I really don't like power level errata. They done goofed, yeah, but minus errata the card is mearly "really really good." It isn't format warping time vault levels stupid. They should have just left it, apologized, and went on with their lives. Right now it's only a little one, but imagine if they errata'd goyf's toughness to *, or added "activate only as a sorcery" to SFM. I'm serious, they shouldn't abuse errata so readily.
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Lycanthropy Awareness Day.
Hoping for a cure, or at least an outbreak.
You forgot the one with the most horrifying implications -- Well of Lost Dreams.
Yeah, somebody else mentioned that, but it's crazy good. Basically, while he is in play, every card that gains you life says "Kicker 1. If you pay the kicker, draw a card and each opponent loses 1 life". When he's not in play, cards like Well of Lost Dreams are still very potent.
I'm sure if I dug through the Gatherer for long enough, I'd find more gems.
As for Marath, I am very thankful that they did the Errata. Without it, it would just be an unfair combo general. At least this way, he has the capability of being an aggro general.
I really don't like power level errata. They done goofed, yeah, but minus errata the card is mearly "really really good." It isn't format warping time vault levels stupid. They should have just left it, apologized, and went on with their lives. Right now it's only a little one, but imagine if they errata'd goyf's toughness to *, or added "activate only as a sorcery" to SFM. I'm serious, they shouldn't abuse errata so readily.
It's not power-level errata, it's fixing a simple templating error. Not really any different from Walking Atlas. The card as printed has a completely unprecedented and broken effect--not necessarily broken in the sense that it would warp a Constructed format, but in the sense that it violates the allowable functionality of a single card. The effect is also completely unintended and doesn't reflect the design. Goyf's 1 toughness was maybe a bad idea, but it's not the equivalent of a simple typo, which this is.
I really don't like power level errata. They done goofed, yeah, but minus errata the card is mearly "really really good." It isn't format warping time vault levels stupid. They should have just left it, apologized, and went on with their lives. Right now it's only a little one, but imagine if they errata'd goyf's toughness to *, or added "activate only as a sorcery" to SFM. I'm serious, they shouldn't abuse errata so readily.
Besides the fact that it was obviously a mistake, it would absolutely be broken in EDH. Purphorous would be an instant win on turn 3 easily if you start with him and a mana dork (or Crypt/Sol Ring+Signet) and they didn't have a 2 mana counter/removal in their first 9 cards. No commander, especially not a 3 mana commander, should ever have instant win combos (or really even infinite combos) with just one other card (especially a 4 mana card).
You can activate the x ability for 0 an infinite number of times and put an infinite number of 0/0 elementals into play. They would die immediately, but would still trigger anything that triggers on a creature entering play.
How? I don't see the correlation between this Legend and the Theros cards you mentioned? Please explain...
Isn't it obvious? If the card did what it says it does, you could spit out 0/0 creatures for 0 an arbitrarily large number of times. That would lead to an arbitrary number of creature ETB and LTB triggers. If you had a way to make them larger than 0/0, such as with an Anthem or Crusade effect, then you could make an arbitrarily large number of dudes.
Which is precisely how the card should be played. Luckily, this is EDH, so you can house-rule away how timid Wizards was with an otherwise awesome general.
He's referring to the fact that if you could produce infinite 0/0 tokens with a spear out they would enter the battlefield as 1/1's and then Purphoros trigger would ping each player for 2 damage per token. GG
They errata'ed it to be unable to do X=0 because of how hideously busted it would be otherwise. Have purphoros, god of the forge in play? Everyone else instantly loses. Have death match in play? Everyone else cannot have creatures while this is in play. The shenanigans go on and on. How about beck//call. Draw my whole deck, kill you in any number of ways. Mana echoes for infinite colorless mana at any time. Would be pretty disgusting.
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"Yawgmoth," Freyalise whispered as she set the bomb, "now you will pay for your treachery."
It's not power-level errata, it's fixing a simple templating error. Not really any different from Walking Atlas. The card as printed has a completely unprecedented and broken effect--not necessarily broken in the sense that it would warp a Constructed format, but in the sense that it violates the allowable functionality of a single card. The effect is also completely unintended and doesn't reflect the design. Goyf's 1 toughness was maybe a bad idea, but it's not the equivalent of a simple typo, which this is.
With the error, Martyr's Bond becomes a reusable free Wrath (that even kills regenerate/indestructible d00dz) once you pay the initial mana investments.
You have to be careful, though I'll point out that, in time, Parallax Wave's errata were returned to "as printed". (As printed, it goes infinite with Opalescence; throw on something like Keldon Champion for an instant win, or just RFG all the things. It's supposed to be printed so it doesn't return itself if it exiles itself. These days, the "as printed" version is the correct interpretation.)
(It's a cast trigger, not an ETB trigger, so it doesn't trigger off tokens, or for that matter reanimator spells, Elvish Piper, or Lin Sivvi, Defiant Hero, but on the flip side, does trigger even when the spell's countered. Mana Echoes works the way you're thinking, though. So does Earthcraft.)
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Card advantage is not the same thing as card draw. Something for 2B cannot be strictly worse than something for BBB or 3BB. If you're taking out Swords to Plowshares for Plummet, you're a fool. Stop doing these things!
Man, you guys are just as timid as Wizards is nowadays.
Yes, this three casting cost, three color dork that does not protect itself would combo pretty well with cards that cost 4 or 6 mana (if not errated). Shocking. Look, if your opponents are letting you stick a two-card, seven-to-nine mana combo, then they're already losing.
Man, you guys are just as timid as Wizards is nowadays.
Yes, this three casting cost, three color dork that does not protect itself would combo pretty well with cards that cost 4 or 6 mana (if not errated). Shocking. Look, if your opponents are letting you stick a two-card, seven-to-nine mana combo, then they're already losing.
Do you even play commander? If you did, you'd realize exactly how absurd your statement is.
Not to mention, a three mana 3/3 that combos with cards like Soul Warden and Blood Artist might even cause trouble in 60 card magic.
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Decks: Standard - Rally, Modern - Kikichord, Legacy - Elves
Commmander - Eight-and-a-Half Tails; Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker; Prime Speaker Zegana; Alesha, Who Smiles at Death; Daxos the Returned; Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest; Patron of the Moonfolk; Animar, Soul of Elements
Man, you guys are just as timid as Wizards is nowadays.
Yes, this three casting cost, three color dork that does not protect itself would combo pretty well with cards that cost 4 or 6 mana (if not errated). Shocking. Look, if your opponents are letting you stick a two-card, seven-to-nine mana combo, then they're already losing.
Any anthem effect means infinite tokens for free. fecundity and goblin sharpshooter are under 4 mana and work quite well with it.
The errata is necessary.
Man, you guys are just as timid as Wizards is nowadays.
Yes, this three casting cost, three color dork that does not protect itself would combo pretty well with cards that cost 4 or 6 mana (if not errated). Shocking. Look, if your opponents are letting you stick a two-card, seven-to-nine mana combo, then they're already losing.
Oh hey it's not like two-card seven-to-nine mana infinite creature combos are a staple of Modern or anything
Isn't it obvious? If the card did what it says it does, you could spit out 0/0 creatures for 0 an arbitrarily large number of times. That would lead to an arbitrary number of creature ETB and LTB triggers. If you had a way to make them larger than 0/0, such as with an Anthem or Crusade effect, then you could make an arbitrarily large number of dudes.
Which is precisely how the card should be played. Luckily, this is EDH, so you can house-rule away how timid Wizards was with an otherwise awesome general.
I don't think anyone who actually enjoys Magic will ever play with your house rules.
Everything the poster has commented on since 2010 is "filler".
Reprint Opt for Modern!!
FREE DIG THOROUGH TIME!
PLAY MORE ROUGE DECKS!
Tangle Root doesn't work with Marath. It activates "on cast", not "on creature ETB".
I've come up with a Marath list, do take a look. The link is in my signature.
WUBRG Reaper King - Elf Tribal WUBRG | Tribal Fun
WRG Gishath, Sun's Avatar - Dinosaur Tribal WRG | Rawr!!!
WUG Derevi, Empyrial Tactician - Enchantress Tactics WUG | Enchantments Focused
GBG The Gitrog Monster - Land Shenanigans GBG | Lands/Mill Focused
WBW Kambal, Consul of Life Allocation Matters WBW | Life Gain/Loss focused
UBR Kess, Dissident Mage of the Lotus UBR | Spellslinger
BGB Hapatra, Vizier of Poisons - Counters & Tokens BGB | -1/-1 counters focused
Hoping for a cure, or at least an outbreak.
Level 1 Judge (yay)
Really? If you play this without Rite of Passage, Doubling Season , Cathars' Crusade, or Mayael's Aria then I can't help you.
You forgot the one with the most horrifying implications -- Well of Lost Dreams.
Standard: :symu::symu::symu: Mono-Blue Devotion :symu::symu::symu:
Modern: :symr::symu: UR Pyro-Faeries :symu::symr:
EDH Decks:
Thassa, God of VALUE (now with decklist!)
Skullbriar, the Walking Grave
People with signatures are morons.
Yeah, somebody else mentioned that, but it's crazy good. Basically, while he is in play, every card that gains you life says "Kicker 1. If you pay the kicker, draw a card and each opponent loses 1 life". When he's not in play, cards like Well of Lost Dreams are still very potent.
I'm sure if I dug through the Gatherer for long enough, I'd find more gems.
Some more inclusions:
Absorb
Agent of Masks (debatable)
Auriok Champion/Soul Warden/Soul's Attendant/Suture Priest
Consuming Vapors (Offers two triggers of lifegain)
Contemplation
Blood Artist/Falkenrath Noble
Polluted Bonds
Anything with Extort
Test of Endurance
As for Marath, I am very thankful that they did the Errata. Without it, it would just be an unfair combo general. At least this way, he has the capability of being an aggro general.
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It's not power-level errata, it's fixing a simple templating error. Not really any different from Walking Atlas. The card as printed has a completely unprecedented and broken effect--not necessarily broken in the sense that it would warp a Constructed format, but in the sense that it violates the allowable functionality of a single card. The effect is also completely unintended and doesn't reflect the design. Goyf's 1 toughness was maybe a bad idea, but it's not the equivalent of a simple typo, which this is.
Besides the fact that it was obviously a mistake, it would absolutely be broken in EDH. Purphorous would be an instant win on turn 3 easily if you start with him and a mana dork (or Crypt/Sol Ring+Signet) and they didn't have a 2 mana counter/removal in their first 9 cards. No commander, especially not a 3 mana commander, should ever have instant win combos (or really even infinite combos) with just one other card (especially a 4 mana card).
How? I don't see the correlation between this Legend and the Theros cards you mentioned? Please explain...
A 0/0 that gets +1/+1 is a 1/1.
A creature that dies instantly still exists long enough to deal 2 damage.
Isn't it obvious? If the card did what it says it does, you could spit out 0/0 creatures for 0 an arbitrarily large number of times. That would lead to an arbitrary number of creature ETB and LTB triggers. If you had a way to make them larger than 0/0, such as with an Anthem or Crusade effect, then you could make an arbitrarily large number of dudes.
Which is precisely how the card should be played. Luckily, this is EDH, so you can house-rule away how timid Wizards was with an otherwise awesome general.
On spoiled card wishlisting and 'should-have-had'-isms:
Currently Playing:
Retired
With the error, Martyr's Bond becomes a reusable free Wrath (that even kills regenerate/indestructible d00dz) once you pay the initial mana investments.
You have to be careful, though I'll point out that, in time, Parallax Wave's errata were returned to "as printed". (As printed, it goes infinite with Opalescence; throw on something like Keldon Champion for an instant win, or just RFG all the things. It's supposed to be printed so it doesn't return itself if it exiles itself. These days, the "as printed" version is the correct interpretation.)
That card. It does not do what you think it does.
(It's a cast trigger, not an ETB trigger, so it doesn't trigger off tokens, or for that matter reanimator spells, Elvish Piper, or Lin Sivvi, Defiant Hero, but on the flip side, does trigger even when the spell's countered. Mana Echoes works the way you're thinking, though. So does Earthcraft.)
On phasing:
Yes, this three casting cost, three color dork that does not protect itself would combo pretty well with cards that cost 4 or 6 mana (if not errated). Shocking. Look, if your opponents are letting you stick a two-card, seven-to-nine mana combo, then they're already losing.
Do you even play commander? If you did, you'd realize exactly how absurd your statement is.
Not to mention, a three mana 3/3 that combos with cards like Soul Warden and Blood Artist might even cause trouble in 60 card magic.
Commmander - Eight-and-a-Half Tails; Kiki-Jiki, Mirror Breaker; Prime Speaker Zegana; Alesha, Who Smiles at Death; Daxos the Returned; Mazirek, Kraul Death Priest; Patron of the Moonfolk; Animar, Soul of Elements
Any anthem effect means infinite tokens for free.
fecundity and goblin sharpshooter are under 4 mana and work quite well with it.
The errata is necessary.
Makes sense to me.
Oh hey it's not like two-card seven-to-nine mana infinite creature combos are a staple of Modern or anything
Standard: W/R Aggro
I don't think anyone who actually enjoys Magic will ever play with your house rules.
I think you would be surprised by how otheir people play. The "cards do what they say" house rule is very common in my experience.
Hoping for a cure, or at least an outbreak.
Level 1 Judge (yay)
Agreed.
"Ok House Rule: This general is easily the most broken commander in existence."