Sealed: 3.5/5 In a slow format this can potentially draw you several cards. If you have the colors to support it, you'd want to play it. Pray your opponent doesn't have cheap removal.
Draft: 2.5/5 If you are playing Simic you'll probably never cut this. It is worse in draft than sealed, but if you can take it you should.
You played JESUS?!?! I heard none of his guys stay in the graveyard, and once you think you have him beat he ALWAYS comes back to win within three turns. I like...WORSHIP him.
This card will be casual awesome.
For myself, it will be constructed awesome.
If it's converted cost was 3 (or 2, yeah right), my golly I'd be in love.
At 4, it really hurts in constructed, but nice art and flavor. I'll play it along side Belssings of Nature and some others.
Why oh why could't it have been 1UG? It would have been at least standard playable imo, without being broken at all. Maybe t1 arbor elf t2 this- start drawing extra cards from t3 onwards, while almost Every deck in standard has at least 4 maindeck answers.
At 4, i dont see it being played except in maybe humaninator
Because repeatable card draw for 3 mana, is very dangerous to print.
They tend to playtest cards on different manacosts, and I am pretty certain it proved broken in the FL (what that is worth though).
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The Internet was a revelation to me, I never imagined there are so many idiots on this planet.
Not that slow. You'd be getting a 5/5 on turn 4. Which, dare I say it, is better then a turn 4 Thragtusk. Just on card advantage alone.
and then your 1/1 mage just dies before.... the problem is, he is a 4 drop. that means he competes with guys like hellrider, falkenrath aristocrat, supreme verdict for control, resto angel and so on.
he is pretty cool if he stays and you can keep putting counters on him, but how likely is it, that he will stay in current meta, which is packed with removal in nearly every deck?
i mean: in limited he is a bomb. but a 1/1 constructed card for 4cmc who has no immediate impact on the board is unplayable in my oppinion.
Because repeatable card draw for 3 mana, is very dangerous to print.
They tend to playtest cards on different manacosts, and I am pretty certain it proved broken in the FL (what that is worth though).
I can't see any way this is broken at 3. The card draw on this is incredibly conditional and becomes increasingly difficult once you get a few cards off of it. Vanilla 1/1s are notoriously easy to remove as well. If this were at 3 mana I don't think it would be much better than a Phyrexian Arena.
At 3 mana it would be borderline broken in limited though.
BTW a comment i forgot: It's now officially open the "this card isn't constructed playable" season.. Yay!
People this forum don't cease to amuse me with their narrow vision of a card playability.
It's a repeatable AND reliable, card draw that is on colors that can protect it. If it stick (and it's up to the user make it stick, that's part of being a good player) it can win games with such strong draw engine. If people can't see play for it, they should stop netdecking too much and start to actually playing magic.
It's funny people commenting about the 4 CMC being something so terrible, if it couldn't be cast at turn 3 and can be taken advantage right off.
It's not that hard for a bant to turn 2 a geist and turn 3 this card, attack and draw one.
Maybe a BUG with scavenge shenanigans, discard slithead for a loltroll and scavenge it on her, you got +1/+1 counter on 2 creatures and replaced the slithead.
There's many way to take advantage of her, and we have only 2 simic cards spoiled.
"But she dies to removal". Almost every single creature dies to removal, this argument is the worst argument ever to use on a card playability. While resilience is good.
If she will see play i don't know, but she have potential for that.
BTW a comment i forgot: It's now officially open the "this card isn't constructed playable" season.. Yay!
People this forum don't cease to amuse me with their narrow vision of a card playability.
It's a repeatable AND reliable, card draw that is on colors that can protect it. If it stick (and it's up to the user make it stick, that's part of being a good player) it can win games with such strong draw engine. If people can't see play for it, they should stop netdecking too much and start to actually playing magic.
It's funny people commenting about the 4 CMC being something so terrible, if it couldn't be cast at turn 3 and can be taken advantage right off.
It's not that hard for a bant to turn 2 a geist and turn 3 this card, attack and draw one.
Maybe a BUG with scavenge shenanigans, discard slithead for a loltroll and scavenge it on her, you got +1/+1 counter on 2 creatures and replaced the slithead.
There's many way to take advantage of her, and we have only 2 simic cards spoiled.
"But she dies to removal". Almost every single creature dies to removal, this argument is the worst argument ever to use on a card playability. While resilience is good.
If she will see play i don't know, but she have potential for that.
It isn't just "dies to removal." It is much more than that. It has a mostly irrelevant body and does nothing as it comes into play at 4 mana. The fact that it is a 1/1 and dies to basically everything doesn't help it any. When it gets to the point where you'd be playing bad cards such as slitherhead just to allow this to gain a counter you know you're reaching.
In what way is this card better than Phyrexian Arena? Since the main purpose of the card is to draw more cards you should probably be comparing it to Arena. So let's see... Costs more than arena...easier to remove than arena...less reliable than arena. That adds up to a bad arena that has the upside of being marginally more useful in conjunction with other bad cards.
How many of the above cards see any actual play in standard? I venture the answer to that is zero except for some very, very rare exceptions with Mikaeus or maybe Goliath. You don't play bad cards together with other bad cards and expect a miracle unless you can do it with consistency AND it instantly wins you the game.
Barring something completely out of left field there is no chance at this being a standard playable card. It it had been 1UG it "might" have been playable. Even at that mana cost I doubt it would be a staple in anything. It is incredibly fragile and slow. Will it see play at 4? No.
she is 1/1 un turn 3 or 4. and has no immediate impact, since you need mana for most counters you can put onto her.
so she is just too slow, since nearly no creature which is any danager sticks more than 1 turn in current meta. so you need creatures especialy at 4cmc and above who have immediate impact on the board. like falkenrath aristocrat, hellrider, resto angel and so on.
the decks who would play this guy are control decks, who can buy enough time to draw cards. but then again: how are they supposed to do it? they dont play scavenge creatures. so there draw mechanics are think twice and sphinx revelation. and sphinx revelation is so much more reliable in drawing, that there is absoluty no space for this guy.
sure hs is 1/1 so you get to draw a card, for nearly every creature you play after him.
but like i said, in my oppinion there is no place in current meta for a 4cmc card which is no immediate impact on the field, since nearly no threat stays longer than 1 turn.
if it has no resilence like hound of griselbrand or falkenrath aristocrat.
and sorry to say that, but he is NO reliable draw engine. how can you be 100% sure that you will get the cards you need to put counters on him? he does not draw cards on his own like sphinx revelation does. he needs the right cards to give him counters, before you can draw anything.
Yeah...um, no. If you're talking about playable in a sense of casual decks, sure. Anything is playable in that context. Where has Ajani been played other than as a bad sideboard card in UW aggro? Same can basically be said for Mikaeus. And those cards would hardly make this card "good" or even "playable." The rest are bad cards in basically any context of standard play.
Really like it, but as others have said its just too slow. Though, if a way to survive a single turn can be found (Ramp to cast early + Mizzium Skin / Vengevine in modern)...
Sigh I was hoping this Gorgeous Art was at least the guild mage. 4 mana 1/1s Woo hoo!... NOT
Bant is my true calling so Simic beter have something good, this will take some work to be better than an elvish Visionary yea, just make that comparison. Card is not good, would 3 mana been to strong for this?
Of course i'm talking only about EDH material, in standard the card is good but not exceptional, for now. It has potential though, let's see other GTC cards before judging it in standard
i'm curious about the interaction with shambling shell: can I sac shell and dredge it if i put the counter on fathom mage?
Too slow? Thragtusk is most people's first real card if the game, and people are havong Revelations for about 8+ cards at a time.
No. Card is obscene. I will Increasing Savagery it amd laugh.
Thragtusk is the anti-this. Thragtusk starts with a relevant body. It does something upon entering play, AND when it is removed. Oh, and it also has a broken synergy with one of the other staples in the format.
This card hits play, does nothing, and durdles around praying your opponent has no removal of any kind so that you can at least get a card back for wasting your turn on it.
This has cute combo written all over it, but is outdone by a simple and constructed unworthy divination. If you respect your opponent you will stay far away from this card. I like it, and it will carry some casual and draft decks to crushing victory, but really think about how hard you have to work for the cards this can provide, and then ask yourself WHY YOU ARE WORKING SO HARD.
Perhaps you should just send WOTC a resume and tell them why you're better at Magic than one of their employees instead of complaining here, where nobody really has any authority on the matter.
It isn't just "dies to removal." It is much more than that. It has a mostly irrelevant body and does nothing as it comes into play at 4 mana. The fact that it is a 1/1 and dies to basically everything doesn't help it any. When it gets to the point where you'd be playing bad cards such as slitherhead just to allow this to gain a counter you know you're reaching.
In what way is this card better than Phyrexian Arena? Since the main purpose of the card is to draw more cards you should probably be comparing it to Arena. So let's see... Costs more than arena...easier to remove than arena...less reliable than arena. That adds up to a bad arena that has the upside of being marginally more useful in conjunction with other bad cards.
And arena is standard legal... oh wait...
What it the point of comparing it with a card that isn't legal? Next time try to compare the card with a card valid on the format.
Also i don't get the "less reliable" draw, if you can't get at last 1 card/turn for at last 4 turns, then there's something wrong with your game plan.
Once it start to not neting you any cards, this mean that it's because it's big, and this isn't bad either.
The small body is relevant only against Rx decks, since no one would be dumb enough to attack with it until it's big enoug.
Also there's plenty of ways of making this card have impact on the turn it enters the battlefield with the right plays. Playing cards blidly without consideting the game state is dumb, and this isn't a card 'i have 4 manas i will play it blindly'
But feel free to play arena over this on standard if this card is so bad... oh wait again...
And arena is standard legal... oh wait...
What it the point of comparing it with a card that isn't legal? Next time try to compare the card with a card valid on the format.
Also i don't get the "less reliable" draw, if you can't get at last 1 card/turn for at last 4 turns, then there's something wrong with your game plan.
Once it start to not neting you any cards, this mean that it's because it's big, and this isn't bad either.
But feel free to play arena over this on standard if this card is so bad... oh wait again...
It has nothing to do if Arena were legal or not. I was making a comparison to the most comparable tool available in order to demonstrate how bad it actually is. People have a general idea about the strength of that card, so the comparison should remain valid.
Now as to drawing you at least one card per turn for 4 turns? Not likely. Here is why:
1. It is easily removed. Very easily.
2. What if you need to cast a non-creature spell? Quite likely. Especially since you just wasted a turn on a card that gives you no real board presence. Are you going to be playing nothing but creatures for the next 4 turns? Better hope your opponent has worse creatures AND no removal.
3. Speaking of creatures, you're going to need big ones. Does your deck have a plethora of creatures with P/T > 4. You better hope so. Oh, and by the way, those cards are likely competing with spots that this card is currently taking up.
It isn't as if I'm a "card hater" either. I'm generally on the side of caution when it comes to playability of a card. This card isn't even what I'd call "fringe playable" though. I'm not even sure what could possibly be printed that might make him usable.
I like that the wording is more flexible than just "whenever ~ evolves" and triggers from any kind of +1/+1 counter... in block that means Scavenge becomes awesome. In Standard, maybe Increasing Savagery? Hunger of the Howlpack?
It has nothing to do if Arena were legal or not. I was making a comparison to the most comparable tool available in order to demonstrate how bad it actually is. People have a general idea about the strength of that card, so the comparison should remain valid.
Yeah, and since Lightning Bolt exist, Searing Spear is a total crap that would never be played in any format... oh wait...
Just because a better card exist, that don't means the others are bad, specially considering that the better card can't be played.
3. Speaking of creatures, you're going to need big ones. Does your deck have a plethora of creatures with P/T > 4. You better hope so. Oh, and by the way, those cards are likely competing with spots that this card is currently taking up.
Because the only way of getting the draws is the evolve trigger.
Oh, by the way, do you know this card? This one can realiabily trigger the evolve 3 times alone for no cost, being one in the same turn she etb. Also you can trigger her twice in a turn while adding value to the board. Not to mention the other smart ways already mentioned to trigger her for free/adding value.
Because her trigger isn't "when evolve triggers" but "whenever a +1/+1 counter is placed".
Not to mention that, since the simic mechanic is based on counter, we can expect cards that manage counter, we already got one. This one isn't the best, but why not expect better cards for that?
The main rule to follow on this forum is "what people say is bad turns out to be good while what people say is good turns out to be bad".
As an example, out of Vraska and Jace, Vraska would be the dominating planeswalker - I mean Jace is worst than the Mind Sculptor. Angel of Serenity would be too expensive to be played. Delver/Lingering Souls would be still dominating.
BTW a comment i forgot: It's now officially open the "this card isn't constructed playable" season.. Yay!
People this forum don't cease to amuse me with their narrow vision of a card playability.
It's a repeatable AND reliable, card draw that is on colors that can protect it. If it stick (and it's up to the user make it stick, that's part of being a good player) it can win games with such strong draw engine. If people can't see play for it, they should stop netdecking too much and start to actually playing magic.
It's funny people commenting about the 4 CMC being something so terrible, if it couldn't be cast at turn 3 and can be taken advantage right off.
It's not that hard for a bant to turn 2 a geist and turn 3 this card, attack and draw one.
Maybe a BUG with scavenge shenanigans, discard slithead for a loltroll and scavenge it on her, you got +1/+1 counter on 2 creatures and replaced the slithead.
There's many way to take advantage of her, and we have only 2 simic cards spoiled.
"But she dies to removal". Almost every single creature dies to removal, this argument is the worst argument ever to use on a card playability. While resilience is good.
If she will see play i don't know, but she have potential for that.
This is very ironic. Magical Christmasland scenarios are the definition of narrow vision. You have to come up with narrow scenarios to find situations where the card isn't totally worthless.
It doesn't take a genius to figure out that 4 mana 1/1s with no protection or immediate board impact aren't going to cut it. Probably ever.
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Sealed: 3.5/5 In a slow format this can potentially draw you several cards. If you have the colors to support it, you'd want to play it. Pray your opponent doesn't have cheap removal.
Draft: 2.5/5 If you are playing Simic you'll probably never cut this. It is worse in draft than sealed, but if you can take it you should.
Constructed: 0.5/5 No useful applications.
My 180 Modern Bordered Only Cube
it's worth testing in something like bant or BUG midrange.
........................
For myself, it will be constructed awesome.
If it's converted cost was 3 (or 2, yeah right), my golly I'd be in love.
At 4, it really hurts in constructed, but nice art and flavor. I'll play it along side Belssings of Nature and some others.
Because repeatable card draw for 3 mana, is very dangerous to print.
They tend to playtest cards on different manacosts, and I am pretty certain it proved broken in the FL (what that is worth though).
Give irony and sarcasm, when ignorance and stupidity is found.
The whip is kept for special occasions
and then your 1/1 mage just dies before.... the problem is, he is a 4 drop. that means he competes with guys like hellrider, falkenrath aristocrat, supreme verdict for control, resto angel and so on.
he is pretty cool if he stays and you can keep putting counters on him, but how likely is it, that he will stay in current meta, which is packed with removal in nearly every deck?
i mean: in limited he is a bomb. but a 1/1 constructed card for 4cmc who has no immediate impact on the board is unplayable in my oppinion.
i find pretty difficult to jump out of the third (4/4) or fourth counter (5/5)
Chile!
I can't see any way this is broken at 3. The card draw on this is incredibly conditional and becomes increasingly difficult once you get a few cards off of it. Vanilla 1/1s are notoriously easy to remove as well. If this were at 3 mana I don't think it would be much better than a Phyrexian Arena.
At 3 mana it would be borderline broken in limited though.
It's now officially open the "this card isn't constructed playable" season.. Yay!
People this forum don't cease to amuse me with their narrow vision of a card playability.
It's a repeatable AND reliable, card draw that is on colors that can protect it. If it stick (and it's up to the user make it stick, that's part of being a good player) it can win games with such strong draw engine. If people can't see play for it, they should stop netdecking too much and start to actually playing magic.
It's funny people commenting about the 4 CMC being something so terrible, if it couldn't be cast at turn 3 and can be taken advantage right off.
It's not that hard for a bant to turn 2 a geist and turn 3 this card, attack and draw one.
Maybe a BUG with scavenge shenanigans, discard slithead for a loltroll and scavenge it on her, you got +1/+1 counter on 2 creatures and replaced the slithead.
There's many way to take advantage of her, and we have only 2 simic cards spoiled.
"But she dies to removal". Almost every single creature dies to removal, this argument is the worst argument ever to use on a card playability. While resilience is good.
If she will see play i don't know, but she have potential for that.
It isn't just "dies to removal." It is much more than that. It has a mostly irrelevant body and does nothing as it comes into play at 4 mana. The fact that it is a 1/1 and dies to basically everything doesn't help it any. When it gets to the point where you'd be playing bad cards such as slitherhead just to allow this to gain a counter you know you're reaching.
In what way is this card better than Phyrexian Arena? Since the main purpose of the card is to draw more cards you should probably be comparing it to Arena. So let's see... Costs more than arena...easier to remove than arena...less reliable than arena. That adds up to a bad arena that has the upside of being marginally more useful in conjunction with other bad cards.
Maybe we'll get Viridian Joiner + this keyword?
Ajani, caller of the pride and Mikaeus, the Lunarch are the two that see play.
Deranged Outcast, Deadbridge Goliath, and Slitherhead are all extremely playable cards that might just be looking for a deck.
Hunger of the Howlpack, Cathars' Crusade, Herald of War and Increasing Savagery may all be iffy, but I wouldn't call them bad, and all of them can be pretty damn good.
so she is just too slow, since nearly no creature which is any danager sticks more than 1 turn in current meta. so you need creatures especialy at 4cmc and above who have immediate impact on the board. like falkenrath aristocrat, hellrider, resto angel and so on.
the decks who would play this guy are control decks, who can buy enough time to draw cards. but then again: how are they supposed to do it? they dont play scavenge creatures. so there draw mechanics are think twice and sphinx revelation. and sphinx revelation is so much more reliable in drawing, that there is absoluty no space for this guy.
sure hs is 1/1 so you get to draw a card, for nearly every creature you play after him.
but like i said, in my oppinion there is no place in current meta for a 4cmc card which is no immediate impact on the field, since nearly no threat stays longer than 1 turn.
if it has no resilence like hound of griselbrand or falkenrath aristocrat.
and sorry to say that, but he is NO reliable draw engine. how can you be 100% sure that you will get the cards you need to put counters on him? he does not draw cards on his own like sphinx revelation does. he needs the right cards to give him counters, before you can draw anything.
limited bomb, constructed unplayable.
Yeah...um, no. If you're talking about playable in a sense of casual decks, sure. Anything is playable in that context. Where has Ajani been played other than as a bad sideboard card in UW aggro? Same can basically be said for Mikaeus. And those cards would hardly make this card "good" or even "playable." The rest are bad cards in basically any context of standard play.
BRG Living End
UGWRB Titan Bloom (40% complete)
Bant is my true calling so Simic beter have something good, this will take some work to be better than an elvish Visionary yea, just make that comparison. Card is not good, would 3 mana been to strong for this?
slitherhead becomes a free cantrip from the grave
ring of evos isle and ring of kalonia become one sided howling mines
heck even junk cards like afiya grove become less junk-ish lol
quest for the gemblades = instant draw 4
With doubling season, let's double the draws
Of course i'm talking only about EDH material, in standard the card is good but not exceptional, for now. It has potential though, let's see other GTC cards before judging it in standard
i'm curious about the interaction with shambling shell: can I sac shell and dredge it if i put the counter on fathom mage?
It's strange that so many people choose to be stupid...
Thragtusk is the anti-this. Thragtusk starts with a relevant body. It does something upon entering play, AND when it is removed. Oh, and it also has a broken synergy with one of the other staples in the format.
This card hits play, does nothing, and durdles around praying your opponent has no removal of any kind so that you can at least get a card back for wasting your turn on it.
And arena is standard legal... oh wait...
What it the point of comparing it with a card that isn't legal? Next time try to compare the card with a card valid on the format.
Also i don't get the "less reliable" draw, if you can't get at last 1 card/turn for at last 4 turns, then there's something wrong with your game plan.
Once it start to not neting you any cards, this mean that it's because it's big, and this isn't bad either.
The small body is relevant only against Rx decks, since no one would be dumb enough to attack with it until it's big enoug.
Also there's plenty of ways of making this card have impact on the turn it enters the battlefield with the right plays. Playing cards blidly without consideting the game state is dumb, and this isn't a card 'i have 4 manas i will play it blindly'
But feel free to play arena over this on standard if this card is so bad... oh wait again...
It has nothing to do if Arena were legal or not. I was making a comparison to the most comparable tool available in order to demonstrate how bad it actually is. People have a general idea about the strength of that card, so the comparison should remain valid.
Now as to drawing you at least one card per turn for 4 turns? Not likely. Here is why:
1. It is easily removed. Very easily.
2. What if you need to cast a non-creature spell? Quite likely. Especially since you just wasted a turn on a card that gives you no real board presence. Are you going to be playing nothing but creatures for the next 4 turns? Better hope your opponent has worse creatures AND no removal.
3. Speaking of creatures, you're going to need big ones. Does your deck have a plethora of creatures with P/T > 4. You better hope so. Oh, and by the way, those cards are likely competing with spots that this card is currently taking up.
It isn't as if I'm a "card hater" either. I'm generally on the side of caution when it comes to playability of a card. This card isn't even what I'd call "fringe playable" though. I'm not even sure what could possibly be printed that might make him usable.
I like that the wording is more flexible than just "whenever ~ evolves" and triggers from any kind of +1/+1 counter... in block that means Scavenge becomes awesome. In Standard, maybe Increasing Savagery? Hunger of the Howlpack?
Simic is not disappointing.
R Citizen Cane (Feldon of the Third Path)
Just because a better card exist, that don't means the others are bad, specially considering that the better card can't be played.
Because the only way of getting the draws is the evolve trigger.
Oh, by the way, do you know this card? This one can realiabily trigger the evolve 3 times alone for no cost, being one in the same turn she etb. Also you can trigger her twice in a turn while adding value to the board. Not to mention the other smart ways already mentioned to trigger her for free/adding value.
Because her trigger isn't "when evolve triggers" but "whenever a +1/+1 counter is placed".
Not to mention that, since the simic mechanic is based on counter, we can expect cards that manage counter, we already got one. This one isn't the best, but why not expect better cards for that?
That's what i was talking about narrow vision.
As an example, out of Vraska and Jace, Vraska would be the dominating planeswalker - I mean Jace is worst than the Mind Sculptor. Angel of Serenity would be too expensive to be played. Delver/Lingering Souls would be still dominating.
This is very ironic. Magical Christmasland scenarios are the definition of narrow vision. You have to come up with narrow scenarios to find situations where the card isn't totally worthless.
It doesn't take a genius to figure out that 4 mana 1/1s with no protection or immediate board impact aren't going to cut it. Probably ever.