Between supreme verdict, counterspells and celestial flare in U/W, I don't foresee this card being a huge problem for me. Unless is stumble on turn 4 with a freaking guldgate.
I just find it funny that a card that is new and most often will be treat the same way as a $1 uncommon in most game instances is fetching 8 plus times the amount of money as said established card.
Aaaaah spolier season... a time to throw all fiscal responsibility to the four winds.
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Modern GB Rock U Flooding Merfolk RUG Delver Midrange WU Monks UW Tempo Geist GW Bogle GW Liege UR Tron B Vampires
Affinity Legacy
Fish
Goblins
Burn
Reanimator
Dredge
Affinity EDH W Akroma GBW Ghave BRU Thrax GR Ruric I advocate for the elimination of the combo archetype in Modern. I believe it is degenerate and unfun by its very nature and will always limit design space and cause unnecessary bans.
Between supreme verdict, counterspells and celestial flare in U/W, I don't foresee this card being a huge problem for me. Unless is stumble on turn 4 with a freaking guldgate.
Be advised that this is just a two drop so countering doesnt bring you much if you are even able to do it and lets not forget that G/W has Voice of Resurgence that makes sure you dont get as much value out of your instants. If if you do a turn 4 verdict they could just play Advent of Wurm on your EoT and bash in with a 5/5 or a 5/5 and a 2/2 if they had Voice in play.
Modern GB Rock U Flooding Merfolk RUG Delver Midrange WU Monks UW Tempo Geist GW Bogle GW Liege UR Tron B Vampires
Affinity Legacy
Fish
Goblins
Burn
Reanimator
Dredge
Affinity EDH W Akroma GBW Ghave BRU Thrax GR Ruric I advocate for the elimination of the combo archetype in Modern. I believe it is degenerate and unfun by its very nature and will always limit design space and cause unnecessary bans.
i think it's easy to overestimate how hard this will be to deal with once it's monstrous but like 14 times out of 15 it will just be played as a solid 3/3 for 2 and die before getting monstrous. This is not a 5 mana aetherling, it is a kolonian tusker with upside.
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"A scrupulous writer, in every sentence that he writes, will ask himself at least four questions, thus: 1. What am I trying to say? 2. What words will express it? 3. What image or idiom will make it clearer? 4. Is this image fresh enough to have an effect? And he will probably ask himself two more: 1. Could I put it more shortly? 2. Have I said anything that is avoidably ugly?"
Not having hexproof automatically makes this card a lot easier to deal with. You can always kill it in response to the monstrous activation, and if they want to hold up 5 mana to keep him safe, fine by me.
2 mana for a 3/3 isn't even that scary (it can definitely add a lot to aggro, but not just take over the format on its own), and 5 mana to upgrade it is quite a bit.
While it becomes almost unkillable when it becomes monstrous, it's still just a 4/4. It will still take a while to kill you. There are probably scarier things to worry about at 5 mana anyway.
Unfortunately Wizards has retired Shroud in favor of Hexproof because new players and casual players, (who always have and will make up the largest base of their business,) do not like, enjoy, and often don't understand the power in "symmetric" effects like Shroud.
The same goes for self-harming things, reasons we will never see cards like Phyrexian Arena in a core set again, or the pain land cycle, that flavor of ability doesn't sit well with the casual and newb crowd.
Sad, but true.
Maybe in a core set. But didnt we just see erebos? He self harms
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I fear I won't have much time to play Magic these days.
I get to watch worlds develop around me.
I get to watch great leaders, terrible oppressors, and trend setters rise and fall.
Limited, Standard, Modern, everything is a different playing field I feel I can observe, but will not actually touch.
I look forward to the stories I will hear.
And more so to the ones I will watch unfold first hand.
Isn't the unknown exciting?
Not having hexproof automatically makes this card a lot easier to deal with. You can always kill it in response to the monstrous activation, and if they want to hold up 5 mana to keep him safe, fine by me.
2 mana for a 3/3 isn't even that scary (it can definitely add a lot to aggro, but not just take over the format on its own), and 5 mana to upgrade it is quite a bit.
While it becomes almost unkillable when it becomes monstrous, it's still just a 4/4. It will still take a while to kill you. There are probably scarier things to worry about at 5 mana anyway.
In a deck with Voice, Thune, Trostani, and Ooze how long do you expect Fabiocat to stay a 3/3 or 4/4? You are also forgetting Unflinching Courage on a Monstrous Fabiocat with Thune out. Can you say freaking nasty?
You only need to keep open 5 mana if you don't have some protection in hand, 2 I can think of for 1 mana in m14 alone. Otherwise you hold off until you get to 6 mana.
In a deck with Voice, Thune, Trostani, and Ooze how long do you expect Fabiocat to stay a 3/3 or 4/4? You are also forgetting Unflinching Courage on a Monstrous Fabiocat with Thune out. Can you say freaking nasty?
You only need to keep open 5 mana if you don't have some protection in hand, 2 I can think of for 1 mana in m14 alone. Otherwise you hold off until you get to 6 mana.
Thank you, Thank you for using my dubbed name for him, Fabio cat/lion. He will be good, but not broken. It still can be countered, burned, destroyed, bounced, and turned into bacon before he goes Fabio lion hulk. Forced Sacrifice is still an option. I am not worried he will be hard to rid of or priced to high, cause its still a rare, not mythic.
Wrong by what, your standards? Fortunately for us, you don't design Magic cards, nor are the authority on what makes Magic a successful game.
Shroud is counter-intuitive. Hexproof isn't. I don't remember people making as big of a fuss about all this when Troll Ascetic was first printed, but after 2 years of Geist of Saint Traft, it seems like it's easier to jump to conclusions than actually think about how a card effects the format as a whole.
Shroud is very intuitive. The creature is untouchable. Something untouchable can't be touched. Nobody can touch it. This is true for all parties under all circumstances at all times. How hard is that to understand?
Hexproof is less intuitive. The creature is untouchable to some things but not others? A novice might think that hexproof means the creature is only touchable by good things that they allow (we know this not to be true, but again. Causals). Multi-player formats are a thing, especially amongst the novice kitchen table crowd. Opponents might team up to gang up on a common foe. Giant growth is a good thing, I'd love to have my creatures be giant growthed so that they can win in combat. Especially if someone else paid the casting cost. Novices might think that since giant growth is a positive effect, it can help their hexproof guys when they want it to beacuse in their mind hexproof = "bad things can't touch it, good things can"
FabioCat isn't broken, but will be fun. I doubt he will be used a lot in competitions. Maybe... he is rather non-hostile to the point that a person could be dropping bomb after bomb completely ignoring FabioCat for several turns. Then, they might remember him as all their bombs get doombladed(etc. etc.), and just go for it to have their prayers answered. I'd like to see that match where FabioCat saves the day.
Maybe in a core set. But didnt we just see erebos? He self harms
We just saw Erebos in an expert level set, we just saw shock lands in an expert level set. Self-harm is not out of the question when it isn't in a core set, but it is still used sparingly. Self-harm is, however, almost entirely out of core set possibility unless it happens from some hoop-jumping (like Dark Prophecy triggers on your dudes' deaths, rather than just hurting you every turn like Arena.)
As a whole, self-harming effects and "symmetric effects" that aren't symmetric because of white's flavor, are on a decline in printing, and are all but extinct in terms of core sets.
Simple. They're all optional. We still see life-for-power occasionally, but in a generally weaker more casualized form. The mandatory commitment to the price of power is long gone.
"A scrupulous writer, in every sentence that he writes, will ask himself at least four questions, thus: 1. What am I trying to say? 2. What words will express it? 3. What image or idiom will make it clearer? 4. Is this image fresh enough to have an effect? And he will probably ask himself two more: 1. Could I put it more shortly? 2. Have I said anything that is avoidably ugly?"
I'm thinking he'll be a 1-2 of in GW midrange decks looking for a mana sink. He *might* see play in aggro decks as a 4 of until another good 2 drop in his colors becomes available.
Keep in mind: While Watchwolf is efficient, it is not impactful. A lot of people conflate the two. As a deck builder and as a player, I would rather leave my two slot a little lacking with just 4 VoRs and add more impactful threats at different mana levels than run a 3/3 for GW with a 5 mana activated ability that still isn't very impactful.
If Sigarda isn't good enough for mainstream standard play at 5, then that would imply that Fleeceman Lion's activated ability isn't good enough for standard. And Watchwolf, from what I hear, didn't see much standard play either.
Yeah it's a shame we don't have "self harm" stuff in the core set anymore, it's not like Sign in Blood or Dark Favor or Altar's Reap or Dark Prophecy or Smallpox or Xathrid Demon have been in core sets.
Its nice, really nice, that it has a mana sink for a great pair of buffs, otherwise, this is just Kalonian Tusker (in comparison to its standard impact).
Well I countered this turn 2 on turn 3 I detention sphered the voice and I have an azorius charm waiting with my untapped mana on my turn 4... as you can see its just as easy to theory beat any plays :p.
Hmm and with a new set bringing so many enchantment effects your opponent is going to have no answers!
Fabio cat/lion cant wait to get a playset, I would prob go 2-2 lion/ooze depending the meta shifts
Well I countered this turn 2 on turn 3 I detention sphered the voice and I have an azorius charm waiting with my untapped mana on my turn 4... as you can see its just as easy to theory beat any plays :p.
Just saying that G/W has a lot of cards that are good against control. They can easily overwhelm you reducing the chances that you can stop this turning monstrous.
Are jokes that aren't even in remotely the same league as bob/arena. Bob and arena will give you more cards and will consistently drain life. Bob/arena place you on a clock that will kill you in a matter of time. You can "turn-off" the life drain of scrivener by simply not entering topdeck mode. Prophecy will never trigger so frequently that you are in danger of dying to it.
Dark prophecy is just bleh. It does nothing whatsoever on its own and requires you to jump through a bunch of hoops to gain any benefit from it at all. That's a far cry from the playable draw engines.
Blood Scrivener has anti-synergy with itself. You want draw engines in order to keep your hand full, not to be eternally in topdeck mode. He has a relevant creature type as a zombie, and some niche decks might have a use for him, but he is FAR from the level of bob.
Yeah it's a shame we don't have "self harm" stuff in the core set anymore, it's not like Sign in Blood or Dark Favor or Altar's Reap or Dark Prophecy or Smallpox or Xathrid Demon have been in core sets.
Those are all either one-offs that have no chance of killing you unless you are at 2 life, or are unplayable trash.
Yeah it's a shame we don't have "self harm" stuff in the core set anymore, it's not like Sign in Blood or Dark Favor or Altar's Reap or Dark Prophecy or Smallpox or Xathrid Demon have been in core sets.
It's because of New World Order (which has everything to do with complexity at common and nothing to do with "no downsides").
I love when people (not you, I know you're being sarcastic) talk about what they have no idea about. Like how people who keep saying the Gainsay cycle will be good in limited have never heard of signaling.
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Card advantage is not the same thing as card draw. Something for 2B cannot be strictly worse than something for BBB or 3BB. If you're taking out Swords to Plowshares for Plummet, you're a fool. Stop doing these things!
Am I missing something or are people over hyping this guy. He's a slightly better Watchwolf, but honestly, is it worth sinking in 5 mana to give Watchwolf a +1/+1 counter? Yeah, he gets hexproof and doesn't die, but it's probably going to be later in the game anyway. Think of all the other things I can do with 5 mana, I could play much better beaters, I can keep the mana open for spells to use against my opponents, etc. This could have been an uncommon.
well for one we can make a creature monstrous at instant speed so why not keep ur mana open and if they do have targeted removal make him monstrous in resp. two hes a 4.4. on turn 5 which isnt bad at all especially if hes swinging in early in the game at all. and finally turn 5 isnt that late in a game hence how thragtusk saw play out the wazoo and then thats not even counting that this creature loses a power from thragtusk that goes to his toughness so now he can not only survive a rakdos keyrune or a lightning strile/searing spear and since thats really all that need be done, because hes indestructable and hexproof he beats smiter in the mirror match but yes there are ways to get around him but post rotation there arent nearly as many and thats not taking into account all the other amazing cards in GW decks which include advent, call, voice, ooze, smiter... need i continue. but anyways wg decks are going to be exceptionally potent and thats not including whats going to happen when people dip into third colors including naya which is going to be pretty ridiculous on the powerscale next to jund fantastic that aristocrats is gone now though
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\m/ Device \m/
Decks i'm currently running
Standard BUGW BUG Control (With a splash of white) WUG Midrange Lifegain
Modern
Death and Taxes
Legacy RG Valakut Lands WG Maverick R Burn
EDH G Azusa, Lost but Seeking
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Aaaaah spolier season... a time to throw all fiscal responsibility to the four winds.
GB Rock
U Flooding Merfolk
RUG Delver Midrange
WU Monks
UW Tempo Geist
GW Bogle
GW Liege
UR Tron
B Vampires
Affinity
Legacy
Fish
Goblins
Burn
Reanimator
Dredge
Affinity
EDH
W Akroma
GBW Ghave
BRU Thrax
GR Ruric
I advocate for the elimination of the combo archetype in Modern. I believe it is degenerate and unfun by its very nature and will always limit design space and cause unnecessary bans.
Be advised that this is just a two drop so countering doesnt bring you much if you are even able to do it and lets not forget that G/W has Voice of Resurgence that makes sure you dont get as much value out of your instants. If if you do a turn 4 verdict they could just play Advent of Wurm on your EoT and bash in with a 5/5 or a 5/5 and a 2/2 if they had Voice in play.
GB Rock
U Flooding Merfolk
RUG Delver Midrange
WU Monks
UW Tempo Geist
GW Bogle
GW Liege
UR Tron
B Vampires
Affinity
Legacy
Fish
Goblins
Burn
Reanimator
Dredge
Affinity
EDH
W Akroma
GBW Ghave
BRU Thrax
GR Ruric
I advocate for the elimination of the combo archetype in Modern. I believe it is degenerate and unfun by its very nature and will always limit design space and cause unnecessary bans.
2 mana for a 3/3 isn't even that scary (it can definitely add a lot to aggro, but not just take over the format on its own), and 5 mana to upgrade it is quite a bit.
While it becomes almost unkillable when it becomes monstrous, it's still just a 4/4. It will still take a while to kill you. There are probably scarier things to worry about at 5 mana anyway.
BBB Two Hundred Zombies BBB
Duel Commander
WR Tajic, Wrath of the Manlands RW
BGW Doran Destruction WGB
Commander
GUB Mimeoplasm, Screw Politics BUG
BR Mogis, God of Slaughter RB
RGW Marath, Ramp and Removal WGR
WUBRG Karona, Jank God GRBUW
Maybe in a core set. But didnt we just see erebos? He self harms
I get to watch great leaders, terrible oppressors, and trend setters rise and fall.
Limited, Standard, Modern, everything is a different playing field I feel I can observe, but will not actually touch.
I look forward to the stories I will hear.
And more so to the ones I will watch unfold first hand.
Isn't the unknown exciting?
In a deck with Voice, Thune, Trostani, and Ooze how long do you expect Fabiocat to stay a 3/3 or 4/4? You are also forgetting Unflinching Courage on a Monstrous Fabiocat with Thune out. Can you say freaking nasty?
You only need to keep open 5 mana if you don't have some protection in hand, 2 I can think of for 1 mana in m14 alone. Otherwise you hold off until you get to 6 mana.
Thank you, Thank you for using my dubbed name for him, Fabio cat/lion. He will be good, but not broken. It still can be countered, burned, destroyed, bounced, and turned into bacon before he goes Fabio lion hulk. Forced Sacrifice is still an option. I am not worried he will be hard to rid of or priced to high, cause its still a rare, not mythic.
Multiplayer Decks- Memnarch - Animar, Soul of Elements - Zur, the Enchanter - Atraxa, Praetors' Voice - Food Chain Tazri - Teysa Karlov
Modern BUMill and Bant Spirits.
Thank you Xenphire for the signature!
Shroud is very intuitive. The creature is untouchable. Something untouchable can't be touched. Nobody can touch it. This is true for all parties under all circumstances at all times. How hard is that to understand?
Hexproof is less intuitive. The creature is untouchable to some things but not others? A novice might think that hexproof means the creature is only touchable by good things that they allow (we know this not to be true, but again. Causals). Multi-player formats are a thing, especially amongst the novice kitchen table crowd. Opponents might team up to gang up on a common foe. Giant growth is a good thing, I'd love to have my creatures be giant growthed so that they can win in combat. Especially if someone else paid the casting cost. Novices might think that since giant growth is a positive effect, it can help their hexproof guys when they want it to beacuse in their mind hexproof = "bad things can't touch it, good things can"
shock lands anyone? phrexian mana?
self harm stuff is everywhere, normaly in black though.
We just saw Erebos in an expert level set, we just saw shock lands in an expert level set. Self-harm is not out of the question when it isn't in a core set, but it is still used sparingly. Self-harm is, however, almost entirely out of core set possibility unless it happens from some hoop-jumping (like Dark Prophecy triggers on your dudes' deaths, rather than just hurting you every turn like Arena.)
As a whole, self-harming effects and "symmetric effects" that aren't symmetric because of white's flavor, are on a decline in printing, and are all but extinct in terms of core sets.
Only if you choose to.
Erebos, Shocklands, Phyrexian mana, Underworld Connections, Bloodgift Demon, Griselbrand.
How do these cards all differ from the likes of Phyrexian Arena and Dark Confidant?
Simple. They're all optional. We still see life-for-power occasionally, but in a generally weaker more casualized form. The mandatory commitment to the price of power is long gone.
But for 1drops you have
Elvish Mystic
Experiment one
2Drops
3Drops
4Drops
5Drops
6Drops
Armada Wurm
This along with a whole subset of good support like Savage summoning and Sylesnia Charm makes me feel like this could be a real architype.
Keep in mind: While Watchwolf is efficient, it is not impactful. A lot of people conflate the two. As a deck builder and as a player, I would rather leave my two slot a little lacking with just 4 VoRs and add more impactful threats at different mana levels than run a 3/3 for GW with a 5 mana activated ability that still isn't very impactful.
If Sigarda isn't good enough for mainstream standard play at 5, then that would imply that Fleeceman Lion's activated ability isn't good enough for standard. And Watchwolf, from what I hear, didn't see much standard play either.
Loam Pox
Standard:
Boros Burn
Standard: W/R Aggro
Hmm and with a new set bringing so many enchantment effects your opponent is going to have no answers!
Fabio cat/lion cant wait to get a playset, I would prob go 2-2 lion/ooze depending the meta shifts
I'm not a God, but the creator of God's
Just saying that G/W has a lot of cards that are good against control. They can easily overwhelm you reducing the chances that you can stop this turning monstrous.
Are jokes that aren't even in remotely the same league as bob/arena. Bob and arena will give you more cards and will consistently drain life. Bob/arena place you on a clock that will kill you in a matter of time. You can "turn-off" the life drain of scrivener by simply not entering topdeck mode. Prophecy will never trigger so frequently that you are in danger of dying to it.
Dark prophecy is just bleh. It does nothing whatsoever on its own and requires you to jump through a bunch of hoops to gain any benefit from it at all. That's a far cry from the playable draw engines.
Blood Scrivener has anti-synergy with itself. You want draw engines in order to keep your hand full, not to be eternally in topdeck mode. He has a relevant creature type as a zombie, and some niche decks might have a use for him, but he is FAR from the level of bob.
Those are all either one-offs that have no chance of killing you unless you are at 2 life, or are unplayable trash.
It's because of New World Order (which has everything to do with complexity at common and nothing to do with "no downsides").
I love when people (not you, I know you're being sarcastic) talk about what they have no idea about. Like how people who keep saying the Gainsay cycle will be good in limited have never heard of signaling.
On phasing:
well for one we can make a creature monstrous at instant speed so why not keep ur mana open and if they do have targeted removal make him monstrous in resp. two hes a 4.4. on turn 5 which isnt bad at all especially if hes swinging in early in the game at all. and finally turn 5 isnt that late in a game hence how thragtusk saw play out the wazoo and then thats not even counting that this creature loses a power from thragtusk that goes to his toughness so now he can not only survive a rakdos keyrune or a lightning strile/searing spear and since thats really all that need be done, because hes indestructable and hexproof he beats smiter in the mirror match but yes there are ways to get around him but post rotation there arent nearly as many and thats not taking into account all the other amazing cards in GW decks which include advent, call, voice, ooze, smiter... need i continue. but anyways wg decks are going to be exceptionally potent and thats not including whats going to happen when people dip into third colors including naya which is going to be pretty ridiculous on the powerscale next to jund fantastic that aristocrats is gone now though
Decks i'm currently running
Standard
BUGW BUG Control (With a splash of white)
WUG Midrange Lifegain
Modern
Death and Taxes
Legacy
RG Valakut Lands
WG Maverick
R Burn
EDH
G Azusa, Lost but Seeking