All we know for sure is the text was left off the card. It's unconfirmed if it was a typo or an oversight. Until we see the leaked design file, or get direct confirmation, we can't be sure.
We know that THEY discovered it before the card was even spoiled, so there isn't really a difference. ...But good job discovering a conspiracy, Sherlock!
Actually, I play Vintage weekly, and Legacy very occasionally. That might put my comments in context.
No one, least of all me, is denying that Marat would be an exceedingly powerful combo general. We just disagree on what "healthy for the format" means. It's a casual format, but some people think that means "let me play my bombs and swing" and some people think that means "find creative ways to break cards that don't make it in competitive formats." I'm the latter. But it's not a big deal, because if your play group groans about certain decks, you just pull out a different one. It's a casual format, after all.
There's nothing clever about breaking Marath - it's done for us already without the errata. It's an inexpensive, 2 card infinite combo with countless other things that even terrible MTG players could figure out and build around. No one alive would actually enjoy losing to that and only a 7 year old who never wins at things would enjoy winning with it.
There's nothing clever about breaking Marath - it's done for us already without the errata. It's an inexpensive, 2 card infinite combo with countless other things that even terrible MTG players could figure out and build around. No one alive would actually enjoy losing to that and only a 7 year old who never wins at things would enjoy winning with it.
Name 1 card that goes infinite with Marath. I can think of some combos that are Marath + 2 cards but none that are Marath + 1.
Unfortunately every try hard from Sacramento to Shanghai preaches from the top of their 27 lands + Mana Reflection that Tooth and Nail and Time Stretch are fine to play in the same turn but Armageddon is unfair.
We know that THEY discovered it before the card was even spoiled, so there isn't really a difference. ...But good job discovering a conspiracy, Sherlock!
No need to be a jerk. You should really try to at least act like a decent person.
As to the constructive part of your post (as much as I hate to acknowledge that there is one,) I have to disagree. There is a difference between a typo and a mechanical oversight, and fhem discovering it before spoilors has nothing to do with that. The point is this card will be printed as is, but function differently than printed, all because wizards done goofed. Mistakes happen, but unlike in video games, they are here to stay. This errata isn't trivial (it changes how the card functions in a normal game of magic,) and them just waving it away means tney are treating this tcg as a video game with power level patches.
Now there is nothing inherantly wrong with that, and if this forum is any indication, it seems to be a popular move. I'm of the opinion that cards should function as printed, and errata should be limited to updating terms and maintaining the functionality of cards through rule changes. That is just my oponion thoughl, and it seems to be the less popular one.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Lycanthropy Awareness Day.
Hoping for a cure, or at least an outbreak.
No need to be a jerk. You should really try to at least act like a decent person.
As to the constructive part of your post (as much as I hate to acknowledge that there is one,) I have to disagree. There is a difference between a typo and a mechanical oversight, and fhem discovering it before spoilors has nothing to do with that. The point is this card will be printed as is, but function differently than printed, all because wizards done goofed. Mistakes happen, but unlike in video games, they are here to stay. This errata isn't trivial (it changes how the card functions in a normal game of magic,) and them just waving it away means tney are treating this tcg as a video game with power level patches.
Now there is nothing inherantly wrong with that, and if this forum is any indication, it seems to be a popular move. I'm of the opinion that cards should function as printed, and errata should be limited to updating terms and maintaining the functionality of cards through rule changes. That is just my oponion thoughl, and it seems to be the less popular one.
It's a less popular "opinion" because it's an absurd "opinion." You're basically saying that you'd rather have the game be inferior (and it would undeniably be inferior) just because Wizards made a mistake that they've now rectified in the only logical way they can? They can't patch the game, clearly, but they are doing the next best thing. They're certainly not going to destroy all of the product they've already produced just to make a few people who are being stubborn a bit happier.
Besides, you realize that if they didn't errata it, they'd simply ban it, right?
It's a less popular "opinion" because it's an absurd "opinion." You're basically saying that you'd rather have the game be inferior (and it would undeniably be inferior) just because Wizards made a mistake that they've now rectified in the only logical way they can? They can't patch the game, clearly, but they are doing the next best thing. They're certainly not going to destroy all of the product they've already produced just to make a few people who are being stubborn a bit happier.
Besides, you realize that if they didn't errata it, they'd simply ban it, right?
^
The choices are Marath has errata or Marath is banned in all formats that you'd actually want to play him in. Errata wins.
There are people convinced that Marath isn't broken without the errata?
You guys realized technically, you can keep pulling off X=0 non-stop in response to everything and end the entire game in a draw (and get yourself kicked out of the playgroup) by simply casting Marath right?
A card that can go infinite by itself has no place in Magic.
It's almost as if you don't know what we're talking about, AND you don't know what you're talking about...
I meant name a combo with the errata. It was implied but I did come in at the end of a conversation where you were talking about no errata Marath apparently.
Without the errata it's glaringly obvious, the dude makes infinite everything with damn near any card. With the errata I can't think of any combos that are Marath + 1 though.
Unfortunately every try hard from Sacramento to Shanghai preaches from the top of their 27 lands + Mana Reflection that Tooth and Nail and Time Stretch are fine to play in the same turn but Armageddon is unfair.
No need to be a jerk. You should really try to at least act like a decent person.
As to the constructive part of your post (as much as I hate to acknowledge that there is one,) I have to disagree. There is a difference between a typo and a mechanical oversight, and fhem discovering it before spoilors has nothing to do with that. The point is this card will be printed as is, but function differently than printed, all because wizards done goofed. Mistakes happen, but unlike in video games, they are here to stay. This errata isn't trivial (it changes how the card functions in a normal game of magic,) and them just waving it away means tney are treating this tcg as a video game with power level patches.
Now there is nothing inherantly wrong with that, and if this forum is any indication, it seems to be a popular move. I'm of the opinion that cards should function as printed, and errata should be limited to updating terms and maintaining the functionality of cards through rule changes. That is just my oponion thoughl, and it seems to be the less popular one.
You are the one calling names and making personal attacks. Take your hypocritical comments and apply them to yourself. I'm just goofing around, not trying to make you cry.
Like I said in my first post, I definitely feel like they should have caught the issue BEFORE it was printed. I have the feeling there will be no infinite combos in the box, errata or not, so it won't affect me. As for everyone else, yeah, better find CMoriarty if you want to play it w/out the errata (Come on, Sherlock and Moriarty? That's comedy gold!).
I meant name a combo with the errata. It was implied but I did come in at the end of a conversation where you were talking about no errata Marath apparently.
Without the errata it's glaringly obvious, the dude makes infinite everything with damn near any card. With the errata I can't think of any combos that are Marath + 1 though.
You guys realized technically, you can keep pulling off X=0 non-stop in response to everything and end the entire game in a draw (and get yourself kicked out of the playgroup) by simply casting Marath right?
Think about this one for a second. You can, but you shouldn't. At a tournament, that would be a slow-play violation. Abilities that cost 0 don't automatically break the game. See Mist Dragon, for example.
You guys realized technically, you can keep pulling off X=0 non-stop in response to everything and end the entire game in a draw (and get yourself kicked out of the playgroup) by simply casting Marath right?
This isn't true. You can only draw the game with non-optional triggers, not with abilities like this.
Think about this one for a second. You can, but you shouldn't. At a tournament, that would be a slow-play violation. Abilities that cost 0 don't automatically break the game. See Mist Dragon, for example.
This isn't true. You can only draw the game with non-optional triggers, not with abilities like this.
I don't think I can reply to this without sounding defensive in any way (since it's my mistake), but thanks for the information.
But being stubborn and prideful I'm still going to defend myself - I did say "technically" (and EDH more often a casual format as opposed to a competitive one - so one can simply just grind on to wear down patience - yes I know that only annoying people asking to be kicked out would do that, and Marath is likely going to be a often-seen commander as opposed to Mist Dragon in the 99 - the defenses go on...)
But my mistake aside, my other biggest mistake here was not stating that since it can "technically" go infinite by itself, so imagine it with any single other card out there that combos with it that everyone else has mentioned in this thread.
Had to use to "technical" but wrong example to get the point across to those who thought Marath wasn't broken without the errata. (Since everyone else already stated the obvious combos.)
I'm confused. For those saying "pay infinite mana and win", how can you pay infinite mana? Can you actually pay more mana than its casting cost + commander tax ever?
I'm confused. For those saying "pay infinite mana and win", how can you pay infinite mana? Can you actually pay more mana than its casting cost + commander tax ever?
If you have infinite mana, you can cast Marath, ping 3, cast +2, ping 5, cast +4, ping 7 and so forth.
Hold on, I suddenly realized something thanks to today's Arcana.
You know that deer god from Princess Mononoke? The one with the weird human face who then turns into a giant tidal wave of death near the end of the movie?
This may have already been explained, but why does this card need to have the errata "X cannot be 0?" If X is 0, will not he ability have no effect, thus making it pointless to pay 0 for X?
Private Mod Note
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Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
“Those who would trade their freedoms for security will have neither.”-Benjamin Franklin
“When the people fear the government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.”-Thomas Jefferson
“A vote is like a rifle; its usefulness depends upon the character of its user.”-Theodore Roosevelt
“Patriotism means to stand by one's country; it does not mean to stand by one's president.”-Theodore Roosevelt
This may have already been explained, but why does this card need to have the errata "X cannot be 0?" If X is 0, will not he ability have no effect, thus making it pointless to pay 0 for X?
Assuming no errata, you can just pay 0 to put a 0/0 elemental token into play, which will trigger a whole lot bunch of "whenever a creature ETB" even after the token is sent to the graveyard due to state effects.
eg
Purphoros, God of the Forge = infinite damage to all opponents
Soul Warden = infinite life gain
any anthem effect = infinite token
Aura shards = infinite anti-artifact/enchantment
Assuming no errata, you can just pay 0 to put a 0/0 elemental token into play, which will trigger a whole lot bunch of "whenever a creature ETB" even after the token is sent to the graveyard due to state effects.
eg
Purphoros, God of the Forge = infinite damage to all opponents
Soul Warden = infinite life gain
any anthem effect = infinite token
Aura shards = infinite anti-artifact/enchantment
so on and forth.
Yes, I understand; in that case, it is very good that WotC shall be adding that errata to this card.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
“Those who would trade their freedoms for security will have neither.”-Benjamin Franklin
“When the people fear the government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.”-Thomas Jefferson
“A vote is like a rifle; its usefulness depends upon the character of its user.”-Theodore Roosevelt
“Patriotism means to stand by one's country; it does not mean to stand by one's president.”-Theodore Roosevelt
This card is great. I've been running Mayael for... well for a long time and this dude is replacing her outright. I've reworked the deck to a sort of tokens-good-stuff-doubling-season kind of deck with lots of mana doubling effects to abuse marath as much as possible. Its a really fun deck to play. Symmetrical mana doubling also makes it so everyone doesn't hate you quite as much when you win out of nowhere with something silly like genesis wave for 30 (oops I hit Gisela, Blade of Goldlight, Purphoros, God of the Forge and Avenger of Zendikar....).
You don't really need to build it around a combo. In fact I think the deck is much more reliable as a ramp/token deck. I can get a turn 3 Avacyn, Angel of Hope or a turn 4 Kozilek, Butcher of Truth, or I can just poo out a bunch of tokens and drop those dudes later as finishers. The deck rocks!
Not to mention the planeswalkers for the deck are awesome. You have the elspeths to work with, Garruk Wildspeaker, Garruk 2GGG version, and Xenagos. All good choices. Maybe a Sarkhan Vol could be good if you do a token heavy strategy.
Anyways. Thats what I've done with this general. Its fun. People like playing agains't it. Its a healthy card.
Thank you, I do my best.
We know that THEY discovered it before the card was even spoiled, so there isn't really a difference. ...But good job discovering a conspiracy, Sherlock!
Agreed!
There's nothing clever about breaking Marath - it's done for us already without the errata. It's an inexpensive, 2 card infinite combo with countless other things that even terrible MTG players could figure out and build around. No one alive would actually enjoy losing to that and only a 7 year old who never wins at things would enjoy winning with it.
Name 1 card that goes infinite with Marath. I can think of some combos that are Marath + 2 cards but none that are Marath + 1.
Without the errata:
Marath by himself gives infinite etb ltb triggers.
Marath + Cathar's Crusade = infinite infinitely big creatures
Marath + Purphoros = infinite damage to all opponents
Marath + Soul Warden/Essence Warden/Suture Priest = Infinite Life
Marath + Goblin Sharpshooter = infinite damage to any number of creatures or players
Marath + Any Anthem effect = infinite creatures
The list goes on and on and on.
Um... Soul Warden.
Well...that was easy...
It's almost as if you don't know what we're talking about, AND you don't know what you're talking about...
No need to be a jerk. You should really try to at least act like a decent person.
As to the constructive part of your post (as much as I hate to acknowledge that there is one,) I have to disagree. There is a difference between a typo and a mechanical oversight, and fhem discovering it before spoilors has nothing to do with that. The point is this card will be printed as is, but function differently than printed, all because wizards done goofed. Mistakes happen, but unlike in video games, they are here to stay. This errata isn't trivial (it changes how the card functions in a normal game of magic,) and them just waving it away means tney are treating this tcg as a video game with power level patches.
Now there is nothing inherantly wrong with that, and if this forum is any indication, it seems to be a popular move. I'm of the opinion that cards should function as printed, and errata should be limited to updating terms and maintaining the functionality of cards through rule changes. That is just my oponion thoughl, and it seems to be the less popular one.
Hoping for a cure, or at least an outbreak.
Level 1 Judge (yay)
It's a less popular "opinion" because it's an absurd "opinion." You're basically saying that you'd rather have the game be inferior (and it would undeniably be inferior) just because Wizards made a mistake that they've now rectified in the only logical way they can? They can't patch the game, clearly, but they are doing the next best thing. They're certainly not going to destroy all of the product they've already produced just to make a few people who are being stubborn a bit happier.
Besides, you realize that if they didn't errata it, they'd simply ban it, right?
^
The choices are Marath has errata or Marath is banned in all formats that you'd actually want to play him in. Errata wins.
You guys realized technically, you can keep pulling off X=0 non-stop in response to everything and end the entire game in a draw (and get yourself kicked out of the playgroup) by simply casting Marath right?
A card that can go infinite by itself has no place in Magic.
I meant name a combo with the errata. It was implied but I did come in at the end of a conversation where you were talking about no errata Marath apparently.
Without the errata it's glaringly obvious, the dude makes infinite everything with damn near any card. With the errata I can't think of any combos that are Marath + 1 though.
You are the one calling names and making personal attacks. Take your hypocritical comments and apply them to yourself. I'm just goofing around, not trying to make you cry.
Like I said in my first post, I definitely feel like they should have caught the issue BEFORE it was printed. I have the feeling there will be no infinite combos in the box, errata or not, so it won't affect me. As for everyone else, yeah, better find CMoriarty if you want to play it w/out the errata (Come on, Sherlock and Moriarty? That's comedy gold!).
Haha, I know, that's why I was ribbing you.
Think about this one for a second. You can, but you shouldn't. At a tournament, that would be a slow-play violation. Abilities that cost 0 don't automatically break the game. See Mist Dragon, for example.
This isn't true. You can only draw the game with non-optional triggers, not with abilities like this.
I don't think I can reply to this without sounding defensive in any way (since it's my mistake), but thanks for the information.
But being stubborn and prideful I'm still going to defend myself - I did say "technically" (and EDH more often a casual format as opposed to a competitive one - so one can simply just grind on to wear down patience - yes I know that only annoying people asking to be kicked out would do that, and Marath is likely going to be a often-seen commander as opposed to Mist Dragon in the 99 - the defenses go on...)
But my mistake aside, my other biggest mistake here was not stating that since it can "technically" go infinite by itself, so imagine it with any single other card out there that combos with it that everyone else has mentioned in this thread.
Had to use to "technical" but wrong example to get the point across to those who thought Marath wasn't broken without the errata. (Since everyone else already stated the obvious combos.)
If you have infinite mana, you can cast Marath, ping 3, cast +2, ping 5, cast +4, ping 7 and so forth.
Duel Commander
URG [Primer] Maelstrom Wanderer [Primer] URG
Duel Commander Current Projects:
RGWMarath, Will of the WildRGW
BRXMogis, God of SlaughterBRX
RWxIoras, God of VictoryRWx
WBxAthreos, God of PassageWBx
Created By: DarkNightCavalier
You know that deer god from Princess Mononoke? The one with the weird human face who then turns into a giant tidal wave of death near the end of the movie?
Yes, this is him. Or as close as we're getting.
----------------------------
Club Flamingo Wins: 10
----------------------------
EDH Decks
BG Vicious Varolz | RW Jor Kadeen, the Mean Machine | RG Atarka: Muh_Dragons.dec (WIP) | WU Brago, Blink Eternal (WIP)
----------------------------
“When the people fear the government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.”-Thomas Jefferson
“A vote is like a rifle; its usefulness depends upon the character of its user.”-Theodore Roosevelt
“Patriotism means to stand by one's country; it does not mean to stand by one's president.”-Theodore Roosevelt
Assuming no errata, you can just pay 0 to put a 0/0 elemental token into play, which will trigger a whole lot bunch of "whenever a creature ETB" even after the token is sent to the graveyard due to state effects.
eg
Purphoros, God of the Forge = infinite damage to all opponents
Soul Warden = infinite life gain
any anthem effect = infinite token
Aura shards = infinite anti-artifact/enchantment
so on and forth.
WUBRG Reaper King - Elf Tribal WUBRG | Tribal Fun
WRG Gishath, Sun's Avatar - Dinosaur Tribal WRG | Rawr!!!
WUG Derevi, Empyrial Tactician - Enchantress Tactics WUG | Enchantments Focused
GBG The Gitrog Monster - Land Shenanigans GBG | Lands/Mill Focused
WBW Kambal, Consul of Life Allocation Matters WBW | Life Gain/Loss focused
UBR Kess, Dissident Mage of the Lotus UBR | Spellslinger
BGB Hapatra, Vizier of Poisons - Counters & Tokens BGB | -1/-1 counters focused
Yes, I understand; in that case, it is very good that WotC shall be adding that errata to this card.
“When the people fear the government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.”-Thomas Jefferson
“A vote is like a rifle; its usefulness depends upon the character of its user.”-Theodore Roosevelt
“Patriotism means to stand by one's country; it does not mean to stand by one's president.”-Theodore Roosevelt
You don't really need to build it around a combo. In fact I think the deck is much more reliable as a ramp/token deck. I can get a turn 3 Avacyn, Angel of Hope or a turn 4 Kozilek, Butcher of Truth, or I can just poo out a bunch of tokens and drop those dudes later as finishers. The deck rocks!
Not to mention the planeswalkers for the deck are awesome. You have the elspeths to work with, Garruk Wildspeaker, Garruk 2GGG version, and Xenagos. All good choices. Maybe a Sarkhan Vol could be good if you do a token heavy strategy.
Anyways. Thats what I've done with this general. Its fun. People like playing agains't it. Its a healthy card.
Current
RGWMarath, Will of the WildRGW
GWUPheldagriff Group HugGWU
RGRRuric Thar, the UnbowedGRG
UXBOona ControlUXB
Retired
RGWMayael, the AnimaRGW
XGXGlissa Sunseeker ComboXGX
UR Melek, Izzet ParagonUR, B Shirei, Shizo's CaretakerB, R Jaya Ballard, Task MageR,RW Tajic, Blade of the LegionRW, UB Lazav, Dimir MastermindUB, UB Circu, Dimir LobotomistUB, RWU Zedruu the GreatheartedRWU, GUBThe MimeoplasmGUB, UGExperiment Kraj UG, WDarien, King of KjeldorW, BMarrow-GnawerB, WBGKarador, Ghost ChieftainWBG, UTeferi, Temporal ArchmageU, GWUDerevi, Empyrial TacticianGWU, RDaretti, Scrap SavantR, UTalrand, Sky SummonerU, GEzuri, Renegade LeaderG, WUBRGReaper KingWUBRG, RGXenagos, God of RevelsRG, CKozilek, Butcher of TruthC, WUBRGGeneral TazriWUBRG, GTitania, Protector of ArgothG
I play a heck of a lot more cards they've made than I have yours.