Okay, seriously? I mean, I knew this was MTGS, but come on.
We've seen what, now? Thousand Winds, Jeskai Elder, the Mardu raid guy, Zurgo, and now this?
Three of those were in a duel deck and one is a release promo!
Here's the thing. The non-face preview cards of duel decks literally almost always suck. For HvM, we got Anax and Cymede, Cavalry Pegasus, and Ordeal of Purphoros. We did get Polukranos, which I'll give them, but a lot of people were complaining about how much he sucked too.
Is Dragon Throne of Tarkir a standard allstar? No, of course not. It's pretty awesome of Kemba EDH decks. It's pretty cool in draft. But no, you are unlikely to ever see a copy make its way into a standard decklist. It's jank outside EDH (and not very good in EDH outside of a few select decklists.)
Doesn't mean the set sucks. Spoiler season hasn't even begun. You do realize we haven't seen ANYTHING, essentially, right?
I absolutely love this card already. The design is just so very flavorful. Worst comes to worst, it's playable in casual. I'm also hoping this points to a Legendary subtheme, ala Kamigawa-done-right. I loved the ideas of Kamigawa block, just not the execution.
So far all the spoiled cards from the new expansion are really bad.
I hope it changes.
I have bad news for you: Khans will be both the worst and last Magic expansion (Maro will announce that on monday).
They have it all planned.
That's right.
Magic is dead! They killed it.
So far all the spoiled cards from the new expansion are really bad.
I hope it changes.
I have bad news for you: Khans will be both the worst and last Magic expansion (Maro will announce that on monday).
They have it all planned.
That's right.
Magic is dead! They killed it.
This just in! Chronicles 2 and fetch lands confirmed, standard will be full Storm Crows, the end is near!
Oh no, a card that was clearly not made for standard is bad in standard. Gaspity gasp gasp.
I wouldn't even play this in limited unless it's a limited format that generates ground stalls a lot.
Haha, I'll gladly take a "you win the game next turn" card in limited all the time.
Your post is almost as hilarious as the guy who claimed that Sliver Hivelord would still be junk if it costed 2WW.
Like I said, it's only good if the ground is stalled. It costs you two cards and a lot of mana to set up, it's not going to win you the game in a racing situation and unlike Overrun you can blow it out with any kind of removal or bounce spell.
Love that most of the people saying this is bad without knowing the upcomming new meta are the same who said Desecration Demon was trash and that would see no competitive play .... Yeah they were right in both cases
It WAS trash for over a year. It's basically impossible for anyone to predict four sets ahead of time.
Oh no, a card that was clearly not made for standard is bad in standard. Gaspity gasp gasp.
I wouldn't even play this in limited unless it's a limited format that generates ground stalls a lot.
Haha, I'll gladly take a "you win the game next turn" card in limited all the time.
Your post is almost as hilarious as the guy who claimed that Sliver Hivelord would still be junk if it costed 2WW.
Like I said, it's only good if the ground is stalled. It costs you two cards and a lot of mana to set up, it's not going to win you the game in a racing situation and unlike Overrun you can blow it out with any kind of removal or bounce spell.
Love that most of the people saying this is bad without knowing the upcomming new meta are the same who said Desecration Demon was trash and that would see no competitive play .... Yeah they were right in both cases
It WAS trash for over a year. It's basically impossible for anyone to predict four sets ahead of time.
Wanna know what else was thought fairly garbage for its time until people saw what applications it had? Pack Rat. Tarmogoyf also follows in this category. Even the eldrazi titans like Emrakul, the Aeons Torn were thought unplayable yet later on people did find a home for it in green ramp decks in standard, however this was also during the time that the previous set brought us the solidification of Cawblade with Stoneforge Mystic AND Jace, the Mind Sculptor. It is always the same with each rumor season, the actual goodstuff that isn't overtly obvious gets called garbage and then people wisen up and pick up a play set of what was originally thought to be garbage. Do I see the throne as goodstuff or garbage? At the moment it seems pretty good but I don't know what else is in the block.
Oh no, a card that was clearly not made for standard is bad in standard. Gaspity gasp gasp.
I wouldn't even play this in limited unless it's a limited format that generates ground stalls a lot.
Haha, I'll gladly take a "you win the game next turn" card in limited all the time.
Your post is almost as hilarious as the guy who claimed that Sliver Hivelord would still be junk if it costed 2WW.
Like I said, it's only good if the ground is stalled. It costs you two cards and a lot of mana to set up, it's not going to win you the game in a racing situation and unlike Overrun you can blow it out with any kind of removal or bounce spell.
Love that most of the people saying this is bad without knowing the upcomming new meta are the same who said Desecration Demon was trash and that would see no competitive play .... Yeah they were right in both cases
It WAS trash for over a year. It's basically impossible for anyone to predict four sets ahead of time.
Wanna know what else was thought fairly garbage for its time until people saw what applications it had? Pack Rat. Tarmogoyf also follows in this category. Even the eldrazi titans like Emrakul, the Aeons Torn were thought unplayable yet later on people did find a home for it in green ramp decks in standard, however this was also during the time that the previous set brought us the solidification of Cawblade with Stoneforge Mystic AND Jace, the Mind Sculptor. It is always the same with each rumor season, the actual goodstuff that isn't overtly obvious gets called garbage and then people wisen up and pick up a play set of what was originally thought to be garbage. Do I see the throne as goodstuff or garbage? At the moment it seems pretty good but I don't know what else is in the block.
Just to add to the list:
People thought Sphinx's Revelation was bad, this is why its pre order was under $5 ...
What more? Snapcaster Mage if you see the thread where he was posted here in the rumor mill you will see some people calling it good, others saying it was "almost playable" and them some saying unplayable.... ( and its pre order price was under $10 if i remenber...)
Love that most of the people saying this is bad without knowing the upcomming new meta are the same who said Desecration Demon was trash and that would see no competitive play .... Yeah they were right in both cases
Just because some predictions of card value are wrong does not mean all predictions of card value are wrong.
Some things are meta-indpendent. Many things are meta-independent.
Limited jank that sounds vaguely cool upon first reading, just like The Chain Veil.
The Chain Veil was limited jank? The Chain Veil is unplayable in limited <you doughnut>.
Flaming infraction issued. Mild flaming is still flaming. Please be respectful of your fellow users. - Wildfire393
Who know... we might get spoiled a way to "cheat" Legendary card into play for free. Or maybe a legendary creature with "When *cardname* etb - put equipment card from your hand into battlefield attached to *cardname*". Depending on CMC this wouldn't be OP.
Love that most of the people saying this is bad without knowing the upcomming new meta are the same who said Desecration Demon was trash and that would see no competitive play .... Yeah they were right in both cases
Yes i will remenber you that you can t say a card is trash before knowing the formart... If you want to say the card looks bad or that you can t farthorn any usages its ok but saying it is unplayable is stupid...
Yeah man all those people were so wrong about desecration demon it saw so much play in RTR Innistrad standard. Oh wait it saw almost no play in that format.
The real question is whether the power shrivel is at the bottom of its swing, or if wizards is going to push it further with khans.
When that card was spoiled, it was a year out of having prime times swinging with 4 valakuts. I don't think much of anyone anticipated how far wotc would reverse course
Love that most of the people saying this is bad without knowing the upcomming new meta are the same who said Desecration Demon was trash and that would see no competitive play .... Yeah they were right in both cases
Yes i will remenber you that you can t say a card is trash before knowing the formart... If you want to say the card looks bad or that you can t farthorn any usages its ok but saying it is unplayable is stupid...
Yeah man all those people were so wrong about desecration demon it saw so much play in RTR Innistrad standard. Oh wait it saw almost no play in that format.
The card is seening play today? yeah you are right people that called the demon to be trash were right because the demon never saw play in its time in standard and neither was a staple, now it is leaving standard and no one have never removed hin from the bulk rares box....
@Leslak: I actually searched the history for Snapcaster Mage when it first appeared and all posts in the first 3 pages are positive. Are you sure there are people that did not see this card's potential? For the other cards I agree, they were pretty underated when they were spoiled.
On topic: I could see this Dragon Throne being a limited bomb if the format is not fast but in Standard I really don't feel it can see play, even with the lowered power level that these new sets bring.
I said i saw people calling it good
people calling it to be good but not that much playable
can someone give a scenario on how this guy would be good? im not going against the millions of threads of people saying hes awesome. im just not seeing it. writers block i guess
I see this raising to about 20 while in standard, and then dipping down to fifteen, held afloat by the eternal demand. It's not as general purpose as bob or thoughtseize, keeping the prices from being completely outrageous. Seriously, get them now. they will be ten by the end off the week.
Love that most of the people saying this is bad without knowing the upcomming new meta are the same who said Desecration Demon was trash and that would see no competitive play .... Yeah they were right in both cases
Yes i will remenber you that you can t say a card is trash before knowing the formart... If you want to say the card looks bad or that you can t farthorn any usages its ok but saying it is unplayable is stupid...
Yeah man all those people were so wrong about desecration demon it saw so much play in RTR Innistrad standard. Oh wait it saw almost no play in that format.
The card is seening play today? yeah you are right people that called the demon to be trash were right because the demon never saw play in its time in standard and neither was a staple, now it is leaving standard and no one have never removed hin from the bulk rares box....
I smell butthurt....
What a card is doing i this format is irrelevent to the conversation that took place when the card was spoiled. cards exist within their formats. People always bring up stoneforge mystic and how people said it would be bad in standard. Well look at the cards that stoneforge mystic is known for getting. Swords batterskull and jitte. If you look at the standard stoneforge mystic was printed into none of these cards existed. Even in eternal formats im not sure if mystic would he played without batterskull.
The same can be said about JtMS. He was printed in a standard where jund was king the best card was BBE which jace is very bad against. Jace didnt become a powerhouse until zendikar mirrodin standard.
If desecration demon had been printed people had said it was bad and then it was played in the standard it was printed in then it would be correct to call out people who said it was bad.
Love that most of the people saying this is bad without knowing the upcomming new meta are the same who said Desecration Demon was trash and that would see no competitive play .... Yeah they were right in both cases
Yes i will remenber you that you can t say a card is trash before knowing the formart... If you want to say the card looks bad or that you can t farthorn any usages its ok but saying it is unplayable is stupid...
Yeah man all those people were so wrong about desecration demon it saw so much play in RTR Innistrad standard. Oh wait it saw almost no play in that format.
The card is seening play today? yeah you are right people that called the demon to be trash were right because the demon never saw play in its time in standard and neither was a staple, now it is leaving standard and no one have never removed hin from the bulk rares box....
I smell butthurt....
What a card is doing i this format is irrelevent to the conversation that took place when the card was spoiled. cards exist within their formats. People always bring up stoneforge mystic and how people said it would be bad in standard. Well look at the cards that stoneforge mystic is known for getting. Swords batterskull and jitte. If you look at the standard stoneforge mystic was printed into none of these cards existed. Even in eternal formats im not sure if mystic would he played without batterskull.
The same can be said about JtMS. He was printed in a standard where jund was king the best card was BBE which jace is very bad against. Jace didnt become a powerhouse until zendikar mirrodin standard.
If desecration demon had been printed people had said it was bad and then it was played in the standard it was printed in then it would be correct to call out people who said it was bad.
Soo you are saying people that claimed that JTMS and Stoneforge Mystic unplayable were right?
IMO people should say this card is not playable in this standard ... and i would agree...
But saying a card that is not a vanilla or a bad effect(do nothing) card will be bad/unplayable/trash without knowing the rest 230+ cards from the new set is stupidy.
This card is not good in standard, unless standard slows to a crazy low level, Wraths are unplayable, or spot removal becomes unplayable. This card is only only good if you have multiple creatures, one of which has to be big (at least 3/3 to justify playing this thing). So basically, unplayable against control, because it forces you to overextend. Against aggro this is iffy, you need ensure you hit lands and have a sizeable force of creatures to avoid being overrun. Against midrange, this is really iffy because you need an equipped creature large enough to get through your opponent and a few creatures to make it worth using the ability; ambushing is impractical as it costs 9 and requires a perfect set up (having the right creatures, your opponent not having a response, etc.). I think the only deck that could really use this thing is a Monogreen aggro deck. 4-8 One-drop dorks (if we get one in Khans), Courser of Kruphix, Polukranos, World Eater, Aspect of the Hydra, Swordwise Centaur, Nykthos, Shrine to Nyx, maybe Fated Intervention....even in this shell, you are vulnerable to Anger of the Gods and other sweepers. Long story short, this will see play at FNM, but I don't expect to see it at a professional event. Khans would have to have some weird stuff for this to be an actual deck.
If it weren't so absurdly expensive I'd say it has a pretty interesting interaction with Goblin Rabblemaster.
It's an EDH card I suppose. Looks like it fits in a token deck, preferably one where the general doesnt themselves have an tap ability like Krenko or Trostani. Elesh Norn might want this card, +4/+4 and trample seem like they'd work great with her
I just wanna live the dream of paying 2R with Kurkesh, Onakke Ancient on the field, and giving my creatures +2X/+2X and double trample.
It seems like it'd be easy enough to pull off, if the deck gets built right.
I just wanna live the dream of paying 2R with Kurkesh, Onakke Ancient on the field, and giving my creatures +2X/+2X and double trample.
It seems like it'd be easy enough to pull off, if the deck gets built right.
I was all giggly, drooling all over the place. Then I realized that the artifact gives the creature the ability. The only thing you'll be able to copy with Kurkesh is the Equip ability. Bummer. What a freaking waste of potential. Two cards, one set appart? a) They didn't see it. C'mon wiz. Or b) They think it's «broken». Is it? Don't think so. C'mon wiz.
C'mon wiz.
Private Mod Note
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Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
MODERN Blue Lantern, UBx Tezzerator. OLD SCHOOL 93/94 «The Pain Train» Black Sligh, Esper «Machine Gun» Artifacts, Jund «Psycho» Ponza-Disko.
I just wanna live the dream of paying 2R with Kurkesh, Onakke Ancient on the field, and giving my creatures +2X/+2X and double trample.
It seems like it'd be easy enough to pull off, if the deck gets built right.
We've seen what, now? Thousand Winds, Jeskai Elder, the Mardu raid guy, Zurgo, and now this?
Three of those were in a duel deck and one is a release promo!
Here's the thing. The non-face preview cards of duel decks literally almost always suck. For HvM, we got Anax and Cymede, Cavalry Pegasus, and Ordeal of Purphoros. We did get Polukranos, which I'll give them, but a lot of people were complaining about how much he sucked too.
Is Dragon Throne of Tarkir a standard allstar? No, of course not. It's pretty awesome of Kemba EDH decks. It's pretty cool in draft. But no, you are unlikely to ever see a copy make its way into a standard decklist. It's jank outside EDH (and not very good in EDH outside of a few select decklists.)
Doesn't mean the set sucks. Spoiler season hasn't even begun. You do realize we haven't seen ANYTHING, essentially, right?
WUBRGCommander Decklists - PaperWUBRG
CCCCCommander Decklists - TheorycraftCCCC
Sig Credit: Pegasus Bishop
avenger's gonna need haste if you want to pump with a freshly casted avenger.
UBRThe MindrazerRBU
UUUSpymaster of TrestGGG
GGGThe South TreeGGG
RRRHuman AscendantRRR
why are people struggling to convince themselves that this isn't a junk rare in every format?
UBRThe MindrazerRBU
UUUSpymaster of TrestGGG
GGGThe South TreeGGG
RRRHuman AscendantRRR
Haha, I'll gladly take a "you win the game next turn" card in limited all the time.
Your post is almost as hilarious as the guy who claimed that Sliver Hivelord would still be junk if it costed 2WW.
I have bad news for you: Khans will be both the worst and last Magic expansion (Maro will announce that on monday).
They have it all planned.
That's right.
Magic is dead! They killed it.
This just in! Chronicles 2 and fetch lands confirmed, standard will be full Storm Crows, the end is near!
Cheeri0sXWU
Reid Duke's Level One
Who's the Beatdown
Alt+0198=Æ
Like I said, it's only good if the ground is stalled. It costs you two cards and a lot of mana to set up, it's not going to win you the game in a racing situation and unlike Overrun you can blow it out with any kind of removal or bounce spell.
It WAS trash for over a year. It's basically impossible for anyone to predict four sets ahead of time.
Wanna know what else was thought fairly garbage for its time until people saw what applications it had? Pack Rat. Tarmogoyf also follows in this category. Even the eldrazi titans like Emrakul, the Aeons Torn were thought unplayable yet later on people did find a home for it in green ramp decks in standard, however this was also during the time that the previous set brought us the solidification of Cawblade with Stoneforge Mystic AND Jace, the Mind Sculptor. It is always the same with each rumor season, the actual goodstuff that isn't overtly obvious gets called garbage and then people wisen up and pick up a play set of what was originally thought to be garbage. Do I see the throne as goodstuff or garbage? At the moment it seems pretty good but I don't know what else is in the block.
Just to add to the list:
People thought Sphinx's Revelation was bad, this is why its pre order was under $5 ...
What more?
Snapcaster Mage if you see the thread where he was posted here in the rumor mill you will see some people calling it good, others saying it was "almost playable" and them some saying unplayable.... ( and its pre order price was under $10 if i remenber...)
The Chain Veil was limited jank? The Chain Veil is unplayable in limited <you doughnut>.
Flaming infraction issued. Mild flaming is still flaming. Please be respectful of your fellow users. - Wildfire393
Yeah man all those people were so wrong about desecration demon it saw so much play in RTR Innistrad standard. Oh wait it saw almost no play in that format.
When that card was spoiled, it was a year out of having prime times swinging with 4 valakuts. I don't think much of anyone anticipated how far wotc would reverse course
Wow
The card is seening play today? yeah you are right people that called the demon to be trash were right because the demon never saw play in its time in standard and neither was a staple, now it is leaving standard and no one have never removed hin from the bulk rares box....
I smell butthurt....
I said i saw people calling it good
people calling it to be good but not that much playable
I have to confess that i didn t see a truly : this card is not good in the rumor mill thread, and soo i went into new card forum:
just see that you were looking into new card discussion
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/magic-fundamentals/the-rumor-mill/new-card-discussion/235680-isd-why-is-snapcaster-mage-believed-to-be-so-good
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/the-game/standard-type-2/standard-archives/112127-snapcaster-mage
And here is the thread where it got spoiled:
http://www.mtgsalvation.com/forums/magic-fundamentals/the-rumor-mill/227893-isd-4-new-cards-from-pro-tour-preview
What a card is doing i this format is irrelevent to the conversation that took place when the card was spoiled. cards exist within their formats. People always bring up stoneforge mystic and how people said it would be bad in standard. Well look at the cards that stoneforge mystic is known for getting. Swords batterskull and jitte. If you look at the standard stoneforge mystic was printed into none of these cards existed. Even in eternal formats im not sure if mystic would he played without batterskull.
The same can be said about JtMS. He was printed in a standard where jund was king the best card was BBE which jace is very bad against. Jace didnt become a powerhouse until zendikar mirrodin standard.
If desecration demon had been printed people had said it was bad and then it was played in the standard it was printed in then it would be correct to call out people who said it was bad.
Soo you are saying people that claimed that JTMS and Stoneforge Mystic unplayable were right?
IMO people should say this card is not playable in this standard ... and i would agree...
But saying a card that is not a vanilla or a bad effect(do nothing) card will be bad/unplayable/trash without knowing the rest 230+ cards from the new set is stupidy.
It's an EDH card I suppose. Looks like it fits in a token deck, preferably one where the general doesnt themselves have an tap ability like Krenko or Trostani. Elesh Norn might want this card, +4/+4 and trample seem like they'd work great with her
It seems like it'd be easy enough to pull off, if the deck gets built right.
C'mon wiz.
OLD SCHOOL 93/94 «The Pain Train» Black Sligh, Esper «Machine Gun» Artifacts, Jund «Psycho» Ponza-Disko.
And it will take only 10 mana while at the time you can play an eldrazi creature or Kozilek, Butcher of Truth, Griselbrand,Avacyn, Angel of Hope, Iona, Shield of Emeria or god knows how many expensive spells that are actually good and cheaper then this!