Honestly putting a product like this on shelves in big box stores would just cause more of them to get stolen. The vast majority of people looking for an expensive product like this are not going to be looking for it at WalMart unless it is for the express purpose to lift it. I work in retail and I can tell you this: the amount of trading cards, not just magic, that get stolen would surprise you.
I worked retail during my college years and do understand the amount of thieving that happens. That aside my point is still valid. People want what they can not have. Broodmate dragon promo is a perfect example of this.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
currently playing: LEGACY loam/depthsBG Sneak showUR LED DredgeUBR ReanimatorUB landsBURG EDH DoranWBG JhoiraUR
Really? Please keep telling me about the demographic of collectors that wants crappy oversized cards, dice, and sleeves.
This is obviously a product for collectors, but I'm really starting to wonder if it started out that way just by how strange the whole thing was handled.
If you are going after collectors why market it that way and include a lot of extra stuff collectors don't care about.
I think this was originally designed to be like a FTV product, but someone realized there was a lot of money to be made on the secondary market.
The only question is why wizards is going out of their way to design a product for shop owners to make money.
It's nice and all, but it seems like they could have just printed off some free cards and sent those out.
They can't be making as much money with this as they would have had it not been so limited.
The whole thing is very strange.
Ummmm if collectors don't care for oversized cards then why are the foil oversized cards for Avacyn Restored going for $90+ on Star City and the MTG 15th Anniversary Life Counter going for $100 on Toad and Troll?
Ummmm if collectors don't care for oversized cards then why are the foil oversized cards for Avacyn Restored going for $90+ on Star City and the MTG 15th Anniversary Life Counter going for $100 on Toad and Troll?
Because both of those are insanely rare compared to these or other oversized cards that have been printed.
This proves anything related to MTG that is super rare is for collectors.
Right. I think that was pretty well established in the last page or so. But to belabor the point, the Helvault foils only went out to 30 stores (54x each), and there are only 250 15th Anniversary counters -- I do think those products attract collectors more than Oversized promos found at every store, even if they are pretty limited in number.
Because both of those are insanely rare compared to these or other oversized cards that have been printed.
EDIT:
Right. I think that was pretty well established in the last page or so. But to belabor the point, the Helvault foils only went out to 30 stores (54x each), and there are only 250 15th Anniversary counters -- I do think those products attract collectors more than Oversized promos found at every store, even if they are pretty limited in number.
I guess we will find out supply and demand come November 2.
Use the Edit button Don't Double Post
This proves anything related to MTG that is super rare is for collectors.
...umm...I mean...isn't ANYTHING that's super rare related to ANYTHING for collectors? I can't tell if this is a complaint, sarcasm, or if you just graduated from your elementary school logic class.
my lgs store owner told me the other day he is only able to get 2 of these and it pisses him off since he then had to give people who really wanted these there money back that they had put down since he assumed he'd was going to be at least the same amount of these as ftv's(20) the 2 he is getting are going to his employees
Your LGS owner is a ****ing moron for taking their money in the first place. It's ignorant to take preorders on anything before you know how many you're getting. It's begging for trouble to take someone's money before you have that product in hand. Zero sympathy for this ******.
Wizards could put $100 bills in packs and people would complain about how they were folded. http://www.twitter.com/Dr_Jeebus - Follow me on Twitter!
Check out www.mtgbrodeals.com for daily content from the brothers of Mu Tau Gamma!
Wizards can not make everyone happy and if they released this product in walmart, target, and meijers players would want them and buy them. But many of these would sit on shelves and not draw this much attention. The MSRP would turn off most players in the first place. That's almost the price of a booster.
I agree completely that this product shouldn't land on the shelves of mass-retail stores. I never said it should be. People keep drawing a comparison between this product and FTV, and use the existence of FTV to somehow justify the fact that this product is so limited. FTV is already the rarest sealed product currently on the market. This has literally 1/5 of the distribution of FTV; comparing the two is a fallacy.
But let's say that they had the same distribution, for the sake of argument. Let's say that Arsenal were allocated 8/20 instead of 2/4. If that were the case, people would be much less up-in-arms, price gouging would exist on a much smaller scale, stores would still be able to sell for more than MSRP and the product would still be limited enough to appease collectors.
I agree completely that this product shouldn't land on the shelves of mass-retail stores. I never said it should be. People keep drawing a comparison between this product and FTV, and use the existence of FTV to somehow justify the fact that this product is so limited. FTV is already the rarest sealed product currently on the market. This has literally 1/5 of the distribution of FTV; comparing the two is a fallacy.
But let's say that they had the same distribution, for the sake of argument. Let's say that Arsenal were allocated 8/20 instead of 2/4. If that were the case, people would be much less up-in-arms, price gouging would exist on a much smaller scale, stores would still be able to sell for more than MSRP and the product would still be limited enough to appease collectors.
I fail to see how my example is a fallacy. We are talking about limited print run magic sets, that's it. This is an apples to apples comparison. The same principles apply just to a higher degree.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
currently playing: LEGACY loam/depthsBG Sneak showUR LED DredgeUBR ReanimatorUB landsBURG EDH DoranWBG JhoiraUR
I fail to see how my example is a fallacy. We are talking about limited print run magic sets, that's it. This is an apples to apples comparison. The same principles apply just to a higher degree.
Okay, you said:
Not everyone can get From the Vaults as well, some are priced out by them as well. The print run is limited as well. Stores gouge their prices as well. It's the same thing just amplified. From the vaults is just as guilty.
In my post that you responded to, I theorized that if this set were released with the same distribution as FTV, there wouldn't be nearly as much of an uproar over it. Even if the MSRP were still $75, I can assure you many fewer jimmies would be rustled because five times as many people would have the chance to own a set. People aren't as upset about the prospect of price gouging as they are about the prospect of not being able to obtain the set AT ALL. With FTV, there's at least a reasonable chance of getting a copy, even if you're paying well over MSRP. With Arsenal, that same chance is no longer reasonable.
This is hardly apples-to-apples. At best, you're comparing apples from Costco to the enchanted apple from Snow White. I know that's a lame metaphor, but I couldn't think of a better one involving apples.
Not everyone can get From the Vaults as well, some are priced out by them as well. The print run is limited as well. Stores gouge their prices as well. It's the same thing just amplified. From the vaults is just as guilty.
In my post that you responded to, I theorized that if this set were released with the same distribution as FTV, there wouldn't be nearly as much of an uproar over it. Even if the MSRP were still $75, I can assure you many fewer jimmies would be rustled because five times as many people would have the chance to own a set. People aren't as upset about the prospect of price gouging as they are about the prospect of not being able to obtain the set AT ALL. With FTV, there's at least a reasonable chance of getting a copy, even if you're paying well over MSRP. With Arsenal, that same chance is no longer reasonable.
This is hardly apples-to-apples. At best, you're comparing apples from Costco to the enchanted apple from Snow White. I know that's a lame metaphor, but I couldn't think of a better one involving apples.
Where you playing when the first FTV's was announced, dragons? It created a bigger stink then this set is. It doesn't matter what the product is magic players will complain and weild their mighty skill of hyperbole.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
currently playing: LEGACY loam/depthsBG Sneak showUR LED DredgeUBR ReanimatorUB landsBURG EDH DoranWBG JhoiraUR
I just want the cards for my cube. They are probably powerful cards that are fun to play with. The FTV sets never fail to disappoint me (even Legends was great for my cube). I'm really excited about this, but not at the prices it is fetching.
$75 seemed like overkill, but I'm guessing Wizards will make this beyond worth it. $200? $300? $400? I'll hold off on that.
What I find most amusing about this is that barring the over-sized cards everything found in this thing is cheaper in other versions.
I mean you don't have to buy this thing to get Command Tower unless you "Need" Command Tower in Foil.
I can understand the "pimpage" factor but unless this thing easily contains 300+ dollars worth of cards on the secondary market it's not a huge boon to buy it and bust it. The only ones that are going to make bank on this product from a value perspective are those that keep it sealed for 5+ years. (I am referring to buying this product at 200-300 a copy..)
The only way this product would really piss me off is it contained 1-2 brand new cards that are unavailable outside of this print run.
The only way this product would really piss me off is it contained 1-2 brand new cards that are unavailable outside of this print run.
Agreed. THAT would be put me on the whiner's bandwagon in a heartbeat (depending on the eternal playability of said cards), but this is thankfully very unlikely.
I got on the list in August at my local game store. The owner always sells everything at MSRP or less so I checked with him and he is charging MSRP on this too. I was the first one on the list and asked for two, since he was only getting two he told me I was getting one and the second guy on the list would get the other one. I traded guy number two for his "slot" Saturday. So I will be getting both. I will be opening one and saving the other for a friend. I also picked up two more FTV realms for MSRP at the same place! It seems most of the gamers at this store are more "standard" and "casual" players and are not interested in these two sets. I really appreciate having a LGS owner that treats his customers well and is not trying to gouge them at every opportunity.
The way this set is so limited it puts the owners in a very bad position. How to fairly distribute this product at your store is a precarious situation. Any way you decide is going to upset someone. But in my opinion, charging a high price is penny wise and dollar foolish. The temptation to make a fast dollar at the expense of your reputation is very tempting but I think it will comeback to bite them in the end. It makes the owner look greedy and opportunistic. This may not be fair, but perception is reality. If your customers see you this way, the damage is done. I understand the business side of this, A owner can make a couple of hundred quickly but if it hurts his reputation with his customers in the long run, is it worth it?
Man I'm screwed. My local LGS' is Cool Stuff and they'll charge an arm and a leg depending on what comes in it and the comic shop near by prices it at the same as them... Price gouging of product that has a preset MSRP is stupid but the MSRP is just a suggestive price for stores.
Urzisha: "To me, this is no different then when they made a promo for a convention. Only the really special people who can get to it will get it, everyone else will just have to look in on the outside. ''
also... this product has yet to spoil and NOBODY SHOULD LOSE A JOB OVER THIS. Even if they are 5 times off on the numbers.. of a test product. Not even a slap on the wrist. Rude to suggest a lose of job given this.
p.s. maybe a litttttttttttttle slap. : )
Whoever does market research for them isn't doing a very good job if this is the best kind of distribution method they could come up with.
If I worked at a restaurant and I said to the boss "Hey, we should make a special burger that uses higher quality meat and a special bun." He'd reply "Yeah, but we can't afford to do that for everyone" and I said "Here's the thing, we'll make 2 but advertise the hell out of it, everyone already loves our burgers the way we make them, but this will be only for the REALLY special people and we'll charge them a premium for it." Time comes to sell the burgers, and 100 people line up wanting one of these "special" burgers. First two in line, they've been camped out at the restaurant since the initial conversation about these burgers took place, they love them. Everyone else, shrugs and while they buy the regular version of the burger, they are really bummed out that they couldn't get the special one, even though they tried everything to get them.
Whoever thought on average that a store should only get 2 or 4 of a product of a game as popular and far reaching as Magic the gathering, isn't a very good product researcher IMO. That just leads to a product being price gouged, many hurt feelings (product does not even come close to meeting demand) and just leaves a bad taste in the mouths of people who didn't get it. ("What happens the next time they want to do this and they put stuff in here I want a lot?, Doesn't matter I won't be able to get this anyways.") Every other product they have ever produced, even the limited stuff, found a way to be accessible to players. I'm still certain that this is only for people who run stores/work in stores they are the target market for this. Outside of them people who got really really really lucky. And that really sucks for everyone else.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I just want people who redraft to admit this:
"I can't draft objectively unless I am able to guarantee that I receive at least 3 rares. I am also better than most average/new players so I want to make sure that I get the best rares and they end up with worse ones. I care more about the monetary value of cards than actually playing the game for decent prizes."
What annoys me most about this whole thing is the fact its called the "Commanders' Arsenal".
And then there's this:
"This will be a limited print run product, meant for the collectors and the avid Commander players."
The last time I checked, I'm sure there were more avid Commander Players than Avid Collectors. For a product meant for both (explictly stated), it has less print than a From the Vault product? (Which well, was meant for "Avid Collectors, even if it does have a large Commander impact, wasn't core-designed for Commander).
WotC is mocking Commander, Its like saying there are only 4 Avid Commander Players in every "Top Seller" LGS out there.
If anything, something called Commander's Arsenal should be like a Deck Builder's Toolkit, coming with a random Commander pre-con and an assortment of one-ofs, a mass amount of cards that are not neccessary all valuable, but at an affordable price.
Good thing this is a one-of product, so my complaints stop here.
Any chance we can lock this thread til spoilers? I'm getting a headache from all the circles we're turning...
On a more positive note, they already admitted to scrambling this thing together last-second. They probably didn't want to spend a ton of money investing in a product that they weren't ultra-confident in. Yes, the limited print run is annoying but sucks to suck, they'll have BETTER and MORE INTERESTING products for Commander palyers as time goes on.
Also, I have a sneaking suspicion that they wouldn't commission new art for awesome old cards in a product that they had to hurry to make that would replace something like PDS. I smell a rat. Or maybe a new Sylvan Library in next year's Commander decks?:D
If they chose to print a foil sylvan library in this set and include a nonfoil version in the next commander decks that would be pretty cool, but I doubt that will happen.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
If combo should die before I wake I'll slide a Smokestack in every deck I play, roll in every shop wreck the Spirit of EDH.
Any chance we can lock this thread til spoilers? I'm getting a headache from all the circles we're turning...
Seriously... All we know so far is Sylvan Library and the extras (ie. the life counter, sleeves, etc.). People are going a bit overboard with the speculation, and (just like with every FTV) I'm going to bet that more people will be disappointed than blown away.
Seriously... All we know so far is Sylvan Library and the extras (ie. the life counter, sleeves, etc.). People are going a bit overboard with the speculation, and (just like with every FTV) I'm going to bet that more people will be disappointed than blown away.
We also know there is a Foil Mimeoplasm and an oversized Azusa, Lost but Seeking as well.
Plains - John Avon - 230
Island - Jung Park - 235
Island - Vincent Proce - 237
Swamp - John Avon - 238
Mountain - John Avon - 242
Forest - John Avon - 246
What annoys me most about this whole thing is the fact its called the "Commanders' Arsenal".
And then there's this:
"This will be a limited print run product, meant for the collectors and the avid Commander players."
The last time I checked, I'm sure there were more avid Commander Players than Avid Collectors. For a product meant for both (explictly stated), it has less print than a From the Vault product? (Which well, was meant for "Avid Collectors, even if it does have a large Commander impact, wasn't core-designed for Commander).
WotC is mocking Commander, Its like saying there are only 4 Avid Commander Players in every "Top Seller" LGS out there.
If anything, something called Commander's Arsenal should be like a Deck Builder's Toolkit, coming with a random Commander pre-con and an assortment of one-ofs, a mass amount of cards that are not neccessary all valuable, but at an affordable price.
Good thing this is a one-of product, so my complaints stop here.
Part of the reason for the way this product ended up being setup, is that it was an emergency replacement for the recently cut product line of the PDS's. They had a choice between putting out ... nothing ... or putting out something they could put together quickly and fit into their allready packed production/printing schedule. In this case, they decided on a 1-off specialty product with a nod towards the higher end of the commander crowd, with a higher than normal msrp, and limited availability (both due to what it was, and the time constraints), allowing them to put cooler and more valuable than normal stuff in them without as much worry of the impact the product would have on the market values of the contents (likely not as huge a concern, but likely to an extent.).
Ill admit that the huge limitation came as something of a shock when the final numbers where found out (4 for advanced stores), that currently the secondary market pre-sales prices on these are a bit insane ($300 on ebay I think for some of the last ones I saw sold as of a week ago?) For myself, Ive allready told the shop owner that Ill make him an offer he cannot refuse, so he would hand them over to me so I can just bust em open and sell them as singles to the large customer base of commander players, etc, that I have, which I think is the best option to make as many people happy as possible (including him) :p. Thankfully, future commander product will be more normal and have more normal availability, this was just a last-minute thrown-together product that ended up the way it did.
It sure would be nice if this thread would only bump itself when there was new info on the product.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Oh, you think the losers' bracket is your ally, but you merely adopted the scrub tier. I was born in it, molded by it. I didn’t 4-0 an FNM until I was already a man; by then, it was nothing to me but an extra pack to sell for store credit!
I worked retail during my college years and do understand the amount of thieving that happens. That aside my point is still valid. People want what they can not have. Broodmate dragon promo is a perfect example of this.
currently playing:
LEGACY
loam/depthsBG
Sneak showUR
LED DredgeUBR
ReanimatorUB
landsBURG
EDH
DoranWBG
JhoiraUR
Ummmm if collectors don't care for oversized cards then why are the foil oversized cards for Avacyn Restored going for $90+ on Star City and the MTG 15th Anniversary Life Counter going for $100 on Toad and Troll?
Because both of those are insanely rare compared to these or other oversized cards that have been printed.
EDIT:
Right. I think that was pretty well established in the last page or so. But to belabor the point, the Helvault foils only went out to 30 stores (54x each), and there are only 250 15th Anniversary counters -- I do think those products attract collectors more than Oversized promos found at every store, even if they are pretty limited in number.
This proves anything related to MTG that is super rare is for collectors.
I guess we will find out supply and demand come November 2.
Use the Edit button Don't Double Post
...umm...I mean...isn't ANYTHING that's super rare related to ANYTHING for collectors? I can't tell if this is a complaint, sarcasm, or if you just graduated from your elementary school logic class.
Your LGS owner is a ****ing moron for taking their money in the first place. It's ignorant to take preorders on anything before you know how many you're getting. It's begging for trouble to take someone's money before you have that product in hand. Zero sympathy for this ******.
Use the Edit Button, Don't Double Post.
Wizards could put $100 bills in packs and people would complain about how they were folded.
http://www.twitter.com/Dr_Jeebus - Follow me on Twitter!
Check out www.mtgbrodeals.com for daily content from the brothers of Mu Tau Gamma!
I agree completely that this product shouldn't land on the shelves of mass-retail stores. I never said it should be. People keep drawing a comparison between this product and FTV, and use the existence of FTV to somehow justify the fact that this product is so limited. FTV is already the rarest sealed product currently on the market. This has literally 1/5 of the distribution of FTV; comparing the two is a fallacy.
But let's say that they had the same distribution, for the sake of argument. Let's say that Arsenal were allocated 8/20 instead of 2/4. If that were the case, people would be much less up-in-arms, price gouging would exist on a much smaller scale, stores would still be able to sell for more than MSRP and the product would still be limited enough to appease collectors.
EVOLVE ALL THE THINGS!!!
currently playing:
LEGACY
loam/depthsBG
Sneak showUR
LED DredgeUBR
ReanimatorUB
landsBURG
EDH
DoranWBG
JhoiraUR
Okay, you said:
Not everyone can get From the Vaults as well, some are priced out by them as well. The print run is limited as well. Stores gouge their prices as well. It's the same thing just amplified. From the vaults is just as guilty.
In my post that you responded to, I theorized that if this set were released with the same distribution as FTV, there wouldn't be nearly as much of an uproar over it. Even if the MSRP were still $75, I can assure you many fewer jimmies would be rustled because five times as many people would have the chance to own a set. People aren't as upset about the prospect of price gouging as they are about the prospect of not being able to obtain the set AT ALL. With FTV, there's at least a reasonable chance of getting a copy, even if you're paying well over MSRP. With Arsenal, that same chance is no longer reasonable.
This is hardly apples-to-apples. At best, you're comparing apples from Costco to the enchanted apple from Snow White. I know that's a lame metaphor, but I couldn't think of a better one involving apples.
EVOLVE ALL THE THINGS!!!
Where you playing when the first FTV's was announced, dragons? It created a bigger stink then this set is. It doesn't matter what the product is magic players will complain and weild their mighty skill of hyperbole.
currently playing:
LEGACY
loam/depthsBG
Sneak showUR
LED DredgeUBR
ReanimatorUB
landsBURG
EDH
DoranWBG
JhoiraUR
$75 seemed like overkill, but I'm guessing Wizards will make this beyond worth it. $200? $300? $400? I'll hold off on that.
I mean you don't have to buy this thing to get Command Tower unless you "Need" Command Tower in Foil.
I can understand the "pimpage" factor but unless this thing easily contains 300+ dollars worth of cards on the secondary market it's not a huge boon to buy it and bust it. The only ones that are going to make bank on this product from a value perspective are those that keep it sealed for 5+ years. (I am referring to buying this product at 200-300 a copy..)
The only way this product would really piss me off is it contained 1-2 brand new cards that are unavailable outside of this print run.
Feel free to bid on my cards here!
wizards is really dropping the ball on this one.
Agreed. THAT would be put me on the whiner's bandwagon in a heartbeat (depending on the eternal playability of said cards), but this is thankfully very unlikely.
The way this set is so limited it puts the owners in a very bad position. How to fairly distribute this product at your store is a precarious situation. Any way you decide is going to upset someone. But in my opinion, charging a high price is penny wise and dollar foolish. The temptation to make a fast dollar at the expense of your reputation is very tempting but I think it will comeback to bite them in the end. It makes the owner look greedy and opportunistic. This may not be fair, but perception is reality. If your customers see you this way, the damage is done. I understand the business side of this, A owner can make a couple of hundred quickly but if it hurts his reputation with his customers in the long run, is it worth it?
Whoever does market research for them isn't doing a very good job if this is the best kind of distribution method they could come up with.
If I worked at a restaurant and I said to the boss "Hey, we should make a special burger that uses higher quality meat and a special bun." He'd reply "Yeah, but we can't afford to do that for everyone" and I said "Here's the thing, we'll make 2 but advertise the hell out of it, everyone already loves our burgers the way we make them, but this will be only for the REALLY special people and we'll charge them a premium for it." Time comes to sell the burgers, and 100 people line up wanting one of these "special" burgers. First two in line, they've been camped out at the restaurant since the initial conversation about these burgers took place, they love them. Everyone else, shrugs and while they buy the regular version of the burger, they are really bummed out that they couldn't get the special one, even though they tried everything to get them.
Whoever thought on average that a store should only get 2 or 4 of a product of a game as popular and far reaching as Magic the gathering, isn't a very good product researcher IMO. That just leads to a product being price gouged, many hurt feelings (product does not even come close to meeting demand) and just leaves a bad taste in the mouths of people who didn't get it. ("What happens the next time they want to do this and they put stuff in here I want a lot?, Doesn't matter I won't be able to get this anyways.") Every other product they have ever produced, even the limited stuff, found a way to be accessible to players. I'm still certain that this is only for people who run stores/work in stores they are the target market for this. Outside of them people who got really really really lucky. And that really sucks for everyone else.
Watch Play Read
Twitter
And then there's this:
"This will be a limited print run product, meant for the collectors and the avid Commander players."
The last time I checked, I'm sure there were more avid Commander Players than Avid Collectors. For a product meant for both (explictly stated), it has less print than a From the Vault product? (Which well, was meant for "Avid Collectors, even if it does have a large Commander impact, wasn't core-designed for Commander).
WotC is mocking Commander, Its like saying there are only 4 Avid Commander Players in every "Top Seller" LGS out there.
If anything, something called Commander's Arsenal should be like a Deck Builder's Toolkit, coming with a random Commander pre-con and an assortment of one-ofs, a mass amount of cards that are not neccessary all valuable, but at an affordable price.
Good thing this is a one-of product, so my complaints stop here.
On a more positive note, they already admitted to scrambling this thing together last-second. They probably didn't want to spend a ton of money investing in a product that they weren't ultra-confident in. Yes, the limited print run is annoying but sucks to suck, they'll have BETTER and MORE INTERESTING products for Commander palyers as time goes on.
Also, I have a sneaking suspicion that they wouldn't commission new art for awesome old cards in a product that they had to hurry to make that would replace something like PDS. I smell a rat. Or maybe a new Sylvan Library in next year's Commander decks?:D
http://www.wizards.com/magic/magazine/article.aspx?x=mtg/daily/arcana/1035
If they chose to print a foil sylvan library in this set and include a nonfoil version in the next commander decks that would be pretty cool, but I doubt that will happen.
WBRG Saskia the Unyielding
WUB Sharuum the Hegemon
RWU Shu Yun, the Silent Tempest
RG Wort, the Raidmother
WU Brago, King Eternal
B Chainer, Dementia Master
Seriously... All we know so far is Sylvan Library and the extras (ie. the life counter, sleeves, etc.). People are going a bit overboard with the speculation, and (just like with every FTV) I'm going to bet that more people will be disappointed than blown away.
Thank you to Rivenor for this awesome banner!
Palladia-Mors of {The Spirit of EDH}
EDH
WLinvala, Queen of the AngelsW
WUThe Prison of the Grand ArbiterUW [Primer]
URNiv-Mizzet, Handcycling ComboRU
UTalrand, Drake-Slinging to VictoryU
WUGDerevi, Tactical ShufflingGUW
BCao Cao, Discard Stax of Absolute MiseryB
We also know there is a Foil Mimeoplasm and an oversized Azusa, Lost but Seeking as well.
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=4832736
Trading 10 full art zen basics for 8 of yours!
I want
Plains - John Avon - 230
Island - Jung Park - 235
Island - Vincent Proce - 237
Swamp - John Avon - 238
Mountain - John Avon - 242
Forest - John Avon - 246
RRR Khorenthos - The Red Block (Feedback needed!) RRR
Part of the reason for the way this product ended up being setup, is that it was an emergency replacement for the recently cut product line of the PDS's. They had a choice between putting out ... nothing ... or putting out something they could put together quickly and fit into their allready packed production/printing schedule. In this case, they decided on a 1-off specialty product with a nod towards the higher end of the commander crowd, with a higher than normal msrp, and limited availability (both due to what it was, and the time constraints), allowing them to put cooler and more valuable than normal stuff in them without as much worry of the impact the product would have on the market values of the contents (likely not as huge a concern, but likely to an extent.).
Ill admit that the huge limitation came as something of a shock when the final numbers where found out (4 for advanced stores), that currently the secondary market pre-sales prices on these are a bit insane ($300 on ebay I think for some of the last ones I saw sold as of a week ago?) For myself, Ive allready told the shop owner that Ill make him an offer he cannot refuse, so he would hand them over to me so I can just bust em open and sell them as singles to the large customer base of commander players, etc, that I have, which I think is the best option to make as many people happy as possible (including him) :p. Thankfully, future commander product will be more normal and have more normal availability, this was just a last-minute thrown-together product that ended up the way it did.
0 Karn
W Darien
U Arcanis
B Geth
R Norin
G Yeva
UW Hanna
RB Olivia
WB Obzedat
UR Melek
BG Glissa
WR Aurelia
GU Kraj
BRU Nicol Bolas
RGB Prossh
BGW Ghave
GUB Mimeoplasm
WUBRG Sliver Overlord
GWU Treva, the Renewer
EDH Spike:
U Azami, Lady of Scrolls
Trades