2012 Holiday Promo Card: Naughty//Nice

  • #52
    Quote from headley

    Snow Mercy: {T}, {Q}, {T}, {Q}, {T} will never show up on a serious card.


    Probably, but there's no reason why it couldn't. It works perfectly fine within the rules.

    Quote from Bogardan Mage
    Yes, if your opponent has those. The problem is you can't count on that being the case.


    That's why you Nice a card into your opponent's hand, then use something like Winds of Change to get it in your opponent's library. Then you use Naughty to get it back. Granted, that does require 2 copies or a way to recur it.

    Practice for Journey into Nyx Limited:
    Draft: (#1) (#2) (#3)
  • #53
    Quote from Bogardan Mage
    Yes, if your opponent has those. The problem is you can't count on that being the case.


    I think that in the formats where this will show up (EDH, kitchen table), I can count on my opponents playing at least one strong colorless artifact or land that does something useful if they're not playing anything in my at least two colors.

    But if not, hey! I'm perfectly willing to spend a card to find out that my opponent has no good cards in his/her library.
  • #54
    Quote from KnickM
    I think that in the formats where this will show up (EDH, kitchen table), I can count on my opponents playing at least one strong colorless artifact or land that does something useful if they're not playing anything in my at least two colors.

    But if not, hey! I'm perfectly willing to spend a card to find out that my opponent has no good cards in his/her library.


    Its the Praetors Grip, which allways finds you at least a land, and in Mirrodin allways some form of artifact, sometimes spoilers.

    Thats obvisious usefull enough, but in EDH its kind of annoying as its expensive for 3 mana, as in worst they have the card you want on the hand, which sucks a lot.
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  • #55
    These are always pretty fun, and this one too.
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  • #56
    Holiday cards are so much fun, even though I know I will never be owning one of them. I hope there are more Un-sets in the future so we can see more hilarious cards like this.
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  • #57
    Quote from empathogen
    Naughty is basically what Praetor's Grasp attempts to be.
    Nice is basically hilarious.


    I think the difference is that you now "own" the card you took (obviously depends on the person you're playing with), and you are giving a gift with nice.

    Cool card.
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    -A person riding a horse cannot be stopped by foot soldiers, large animals, walls, archers, or even catapults.

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  • #58
    Wonder why these dont cost BB and WW.
  • #59
    Quote from benbuzz790
    I think the difference is that you now "own" the card you took (obviously depends on the person you're playing with), and you are giving a gift with nice.

    Cool card.

    It doesn't say that, and there isn't really any reason to think it does. In normal magic your hand can only contain cards that you own, but that doesn't necessarily apply in silver-bordered land.
  • #60
    Nice. However, why don't they show real spoilers on Christmas? (I am assuming that they won't) So people get incentives to spend their new money? I love the flavor of these Holiday cards.
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  • #61
    Quote from Zuriya
    Nice. However, why don't they show real spoilers on Christmas? (I am assuming that they won't) So people get incentives to spend their new money? I love the flavor of these Holiday cards.

    This might be relevant.
    Quote from Tackman
    We will probably get our first official spoiler(s) on the week of December 24th.

    Regarding a question asked to Wizards about when the GTC spoiler season starts:
    "Gatecrash preview week kicks off on New Year's Eve; be sure to come see the new articles and cards about the upcoming set!
    But, just between you and me, you might want to keep an eye on DailyMTG.com the week before, too. We might have some winter gifts in store for you all."

    Source

    And today we got:
    "Be sure to check DailyMTG.com on December 24, 2012, and every day that week. I'm sure you'll find something worth unwrapping."
    Source

    Since Jarrett used "gifts" in plural form, and says to check the site on every day of that week, we could even assume we will get multiple spoilers, maybe up to five! (Hopefully not the 5 mythics we already know of...)

    She wants a ride on the pony, dude.

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  • #62
    Quote from fnord
    Probably, but there's no reason why it couldn't. It works perfectly fine within the rules.


    If I recall the rules correctly, paying the cost is impossible. You can only pay the "Tap" cost if the permanent is untapped and you can only pay the "Untap" cost is the permanent is tapped. When paying a cost for a spell or ability, all parts of it must be paid at once. Partial payments are not allowed.

    So yes, I do agree that Fruitcake Elemental and Season's Beatings are the only cards that can actually work under the game rules as they exist. I suppose technically Yule Ooze can work, since there's no rule forbidding the eating of food as part of a cost, although rules clarification might be requires towards defining food and setting a minimum required quantity.
    Must you?
  • #63
    Quote from Marelt Ekiran
    If I recall the rules correctly, paying the cost is impossible. You can only pay the "Tap" cost if the permanent is untapped and you can only pay the "Untap" cost is the permanent is tapped. When paying a cost for a spell or ability, all parts of it must be paid at once. Partial payments are not allowed.


    Half right:

    Quote from "Comprehensive Rules" »
    601.2g The player pays the total cost in any order. Partial payments are not allowed. Unpayable costs can't be paid.


    Since you can pay the costs in any order, you can pay the tap cost, then the untap cost, then the second tap cost, then the second untap cost, then the final tap cost.

    Practice for Journey into Nyx Limited:
    Draft: (#1) (#2) (#3)
  • #64
    Gotta love holiday promos...though I kinda was hoping for "Angel of the Christmas Tree." Given how broken Angel of Serenity is, it was more of an unreachable dream.

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  • #65
    I think the difference is that you now "own" the card you took (obviously depends on the person you're playing with), and you are giving a gift with nice.

    Cool card.


    Quote from Bogardan Mage
    It doesn't say that, and there isn't really any reason to think it does. In normal magic your hand can only contain cards that you own, but that doesn't necessarily apply in silver-bordered land.


    Breaking the rule that says you own all the cards in your library seems less likely than actually allowing someone to give a gift when you take into account that it's a holiday card. I really admire how they implied it's a gift in such a subtle way.

    Do you think it's more likely that they broke the rule that says you can't put cards in your hand or lib you don't own, or the rule that keeps ownership from changing?
    Last edited by benbuzz790: 12/22/2012 3:24:11 PM
    Facts of Magic

    -Terror is an emotion which, when experienced, results in death.
    -The pox was a disease notorious for having killed one-third, rounded up, of Europe’s population. Smallpox, on the other hand, killed only a single person.
    -A person riding a horse cannot be stopped by foot soldiers, large animals, walls, archers, or even catapults.

    Other Facts of Magic
    Funniest Magic cards ever
  • #66
    Quote from benbuzz790
    Breaking the rule that says you own all the cards in your library seems less likely than actually allowing someone to give a gift when you take into account that it's a holiday card. I really admire how they implied it's a gift in such a subtle way.

    Do you think it's more likely that they broke the rule that says you can't put cards in your hand or lib you don't own, or the rule that keeps ownership from changing?

    There is no rule that keeps ownership from changing, black bordered cards have been printed that do so. However, they do not do so without saying as much. Nice does exactly what it says it does, which is put a card into your opponent's library. Nowhere does it say that they now own it. By analogy, the opponent will also not own a Letter Bomb that has been shuffled into their library.
  • #67
    Right, I know. It's implied because it's a holiday card. They're being clever. It's like a play-on-words, but instead it's a play-on-rules.
    Facts of Magic

    -Terror is an emotion which, when experienced, results in death.
    -The pox was a disease notorious for having killed one-third, rounded up, of Europe’s population. Smallpox, on the other hand, killed only a single person.
    -A person riding a horse cannot be stopped by foot soldiers, large animals, walls, archers, or even catapults.

    Other Facts of Magic
    Funniest Magic cards ever
  • #68
    Quote from Marelt Ekiran
    If I recall the rules correctly, paying the cost is impossible. You can only pay the "Tap" cost if the permanent is untapped and you can only pay the "Untap" cost is the permanent is tapped. When paying a cost for a spell or ability, all parts of it must be paid at once. Partial payments are not allowed.

    So yes, I do agree that Fruitcake Elemental and Season's Beatings are the only cards that can actually work under the game rules as they exist. I suppose technically Yule Ooze can work, since there's no rule forbidding the eating of food as part of a cost, although rules clarification might be requires towards defining food and setting a minimum required quantity.


    They already defined this with Fat Ass from Unhinged. Read the FAQ for that set. (Gum isn't food.)
  • #69
    Quote from benbuzz790
    Right, I know. It's implied because it's a holiday card. They're being clever. It's like a play-on-words, but instead it's a play-on-rules.

    No it isn't. It is what it appears to be and nothing more. This is not unprecedented even in silver border. You are wrong about how this card works.
  • #70
    Quote from Bogardan Mage
    No it isn't. It is what it appears to be and nothing more. This is not unprecedented even in silver border. You are wrong about how this card works.


    I have to agree with you here on this one.

    108.3. The owner of a card in the game is the player who started the game with it in his or her deck. If a card is brought into the game from outside the game rather than starting in a player’s deck, its owner is the player who brought it into the game. If a card starts the game in the command zone, its owner is the player who put it into the command zone to start the game. Legal ownership of a card in the game is irrelevant to the game rules except for the rules for ante. (See rule 407.)


    Just because this is silver bordered sillyness, doesn't mean the fundamental rules of the game change. If WotC wanted it to change ownership, they would have stated it on the card.
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  • #71
    This would be so fun in EDH.
    "I think EDH would be more fun for the majority of participants if players just showed eachother their decks rather than actually playing games out."
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