"Play answers" is always a valid response. In fact, in most situations, it's the only valid response. It's only people who are too whiny and angry that they have to interact with their opponents that call for bannings. Certain cards that win the game when cast should be banned (Biorhythm, for example), but cards that just have value are perfectly fine. Having a problem with someone's Deadeye Navigator? Wait til they tap out then Path that son of a ***** to Hell and back. Kiki-Jiki givin' you problems? Wrath the bastard and all his tokens.
EDH began as a Timmy-leaning format, but it's degenerated to the point where people are afraid to pack answers because removal and counters are "unfun." Well, to me, it's more fun to play with skill and build a deck with a measure of resilience than it is to slam down some fat nonsense creatures with synergy and win the same way every time. I'd rather cast Vindicate than ***** and moan and call for a card to be banned.
Those of you who want synergistic, value-based cards to be banned are nothing but cowards.
Let me get this straight, you're suggesting sorcery speed answers to kikijiki combos? Who plays Deadeye Navigator and taps out?
I run nearly everyone of these widely-hated blue/green cards in my Damia deck, and I will continue to until they are banned. More often than not if I get Deadeye Navigator I just win, quite often that turn. And the people around me most definitely play all the removal, hate cards, countermagic, and sweepers.
At some point you have to draw the line and say we can't ban more, because there always be a best deck or a best card. But again, "play answers" isn't an argument. You could use that argument for everything else on the banlist.
Why do people complain about the ban list as if they are forced to play it? It's not an official format, house rules it. Alternatively, if your friend has a deck you can't beat/don't like to play/don't care to beat you aren't forced to play it. No one is holding a gun to your head saying "play against this deck or I'll blow your brains out". If you like EDH at a different power level than someone else either convince them to play in a different manner or play someone else. The answer really is that simple folks.
Let me get this straight, you're suggesting sorcery speed answers to kikijiki combos? Who plays Deadeye Navigator and taps out?
I run nearly everyone of these widely-hated blue/green cards in my Damia deck, and I will continue to until they are banned. More often than not if I get Deadeye Navigator I just win, quite often that turn. And the people around me most definitely play all the removal, hate cards, countermagic, and sweepers.
At some point you have to draw the line and say we can't ban more, because there always be a best deck or a best card. But again, "play answers" isn't an argument. You could use that argument for everything else on the banlist.
You don't have to tap out. You can't bounce either of them until both are in play and the soulbond trigger has resolved. This means that any counter over the course of probably two turns stops it, any instant speed removal on either turn stops it, AND you have one turn to answer it at sorcery speed (at least).
You're talking about a two turn, two card, 9 mana combo or a one turn, two card, 15 mana combo that doesn't really get crazy until the turn after you untap with it all. That's a hilariously weak combo for that much mana. I'd rather just cast Omniscience or Tooth and Nail up an infinite combo and just win on the spot.
Anyone who thinks Sylvan Primordial is broken isn't good at Magic, plain and simple.
PS: That's a pretty bad attitude for a casual, just for fun format. If you think something is broken enough that it deserves to be banned, you shouldn't be playing with it. I don't play with Sol Ring for that very reason.
PPS: The play answers thing does work sometimes. The number of answers is completely relevant in the discussion. How many answers are there to a hardcast Emrakul in EDH? Very, very few. How many answers are there to Sylvan Primordial+Deadeye Navigator? Countless.
We had one player who refused to dilute any of his combo decks. We pleaded with him to dial them down a notch because some of us didn't have the card pool he had, or some of us just didn't enjoy "going infinite". The majority of us agreed that we weren't having fun, but we also didn't want to force him to change his deck. This man truly enjoys combo decks more than anything else. He is a true Johnny. It's not fair to strip him of his combos. If he wants to play them, he should have every right to. Granted, this caused quite the rift in the group.
So I had a solution. The 5 color "Screw You" deck. We approve of using certain Legendary Artifacts or planeswalkers as Commanders, and Legacy Weapon was easily approved by all players. So I made a 5 color deck, with Legacy Weapon as the Commander. Seems fun and harmless, but let me show you an example of the kinds of cards I played.
Every single card was targeted hate. If I got to 7 mana, I played Legacy Weapon and started blowing up his lands. I had 0 win conditions.
He wasn't too happy to play against this deck. He asked why I was singling him out and I told him "because it is fun, it's what I enjoy doing". Effectively the same thing he told us in regards to comboing. Eventually he came around and toned down the deck. He actually seems to be enjoying himself just as much now, and everybody is having a better time. He realized that you can do what you enjoy without making everybody miserable. Commander is a group effort. A group of people get together, play a crazy game of Magic, and attempt to have good time. If the majority of the group isn't having a good time, even if you are having a wonderful time, the event, as a whole, is a failure. Take it from a long time DM; if you are the only one enjoying your campaign, and the players aren't having fun, you have failed.
The deck has since been retired, but the threat of it remains.
I firmly believe deadeye should be banned, but as the rest of my playgoup agrees the only time I ever see him is during the local league games which granted is always an arms race anyways.
And if prime time deserved banning sylvan prime should get the ax too imo, its in every green deck period. And dropping it turns into a clone/reanimate/exile/flicker/abuse war faster than prime time, consecrated sphinx, an kokusho combined (in our group) with even the non-green decks getting in on it just for the removal factor.
And running answers is great, until there's 3-6 per game and one of them is bound to stick eventually.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I had a wordy signature here once.
URGRiku, Sorcerer SupremeGRU Who needs permanents anyways? WUBRGDeckbuilder's ToolboxGRBUW Warning:Contents include 34 decks and growing
Deadeye Navigator is one that I've never really understood all of the hate for. Sure, it can combo with Sylvan or any other ETB guy for tons and tons of value, but literally every single time you use him, including the first time, there is a window of vulnerability. If you are holding an instant speed removal card, your opponent will get zero value out of Navigator, and you get another chance every time they flicker.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
My Moderator Helpdesk
Currently Playing:
Legacy: Something U/W Controlish EDH Cube
Hypercube! A New EDH Deck Every Week(ish)!
I reeealy wish WotC would just take this over, so stupid they let these fools manage it. This is a constructed format like any other and especially in 1v1 a VERY real format there needs to be an OFFICIAL ban lists! If people want to play banned cards in "house rules" that is fine but there needs to be much tighter control for playing vs randoms online and in real life, its an extremely common scenario and simply how the game works.
I used to LOVE commander, now I think its the biggest pile of trash because of gaping power disparities between players decks and broken card draws.
Please please WotC at least create a "commander duel" format and bann the fark out of the stupid cards like you did with 100cs!
This is the website for the French 1v1 Duel Commander format. It's a much healthier banlist for 1v1, and is just amazing to play. Also, nice icon! Damia BUG control is what I run in the format, it does pretty well, but it's definitely a rogue deck. V. Clique, Arbiter, Maelstrom Wanderer, these guys are the "top decks".
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Whenever someone claims to hate blue I automatically assume they're a bad player.
Deadeye Navigator is one that I've never really understood all of the hate for. Sure, it can combo with Sylvan or any other ETB guy for tons and tons of value, but literally every single time you use him, including the first time, there is a window of vulnerability. If you are holding an instant speed removal card, your opponent will get zero value out of Navigator, and you get another chance every time they flicker.
"Flicker Sylvan Primordial"
"In response Slaughter Pact Deadeye"
"In response flicker Deadeye"
"In response Go for the Throat Deadeye"
"In response flicker Deadeye"
Do you even know how this game works? lol, Unless they tap out, he's not vulnerable.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Whenever someone claims to hate blue I automatically assume they're a bad player.
Do you even know how this game works? lol, Unless they tap out, he's not vulnerable.
Flicker Sylvan Primordial.
Comes back, Soulbond on the stack
You Slaughter Pact Deadeye? Well, since he's not bonded, I can't flicker him. Guess he dies.
Do YOU even know how the game works?
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
My Moderator Helpdesk
Currently Playing:
Legacy: Something U/W Controlish EDH Cube
Hypercube! A New EDH Deck Every Week(ish)!
I don't think it's good deck building if you running removal just to stop one guy.
It's so easy to say "geez you suck at deckbuilding". I'm not really sure if you cared about a social game, where people are the most important thing and winning is secondary.
Anyone can make a hate deck just to prove a point, like tehgrease did. Even I have one. And you know what? It's full of removals and I win all the time. It's so easy to make this sort of deck. In fact, it's too easy. This is what I call poor deckbuilding.
Let's also give some benefit of a doubt to Commander matchups. Some generals are really poor matchups against certain legends, and I can accept that. You should accept that.
We all don't wanna call or be called a jerk. It's easy to fall into temptation and go big with cards like Deadeye. The assumption that one can be trusted and responsible with his cards is often the playgroup's downfall. If not, why are some people playing kiki-jikki pestermite combo in their decks? Go play modern bro!
What I don't agree is having the majority tuning their decks to the level of "that guy" when he should be the one toning down instead. I hope we can have some agreement on this.
If your playgroup is high level, competitive, cutthroat, shuffling-more-than-playing type and yours is a precon deck, then the latter should tune up or ship out. Simple as that.
Flicker Sylvan Primordial.
Comes back, Soulbond on the stack
You Slaughter Pact Deadeye? Well, since he's not bonded, I can't flicker him. Guess he dies.
"Oops I got your only black source. Nice Slaughter Pact. GG."
How bad are you if you only have one black source by the time he has Deadeye, Sylvan AND the mana to flicker it? He's either got 9+ mana or you've let it go for three turns total with Deadeye sitting out there vulnerable for two turns.
People build decks with three removal spells and then whine about easy to disrupt, creature based combos. It's silly.
PS: Anyone comparing Deadeye's survivability with Aetherling's has no clue how Magic works. Atherling needs one mana per removal spell. Deadeye needs two mana per removal speed and just plain can't do anything to a removal spell and an instant removal spell.
Nah, that's more an issue of playgroup and mindset. People have this mistaken idea that they HAVE to play some certain huge percentage of staples. They have to play a top tier commander, etc.
Lots of people seem pretty disingenuous about this. They'll complain about stale board states, everything feeling the same, but then they'll still continue to play their 100 stack of good stuff "staples in my color" with a heavily played commander. People end up feeling like they brought a knife to a gun fight. Or a gun to tank battle. Or a tank to bombing campaign. Or a bombing campaign to a nuclear standoff. Sometimes to defuse an arms race, you need to show up at the table with a squeaky clown hammer. (Even if the squeaky clown hammer spits out Joker toxin. )
This is 100% my meta, and I did try doing what you said. It did not work. All that happened was that I simply didn't win the game and didn't have any more fun.
I am shocked at how often people play commander decks without removal. I know you are trying ot have fun, but it is removal.
And there is plenty of simple stuff like pithing needle, that you can run out early and shut down all kinds of stupidity.
Being degenerate is what the format is about. If someone in your playgroup is out of control, so they bring their vintage legacy sneak and show deck to compete with your sliver homebrew? If so then you guys shouldn't be sharing a kitchen table.
I am shocked at how often people play commander decks without removal. I know you are trying ot have fun, but it is removal.
And there is plenty of simple stuff like pithing needle, that you can run out early and shut down all kinds of stupidity.
Being degenerate is what the format is about. If someone in your playgroup is out of control, so they bring their vintage legacy sneak and show deck to compete with your sliver homebrew? If so then you guys shouldn't be sharing a kitchen table.
This is a sad fact. My school has a gamer's guild. We're trying to introduce more people into the game of magic. However, theyre are these few guys that seriously make new players not want to play. Oh, you played a turn 3 Barony Vampire? Alright, I'm going to isochron scepter a second counter spell and basically make you not able to play spells and you don't even understand why. Or another character who insults you if you play cards that aren't foiled. We try not to play with these people. EDH is a timmy format, in the sense that most casual decks will give you time to play the big fatties that other formats would laugh at. I run Worldspine Wurm in my mono green deck and know what? I love the giant critter.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I fear I won't have much time to play Magic these days.
I get to watch worlds develop around me.
I get to watch great leaders, terrible oppressors, and trend setters rise and fall.
Limited, Standard, Modern, everything is a different playing field I feel I can observe, but will not actually touch.
I look forward to the stories I will hear.
And more so to the ones I will watch unfold first hand.
Isn't the unknown exciting?
Here's a quick thought, if they feel the format is in a good place at the moment, why does it feel so stagnant with the new M14 legend rule, I mean sure it's nice to have a 4 Kozilek, Butcher of Truth on the board, but the fact of the matter is, this allows specific combo pieces to run rampant.
I'm sure their defintition of the format being in a good place at the moment differs from mine, but I'm just starting to get sick of seeing the same style of board state time and time again, it's getting annoying.
We had one player who refused to dilute any of his combo decks. We pleaded with him to dial them down a notch because some of us didn't have the card pool he had, or some of us just didn't enjoy "going infinite". The majority of us agreed that we weren't having fun, but we also didn't want to force him to change his deck. This man truly enjoys combo decks more than anything else. He is a true Johnny. It's not fair to strip him of his combos. If he wants to play them, he should have every right to. Granted, this caused quite the rift in the group.
So I had a solution. The 5 color "Screw You" deck. We approve of using certain Legendary Artifacts or planeswalkers as Commanders, and Legacy Weapon was easily approved by all players. So I made a 5 color deck, with Legacy Weapon as the Commander. Seems fun and harmless, but let me show you an example of the kinds of cards I played.
Every single card was targeted hate. If I got to 7 mana, I played Legacy Weapon and started blowing up his lands. I had 0 win conditions.
He wasn't too happy to play against this deck. He asked why I was singling him out and I told him "because it is fun, it's what I enjoy doing". Effectively the same thing he told us in regards to comboing. Eventually he came around and toned down the deck. He actually seems to be enjoying himself just as much now, and everybody is having a better time. He realized that you can do what you enjoy without making everybody miserable. Commander is a group effort. A group of people get together, play a crazy game of Magic, and attempt to have good time. If the majority of the group isn't having a good time, even if you are having a wonderful time, the event, as a whole, is a failure. Take it from a long time DM; if you are the only one enjoying your campaign, and the players aren't having fun, you have failed.
The deck has since been retired, but the threat of it remains.
Never say that, spikes will come all together to cry and say that this is a social format and social can mean competitive and social actually means competitive 100% of the time so play competitive and shut up timmy. REMOVAL! PLAY REMOVAL! YOU NEED 50 REMOVALS IN YOUR DECK!!!
really, i seriously miss the time when commander was a timmy format...
Okay, don't play removal. Lose to the Timmy who's smart enough to play a better deck than you, because make no mistake, locking you out of the game is a Timmy move.
1) the whole idea of 1 for 1 removal is bad in multiplayer, while not entirely incorrect, is flawed. If everyone is running a sufficient amount of removal, the usefulness of 1 for 1 removal comes MUCH closer to its usefulness in a 1v1 setting. No, you as a single player cant stop everything but you, as a group, should be able to stop most things.
2) youre not running answers to stop one player at the table. You run answers so that your deck can deal with an array of problems from a variety of players. However if you know someone is running a navigatorn you will probably hold some removal back if you can help it. Everytime you build a deck, you should consider your ratios. If you would run 4 creature removal spells in a 60 card deck, you should probably run 7 or so creature removal spells in a 100 card deck regardless of whether youre playing against deadeye or not.
It becomes more and more of a timmy format every day. Multiplayer politics discourage combos and spikes, so the timmies run rampant with their bull**** and the format suffers.
For real. Every kid out there thinks anyone better than him is a Spike. Not the case, magicians!
Summing it up, it's very simple: there is a divide that's getting larger between the cutthroat, competitive players who want a format of degeneration and instant wins, and then there is the more casual (for whatever reason) playerbase that wants almost everything degenerate (as democratically voted) to be removed from the format, period. You can't satisfy both audiences, and while the RC may settle with the former and smaller group, it doesn't take much for the latter group to become so large that eventually they're forced to change the rules (see: Emrakul, Primeval Titan) when they start losing players (and thus, WOTC's official support).
No idea what the player demographics look like, but this is not what happened with these cards. Titan and Emrakrul are banned precisely because they are dangerous "timmy creatures." You don't need a degenerate combo deck to make them so good that they dominate every game; timmies will throw them into their decks because they are big, nasty board-swinging creatures, but these end up making the table miserable. Even those with the right "spirit" about EDH end up ab-using these cards, so that means they just get into tables everywhere, not just the hands of the degenerate combo abusers that get shunned out of the rules committee (and many other groups) anyway.
Really I was hoping the banlist would move towards that kind of consistency. There are thousands of degenerate combos/lockdowns not on the ban list, you really can't catch them all, so it's not clear why they should even try like some of the ban list items do. Just focus on keeping "timmy tempting" degenerates out of the format, cards that are either nasty on their own or interact in a nasty way with common format staples while having "big effects" (i.e. not lockdown), to keep the people who do get the "EDH spirit" from screwing up their own games.
It seems to me that everyone that says Sylvan is not broken is bad at magic or has very friendly meta without broken decks.
Some time ago we started playing 6 people pods and EVERY single game someone drops Sylvan primordial turn 4 on average. Most of the time we manage to stop or recover from first one, but the problem is when whole table starts copying it or reanimating it multiple times.
After the dust settles, we usually have 2 players with bunch of lands, 1 player at normal count and 3 players out of the game with probably 1-2 lands.
Doesn't this remind you of PrimeTime and how games come to revolve around him whenever he hits play?
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
Let me get this straight, you're suggesting sorcery speed answers to kikijiki combos? Who plays Deadeye Navigator and taps out?
I run nearly everyone of these widely-hated blue/green cards in my Damia deck, and I will continue to until they are banned. More often than not if I get Deadeye Navigator I just win, quite often that turn. And the people around me most definitely play all the removal, hate cards, countermagic, and sweepers.
At some point you have to draw the line and say we can't ban more, because there always be a best deck or a best card. But again, "play answers" isn't an argument. You could use that argument for everything else on the banlist.
More often than not, it is better to be active than reactive in EDH. Sometimes the answers (removal) just come too late.
UR Melek, Izzet ParagonUR, B Shirei, Shizo's CaretakerB, R Jaya Ballard, Task MageR,RW Tajic, Blade of the LegionRW, UB Lazav, Dimir MastermindUB, UB Circu, Dimir LobotomistUB, RWU Zedruu the GreatheartedRWU, GUBThe MimeoplasmGUB, UGExperiment Kraj UG, WDarien, King of KjeldorW, BMarrow-GnawerB, WBGKarador, Ghost ChieftainWBG, UTeferi, Temporal ArchmageU, GWUDerevi, Empyrial TacticianGWU, RDaretti, Scrap SavantR, UTalrand, Sky SummonerU, GEzuri, Renegade LeaderG, WUBRGReaper KingWUBRG, RGXenagos, God of RevelsRG, CKozilek, Butcher of TruthC, WUBRGGeneral TazriWUBRG, GTitania, Protector of ArgothG
You don't have to tap out. You can't bounce either of them until both are in play and the soulbond trigger has resolved. This means that any counter over the course of probably two turns stops it, any instant speed removal on either turn stops it, AND you have one turn to answer it at sorcery speed (at least).
You're talking about a two turn, two card, 9 mana combo or a one turn, two card, 15 mana combo that doesn't really get crazy until the turn after you untap with it all. That's a hilariously weak combo for that much mana. I'd rather just cast Omniscience or Tooth and Nail up an infinite combo and just win on the spot.
Anyone who thinks Sylvan Primordial is broken isn't good at Magic, plain and simple.
PS: That's a pretty bad attitude for a casual, just for fun format. If you think something is broken enough that it deserves to be banned, you shouldn't be playing with it. I don't play with Sol Ring for that very reason.
PPS: The play answers thing does work sometimes. The number of answers is completely relevant in the discussion. How many answers are there to a hardcast Emrakul in EDH? Very, very few. How many answers are there to Sylvan Primordial+Deadeye Navigator? Countless.
We had one player who refused to dilute any of his combo decks. We pleaded with him to dial them down a notch because some of us didn't have the card pool he had, or some of us just didn't enjoy "going infinite". The majority of us agreed that we weren't having fun, but we also didn't want to force him to change his deck. This man truly enjoys combo decks more than anything else. He is a true Johnny. It's not fair to strip him of his combos. If he wants to play them, he should have every right to. Granted, this caused quite the rift in the group.
So I had a solution. The 5 color "Screw You" deck. We approve of using certain Legendary Artifacts or planeswalkers as Commanders, and Legacy Weapon was easily approved by all players. So I made a 5 color deck, with Legacy Weapon as the Commander. Seems fun and harmless, but let me show you an example of the kinds of cards I played.
Every single card was targeted hate. If I got to 7 mana, I played Legacy Weapon and started blowing up his lands. I had 0 win conditions.
He wasn't too happy to play against this deck. He asked why I was singling him out and I told him "because it is fun, it's what I enjoy doing". Effectively the same thing he told us in regards to comboing. Eventually he came around and toned down the deck. He actually seems to be enjoying himself just as much now, and everybody is having a better time. He realized that you can do what you enjoy without making everybody miserable. Commander is a group effort. A group of people get together, play a crazy game of Magic, and attempt to have good time. If the majority of the group isn't having a good time, even if you are having a wonderful time, the event, as a whole, is a failure. Take it from a long time DM; if you are the only one enjoying your campaign, and the players aren't having fun, you have failed.
The deck has since been retired, but the threat of it remains.
PucaTrade Invite. Sign up and enjoy the first 500 points ($5) free!
And if prime time deserved banning sylvan prime should get the ax too imo, its in every green deck period. And dropping it turns into a clone/reanimate/exile/flicker/abuse war faster than prime time, consecrated sphinx, an kokusho combined (in our group) with even the non-green decks getting in on it just for the removal factor.
And running answers is great, until there's 3-6 per game and one of them is bound to stick eventually.
URGRiku, Sorcerer SupremeGRU
Who needs permanents anyways?
WUBRGDeckbuilder's ToolboxGRBUW
Warning:Contents include 34 decks and growing
Currently Playing:
Legacy: Something U/W Controlish
EDH Cube
Hypercube! A New EDH Deck Every Week(ish)!
http://duelcommander.com/
This is the website for the French 1v1 Duel Commander format. It's a much healthier banlist for 1v1, and is just amazing to play. Also, nice icon! Damia BUG control is what I run in the format, it does pretty well, but it's definitely a rogue deck. V. Clique, Arbiter, Maelstrom Wanderer, these guys are the "top decks".
"Flicker Sylvan Primordial"
"In response Slaughter Pact Deadeye"
"In response flicker Deadeye"
"In response Go for the Throat Deadeye"
"In response flicker Deadeye"
Do you even know how this game works? lol, Unless they tap out, he's not vulnerable.
Flicker Sylvan Primordial.
Comes back, Soulbond on the stack
You Slaughter Pact Deadeye? Well, since he's not bonded, I can't flicker him. Guess he dies.
Do YOU even know how the game works?
Currently Playing:
Legacy: Something U/W Controlish
EDH Cube
Hypercube! A New EDH Deck Every Week(ish)!
I don't think it's good deck building if you running removal just to stop one guy.
It's so easy to say "geez you suck at deckbuilding". I'm not really sure if you cared about a social game, where people are the most important thing and winning is secondary.
Anyone can make a hate deck just to prove a point, like tehgrease did. Even I have one. And you know what? It's full of removals and I win all the time. It's so easy to make this sort of deck. In fact, it's too easy. This is what I call poor deckbuilding.
Let's also give some benefit of a doubt to Commander matchups. Some generals are really poor matchups against certain legends, and I can accept that. You should accept that.
We all don't wanna call or be called a jerk. It's easy to fall into temptation and go big with cards like Deadeye. The assumption that one can be trusted and responsible with his cards is often the playgroup's downfall. If not, why are some people playing kiki-jikki pestermite combo in their decks? Go play modern bro!
What I don't agree is having the majority tuning their decks to the level of "that guy" when he should be the one toning down instead. I hope we can have some agreement on this.
If your playgroup is high level, competitive, cutthroat, shuffling-more-than-playing type and yours is a precon deck, then the latter should tune up or ship out. Simple as that.
UR Melek, Izzet ParagonUR, B Shirei, Shizo's CaretakerB, R Jaya Ballard, Task MageR,RW Tajic, Blade of the LegionRW, UB Lazav, Dimir MastermindUB, UB Circu, Dimir LobotomistUB, RWU Zedruu the GreatheartedRWU, GUBThe MimeoplasmGUB, UGExperiment Kraj UG, WDarien, King of KjeldorW, BMarrow-GnawerB, WBGKarador, Ghost ChieftainWBG, UTeferi, Temporal ArchmageU, GWUDerevi, Empyrial TacticianGWU, RDaretti, Scrap SavantR, UTalrand, Sky SummonerU, GEzuri, Renegade LeaderG, WUBRGReaper KingWUBRG, RGXenagos, God of RevelsRG, CKozilek, Butcher of TruthC, WUBRGGeneral TazriWUBRG, GTitania, Protector of ArgothG
Hahaha good one
UR Melek, Izzet ParagonUR, B Shirei, Shizo's CaretakerB, R Jaya Ballard, Task MageR,RW Tajic, Blade of the LegionRW, UB Lazav, Dimir MastermindUB, UB Circu, Dimir LobotomistUB, RWU Zedruu the GreatheartedRWU, GUBThe MimeoplasmGUB, UGExperiment Kraj UG, WDarien, King of KjeldorW, BMarrow-GnawerB, WBGKarador, Ghost ChieftainWBG, UTeferi, Temporal ArchmageU, GWUDerevi, Empyrial TacticianGWU, RDaretti, Scrap SavantR, UTalrand, Sky SummonerU, GEzuri, Renegade LeaderG, WUBRGReaper KingWUBRG, RGXenagos, God of RevelsRG, CKozilek, Butcher of TruthC, WUBRGGeneral TazriWUBRG, GTitania, Protector of ArgothG
Ideally you catch either the Deadeye or the Primordial when it first enters the battlefield.
Currently Playing:
Legacy: Something U/W Controlish
EDH Cube
Hypercube! A New EDH Deck Every Week(ish)!
How bad are you if you only have one black source by the time he has Deadeye, Sylvan AND the mana to flicker it? He's either got 9+ mana or you've let it go for three turns total with Deadeye sitting out there vulnerable for two turns.
People build decks with three removal spells and then whine about easy to disrupt, creature based combos. It's silly.
PS: Anyone comparing Deadeye's survivability with Aetherling's has no clue how Magic works. Atherling needs one mana per removal spell. Deadeye needs two mana per removal speed and just plain can't do anything to a removal spell and an instant removal spell.
This is 100% my meta, and I did try doing what you said. It did not work. All that happened was that I simply didn't win the game and didn't have any more fun.
And there is plenty of simple stuff like pithing needle, that you can run out early and shut down all kinds of stupidity.
Being degenerate is what the format is about. If someone in your playgroup is out of control, so they bring their vintage legacy sneak and show deck to compete with your sliver homebrew? If so then you guys shouldn't be sharing a kitchen table.
This is a sad fact. My school has a gamer's guild. We're trying to introduce more people into the game of magic. However, theyre are these few guys that seriously make new players not want to play. Oh, you played a turn 3 Barony Vampire? Alright, I'm going to isochron scepter a second counter spell and basically make you not able to play spells and you don't even understand why. Or another character who insults you if you play cards that aren't foiled. We try not to play with these people. EDH is a timmy format, in the sense that most casual decks will give you time to play the big fatties that other formats would laugh at. I run Worldspine Wurm in my mono green deck and know what? I love the giant critter.
I get to watch great leaders, terrible oppressors, and trend setters rise and fall.
Limited, Standard, Modern, everything is a different playing field I feel I can observe, but will not actually touch.
I look forward to the stories I will hear.
And more so to the ones I will watch unfold first hand.
Isn't the unknown exciting?
That deck looks awesome. I need to remember this.
Sideboards are no longer allowed and will only be a 'house-rule' thing?
I buy HP and Damaged cards!
Only EDH:
Sigarda, Host of Herons: Enchantress' Enchantments
Jenara, Asura of War: ETB Value Town
Purphoros, God of the Forge: Global Punishment
Xenagos, God of Revels: Ramp, Sneak, & Heavy Hitters
Ghave, Guru of Spores: Dies_to_Doom_Blade's stax list
Edric, Spymaster of Trest: Donald's list
Okay, don't play removal. Lose to the Timmy who's smart enough to play a better deck than you, because make no mistake, locking you out of the game is a Timmy move.
Standard: W/R Aggro
2) youre not running answers to stop one player at the table. You run answers so that your deck can deal with an array of problems from a variety of players. However if you know someone is running a navigatorn you will probably hold some removal back if you can help it. Everytime you build a deck, you should consider your ratios. If you would run 4 creature removal spells in a 60 card deck, you should probably run 7 or so creature removal spells in a 100 card deck regardless of whether youre playing against deadeye or not.
For real. Every kid out there thinks anyone better than him is a Spike. Not the case, magicians!
Standard: W/R Aggro
No idea what the player demographics look like, but this is not what happened with these cards. Titan and Emrakrul are banned precisely because they are dangerous "timmy creatures." You don't need a degenerate combo deck to make them so good that they dominate every game; timmies will throw them into their decks because they are big, nasty board-swinging creatures, but these end up making the table miserable. Even those with the right "spirit" about EDH end up ab-using these cards, so that means they just get into tables everywhere, not just the hands of the degenerate combo abusers that get shunned out of the rules committee (and many other groups) anyway.
Really I was hoping the banlist would move towards that kind of consistency. There are thousands of degenerate combos/lockdowns not on the ban list, you really can't catch them all, so it's not clear why they should even try like some of the ban list items do. Just focus on keeping "timmy tempting" degenerates out of the format, cards that are either nasty on their own or interact in a nasty way with common format staples while having "big effects" (i.e. not lockdown), to keep the people who do get the "EDH spirit" from screwing up their own games.
Some time ago we started playing 6 people pods and EVERY single game someone drops Sylvan primordial turn 4 on average. Most of the time we manage to stop or recover from first one, but the problem is when whole table starts copying it or reanimating it multiple times.
After the dust settles, we usually have 2 players with bunch of lands, 1 player at normal count and 3 players out of the game with probably 1-2 lands.
Doesn't this remind you of PrimeTime and how games come to revolve around him whenever he hits play?