The UK is about the size of 2 average US states. And not much bigger than the state I live in. We never get a GP or GPT.... and oh yeah few, if any PT events.
What do you mean no gpts?? I get them all the time in Scotland. Though I'll give you the GP. The big problem is that based in Scotland any gp just takes ages to travel to
The UK is about the size of 2 average US states. And not much bigger than the state I live in. We never get a GP or GPT.... and oh yeah few, if any PT events.
What do you mean no gpts?? I get them all the time in Scotland. Though I'll give you the GP. The big problem is that based in Scotland any gp just takes ages to travel to
I think he means the US state he lives in never gets events.
I can't really complain too much I guess, Australia/NZ pretty much gets a guaranteed 2 GPs per year, alternating between 4 cities, so the city I live in gets an 8 slot PTQ, I mean GP every second year.
The UK is about the size of 2 average US states. And not much bigger than the state I live in. We never get a GP or GPT.... and oh yeah few, if any PT events.
What do you mean no gpts?? I get them all the time in Scotland. Though I'll give you the GP. The big problem is that based in Scotland any gp just takes ages to travel to
I think he means the US state he lives in never gets events.
I can't really complain too much I guess, Australia/NZ pretty much gets a guaranteed 2 GPs per year, alternating between 4 cities, so the city I live in gets an 8 slot PTQ, I mean GP every second year.
Oops yeah, thanks for the correction, misread him.
The only Grand Prix trial I could go to last season was in another state. Far enough away I had to get a hotel room the night before to be able to get there the day of the event without having to get up at like 5-6 am.
Now that magic has seen a huge boon in popularity we had a few gpts here this year. Still had to drive 9 hours one way for a GP. We get PTQs all the time. But dang near any local games store can host them provided they are willing staff it and and provide good prize support. I don't think we've ever had a pro-tour even in this state.
To be clear I want to say that I think this is a *****ty move. It dicks over anyone that doesn't live near the major hotspots that allways have big stuff going on (likely to host the regional events). So yeah it hurts a lot of american players just as much as it does non-american players.
They can't give more and more invites to PTs, and this is a way to cut down on the number of PT invites. Nobody wants there to be fewer PT invites (except for people already going), so whatever way they did this would make people sad.
Well, why can't they give more and more PT invites?
Because PTs are special. They are the best of the best. The more players you add, these each of those statements is true. They wanted PTs at somewhere around 300 a little over a year ago, and the last PT was ~400. They had to cut back somewhere, and as mentioned above, this does increase overall skill on the PT meaning my second statement above becomes more true.
Pro Tour Born of the Gods was won by someone who qualified from a PTQ. Qualifying by PTQ does not mean that you don't have skill.
I didn't say that they weren't, just that on average, PTQ players are worse. If they are good enough, they will have an even better chance to qualify under the new system, meaning we get better players overall on the PT, and some of them may win a PT too. Many players on the PT originally qualified through PTQs. This new system just helps the best players qualify from each region, in theory, thereby holding up the tradition of the best of the best playing in the biggest tournaments in Magic. There is a reason that the 4 majors of golf and tennis are by invitation or qualifiers, this is no different, they just changed the qualification criteria to help better players rise to the top of the PTQs.
Edit: I did have a typo that made my original post unclear I guess. It should say the more players they add, the less each of those statements is true.
I'm worried about this myself. I mean, I live in Alaska. There's no way we'll have a regional qualifier to ourselves here. So I win a PTQQ and now I have to travel to Seattle or Portland (most likely), on my own dime? On a months notice? I mean, airfare isn't cheap flying from up here and a months notice makes that worse! All for just another qualifier? I can't even imagine the costs for people in Mexico/Central/South America or the APAC region!
This works, in theory, in the Lower 48 and Canada (to an extent) and Europe. But everywhere else this is just a mess!
Interestingly, these PTQ-Q's must be HJ'd by a Level 2 or higher judge--and they just made Level 2 a little harder to get than before. Seems like there could be an issue with that, in some regions--what if the only local Level 2 won't work your store's event--or wants to play?
Winning a PTQ-Q to go to any PTQ worldwide seems like it can create some interesting decisions as well. For example, let's say you live in one of the areas that's previously been having these 200, 300, or 400+ person PTQ's. Under the new system you qualify for a PTQ by winning a local PTQ-Q; do you travel to your local, probably 128+ person PTQ, and hope to Top 8 your way into the Pro Tour? Or do you try traveling to some region which didn't hold too many PTQ-Q's, and try to get on the Pro Tour by getting Top 4 in a field of 30? The net result could be that even the Non-US PTQ's see increased attendance from US PTQ-Q winners, leading to a greater chance of one of them getting the Pro Tour invite and an even more US-heavy Pro Tour.
For now, though, I'd caution everyone to not panic; we will get some more details in the coming weeks, and hopefully some of the questions will be answered.
I'm worried about this myself. I mean, I live in Alaska. There's no way we'll have a regional qualifier to ourselves here. So I win a PTQQ and now I have to travel to Seattle or Portland (most likely), on my own dime? On a months notice? I mean, airfare isn't cheap flying from up here and a months notice makes that worse! All for just another qualifier? I can't even imagine the costs for people in Mexico/Central/South America or the APAC region!
This works, in theory, in the Lower 48 and Canada (to an extent) and Europe. But everywhere else this is just a mess!
This is my first thought as well, it won't be good for rural or international regions. I'm guessing they saw this coming (it's pretty obvious) and had a plan to makes sure it ends up not being too bad for those groups. Time will tell though
I'm worried about this myself. I mean, I live in Alaska. There's no way we'll have a regional qualifier to ourselves here. So I win a PTQQ and now I have to travel to Seattle or Portland (most likely), on my own dime? On a months notice? I mean, airfare isn't cheap flying from up here and a months notice makes that worse! All for just another qualifier? I can't even imagine the costs for people in Mexico/Central/South America or the APAC region!
This works, in theory, in the Lower 48 and Canada (to an extent) and Europe. But everywhere else this is just a mess!
This is my first thought as well, it won't be good for rural or international regions. I'm guessing they saw this coming (it's pretty obvious) and had a plan to makes sure it ends up not being too bad for those groups. Time will tell though
I have a little faith but, like I said, I'm worried. I mean, it's super expensive and somewhat unreasonable for them to cover travel costs for PTQQ winners on top of the travel costs for PT qualifiers. But it's also unreasonable to ask somebody from places like Alaska or Hawai'i to pay their own way to a tournament they had to qualify for.
I'm thinking of emailing Wizards about this tomorrow...
" 3 in Mexico, Central America, and South America" LOL
Is amusing how wizards keep ignoring us, i know we might not be the most profitable region, but that is because they are doing a horrible job with their "official" designed suppliers for our region. 3 PTQs for about 15+ countries... dammn
You think APAC got a better deal? same number but the distance we have to travel is much more than you.
imho, this new Regional PTQ thing is just not gonna work for everyone.
yes, wotc wants to limit the number of people entering the PT, so limit the number of PTQs then.
im saying this from someone coming from a third world country (Philippines).
people winning PTQs before had their once in a long time shot of being able to travel and play at the highest level.
not many people travel abroad for GPs compared to say, HK, where Im currently living at.
people generally take a big amount of consideration already when deciding when they want to play in a GP outside the country, now, wotc shoved this and basically forcing one to either spend more in travel for a CHANCE at a PT.
geeeez, if regional PTs are in the same country then yes, it benefits those from said country.
if not, then how many will actually go to these Regional ones?
maybe people would rather go to a GP instead, at least they have a chance at something better, like day 2 money finish or more events.
This is frankly just being ignorant. People dont complain that expensive things exist, they get annoyed when there are no alternatives to the expensive versions of cards.
Its a card game. People want to play the card game. They arent mad that certain pieces of cardboard are rare and collectable. They get upset when there arent alternative printings that allow them to play the game.
Exactly, Britain needs more tournaments, not less, as a Brit, I could guarantee you that if Starcity hosted even just 1 Open Series Event a month in the UK it would get large attendance.
Honestly, for the PTQ grinders in the Midwest US, this is a welcome change. I've spent countless hours driving through the middle of the night from PTQ to PTQ every season. More recently there have been lots of local PTQs but i'm still hitting the road for 4-5 hours at a time for every PTQ i could. I can now focus on winning one of the 10 or so local ptqqs and save myself lots of time and money hitting the grinding road. Hopfully that money can go towards attending more GP's farther away.
I do think this is the wrong answer to PTQ's getting too large. Regionalizing PTQs period would have worked, I.E. You must live withing X hours/miles of a PTQ to play, but the logistics of it and the burden it places on TO's isn't possible without huge upgrades to wizards software. Or, why not put a limit on the # of PTQ's a player can attend if PTQ's are getting too large. There has to be a better way for the Non-Midwest US to work.
I don't believe at all they are trying to reduce the number of players attending the Pro Tour, they added a ton of slots through the GP circuit.
I also think this might be a death knell to modern prices for the time being. Very few stores will want to run PTQqs of modern, as it currently has the lowest appeal to those not invested in the format.
At the end of the day, premier events like the Pro Tour should want to grow, not reduce or stay Stagnant. Look at the Olympics, they constantly revel in the fact that each time has more competitors than the last and they Occasionally add new events as well.
I think the best way to deal with this is to have the regional PTQ's have special promos. If there are only 3100 people (Assuming an average 100 people at each event) with a promo, and if they are of good cards, most people going to a regional PTQ should get some of their money back from those. Not to mention prize packs.
Please wizards, make wining a PTQQ actually worth doing other than just getting the reward of travelling and a another hoop to climb through.
The UK is about the size of 2 average US states. And not much bigger than the state I live in. We never get a GP or GPT.... and oh yeah few, if any PT events.
Are you serious?
The average US state has something near to about 4.5 million people. The UK has 63 million.
The UK is about the size of California, New York and Florida combined. Yet we only get one GP a year, usually in a format no one wants, like Sealed or Block. And now we're only going to get a single PTQ per year. So we'll be sending about 4 players to the pro tour. The system is pretty much biased against there ever being a strong UK presence.
The UK region includes the Republic of Ireland (the size and population of which alone are comparable to UserMerged759678's homestate Alabama), so the numbers are even more skewed in the direction you are arguing for.
Also, given the general lack of tournaments in the Nordic countries and that it's generally as easy, or easier, to travel to London from Norway or Denmark than to a location in say, Finland, it suffices to say that the UK really should have more tournament support.
Im concerned since the only time I ever got to go to a PTQ was during the Modern season since I only play Modern. But now no store is going to host a Modern event. It likely will be Standard and Sealed since it makes them the most money and sells more singles. Now im SOL and I likely wont ever be able to participate in these events. If Wizards FORCED stores to do a certain format ever season it would be way more fair.
This change seems unfortunate for Modern-only players, but on the bright side, you guys recently got SCG Premier IQs. Unless you actually care about the playing on the Pro Tour (which I doubt, since you're not also grinding Block, Standard, or Limited), this is a net win. I will gladly take well-run SCG Opens (or in Modern's case, Premier IQs) nearly every weekend with generous prize support over playing in an often disorganized PTQ (depending on the TO) with poor prize support because of the disproportionate value that others assign to the airfare associated with the PT invite.
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Due to real-life obligations, I am taking a long break from Magic which may include missing the local Legacy GP. Apologies for not being able to keep my threads updated.
Honestly, for the PTQ grinders in the Midwest US, this is a welcome change. I've spent countless hours driving through the middle of the night from PTQ to PTQ every season. More recently there have been lots of local PTQs but i'm still hitting the road for 4-5 hours at a time for every PTQ i could. I can now focus on winning one of the 10 or so local ptqqs and save myself lots of time and money hitting the grinding road. Hopfully that money can go towards attending more GP's farther away.
I do think this is the wrong answer to PTQ's getting too large. Regionalizing PTQs period would have worked, I.E. You must live withing X hours/miles of a PTQ to play, but the logistics of it and the burden it places on TO's isn't possible without huge upgrades to wizards software. Or, why not put a limit on the # of PTQ's a player can attend if PTQ's are getting too large. There has to be a better way for the Non-Midwest US to work.
I don't believe at all they are trying to reduce the number of players attending the Pro Tour, they added a ton of slots through the GP circuit.
I also think this might be a death knell to modern prices for the time being. Very few stores will want to run PTQqs of modern, as it currently has the lowest appeal to those not invested in the format.
This is my thoughts. I honestly don't feel like this is a move by blizzard to "limit" people who qualify to the pro-tour. I could be wrong, but on paper this could actually make it easier to qualify.
As it stands now, the only way to "qualify" is top to 4/8 a GP or WIN a 200+ man PTQ. The rule change could actually make it easier for someone to qualify if they regularly top 8 at major tournaments.
I do dislike how there will be no designated "season". I kind of hope Wizard back-tracks on that : /
Interestingly, these PTQ-Q's must be HJ'd by a Level 2 or higher judge--and they just made Level 2 a little harder to get than before. Seems like there could be an issue with that, in some regions--what if the only local Level 2 won't work your store's event--or wants to play?
This is an issue I have with this new system, sure there's more than 3,000 stores that are eligible to host one of the preliminary PTQs, but realistically how many of these store have access to a local judge that will be able to do it? Some areas would likely have to find a judge in their state or region and then pay that judge to come and run their event, but how many are going to be willing or able to do that?
This pretty much throws a wrench in this whole system and could lead to a lot of stores just not bothering with the PPTQs simply because it's not possible or economical for them.
I have a clarification question: is the only way to qualify for the regional PTQ to win (first place) a Qualifying PTQ?
If that's the case... someone should petition wizard to make that change.
Having to win first place (out of 200+) to simply qualify for a chance to qualify for the PT... seems nuts.
I honestly don't feel like this is a move by blizzard ...
blizzard?
time to weigh in from the UK. events (right now) are few and far-between. getting to them usually requires stays overnight in hotels, expensive transport and really tight planning among friends. Saying that, the events are numerous enough that they at least take place in several locations.
They are also pretty big. the PTQ i went to last weekend sold out of places (300 players), and a few of my friends were unable to attend because of lack of space. if several of my friends had this problem, you can bet that hundreds of others had similar issues. there is a desire to play in large events in the UK, but there simply isn't the space or number of events to support the large number of players. we need more tournaments to support this playerbase - fact.
I see these changes reducing the number of large events in the UK. sure, we'll get a bunch of tiny events, in a similar vein to a well-populated prerelease or something, but that's not the same.
these changes are poorly considered. i can't speak legitimately for the rest of the world, but i am sure other countries are also getting the short straw, as we are.
we need MORE events, not less! the players want to play! not fork out huge wads of cash for travel and accommodation expenses so they can grind through two tiers of tournaments which are likely to be hundreds of miles away from where you live!
1st place for the plane ticket is FINE. just hold more PTQ events! don't bother with extra tiers and then award the top 8 with plane tickets. you could hold 8 PTQ events for the same effect and make more players happy by having tournaments closer to their region!
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What do you mean no gpts?? I get them all the time in Scotland. Though I'll give you the GP. The big problem is that based in Scotland any gp just takes ages to travel to
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Vintage: NA
I think he means the US state he lives in never gets events.
I can't really complain too much I guess, Australia/NZ pretty much gets a guaranteed 2 GPs per year, alternating between 4 cities, so the city I live in gets an 8 slot PTQ, I mean GP every second year.
Oops yeah, thanks for the correction, misread him.
Now that magic has seen a huge boon in popularity we had a few gpts here this year. Still had to drive 9 hours one way for a GP. We get PTQs all the time. But dang near any local games store can host them provided they are willing staff it and and provide good prize support. I don't think we've ever had a pro-tour even in this state.
I didn't say that they weren't, just that on average, PTQ players are worse. If they are good enough, they will have an even better chance to qualify under the new system, meaning we get better players overall on the PT, and some of them may win a PT too. Many players on the PT originally qualified through PTQs. This new system just helps the best players qualify from each region, in theory, thereby holding up the tradition of the best of the best playing in the biggest tournaments in Magic. There is a reason that the 4 majors of golf and tennis are by invitation or qualifiers, this is no different, they just changed the qualification criteria to help better players rise to the top of the PTQs.
Edit: I did have a typo that made my original post unclear I guess. It should say the more players they add, the less each of those statements is true.
Check out http://www.mtgbrodeals.com/author/john-murphy/ for my EDH articles!
This works, in theory, in the Lower 48 and Canada (to an extent) and Europe. But everywhere else this is just a mess!
Then I clicked at the bottom New WPN Page and was immediately punched in the face by the new website.
God I miss the old website, lol.
Winning a PTQ-Q to go to any PTQ worldwide seems like it can create some interesting decisions as well. For example, let's say you live in one of the areas that's previously been having these 200, 300, or 400+ person PTQ's. Under the new system you qualify for a PTQ by winning a local PTQ-Q; do you travel to your local, probably 128+ person PTQ, and hope to Top 8 your way into the Pro Tour? Or do you try traveling to some region which didn't hold too many PTQ-Q's, and try to get on the Pro Tour by getting Top 4 in a field of 30? The net result could be that even the Non-US PTQ's see increased attendance from US PTQ-Q winners, leading to a greater chance of one of them getting the Pro Tour invite and an even more US-heavy Pro Tour.
For now, though, I'd caution everyone to not panic; we will get some more details in the coming weeks, and hopefully some of the questions will be answered.
This is my first thought as well, it won't be good for rural or international regions. I'm guessing they saw this coming (it's pretty obvious) and had a plan to makes sure it ends up not being too bad for those groups. Time will tell though
Check out http://www.mtgbrodeals.com/author/john-murphy/ for my EDH articles!
I have a little faith but, like I said, I'm worried. I mean, it's super expensive and somewhat unreasonable for them to cover travel costs for PTQQ winners on top of the travel costs for PT qualifiers. But it's also unreasonable to ask somebody from places like Alaska or Hawai'i to pay their own way to a tournament they had to qualify for.
I'm thinking of emailing Wizards about this tomorrow...
You think APAC got a better deal? same number but the distance we have to travel is much more than you.
yes, wotc wants to limit the number of people entering the PT, so limit the number of PTQs then.
im saying this from someone coming from a third world country (Philippines).
people winning PTQs before had their once in a long time shot of being able to travel and play at the highest level.
not many people travel abroad for GPs compared to say, HK, where Im currently living at.
people generally take a big amount of consideration already when deciding when they want to play in a GP outside the country, now, wotc shoved this and basically forcing one to either spend more in travel for a CHANCE at a PT.
geeeez, if regional PTs are in the same country then yes, it benefits those from said country.
if not, then how many will actually go to these Regional ones?
maybe people would rather go to a GP instead, at least they have a chance at something better, like day 2 money finish or more events.
"The Planeswalker Points multiplier will be x4 for Preliminary PTQs and x8 for Regional PTQs"
I do think this is the wrong answer to PTQ's getting too large. Regionalizing PTQs period would have worked, I.E. You must live withing X hours/miles of a PTQ to play, but the logistics of it and the burden it places on TO's isn't possible without huge upgrades to wizards software. Or, why not put a limit on the # of PTQ's a player can attend if PTQ's are getting too large. There has to be a better way for the Non-Midwest US to work.
I don't believe at all they are trying to reduce the number of players attending the Pro Tour, they added a ton of slots through the GP circuit.
I also think this might be a death knell to modern prices for the time being. Very few stores will want to run PTQqs of modern, as it currently has the lowest appeal to those not invested in the format.
My wife was on MTV with this video.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BUutIZg2EpU
I think the best way to deal with this is to have the regional PTQ's have special promos. If there are only 3100 people (Assuming an average 100 people at each event) with a promo, and if they are of good cards, most people going to a regional PTQ should get some of their money back from those. Not to mention prize packs.
Please wizards, make wining a PTQQ actually worth doing other than just getting the reward of travelling and a another hoop to climb through.
The UK region includes the Republic of Ireland (the size and population of which alone are comparable to UserMerged759678's homestate Alabama), so the numbers are even more skewed in the direction you are arguing for.
Also, given the general lack of tournaments in the Nordic countries and that it's generally as easy, or easier, to travel to London from Norway or Denmark than to a location in say, Finland, it suffices to say that the UK really should have more tournament support.
This change seems unfortunate for Modern-only players, but on the bright side, you guys recently got SCG Premier IQs. Unless you actually care about the playing on the Pro Tour (which I doubt, since you're not also grinding Block, Standard, or Limited), this is a net win. I will gladly take well-run SCG Opens (or in Modern's case, Premier IQs) nearly every weekend with generous prize support over playing in an often disorganized PTQ (depending on the TO) with poor prize support because of the disproportionate value that others assign to the airfare associated with the PT invite.
Legacy
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GB Elves GB
UBR ANT UBR
RG Combo Lands RG
Vintage
BUG BUG Fish BUG
Modern
GBW
Junk PodMagic: the BuylistingThis is my thoughts. I honestly don't feel like this is a move by blizzard to "limit" people who qualify to the pro-tour. I could be wrong, but on paper this could actually make it easier to qualify.
As it stands now, the only way to "qualify" is top to 4/8 a GP or WIN a 200+ man PTQ. The rule change could actually make it easier for someone to qualify if they regularly top 8 at major tournaments.
I do dislike how there will be no designated "season". I kind of hope Wizard back-tracks on that : /
Twitter: twitter.com/axmanonline
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Current Decks
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Standard: BW Control
Legacy: Death and Taxes :symw::symr:
Vintage: NA
This is an issue I have with this new system, sure there's more than 3,000 stores that are eligible to host one of the preliminary PTQs, but realistically how many of these store have access to a local judge that will be able to do it? Some areas would likely have to find a judge in their state or region and then pay that judge to come and run their event, but how many are going to be willing or able to do that?
This pretty much throws a wrench in this whole system and could lead to a lot of stores just not bothering with the PPTQs simply because it's not possible or economical for them.
If that's the case... someone should petition wizard to make that change.
Having to win first place (out of 200+) to simply qualify for a chance to qualify for the PT... seems nuts.
Twitter: twitter.com/axmanonline
Stream: twitch.tv/axman
Current Decks
Modern: Affinity
Standard: BW Control
Legacy: Death and Taxes :symw::symr:
Vintage: NA
blizzard?
time to weigh in from the UK. events (right now) are few and far-between. getting to them usually requires stays overnight in hotels, expensive transport and really tight planning among friends. Saying that, the events are numerous enough that they at least take place in several locations.
They are also pretty big. the PTQ i went to last weekend sold out of places (300 players), and a few of my friends were unable to attend because of lack of space. if several of my friends had this problem, you can bet that hundreds of others had similar issues. there is a desire to play in large events in the UK, but there simply isn't the space or number of events to support the large number of players. we need more tournaments to support this playerbase - fact.
I see these changes reducing the number of large events in the UK. sure, we'll get a bunch of tiny events, in a similar vein to a well-populated prerelease or something, but that's not the same.
these changes are poorly considered. i can't speak legitimately for the rest of the world, but i am sure other countries are also getting the short straw, as we are.
we need MORE events, not less! the players want to play! not fork out huge wads of cash for travel and accommodation expenses so they can grind through two tiers of tournaments which are likely to be hundreds of miles away from where you live!
1st place for the plane ticket is FINE. just hold more PTQ events! don't bother with extra tiers and then award the top 8 with plane tickets. you could hold 8 PTQ events for the same effect and make more players happy by having tournaments closer to their region!