Jace bounce was a -1. He could do it 3 times before he would die. Liliana can only do it once before having to do her +1. Overall very disappointed with her unless we get Madness.
Crap, you're right, she's not as good as one of the single most overpowered cards ever printed. Unplayable!
couldn't you play astral for xx1 then vorel on 2 with land played plus astal for 3?
narr
when it says XXX, it means you can pay 0, 3, 6, 9, etc. You can play it for 0 with no counters on it, but vorel will be useless since he needs a counter to already be on it to proliferate it
Well, this is a huge dump of interesting stuff all right. Those naysayers who said the set is terrible may be proven wrong; some good rares in the notes and a ton of interesting commons/uncommons to boot.
Interesting things that pique my interest:
Acolyte's Reward: Certainly an interesting card, and one that could easily see play as a White Weenie reach card. I can forseeably see this being on par with Lightning Strike. It severely punishes big creature strategies, such as Mono-Green. Could really give pause to a Mono-Black player when you attack into their Desecration Demon on turn 4. Six damage to the face will *really* hurt on turn 4.
Akroan Conscriptor: This is actually an interesting top-end for heroic decks. Zealous Conscripts was a thing, after all, and although this is definitely not *that* good(No haste, doesn't require set-up to use), being able to reuse it could prove somewhat interesting. I like it as an uncommon, even though I doubt it will see any serious play. It's a fun card. Good fun to be had, but that's about it.
Aspect of the Hydra: Bwahahahahaha. This combat trick is just dumb. In the "I just hit you for 9 on turn 3 with a BTE" sort of way. I imagine there will be much feel bads due to this card. Certainly playable as a trick I imagine, as green has zero problem making this a Giant Growth at the worst on turn 3. Getting this any higher is just insane. Once again, gives pause to the black player when you attack into that untapped Desecration Demon.
Astral Cornucopia: EDH card methinks, and possible applications in standard. Combine with Cloud Key and Etherium Sculptor in other formats(I'm fairly certain it doesn't reduce it completely, but it could reduce it significantly). I'm not sure if Modern Affinity wants this(I know jack all about the format), but given that it can cost 0 if you want, it could do something. This is quite good.
Courser of Kruphix: Virtual card advantage this is. It's a reasonably costed devotion enabler that doubles as virtual card advantage. Works somewhat nicely with Domri Rade, as you will always know when it's profitable to tick him up or not. If only there was some permanent in green being printed in BNG that let you play extra lands each turn that benefits from having a more defensive creature on the board. Ho-well, we can't have it all.
Dawn to Dusk: Well, this is one way to gain huge advantages in limited, and push enchantment in constructed.
Eidolon of Countless Battle: And here we have another possibly constructed playable bestow creature. It's reasonably costed and could easily get out of hand even with just the creature side. Curves perfectly with a certain Mythic in the set, and couples with his abilities almost perfectly.
Fall of the Hammer: One sided fight, at instant speed. Pit Fight hasn't seen play, but then again Pit Fight isn't one-sided.
Gild: God killer and ramp. Could see play, but sorcery speed really hurts it. That said, more controlly decks would like to have the extra mana sitting around.
Loyal Pegasus: Will see play in WW. That's about all I can say on it, although it is a very good 1-drop.
Marshmist Titan: Gross. Aggro killer. Won't see play really, as mono-black devotion wants other things, but it's fine. I just don't like it for personal reasons (It knows what it did).
Perplexing Chimera: Alright, seems jank... wait, I get to gain control of permanents? I can have your Desecration Demon. Or your Jace? Or your Downfall? Or... okay, I have found my must have card of the set. May not see play, but damn if it isn't strong.
Sunbond: I get it! It makes your creatures into kind-of Archangel of Thunes. Seem fun, but janky.
Vortex Elemental: Oh, it's a 0/1 for 1. Meh... wait a tick. It's shuffle ability is just 1? And it has the ability to force multiple blocks if you can (Doubtful)? I find this extremely funny with Dangerous, and can be a huge tempo play. I like this one a ton, particularly against G/R. I think it might be playable somewhere in the 75. Considering it plays well with Master of Waves means it could find a home in Mono-U.
Whims of the Fates: Completely terrible red rare of the set. Just wanted to point it out. I like it.
Astral cornocopia and the card that adds charges counters every turn from mirrodin... hello mana acceleration on steroid! Ypu can even play cornucopia for 0.
Sudden storm and perigrination Were simply Frost breath and cultivate+scry 1. That was a lazy design AND YOU KNOW IT WIZARD'S
But to be honest, what else are they going to do with scry? Every set needs its staple limited tricks and ramp, and making them with scry is more interesting than making them without...
I would say no. Reach/Cultivate can be ramped into on turn 2. This cannot. You would have to be running max Sylvan Caryatid (or any ramp cheaper than 3 mana to warrant this card. It's a cool name but with four mystics and four caryatids, you'd just never want tobuse this.
narr
when it says XXX, it means you can pay 0, 3, 6, 9, etc. You can play it for 0 with no counters on it, but vorel will be useless since he needs a counter to already be on it to proliferate it
Sudden storm and perigrination Were simply Frost breath and cultivate+scry 1. That was a lazy design AND YOU KNOW IT WIZARD'S
Don't forget +1 mana on each too. I'd rather have strictly better Cultivate and Frost Breath like they did with Infest but noooooooo. Would have been actual decent cards, particularly Peregrination at 3cmc plus scry could have seen standard play but nope. We can't have nice things.
1,1,1 = 1 charge counter then? so its just like a darksteel ingot0
Yup. It's a destructible (?) Darksteel Ingot that has a mode for increased mana production. As such, the card is only better than Ingot in scenarios where you can safely generate the mana to put 2+ charges on it. At which point, I would personally rather be winning the game with said mana....
But I don't play standard, so what do I know? Not much, as has been proven to me by a few cards....
1,1,1 = 1 charge counter then? so its just like a darksteel ingot0
Sort of. If you need a 0-cost artifact for some reason, it can be 0(Actually, it will always be 0 CMC, but if you want just an artifact on the board you can cast it for 0). If you have the mana to do so it can be 2. It's an interesting card with a bit of versatility. Also does strangely dumb things with Vorel and Prophet on the board(Two counters the next turn, four the turn after, eight after, etc; you could end up with ludicrous mana production in a deck with Prophet of Kruphix). So yep.
\Reminds me of Divine Deflection which saw minor play in white weenie decks of the time. I want it to be playable.
I don't get this. 3 mana for 1 ramp, 6 mana for 2, and 9 mana for 3. Way too costly. Gilded Lotus does 3 mana ramp for 5, that seems more reasonable.
This is not a standard card. It other formats there are ways to "cheat" counters onto it very easily. The only way in standard is to use Vorel, which is clunky. In other formats, it can get to ludicrous ramping very quickly (You can drop it for 0 and add counters afterwards, basically).
The problem with Acolyte's Reward is that it only protects one creature, while Divine Deflection protected multiple. It might be good enough, we shall see
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Is that real life??
I have no idea how you plan to get 3 mana on turn 1 in Standard....
couldn't you play astral for xx1 then vorel on next turn. cause youd have 3 mana to play him.
t2 ==type 2 == standard
All values for X must be the same. If you want it to produce x=1 mana (x=1 charge counters), you must pay x thrice. See Chalice of the Void.
Ohhhh ok. That makes much more sense. Sorry; I haven't had anyone refer to the formats by their original names in quite some time.
Level 2 Judge since 12/01/2012
-On Liliana of the Veil
narr
when it says XXX, it means you can pay 0, 3, 6, 9, etc. You can play it for 0 with no counters on it, but vorel will be useless since he needs a counter to already be on it to proliferate it
I think you accidentally said "on t2" instead of "in t2", which is why he was confused.
Interesting things that pique my interest:
Acolyte's Reward: Certainly an interesting card, and one that could easily see play as a White Weenie reach card. I can forseeably see this being on par with Lightning Strike. It severely punishes big creature strategies, such as Mono-Green. Could really give pause to a Mono-Black player when you attack into their Desecration Demon on turn 4. Six damage to the face will *really* hurt on turn 4.
Akroan Conscriptor: This is actually an interesting top-end for heroic decks. Zealous Conscripts was a thing, after all, and although this is definitely not *that* good(No haste, doesn't require set-up to use), being able to reuse it could prove somewhat interesting. I like it as an uncommon, even though I doubt it will see any serious play. It's a fun card. Good fun to be had, but that's about it.
Aspect of the Hydra: Bwahahahahaha. This combat trick is just dumb. In the "I just hit you for 9 on turn 3 with a BTE" sort of way. I imagine there will be much feel bads due to this card. Certainly playable as a trick I imagine, as green has zero problem making this a Giant Growth at the worst on turn 3. Getting this any higher is just insane. Once again, gives pause to the black player when you attack into that untapped Desecration Demon.
Astral Cornucopia: EDH card methinks, and possible applications in standard. Combine with Cloud Key and Etherium Sculptor in other formats(I'm fairly certain it doesn't reduce it completely, but it could reduce it significantly). I'm not sure if Modern Affinity wants this(I know jack all about the format), but given that it can cost 0 if you want, it could do something. This is quite good.
Courser of Kruphix: Virtual card advantage this is. It's a reasonably costed devotion enabler that doubles as virtual card advantage. Works somewhat nicely with Domri Rade, as you will always know when it's profitable to tick him up or not. If only there was some permanent in green being printed in BNG that let you play extra lands each turn that benefits from having a more defensive creature on the board. Ho-well, we can't have it all.
Dawn to Dusk: Well, this is one way to gain huge advantages in limited, and push enchantment in constructed.
Eidolon of Countless Battle: And here we have another possibly constructed playable bestow creature. It's reasonably costed and could easily get out of hand even with just the creature side. Curves perfectly with a certain Mythic in the set, and couples with his abilities almost perfectly.
Fall of the Hammer: One sided fight, at instant speed. Pit Fight hasn't seen play, but then again Pit Fight isn't one-sided.
Gild: God killer and ramp. Could see play, but sorcery speed really hurts it. That said, more controlly decks would like to have the extra mana sitting around.
Loyal Pegasus: Will see play in WW. That's about all I can say on it, although it is a very good 1-drop.
Marshmist Titan: Gross. Aggro killer. Won't see play really, as mono-black devotion wants other things, but it's fine. I just don't like it for personal reasons (It knows what it did).
Perplexing Chimera: Alright, seems jank... wait, I get to gain control of permanents? I can have your Desecration Demon. Or your Jace? Or your Downfall? Or... okay, I have found my must have card of the set. May not see play, but damn if it isn't strong.
Sunbond: I get it! It makes your creatures into kind-of Archangel of Thunes. Seem fun, but janky.
Vortex Elemental: Oh, it's a 0/1 for 1. Meh... wait a tick. It's shuffle ability is just 1? And it has the ability to force multiple blocks if you can (Doubtful)? I find this extremely funny with Dangerous, and can be a huge tempo play. I like this one a ton, particularly against G/R. I think it might be playable somewhere in the 75. Considering it plays well with Master of Waves means it could find a home in Mono-U.
Whims of the Fates: Completely terrible red rare of the set. Just wanted to point it out. I like it.
Decks:
Standard:
Gruul aggro
Modern:
MonoG infect
Edh:
Nekusar, Too bad you have to discard your deck at the end step.
Casual:
I'm trying to make tibalt work guys!
Dimir mill
I'll have you know when I saw Phenax spoiled,
I cried for only 20 minutes.
But to be honest, what else are they going to do with scry? Every set needs its staple limited tricks and ramp, and making them with scry is more interesting than making them without...
Unfortunately, in mana-ramp land the difference between costing 3 and 4 is huge. I don't think it's playable.
I think Impetuous Sunchaser is going to be a HOUSE in limited. It's not fireslinger, but then, what is?
I would say no. Reach/Cultivate can be ramped into on turn 2. This cannot. You would have to be running max Sylvan Caryatid (or any ramp cheaper than 3 mana to warrant this card. It's a cool name but with four mystics and four caryatids, you'd just never want tobuse this.
It uses charge counters!!! see: Energy Chamber
Don't forget +1 mana on each too. I'd rather have strictly better Cultivate and Frost Breath like they did with Infest but noooooooo. Would have been actual decent cards, particularly Peregrination at 3cmc plus scry could have seen standard play but nope. We can't have nice things.
*edit: majorly nath'd
Yup. It's a destructible (?) Darksteel Ingot that has a mode for increased mana production. As such, the card is only better than Ingot in scenarios where you can safely generate the mana to put 2+ charges on it. At which point, I would personally rather be winning the game with said mana....
But I don't play standard, so what do I know? Not much, as has been proven to me by a few cards....
It's back!
Sort of. If you need a 0-cost artifact for some reason, it can be 0(Actually, it will always be 0 CMC, but if you want just an artifact on the board you can cast it for 0). If you have the mana to do so it can be 2. It's an interesting card with a bit of versatility. Also does strangely dumb things with Vorel and Prophet on the board(Two counters the next turn, four the turn after, eight after, etc; you could end up with ludicrous mana production in a deck with Prophet of Kruphix). So yep.
How about Surge Node!
This is not a standard card. It other formats there are ways to "cheat" counters onto it very easily. The only way in standard is to use Vorel, which is clunky. In other formats, it can get to ludicrous ramping very quickly (You can drop it for 0 and add counters afterwards, basically).