Have to give this mechanic a "yuck". There's never been a mechanic that involves discarding cards that I've enjoyed. It's just bad design. Players don't like discarding cards. They like playing cards.
Although I honestly assumed the Simic and Gruul keywaords would be lame, so I'm still hopeful GTC will be a good set. My 3 favorite guilds are the only three left to spoil.
Cycling is one of the most beloved mechanics ever, right up there with Flashback. Obviously you replace the card with another, but it's still a "discard" mechanic. The "cycle" lands, decree of justice, eternal dragon, akroma's vengeance, decree of silence were all awesome cards in their day.
I don't like this mechanic tho, it feels like limited nonsense and not much else. Some of the Reinforce cards from lorwyn were fine in limited, this feels like a worse reinforce (not permanent, but bigger increases).
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Standard:
Bident Layers B Devotion RG Devotion UW Control Modern:
Jund
UW Control
Combo Pod Legacy: DeathBlade RUG Delver BUG Control
If this is true, then they could've expanded on it a lot more. Actually, the templating was the thing that got everybody thinking that they could've done much more with the mechanic.
From what is in the source, I wonder why they didn't just do:
"Bloodrush [COST] ([COST], Discard ~: Target creature gets +X/+Y until end of turn, where X is this card's power and Y is its toughness.)"
I still highly doubt it's just power and toughness boosts, because they could've just made it a keyword if they only intended for the mechanic to give one-turn power/toughness boosts.
They probably wanted to leave it open so they can explore the untapped design space later (either in Dragon's Maze or in a later block). Thanks to new world order, they've become rather zealous lately about conserving design space. Expect to see lots of mechanics like this in the future: mechanics with lots of potential design space, with only the most basic, obvious applications actually used when they're first printed. That way they have somewhere to go if they ever bring them back. Besides, with 10 new mechanics this block, they'll want to keep each one as simple as possible to avoid overwhelming the players with complexity.
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"I am confident that if anyone actually
penetrates our facades, even the most
perceptive would still be fundamentally
unprepared for the truth of House Dimir."
Have to give this mechanic a "yuck". There's never been a mechanic that involves discarding cards that I've enjoyed. It's just bad design. Players don't like discarding cards. They like playing cards.
Although I honestly assumed the Simic and Gruul keywaords would be lame, so I'm still hopeful GTC will be a good set. My 3 favorite guilds are the only three left to spoil.
Discarding cards for an effect is playing them. What people don't like is being incentivized to not use cards, to just leave them in their hand. Being able to use them as something other than a creature is the exact opposite.
Discarding cards for an effect is playing them. What people don't like is being incentivized to not use cards, to just leave them in their hand. Being able to use them as something other than a creature is the exact opposite.
Think some people are missing a point here. This spell may make you discard, but are you really losing out? For one turn, to your opponents shock, you bestow the might of another creature to one on the battlefield.
This was MADE to work with Zoo decks. It works effortlessly with everything from Innistrad, from werewolves to all those green "creatures matter" cards. I wont be playing Gruul, but I wouldnt doubt it if it ends up being tournament greatness.
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There is buried treasure everywhere...in a graveyard.
The best thing about this ability with werewolves is the fact that since TECHNICALLY you are not CASTING something you can pump your weres and still meet the "not casting a spell for a turn" clause.
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This aint your girlfriends meta! This is a man's meta! TURBO META.
If there's a creature or enchantment that gives creatures in your hand this ability, it could be pretty sweet to try and build a reanimator shell. Gruul would also be a solid team with Golgari in DGM.
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"The trick to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources." -Albert Einstein
The best thing about this ability with werewolves is the fact that since TECHNICALLY you are not CASTING something you can pump your weres and still meet the "not casting a spell for a turn" clause.
I sat down and started thinking something along these lines for huntmaster, but yeah what you said.
Also...
That is a huge bump in p/t turn 5 or turn 6... oddly I find my self thinking that some RUG contraption will be using this with ramp and invisible stalker. I've played an iteration of a deck that was doing that already... Some people say with paladin... either way... that can be a huge game winning thing if the game goes for any duration.
I don't know if theres a good green hexproof guy but the blue 1 fits the bill.
Farseek (the card I happen to hate the most in standard), and Rubblehulk... actually make me think, this could be a thing. ESPECIALLY at instant speed.
I sat down and started thinking something along these lines for huntmaster, but yeah what you said.
Also...
That is a huge bump in p/t turn 5 or turn 6... oddly I find my self thinking that some RUG contraption will be using this with ramp and invisible stalker. I've played an iteration of a deck that was doing that already... Some people say with paladin... either way... that can be a huge game winning thing if the game goes for any duration.
I don't know if theres a good green hexproof guy but the blue 1 fits the bill.
Farseek (the card I happen to hate the most in standard), and Rubblehulk... actually make me think, this could be a thing. ESPECIALLY at instant speed.
Only read the first few pages, so probably mentioned, but in case it hasn't been:
This guy's power and toughness are equal to # of lands. He gives +X/+X, where x = # of lands.
So, I would assume each creature discards itself to give some attribute of itself to an attacking creature. Like, a trample creature that can discard to give an attacking creature trample. Or a hexproof creature that can discard to give an attacking creature shroud.
Only read the first few pages, so probably mentioned, but in case it hasn't been:
This guy's power and toughness are equal to # of lands. He gives +X/+X, where x = # of lands.
So, I would assume each creature discards itself to give some attribute of itself to an attacking creature. Like, a trample creature that can discard to give an attacking creature trample. Or a hexproof creature that can discard to give an attacking creature shroud.
Well, he gives +X/+X where X is his P/T.
Rubblehulk does not have the basic form of this ability. He has the splashy one reserved for rares. Like, Chaos Imps getting trample if you unleash.
i think this will be like : pay half the MC and discard this creature: target attacking creature gets +X /+Y Where x is this card power and y is this card T
also would be coollllllll if bloodrush grants the creature other abilitys like trample haste ....
Well, he gives +X/+X where X is his P/T.
Rubblehulk does not have the basic form of this ability. He has the splashy one reserved for rares. Like, Chaos Imps getting trample if you unleash.
The point is that if the only form is +X/+Y then it would be a keyword instead of an ability word. We know it's an ability word instead of a keyword and so that means that they must be doing something else with it as well.
i think this guys will be good in a jund midrange deck, he fits the synergy, a 6/6 for 6 mana that enjoys me farseeking to mana fix. I like it. Makes late game farseeks worth it. plus maybe they'll print new rampant growth type cards.
i think this will be like : pay half the MC and discard this creature: target attacking creature gets +X /+Y Where x is this card power and y is this card T
also would be coollllllll if bloodrush grants the creature other abilitys like trample haste ....
The idea is good here, and I hope this is what they do, effectively "Discard this: Target creature gains this creature until EoT." But...haste is pretty useless for an attacking creature, don't you think?
Cycling is one of the most beloved mechanics ever, right up there with Flashback. Obviously you replace the card with another, but it's still a "discard" mechanic. The "cycle" lands, decree of justice, eternal dragon, akroma's vengeance, decree of silence were all awesome cards in their day.
Good point. What I meant was abilities that cost you cards from your hand. Cycling replaces the card so you're not down any cards.
i think this guys will be good in a jund midrange deck
You can't BBE into him, so Jund has no place for this card.
I think what I like most about this is the element of surprise. Normally you know whats coming or can at least prepare for the worst with counter spells and removal. This really reminds me of the ninjas from Kami block.
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There is buried treasure everywhere...in a graveyard.
The idea of putting this on something with Double Strike like Silverblade Paladin is pretty scary, especially so early in the game (on turn 4 or something). It's uncounterable too, which is also pretty useful.
I think I like the ability. Not bad, not bad at all.
The idea of putting this on something with Double Strike like Silverblade Paladin is pretty scary, especially so early in the game (on turn 4 or something). It's uncounterable too, which is also pretty useful.
I think I like the ability. Not bad, not bad at all.
Does Giant Growth see play in Silverblade Paladin decks? It's +3/+3 for 1. This would be +3/+3 for 3.
Just seems boring. Vanilla dudes are boring. Bad pump spells are boring. Combining vanilla dudes and bad pump spells doesn't make the card very exciting.
Hopefully they expand on the keyword a little more to make it more interesting.
Does Giant Growth see play in Silverblade Paladin decks? It's +3/+3 for 1. This would be +3/+3 for 3.
Just seems boring. Vanilla dudes are boring. Bad pump spells are boring. Combining vanilla dudes and bad pump spells doesn't make the card very exciting.
Hopefully they expand on the keyword a little more to make it more interesting.
Only if you miss a land drop on turn 4. Otherwise it is a +4/+4 for 3.
Abilities like these, "characteristic-defining abilities", apply in all zones.
Cōnservātum album delenda est.
Cycling is one of the most beloved mechanics ever, right up there with Flashback. Obviously you replace the card with another, but it's still a "discard" mechanic. The "cycle" lands, decree of justice, eternal dragon, akroma's vengeance, decree of silence were all awesome cards in their day.
I don't like this mechanic tho, it feels like limited nonsense and not much else. Some of the Reinforce cards from lorwyn were fine in limited, this feels like a worse reinforce (not permanent, but bigger increases).
Bident Layers
B Devotion
RG Devotion
UW Control
Modern:
Jund
UW Control
Combo Pod
Legacy:
DeathBlade
RUG Delver
BUG Control
Standard
W.I.P.
EDH
WNorn Tokens
They probably wanted to leave it open so they can explore the untapped design space later (either in Dragon's Maze or in a later block). Thanks to new world order, they've become rather zealous lately about conserving design space. Expect to see lots of mechanics like this in the future: mechanics with lots of potential design space, with only the most basic, obvious applications actually used when they're first printed. That way they have somewhere to go if they ever bring them back. Besides, with 10 new mechanics this block, they'll want to keep each one as simple as possible to avoid overwhelming the players with complexity.
"I am confident that if anyone actually
penetrates our facades, even the most
perceptive would still be fundamentally
unprepared for the truth of House Dimir."
Discarding cards for an effect is playing them. What people don't like is being incentivized to not use cards, to just leave them in their hand. Being able to use them as something other than a creature is the exact opposite.
and in this case uncounterable!
This was MADE to work with Zoo decks. It works effortlessly with everything from Innistrad, from werewolves to all those green "creatures matter" cards. I wont be playing Gruul, but I wouldnt doubt it if it ends up being tournament greatness.
There is buried treasure everywhere...in a graveyard.
This aint your girlfriends meta! This is a man's meta! TURBO META.
I sat down and started thinking something along these lines for huntmaster, but yeah what you said.
Also...
That is a huge bump in p/t turn 5 or turn 6... oddly I find my self thinking that some RUG contraption will be using this with ramp and invisible stalker. I've played an iteration of a deck that was doing that already... Some people say with paladin... either way... that can be a huge game winning thing if the game goes for any duration.
I don't know if theres a good green hexproof guy but the blue 1 fits the bill.
Farseek (the card I happen to hate the most in standard), and Rubblehulk... actually make me think, this could be a thing. ESPECIALLY at instant speed.
...It is at instant speed right?
EDIT: Hound of Griselbrand Loves this guy as well
Since it is an activated ability and doesnt say otherwise you can do it at instant speed.
This aint your girlfriends meta! This is a man's meta! TURBO META.
This guy's power and toughness are equal to # of lands. He gives +X/+X, where x = # of lands.
So, I would assume each creature discards itself to give some attribute of itself to an attacking creature. Like, a trample creature that can discard to give an attacking creature trample. Or a hexproof creature that can discard to give an attacking creature shroud.
Well, he gives +X/+X where X is his P/T.
Rubblehulk does not have the basic form of this ability. He has the splashy one reserved for rares. Like, Chaos Imps getting trample if you unleash.
Visual Spoiler by Cycle GW The Art of Return to Ravnica
also would be coollllllll if bloodrush grants the creature other abilitys like trample haste ....
The point is that if the only form is +X/+Y then it would be a keyword instead of an ability word. We know it's an ability word instead of a keyword and so that means that they must be doing something else with it as well.
The idea is good here, and I hope this is what they do, effectively "Discard this: Target creature gains this creature until EoT." But...haste is pretty useless for an attacking creature, don't you think?
Good point. What I meant was abilities that cost you cards from your hand. Cycling replaces the card so you're not down any cards.
You can't BBE into him, so Jund has no place for this card.
Because Bloodbraid Elf and Jace, the Mind Sculptor were so important that Standard disussion must always keep them in mind.
There is buried treasure everywhere...in a graveyard.
I think I like the ability. Not bad, not bad at all.
Does Giant Growth see play in Silverblade Paladin decks? It's +3/+3 for 1. This would be +3/+3 for 3.
Just seems boring. Vanilla dudes are boring. Bad pump spells are boring. Combining vanilla dudes and bad pump spells doesn't make the card very exciting.
Hopefully they expand on the keyword a little more to make it more interesting.
Only if you miss a land drop on turn 4. Otherwise it is a +4/+4 for 3.
I'd rather this card/ability suck than a hexproof trampler.
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