyalise.
However, if they could print Freyalise, there's every possibility Serra's in the running too.
UR Melek, Izzet ParagonUR, B Shirei, Shizo's CaretakerB, R Jaya Ballard, Task MageR,RW Tajic, Blade of the LegionRW, UB Lazav, Dimir MastermindUB, UB Circu, Dimir LobotomistUB, RWU Zedruu the GreatheartedRWU, GUBThe MimeoplasmGUB, UGExperiment Kraj UG, WDarien, King of KjeldorW, BMarrow-GnawerB, WBGKarador, Ghost ChieftainWBG, UTeferi, Temporal ArchmageU, GWUDerevi, Empyrial TacticianGWU, RDaretti, Scrap SavantR, UTalrand, Sky SummonerU, GEzuri, Renegade LeaderG, WUBRGReaper KingWUBRG, RGXenagos, God of RevelsRG, CKozilek, Butcher of TruthC, WUBRGGeneral TazriWUBRG, GTitania, Protector of ArgothG
But "too awesome to be print" is a valid argument though. It is hard not to disappoint when hype is too high. Print an Urza or Yawgmoth would be tricky in that sense.
Commander: WUBRG Superfriends, GW Rhys Tokens, WUBRG Scion of the Ur-Dragon
Kitchen Table (now that's real Magic): WUBRG Domain, GU Biovisionary, UB Korlash Grandeur, UW Merfolk Mill
I predict that when they print Yawgmoth, he will be the original Yawgmoth from The Thran. White/black Human Cleric.
I really like that idea. The healer with a perverted sense of the ends justifying the means. And speaking of Yawgmoth, it's interesting that he can finally be discussed as a god card thanks to the ideas from Theros. He could be a monoblack indestructible enchantment creature, but he doesn't have to be devotion based. I can't imagine what kind of card could appropriately demonstrate his character though.
Well, there are some funny lines of text that would fit (not all at once, of course).
"<cost>: Gain control of each creature with a +1/+1 counter." -- old Phyrexia was about augmenting flesh and corrupting it. Any opponent's creatures that are augmented are ready to be compleated.
"At the beginning of your upkeep, put a +1/+1 counter on each creature you control and a -1/-1 counter on each creature you don't control" -- Wizards say that they wouldn't put these two types of counters into the same block, but maybe in supplemental products...
"Whenever you sacrifice a nontoken creature, put a 1/1 black Newt creature token onto the battlefield. Whenever you sacrifice a Newt token, return target creature card from your graveyard to your hand."
"Whenever a creature you control dies, exile it. You may cast an instant or sorcery card from your graveyard without paying its mana cost. If a card cast this way would be put into a graveyard this turn, exile it instead."
"Whenever a planeswalker is put into a graveyard from the battlefield, that planeswalker's controller loses the game."
"Whenever Yawgmoth deals combat damage to an opponent, you gain control of that player. (This effect lasts indefinitely.) When you control all of your opponents, you win the game."
Nights Reach is a sentient embodiment of black mana. The reason she can travel is because black mana exists on most all planes and the barrier around Kamigawa was weakened when O-Kagachi had to physically manifest to find the piece of itself Konda had stolen. It had noting to do with the mending.
Heres your problem guys Doug Beyer recently state how stories are now told on the mothership so everyone can freely read them and know what's going on in the story. We had a recent Uncharted Realms about Sorin journey to Tarkir to find out why Ugin didn't show up on Zendikar. Sorin mentions how Nahiri's silence is troubling, but that Ugin should have definitely shown up. It would take an incredibly compelling reason for Sorin to mention a randomly unrelated person to the Eldrazi sealing while on his quest to find out why one of them didn't show up. That is Wizards officially telling us that Nahiri is the Lithomancer. Its to big of a hint to still be pretending vagueness on.
BAfter the lights go out on you, after your worthless life is through. I will remember how you scream...B
I agree with you, but "a very big hint" is still different from "oficially stating that". While it is pretty safe to assume that Nahiri is indeed the Lithomancer, this information is nowhere to be found. That being said, The Lithomancer could be the planeswalker we know, but not by name, even when everyone is already calling it "Nahiri".
Commander: WUBRG Superfriends, GW Rhys Tokens, WUBRG Scion of the Ur-Dragon
Kitchen Table (now that's real Magic): WUBRG Domain, GU Biovisionary, UB Korlash Grandeur, UW Merfolk Mill
Urza would get artifact-related abilities above all else. He's best known for creating the Legacy Weapon which includes Karn, Silver Golem and Skyship Weatherlight. Artifact tutoring seems like a good start, especially if he's WUB.
Yawgmoth would be a monoblack creature either with tutoring abilities of his own or resource manipulation similar to cards like Yawgmoth's Bargain, Yawgmoth's Will, Phyrexian Reclamation, and Phyrexian Arena. Given his title as "Father of Machines" and his general preference for artifact creatures, it would make sense if he had abilities related to those as well.
Every time I read a comment about "Well if this card had card draw/trample/haste/indestructible/hexproof/life gain...", I think "You're missing the point." They're armchair developer comments that fail to take into account the card's role in the greater Limited and Standard environment. No, it may not be as good as whatever card you're comparing it to. There's a reason for that. Not every burn spell is Lightning Bolt, nor does it need to be or should be.
RADAMARO, FIRST TO DESIRER
UKEFNET THE MINDFULU
GSASAYA, OROCHI ASCENDANTG
MODERN
RMONO-RED ELDRAZIR
This is Serra's greatest chance for a card, Nahiri can get someone else to save her
It had everything to do with the mending.
She could travel from Kamigawa to Dominaria specifically because of the rift between the Talon Gates. That rift was much deeper than any other rift because Ravi rang the Apocalypse Chime and cleft the fabric of the world so deep that it reached Kamigawa. You'll note that Night's Reach has only ever manifested at MADARA or Kamigawa.
http://dougbeyermtg.tumblr.com/post/101017516519/nice-to-have-you-back-answering-questions-i-have-a
He essentially preemptively answers people's complaints about characters/planeswalkers not making it. Interestingly, one of his reasons why a character/planeswalker wouldn't be in C14 is "might exist in a similar mechanical design space to a more prominent character." A lot of people have said Jaya is too similar to Chandra to be the red planeswalker, and Doug pretty much confirmed that this is a line of reasoning they have followed when choosing who gets in.
True the black walker could be Leshrac and some other get the 'mystery man/woman' walker but....I have hopes
The Vorthos community will await the consequences of the Eldrazi Titans' deaths/sealing. We will keep the watch.
“The wind whispers, ‘come home,’ but I cannot.”
— Teferi
RIGHT?!
Come on Serra!