Your sarcasm and passive aggressive attitude is deeply misplaced.
1. Proof? I keep pretty good track of the worldwide Legacy metagame and don't recall seeing Garruk once. I try to maintain a pretty complete Legacy collection and haven't once found the need to buy Garruks. I believe you that he has shown up before but I would like to see what proof you have for "regular play".
2. I thought the sarcasm was a perfect response to your boastful bravado. There was no passive aggressive attitude. I am not even sure how one would do that on a forum :-/.
Yep, that about sums it up. Its not negative, its reality.
It's a negative spin on reality. Because the facts are people do have a choice, they aren't sheep, and Kibler is pretty good at magic.
Do people always make the best choices? No lol. Is Kibler infallible at Magic? No lol. It's just funny when people want to dump on others because they like something.
Taking a real leap out onto a limb aren't you? You pretty much just described the bulk of hyped planewalkers. Also, who is to say this guy isn't going to be a better fit then Domri for the R/G decks?
This guy seems average in a control shell.
Actually its pretty much 90% of all walkers printed. As to being a better fit than Domri, my understanding is Domri is mostly used in aggro type decks. This guys isn't an aggro card. He just isn't. When you drop something for 4 mana in an aggro deck it needs to consistently do more than generate a 2/2 hasty critter. Domri does more for less. That's what we call value in the Magic business.:p
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Affinity EDH W Akroma GBW Ghave BRU Thrax GR Ruric I advocate for the elimination of the combo archetype in Modern. I believe it is degenerate and unfun by its very nature and will always limit design space and cause unnecessary bans.
Am I the only one here noticing the goddamn obvious?
- Young Pyromancer - make oodles of tokens - make Purphoros and Xenagos ridiculous
- Purphoros - This card is just ridiculous - end of story
- Xenagos - Synergy with YP and Purphoros, +1 and 0, what's better the tokens have haste, making effective 4 damage per turn with Red God - ridiculous
- Magma Jet - 'nuff said
- Molten Birth - YP, Purphy, and Xenagos synergy - and 50/50 get it back in hand...man what...
- Then you have an array of cast of characters ranging from Hexproof ramp who also happens to be 0/3, 5 drop 4/4 hastey dragon dude who synergizes with YP, Purph, Xenagos, and the tokens meaning monstrosity will actually be castable, Mizzium Mortars for removal / wrath & works good with YP, and all the other good RG non-sense from last block and whatever else also comes this block.
RG just looks STUPID OP. If they get YP / Xena, Purph / Xena, YP / Purph, etc. etc. going you're screwed because it is just crazy powerful. What a dumb dumb set. I hope everyone will enjoy playing RG again...
Haha my thoughts exactly. I already had a "mono" red deck I built with a buddy that was based around:
But seeing all the pre-release cards like Magma Jet (that will help you get to your finishers) and Xenagos, RG definitely doesn't look like its going anywhere soon. I definitely thought standard would slow all the colors down post rotation, but I think i'm wrong.
After a board wipe, having Purphorus and now Xenagos at the ready will put controll decks away.
Granted, more will be revealed (control), but right now it looks like agro will definitely have a strong presence in standard.
But seeing all the pre-release cards like Magma Jet (that will help you get to your finishers) and Xenagos, RG definitely doesn't look like its going anywhere soon. I definitely thought standard would slow all the colors down post rotation, but I think i'm wrong.
After a board wipe, having Purphorus and now Xenagos at the ready will put controll decks away.
Granted, more will be revealed (control), but right now it looks like agro will definitely have a strong presence in standard.
Everyone watchin' the Azorius throne. :cool2::cool2:
Domri has a much higher chance to whiff than this card does... exponentially higher. domri can create removal-blowouts, but this guy can generate constant bodies with haste. what kind of aggro deck would turn down a 4 mana 2/2haster that can repeat for free after the initial investment? He makes you much more resilient to supreme verdict, which domri really doesn't.
domri's ultimate is pretty cool, but i've actually seen more people *lose* a game vs control with an emblem in play than win. usually by the time the emblem comes out, the control player has survived long enough to boardwipe the aggro player into oblivion with counters and extra board wipes in hand, and can sphinx/rev so far out of the redzone that doublestrike and haste just aren't relevant anymore.
no offense man, but i don't think very highly of your evaluation skills, next time you level up you should probably put a few ranks into appraisal.
Agreed 110% on all accounts. Xenagos is definitely NOT a replacement or new take on Domri. Domri, IMO, is way too narrow of a planeswalker compaired to Xenagos. Domri interacts with creatures in a completely different way; Yes Xenagos does make guys with haste and can pressure much like aggro decks can, but Domri is more suited for this role. Ive never been a fan of Domri. His whiff rate is too high for the early investment and the decks that play him fold too easy to a Supreme Verdict. Xenagos, meanwhile, has the added bonus of FREE 2/2s with haste every turn past turn 3 thanks to mana dorks, something midrange decks seem to love. The added board presence also makes his +1 more dangerous. Ramping to bombs like Aurelia or something like that turns early is the goal for midrange.
I still stand by Sylvan Caryatid into Xenagos as a decent line of play.
Edit: Oh wow i just realizes how nuts Xenagos is with the red god and young pizzy, the pyromancer. Damn
It's a negative spin on reality. Because the facts are people do have a choice, they aren't sheep, and Kibler is pretty good at magic.
Do people always make the best choices? No lol. Is Kibler infallible at Magic? No lol.
Well its been a while since I've been received an infraction for this topic so here goes. No, not everybody exhibits sheepish tendencies but to say they don't exist is being far to nice. And yeah Kibler is an amazing player but let me know when he buys his own cards because most pros don't. I really don't think its negative, rather honest. Pretty much every person who makes these kinds of complaints have been burned on cards. That is also reality. And its one of the dark aspects of the game.
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Affinity EDH W Akroma GBW Ghave BRU Thrax GR Ruric I advocate for the elimination of the combo archetype in Modern. I believe it is degenerate and unfun by its very nature and will always limit design space and cause unnecessary bans.
Well its been a while since I've been received an infraction for this topic so here goes. No, not everybody exhibits sheepish tendencies but to say they don't exist is being far to nice. And yeah Kibler is an amazing player but let me know when he buys his own cards because most pros don't. I really don't think its negative, rather honest. Pretty much every person who makes these kinds of complaints have been burned on cards. That is also reality. And its one of the dark aspects of the game.
I'm quite sure reckless spending on new things is an American pastime, not exclusive to Magic: The Gathering.
Were you negative about the fact that people don't think out a card and just react to it with their wallet open, or were you negative that pros hype new cards?
I understand your point though, just a matter of clarification now.
I'm SO SICK of the "too strong for Standard" argument. It's the new "Dies to removal". We can have a two mana 4/4 with a zillion abilities, but we can't just have Accumulated Knowledge. Makes sense.
Listen im not saying that this is a bad card, it is obviously a good card if not borderline great. What I am saying though is that he is in no way overpowered, nor does he warrant two $20 bills. I would say $20 or maybe $25.
He will undoubtedly see play and he will probably be very good but i dont see him getting any play outside of standard, and I don't see him breaking any games wide open on his own.
Also just want to shout out the the fool that said he is the most overpowered walker since JTMS, I wouldnt even say he is in the top 5 walkers ever. He might make top 8 MAYBE!!
I'm quite sure reckless spending on new things is an American pastime, not exclusive to Magic: The Gathering.
Were you negative about the fact that people don't think out a card and just react to it with their wallet open, or were you negative that pros hype new cards?
I understand your point though, just a matter of clarification now.
The one time that I bit on a hyped card by Wizards?
I am embarrassed to say, it was when they gave Mike Flores Duskmantle Seer...he freaking sold me so hard. Especially since I love black control. I bought a playset right then and there. Didn't help that I was just getting back into Magic after a decade long hiatus...
That was a big lesson in card evaluation. So even when I do get excited about a newly announced card, I take a BIG step back and try to evaluate it's nuances.
Like most good planeswalkers, I expect him to settle for Theros Block to around 20-25 dollars. For presale, 40 dollars doesn't surprise me. In fact, I'd guess 50 dollars for the price point after a bit.
I do think he's on the stronger side of the planeswalker curve, though.
Am I the only one here noticing the goddamn obvious?
- Young Pyromancer - make oodles of tokens - make Purphoros and Xenagos ridiculous
- Purphoros - This card is just ridiculous - end of story
- Xenagos - Synergy with YP and Purphoros, +1 and 0, what's better the tokens have haste, making effective 4 damage per turn with Red God - ridiculous
- Magma Jet - 'nuff said
- Molten Birth - YP, Purphy, and Xenagos synergy - and 50/50 get it back in hand...man what...
- Then you have an array of cast of characters ranging from Hexproof ramp who also happens to be 0/3, 5 drop 4/4 hastey dragon dude who synergizes with YP, Purph, Xenagos, and the tokens meaning monstrosity will actually be castable, Mizzium Mortars for removal / wrath & works good with YP, and all the other good RG non-sense from last block and whatever else also comes this block.
RG just looks STUPID OP. If they get YP / Xena, Purph / Xena, YP / Purph, etc. etc. going you're screwed because it is just crazy powerful. What a dumb dumb set. I hope everyone will enjoy playing RG again...
Absolutely this. Anyone saying this isn't as good a 'walker as Domri or that it has no place in Aggro is fooling themselves.
Listen im not saying that this is a bad card, it is obviously a good card if not borderline great. What I am saying though is that he is in no way overpowered, nor does he warrant two $20 bills. I would say $20 or maybe $25.
He will undoubtedly see play and he will probably be very good but i dont see him getting any play outside of standard, and I don't see him breaking any games wide open on his own.
Also just want to shout out the the fool that said he is the most overpowered walker since JTMS, I wouldnt even say he is in the top 5 walkers ever. He might make top 8 MAYBE!!
Dude's so right. The planeswalker is awesome -- I would go so far to say it amazed me when I first saw the spoiler. None of that means, however, that everyone should buy into the hype and think this is the second coming of Jesus.
Garruk, Primal Hunter was one heck of a planeswalkeer, and he stabilized around 8-20$ for most of his Standard career. Mind you, he was reprinted once, but when it comes to planeswalkwers, it's really hard for you to maintain a high price level unless you see heavy eternal play and/or you become a reallly popular casual card. Usually the 2nd on that list happens after you've well been out of print. (see: Nicol Bolas, Sarkhan Vol, etc). Otherwise, cards like Liliana command 35-40$ because they're played in Legacy/Modern decks as 3-4--ofs. Gideon Jura was a 40$ish Standard card, not because he was specifically really good himself, but because he was really good during a time when Standard was extremely dominated by Jace TMS decks (we're talking post-Shards block rotation). Once he Jace rotated/he was banned, he fell in price (alongside of being reprinted).
This card will probably follow Ajani, Caller of the Pride, Garruk, Caller of Beasts, and Domri Rade. It'll be crazy expensive when it first comes out, but once Theros is opened like mad, after awhile, he'll stabilize at a much lower price. I don't know how long that will take, it make forever like how Ajani took foreever, or it might fall in between Domri Rade (falling pretty quickly to 10-13$ for awhile--then jump up to $20 when players play with it more) and Garruk Caller of Beasts (taking forever to hit its low point, but not taking as long as Ajani did...that card was 20$ for the longest time despite seeing zero-to-little play. Garruk, meanwhile is obv. playable).
TLDR version: Great/amazing/excellent/sweet card, but no way is it going to command $40 for any lengthy period of time soon. You can buy into the hype all you want, but it's simple logic.
EDIT: There's also the Garruk Relentless scenario. Players don't understand what the best shell is for the planeswalker, so it sees marginal play in various decks that aren't dominant. Then *ding, ding, ding*, the metagame evolves to a point where it's playable in all these different decks, but by then, it's a bargain at $5-8, sometimes getting as high as $15 a piece before dropping weeks later. The question is...is Xenagos a Ajani 3.0, a Garruk Relentless, a Garruk Primal Hunter, a Garruk Caller of the Beasts, or a Domri Rade? There's no way Domri + Xenagos is as powerful as Gideon + JaceTMS / Elspeth 1.0 + Jace TMS. Nope. Hmm
Agreed 110% on all accounts. Xenagos is definitely NOT a replacement or new take on Domri. Domri, IMO, is way too narrow of a planeswalker compaired to Xenagos. Domri interacts with creatures in a completely different way; Yes Xenagos does make guys with haste and can pressure much like aggro decks can, but Domri is more suited for this role. Ive never been a fan of Domri. His whiff rate is too high for the early investment and the decks that play him fold too easy to a Supreme Verdict. Xenagos, meanwhile, has the added bonus of FREE 2/2s with haste every turn past turn 3 thanks to mana dorks, something midrange decks seem to love. The added board presence also makes his +1 more dangerous. Ramping to bombs like Aurelia or something like that turns early is the goal for midrange.
I still stand by Sylvan Caryatid into Xenagos as a decent line of play.
Edit: Oh wow i just realizes how nuts Xenagos is with the red god and young pizzy, the pyromancer. Damn
My experience with Domri has bee EXACTLY the opposite, and I play Domri pretty heavily.
First off, Domri is best in a midrange build, not agro. Second off, playing midrange against control, if you have more than 2-3 threats on the board that don't give you value after a Supreme Verdict (i.e. Voice of Resurgence, Thragtusk), then you're overextending and deserve to lose. Third off, every single game against control that I've gone ultimate with Domri, either they scoop, or I win within 1 or 2 turns.
Domri beats control by himself. I often find control players asking me "You have how many cards in hand?" Even with their Sphinx's Revelation, they have a hard time keeping up with Domri's card advantage. He's half a card per turn starting on turn 2 typically. By turn 5, you're usually plus two cards for a 3 mana investment.
Then, making all your dudes hasty ragebeasts usually beats control pretty easily. They just don't have enough counters to handle ALL of your threats, since they all do hefty damage the turn they hit.
Dude's so right. The planeswalker is awesome -- I would go so far to say it amazed me when I first saw the spoiler. None of that means, however, that everyone should buy into the hype and think this is the second coming of Jesus.
Garruk, Primal Hunter was one heck of a planeswalkeer, and he stabilized around 8-20$ for most of his Standard career. Mind you, he was reprinted once, but when it comes to planeswalkwers, it's really hard for you to maintain a high price level unless you see heavy eternal play and/or you become a reallly popular casual card. Usually the 2nd on that list happens after you've well been out of print. (see: Nicol Bolas, Sarkhan Vol, etc). Otherwise, cards like Liliana command 35-40$ because they're played in Legacy/Modern decks as 3-4--ofs. Gideon Jura was a 40$ish Standard card, not because he was specifically really good himself, but because he was really good during a time when Standard was extremely dominated by Jace TMS decks (we're talking post-Shards block rotation). Once he Jace rotated/he was banned, he fell in price (alongside of being reprinted).
This card will probably follow Ajani, Caller of the Pride, Garruk, Caller of Beasts, and Domri Rade. It'll be crazy expensive when it first comes out, but once Theros is opened like mad, after awhile, he'll stabilize at a much lower price. I don't know how long that will take, it make forever like how Ajani took foreever, or it might fall in between Domri Rade (falling pretty quickly to 10-13$ for awhile--then jump up to $20 when players play with it more) and Garruk Caller of Beasts (taking forever to hit its low point, but not taking as long as Ajani did...that card was 20$ for the longest time despite seeing zero-to-little play. Garruk, meanwhile is obv. playable).
TLDR version: Great/amazing/excellent/sweet card, but no way is it going to command $40 for any lengthy period of time soon. You can buy into the hype all you want, but it's simple logic.
EDIT: There's also the Garruk Relentless scenario. Players don't understand what the best shell is for the planeswalker, so it sees marginal play in various decks that aren't dominant. Then *ding, ding, ding*, the metagame evolves to a point where it's playable in all these different decks, but by then, it's a bargain at $5-8, sometimes getting as high as $15 a piece before dropping weeks later. The question is...is Xenagos a Ajani 3.0, a Garruk Relentless, a Garruk Primal Hunter, a Garruk Caller of the Beasts, or a Domri Rade? There's no way Domri + Xenagos is as powerful as Gideon + JaceTMS / Elspeth 1.0 + Jace TMS. Nope. Hmm
He was already announced for a reprint in a coreset when jace got banned. Its hard to keep a price value when you are reprinted in a coreset.
My experience with Domri has bee EXACTLY the opposite, and I play Domri pretty heavily.
First off, Domri is best in a midrange build, not agro. Second off, playing midrange against control, if you have more than 2-3 threats on the board that don't give you value after a Supreme Verdict (i.e. Voice of Resurgence, Thragtusk), then you're overextending and deserve to lose. Third off, every single game against control that I've gone ultimate with Domri, either they scoop, or I win within 1 or 2 turns.
Domri beats control by himself. I often find control players asking me "You have how many cards in hand?" Even with their Sphinx's Revelation, they have a hard time keeping up with Domri's card advantage. He's half a card per turn starting on turn 2 typically. By turn 5, you're usually plus two cards for a 3 mana investment.
Then, making all your dudes hasty ragebeasts usually beats control pretty easily. They just don't have enough counters to handle ALL of your threats, since they all do hefty damage the turn they hit.
Thragtusk is the most annoying thing in this whole post. The yung domri needs his beasties in front of him.
I'm quite sure reckless spending on new things is an American pastime, not exclusive to Magic: The Gathering.
Were you negative about the fact that people don't think out a card and just react to it with their wallet open, or were you negative that pros hype new cards?
I understand your point though, just a matter of clarification now.
That's very true. I'm not sure I'm negative to either of the things you listed. I'm negative to people not thinking. I mean good cards are gonna cost more and pros should be ambassadors of the game but to use the simple fact that people are buying said card or said pro says its good with no other justification is nearly the definition of being sheepish.
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Affinity EDH W Akroma GBW Ghave BRU Thrax GR Ruric I advocate for the elimination of the combo archetype in Modern. I believe it is degenerate and unfun by its very nature and will always limit design space and cause unnecessary bans.
I think he wants to be played in a midrange deck that has lots of mana dumps. These could be either X-costing spells or permanents with abilities that can be used as many times as you can pay for(Purphoros maybe, if the deck could create devotion? Or Erebos in Jund if he's good, Nylea sucks), as well as some of the good monstrous creatures that are solid bodies with a monstrous ability that Xanagos could activate. Current examples are the maybe playable Polukranos, probably Polis Crusher, and definitely Stormbreath Dragon. If the minor gods have non-tapping abilities as well, then he may also work with them later. In a deck like this, you can afford to play lots of ramp because not only does it let you get big creatures out early, it can be a benefit in the later game as well to activate powerful monstrous abilities that deal damage(dragon), destroy enchantments(Polis Crusher, which will be strong this Standard), and wipe an opponent's board(World Eater), while also making your creatures massive. When you don't need the ramp, he spits hasty 2/2 attackers.
The deck would likely want to play a lot of creatures and the new Garruk(would be much better with Primal Hunter and allow more utility spells) to fill your hand with creatures to dump onto the battlefield.
A different option to forcing Garruk would be to go Jund, letting you play Underworld Cerberus as insurance against a Verdict and a powerful, near unblockable creature. This would also potentially open up Thoughtseize and the unspoiled Erebos, and give more removal.
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Actually its pretty much 90% of all walkers printed. As to being a better fit than Domri, my understanding is Domri is mostly used in aggro type decks. This guys isn't an aggro card. He just isn't. When you drop something for 4 mana in an aggro deck it needs to consistently do more than generate a 2/2 hasty critter. Domri does more for less. That's what we call value in the Magic business.:p
That's all fine and dandy, but who's saying R/G is going to be aggro?
That's all fine and dandy, but who's saying R/G is going to be aggro?
Has it ever not been aggro? I guess that's a logical fallacy but there is truth there too. I mean that is RG's traditional place is it not?
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1. Proof? I keep pretty good track of the worldwide Legacy metagame and don't recall seeing Garruk once. I try to maintain a pretty complete Legacy collection and haven't once found the need to buy Garruks. I believe you that he has shown up before but I would like to see what proof you have for "regular play".
2. I thought the sarcasm was a perfect response to your boastful bravado. There was no passive aggressive attitude. I am not even sure how one would do that on a forum :-/.
Standard: UWR
Modern: RDW, Twin
Legacy: I am 3 Candelabra of Tawnos from being able to build almost any tier 1 or 1.5 deck. Here are the ones I care about right now:
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-Control: Stoneblade; UWr Miracles; UB Tezzeret
-Combo: Hive Mind; Combo Elves; Omni Tell; T.E.S.
Vintage: Grixis Painter
EDH: Rith, the Awakener
It's a negative spin on reality. Because the facts are people do have a choice, they aren't sheep, and Kibler is pretty good at magic.
Do people always make the best choices? No lol. Is Kibler infallible at Magic? No lol. It's just funny when people want to dump on others because they like something.
For the record, I find R/G boring
UW Control (:symu: :symw:)
Actually its pretty much 90% of all walkers printed. As to being a better fit than Domri, my understanding is Domri is mostly used in aggro type decks. This guys isn't an aggro card. He just isn't. When you drop something for 4 mana in an aggro deck it needs to consistently do more than generate a 2/2 hasty critter. Domri does more for less. That's what we call value in the Magic business.:p
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I advocate for the elimination of the combo archetype in Modern. I believe it is degenerate and unfun by its very nature and will always limit design space and cause unnecessary bans.
Haha my thoughts exactly. I already had a "mono" red deck I built with a buddy that was based around:
But seeing all the pre-release cards like Magma Jet (that will help you get to your finishers) and Xenagos, RG definitely doesn't look like its going anywhere soon. I definitely thought standard would slow all the colors down post rotation, but I think i'm wrong.
After a board wipe, having Purphorus and now Xenagos at the ready will put controll decks away.
Granted, more will be revealed (control), but right now it looks like agro will definitely have a strong presence in standard.
Everyone watchin' the Azorius throne. :cool2::cool2:
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Agreed 110% on all accounts. Xenagos is definitely NOT a replacement or new take on Domri. Domri, IMO, is way too narrow of a planeswalker compaired to Xenagos. Domri interacts with creatures in a completely different way; Yes Xenagos does make guys with haste and can pressure much like aggro decks can, but Domri is more suited for this role. Ive never been a fan of Domri. His whiff rate is too high for the early investment and the decks that play him fold too easy to a Supreme Verdict. Xenagos, meanwhile, has the added bonus of FREE 2/2s with haste every turn past turn 3 thanks to mana dorks, something midrange decks seem to love. The added board presence also makes his +1 more dangerous. Ramping to bombs like Aurelia or something like that turns early is the goal for midrange.
I still stand by Sylvan Caryatid into Xenagos as a decent line of play.
Edit: Oh wow i just realizes how nuts Xenagos is with the red god and young pizzy, the pyromancer. Damn
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Well its been a while since I've been received an infraction for this topic so here goes. No, not everybody exhibits sheepish tendencies but to say they don't exist is being far to nice. And yeah Kibler is an amazing player but let me know when he buys his own cards because most pros don't. I really don't think its negative, rather honest. Pretty much every person who makes these kinds of complaints have been burned on cards. That is also reality. And its one of the dark aspects of the game.
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I advocate for the elimination of the combo archetype in Modern. I believe it is degenerate and unfun by its very nature and will always limit design space and cause unnecessary bans.
I'm quite sure reckless spending on new things is an American pastime, not exclusive to Magic: The Gathering.
Were you negative about the fact that people don't think out a card and just react to it with their wallet open, or were you negative that pros hype new cards?
I understand your point though, just a matter of clarification now.
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I'd love to see remand sometime soon. Not only for standard, but to reduce its price tag for modern.
He will undoubtedly see play and he will probably be very good but i dont see him getting any play outside of standard, and I don't see him breaking any games wide open on his own.
Also just want to shout out the the fool that said he is the most overpowered walker since JTMS, I wouldnt even say he is in the top 5 walkers ever. He might make top 8 MAYBE!!
The one time that I bit on a hyped card by Wizards?
I am embarrassed to say, it was when they gave Mike Flores Duskmantle Seer...he freaking sold me so hard. Especially since I love black control. I bought a playset right then and there. Didn't help that I was just getting back into Magic after a decade long hiatus...
That was a big lesson in card evaluation. So even when I do get excited about a newly announced card, I take a BIG step back and try to evaluate it's nuances.
I do think he's on the stronger side of the planeswalker curve, though.
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Absolutely this. Anyone saying this isn't as good a 'walker as Domri or that it has no place in Aggro is fooling themselves.
Dude's so right. The planeswalker is awesome -- I would go so far to say it amazed me when I first saw the spoiler. None of that means, however, that everyone should buy into the hype and think this is the second coming of Jesus.
Garruk, Primal Hunter was one heck of a planeswalkeer, and he stabilized around 8-20$ for most of his Standard career. Mind you, he was reprinted once, but when it comes to planeswalkwers, it's really hard for you to maintain a high price level unless you see heavy eternal play and/or you become a reallly popular casual card. Usually the 2nd on that list happens after you've well been out of print. (see: Nicol Bolas, Sarkhan Vol, etc). Otherwise, cards like Liliana command 35-40$ because they're played in Legacy/Modern decks as 3-4--ofs. Gideon Jura was a 40$ish Standard card, not because he was specifically really good himself, but because he was really good during a time when Standard was extremely dominated by Jace TMS decks (we're talking post-Shards block rotation). Once he Jace rotated/he was banned, he fell in price (alongside of being reprinted).
This card will probably follow Ajani, Caller of the Pride, Garruk, Caller of Beasts, and Domri Rade. It'll be crazy expensive when it first comes out, but once Theros is opened like mad, after awhile, he'll stabilize at a much lower price. I don't know how long that will take, it make forever like how Ajani took foreever, or it might fall in between Domri Rade (falling pretty quickly to 10-13$ for awhile--then jump up to $20 when players play with it more) and Garruk Caller of Beasts (taking forever to hit its low point, but not taking as long as Ajani did...that card was 20$ for the longest time despite seeing zero-to-little play. Garruk, meanwhile is obv. playable).
TLDR version: Great/amazing/excellent/sweet card, but no way is it going to command $40 for any lengthy period of time soon. You can buy into the hype all you want, but it's simple logic.
EDIT: There's also the Garruk Relentless scenario. Players don't understand what the best shell is for the planeswalker, so it sees marginal play in various decks that aren't dominant. Then *ding, ding, ding*, the metagame evolves to a point where it's playable in all these different decks, but by then, it's a bargain at $5-8, sometimes getting as high as $15 a piece before dropping weeks later. The question is...is Xenagos a Ajani 3.0, a Garruk Relentless, a Garruk Primal Hunter, a Garruk Caller of the Beasts, or a Domri Rade? There's no way Domri + Xenagos is as powerful as Gideon + JaceTMS / Elspeth 1.0 + Jace TMS. Nope. Hmm
I'd say this isn't a fair comparison because next to JTMS even tibalt doesn't suck... because you have JTMS.
JTMS.
JACE THE ****ING MIND SCULPTOR BLARG JACEJACEJACE
My experience with Domri has bee EXACTLY the opposite, and I play Domri pretty heavily.
First off, Domri is best in a midrange build, not agro. Second off, playing midrange against control, if you have more than 2-3 threats on the board that don't give you value after a Supreme Verdict (i.e. Voice of Resurgence, Thragtusk), then you're overextending and deserve to lose. Third off, every single game against control that I've gone ultimate with Domri, either they scoop, or I win within 1 or 2 turns.
Domri beats control by himself. I often find control players asking me "You have how many cards in hand?" Even with their Sphinx's Revelation, they have a hard time keeping up with Domri's card advantage. He's half a card per turn starting on turn 2 typically. By turn 5, you're usually plus two cards for a 3 mana investment.
Then, making all your dudes hasty ragebeasts usually beats control pretty easily. They just don't have enough counters to handle ALL of your threats, since they all do hefty damage the turn they hit.
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?p=11439737#post11439737
Reality is only what man allows it to be. Few shape it so that many may accept it.
He was already announced for a reprint in a coreset when jace got banned. Its hard to keep a price value when you are reprinted in a coreset.
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=484979
Thragtusk is the most annoying thing in this whole post. The yung domri needs his beasties in front of him.
r.i.p. thrag standard
UW Control (:symu: :symw:)
That's very true. I'm not sure I'm negative to either of the things you listed. I'm negative to people not thinking. I mean good cards are gonna cost more and pros should be ambassadors of the game but to use the simple fact that people are buying said card or said pro says its good with no other justification is nearly the definition of being sheepish.
GB Rock
U Flooding Merfolk
RUG Delver Midrange
WU Monks
UW Tempo Geist
GW Bogle
GW Liege
UR Tron
B Vampires
Affinity
Legacy
Fish
Goblins
Burn
Reanimator
Dredge
Affinity
EDH
W Akroma
GBW Ghave
BRU Thrax
GR Ruric
I advocate for the elimination of the combo archetype in Modern. I believe it is degenerate and unfun by its very nature and will always limit design space and cause unnecessary bans.
The deck would likely want to play a lot of creatures and the new Garruk(would be much better with Primal Hunter and allow more utility spells) to fill your hand with creatures to dump onto the battlefield.
A different option to forcing Garruk would be to go Jund, letting you play Underworld Cerberus as insurance against a Verdict and a powerful, near unblockable creature. This would also potentially open up Thoughtseize and the unspoiled Erebos, and give more removal.
As-is, he can still fuel a really nasty Clan Defiance, Aurelia's Fury, Biomass Mutation, Epic Experiment, or Rakdos's Return
Reprint Stasis!
Control needs more love.
EDH:
Momir Vig, Simic Visionary
Melek, Izzet Paragon
Oona, Queen of the Fae
Bruna, Light of Alabaster
Gisela, Blade of Goldnight
Rhys the Redeemed
Jarad, Golgari Lich Lord
Sen Triplets
The Mimeoplasm
WUBRGSliver OverlordGRBUW
WUBRGSliver Hivelord(Superfriends)GRBUW
That's all fine and dandy, but who's saying R/G is going to be aggro?
Standard
W.I.P.
EDH
WNorn Tokens
"Those who regard the Gruul as savage simpletons underestimate the subtle power of their shamans."
UW Control (:symu: :symw:)
Has it ever not been aggro? I guess that's a logical fallacy but there is truth there too. I mean that is RG's traditional place is it not?
GB Rock
U Flooding Merfolk
RUG Delver Midrange
WU Monks
UW Tempo Geist
GW Bogle
GW Liege
UR Tron
B Vampires
Affinity
Legacy
Fish
Goblins
Burn
Reanimator
Dredge
Affinity
EDH
W Akroma
GBW Ghave
BRU Thrax
GR Ruric
I advocate for the elimination of the combo archetype in Modern. I believe it is degenerate and unfun by its very nature and will always limit design space and cause unnecessary bans.