UGh, I'm really tired of complaining about this product... I think both points stand strong, but seriously, Give us a break WotC! This is coming off the heels of FTV REalms, another product directed towards collectors, and this is in even shorter supply?!? ??? They've got to be thinking 2nd print run, I know I am....
Second print run isn't something they've ever done with a limited product. Interesting idea though.
I don't understand your comments about the heels of FTV Realms. EDH players creamed themselves over that set this year. And it can readily be found for ~$75.
Don't get me wrong - I think them calling something an "Arsenal" and making it as exclusive as a space laser was maybe someones bad marketing decision - but it's WotC, what can you do?
(And I loved the PDS - still sad to see them go. What would have impressed me more would have been them doing the rest of the colors over a 1 year span and then discontinued it. PDS Lifelink? yep. PDS Ramp? Yep. PDS Control? Why not!?)
UGh, I'm really tired of complaining about this product...
Good, then please tell all of your other bored "complain about the limited print run" buddies to stop complaining too.
Seriously, "It's not fair that not everyone gets one?" "It's an elitist product for elitist people?" Cut me a damn break. I am FAR from an elitist player (unless we are talking pure gameplay/strategy), and as a Legacy player, I personally LOATHE collectors with a passion for the impact they have on the game. But you people have the freaking nads to call those fortunate enough to get this product "self-centered" and "selfish." REALLY?
Are you listening to yourselves speak? Rather; whine incessantly over something YOU can't have? That's near the epitome of a selfish act. You all sound like 6-year olds crying because your older sibling got the shiny cards and you have to deal with a non-curling, functionally identical card.
I am not buying this product. I am not attempting to. I wouldn't give a damn if they broke the Reserve List and put Bazaar of ****ing Baghdad in it. It isn't for me, I can accept that, and it seems like everyone who can't get their grubby hands on it simply can't accept that for no other purpose than "waahhhh I can't get this!"
Grow up, you hypocrites. Thus is life. Talk about "first-world problems."
So I heard from my LGS that they have been told they should 'price these agressively' since they will be in stupid high demand. Yep, while I have dibs on one, my shot at getting one seriously decreased.
Because it would have to have 4x Force of Will and 4x Cryptic Command or Sit on shelves for eternity.
ON the topic of availability of the product. It was pretty stupid to have them at a lower print run than FTV... But then again, anything WotC does doesn't compare to the stupidity of Games Workshop (ever shell out $150 for a board game? Mind you, most LGS only got 30 copies, and they sold pretty fast. For those who don't know what i'm talking about, Space Hulk, Not to mention the fact that they constantly abuse their customers by raising prices by an insane amount, when I started 40K codecii were 20$ a book, now they're 35, and still not hard cover, and still completely full of crap. Also, when a model is released at 60$, then just a year later, gets raised to 88$, and it doesn't cost them more to ship or produce it....)
end rant about GW/
Anyways, I'm going to wait and see what they put in this, IT's perfectly possible they won't put anything I need in this box (FOW, Wasteland, Academy Ruins, Tolarian Academy, etc.) However, if there is something I desperately need in the set, I'll buy it single, and i'm pretty sure I can get those sleeves for 3$ after release, because...They're Ultra Pro, so they MUST be pretty poor quality. (Even their Limited Edition sleeves tear up easily.)
I'm not crying that I can't have the set, I'm going to cry if they jack the price on the singles...
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Second print run isn't something they've ever done with a limited product. Interesting idea though.
I don't understand your comments about the heels of FTV Realms. EDH players creamed themselves over that set this year. And it can readily be found for ~$75.
Don't get me wrong - I think them calling something an "Arsenal" and making it as exclusive as a space laser was maybe someones bad marketing decision - but it's WotC, what can you do?
(And I loved the PDS - still sad to see them go. What would have impressed me more would have been them doing the rest of the colors over a 1 year span and then discontinued it. PDS Lifelink? yep. PDS Ramp? Yep. PDS Control? Why not!?)
There is a reason that most places aren't selling PDS for MSRP when someone who buys them turns around and breaks them open to resell to the store for profit. One guy came in our store and sold 20 sets of them to the store and made a killing.
To those who build Cubes / Commander decks, paying more for the product isn't cool but for people who buys / sells a lot of cards, I understand the need for a business to profit on the deal.
It would be incredibly ironic if Primeval Titan was one of the cards slated to be in this set...
I was just about to post this exact same thing lol. Prime Time is the only titan that was never given the foil treatment outside of the regular core set foil versions.
Can't wait to see the contents of this set.
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Look at my name...what did you expect?
Thank you WOTC for introducing the Modern format, a format where all the whiners can enjoy a level playing field and where they can play with none of the best cards of all time!
I was just about to post this exact same thing lol. Prime Time is the only titan that was never given the foil treatment outside of the regular core set foil versions.
Yeah, Frost Titan, Grave Titan, and Inferno Titan had DotP Promos and Sun Titan had a Prerelease Promo, but Primeval Titan has only had it's Coreset printings. And prior to the banning, (and the banning may not even change this) it was a heavily played card in Commander/EDH.
In the end, it's a win/win situatioon. Personally, I keep my copy for my collection. If others save it to sell for five times MSRP in a year or two, cool. They'll be able to afford more cards that way usually, and they're happy either way.
No, it's not win.
For greedy ***** it may be, but for the consumer it's decidedly LOSE.
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Nothing, the format Bores me! Legacy: RBurn (Made on the Cheap!)R RGBelcherRG WSoldier StompyW BReanimatorB EDH: BUGRWSliver OverlordWRGUB BGeth, Lord of the VaultB
Commanders arsonal is a cut on the roof of mtg's mouth, and this thread is a restless and hyperactive tongue.
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I fear I won't have much time to play Magic these days.
I get to watch worlds develop around me.
I get to watch great leaders, terrible oppressors, and trend setters rise and fall.
Limited, Standard, Modern, everything is a different playing field I feel I can observe, but will not actually touch.
I look forward to the stories I will hear.
And more so to the ones I will watch unfold first hand.
Isn't the unknown exciting?
The only true way to have good LGS'es being offered good deals is by doing stuff like the Helvault, but not in the crappy way it was executed. I'm referring to the Judge Gifts and useless oversized cards. If every store got the same promo prize thingy and every attendee got a nice promo card (hello full-art rares) and perhaps a 7-card booster (5 commons, 1 uncommon, 1 rare, NO mythic), THIS would be thé way to give the LGS'es something to stand out, not a sealed product that ends up on eBay after 10 minutes.
This would be COMPLETELY useless. Giving every store the same free stuff to give out doesn't make any store stand out, nor does it do anything to make the stores money. Yes, the latter is important. The latter is why FTV exists. It is not why this product exists, though, as it's clear that this product is being marketed at a very small segment of their audience. And while you may all complain, I can assure you that everyone that they have targeted with this product is thrilled. I've gone over this in great detail, but if you do not already know with 100% certainty that you are buying this, you are not part of that target demographic. If your answer is "I'd buy it if" or "I want it but" then you are not part of that target demographic.
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it's clear that this product is being marketed at a very small segment of their audience. And while you may all complain, I can assure you that everyone that they have targeted with this product is thrilled. I've gone over this in great detail, but if you do not already know with 100% certainty that you are buying this, you are not part of that target demographic. If your answer is "I'd buy it if" or "I want it but" then you are not part of that target demographic.
I disagree. I think that this product is being marketed at a much larger audience (EDH players) and that the vast majority of the targeted people are incredibly disappointed. The fact that they happen to have found a tiny alternate market for the product is purely an accident.
The marketing materials make it clear that this was intended to be targeted at avid commander players. this product has, however, entirely missed that target and hit something else.
bLatch, don't concern yourself with what was said, look at what was done.
This is targeted at EDH players who love to spend a lot of money to pimp out their decks. Period.
What? Going by the product they are coming out with, this wouldn't be targeted at EDH players at all. It's targetted at ZOMG super collectors who have everything mint, in box and never touch it for fear that it will lose value.
What? Going by the product they are coming out with, this wouldn't be targeted at EDH players at all. It's targetted at ZOMG super collectors who have everything mint, in box and never touch it for fear that it will lose value.
I preordered one of these, and I plan on opening it and playing with the cards and using the sleeves and the life counter. Don't really care about the oversized generals, though.
I preordered one of these, and I plan on opening it and playing with the cards and using the sleeves and the life counter. Don't really care about the oversized generals, though.
The stupid part about this product is that most people who want this and are willing to buy it can't because of the limited supply so we're going to have to fight one another on eBay to get one.
Translation: I've repeated myself and ignored critics.
but if you do not already know with 100% certainty that you are buying this, you are not part of that target demographic. If your answer is "I'd buy it if" or "I want it but" then you are not part of that target demographic.
Oh, so you're devolved in tautology territory now for your arguments? "The product is for people who buy the product." Great reasoning!
In all honesty, I'm not sure why I'm posting in this thread again and espcially responding to another one of your astounding claims in particular. Must be bored.
So, my local store said they talked to there rep, and that it is 2 or 4 units, but each unit is 2 boxes, so the actual numbers are 4 to 16. This is just a word of mouth though. Just thought I would share.
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"It's like some kind of Voltron... made of elephants??"
How is the targeted demographic for this audience thrilled for the product when the overwhelming majority of them won't be able to purchase them? Unless you truly believe every local game shop only has 2-4 players who enjoy pimping out their decks with foil cards which would be a grievous error.
Nothing in this game is degenerate or completely dominant. They haven't banned anything in standard in a long, long time. Hell they should have banned affinity right away, but they didn't until boxed sales collapsed too. Hasbro had to come in and fire people.
I'll enjoy watching all the whiners eat crow monday.
So, my local store said they talked to there rep, and that it is 2 or 4 units, but each unit is 2 boxes, so the actual numbers are 4 to 16. This is just a word of mouth though. Just thought I would share.
This honestly makes far more sense than the 2-4 individual units per store that's been tossed around, and I wouldn't be at all surprised if it turned out to be true. Not sure how you got at 4-16, but either way, I expect the numbers to be greater than the 2-4 that was the previously accepted distribution.
The product info sheet sent to dealers specifically mentioned cases, and amount of units per case (I think it was 4?); there just wasn't a UPC or price per case listed.
It's amazing and quite funny how this thread just cycles itself over and over..
'too expensive' -> 'amount of units' -> 'elitist product' -> 'too expensive' -> etc, etc..
Edit: Oh, and a unit is just one Commander's Arsenal.. Confirmed. So 2-4 CA per shop. Browse back a few pages
AND: some guys here missed some math classes in elementary school.
So, my local store said they talked to there rep, and that it is 2 or 4 units, but each unit is 2 boxes, so the actual numbers are 4 to 16. This is just a word of mouth though. Just thought I would share.
I really hope this is the case...
and 4 x 2 is 8.
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I am petitioning for the removal of mythic rarity. Sig this to join the cause! I am petitioning for the removal of the reserved list. Sig this to join the cause!
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Second print run isn't something they've ever done with a limited product. Interesting idea though.
I don't understand your comments about the heels of FTV Realms. EDH players creamed themselves over that set this year. And it can readily be found for ~$75.
Don't get me wrong - I think them calling something an "Arsenal" and making it as exclusive as a space laser was maybe someones bad marketing decision - but it's WotC, what can you do?
(And I loved the PDS - still sad to see them go. What would have impressed me more would have been them doing the rest of the colors over a 1 year span and then discontinued it. PDS Lifelink? yep. PDS Ramp? Yep. PDS Control? Why not!?)
Good, then please tell all of your other bored "complain about the limited print run" buddies to stop complaining too.
Seriously, "It's not fair that not everyone gets one?" "It's an elitist product for elitist people?" Cut me a damn break. I am FAR from an elitist player (unless we are talking pure gameplay/strategy), and as a Legacy player, I personally LOATHE collectors with a passion for the impact they have on the game. But you people have the freaking nads to call those fortunate enough to get this product "self-centered" and "selfish." REALLY?
Are you listening to yourselves speak? Rather; whine incessantly over something YOU can't have? That's near the epitome of a selfish act. You all sound like 6-year olds crying because your older sibling got the shiny cards and you have to deal with a non-curling, functionally identical card.
I am not buying this product. I am not attempting to. I wouldn't give a damn if they broke the Reserve List and put Bazaar of ****ing Baghdad in it. It isn't for me, I can accept that, and it seems like everyone who can't get their grubby hands on it simply can't accept that for no other purpose than "waahhhh I can't get this!"
Grow up, you hypocrites. Thus is life. Talk about "first-world problems."
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WBG Karador, Ghost Chieftan WBG
B Korlash, Heir to Blackblade B
RU Tibor and Lumia RU
'He tasks me! He tasks me, and I shall have him!' - Khan Noonien Singh
Because it would have to have 4x Force of Will and 4x Cryptic Command or Sit on shelves for eternity.
ON the topic of availability of the product. It was pretty stupid to have them at a lower print run than FTV... But then again, anything WotC does doesn't compare to the stupidity of Games Workshop (ever shell out $150 for a board game? Mind you, most LGS only got 30 copies, and they sold pretty fast. For those who don't know what i'm talking about, Space Hulk, Not to mention the fact that they constantly abuse their customers by raising prices by an insane amount, when I started 40K codecii were 20$ a book, now they're 35, and still not hard cover, and still completely full of crap. Also, when a model is released at 60$, then just a year later, gets raised to 88$, and it doesn't cost them more to ship or produce it....)
end rant about GW/
Anyways, I'm going to wait and see what they put in this, IT's perfectly possible they won't put anything I need in this box (FOW, Wasteland, Academy Ruins, Tolarian Academy, etc.) However, if there is something I desperately need in the set, I'll buy it single, and i'm pretty sure I can get those sleeves for 3$ after release, because...They're Ultra Pro, so they MUST be pretty poor quality. (Even their Limited Edition sleeves tear up easily.)
I'm not crying that I can't have the set, I'm going to cry if they jack the price on the singles...
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There is a reason that most places aren't selling PDS for MSRP when someone who buys them turns around and breaks them open to resell to the store for profit. One guy came in our store and sold 20 sets of them to the store and made a killing.
To those who build Cubes / Commander decks, paying more for the product isn't cool but for people who buys / sells a lot of cards, I understand the need for a business to profit on the deal.
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I was just about to post this exact same thing lol. Prime Time is the only titan that was never given the foil treatment outside of the regular core set foil versions.
Can't wait to see the contents of this set.
Thank you WOTC for introducing the Modern format, a format where all the whiners can enjoy a level playing field and where they can play with none of the best cards of all time!
Yeah, Frost Titan, Grave Titan, and Inferno Titan had DotP Promos and Sun Titan had a Prerelease Promo, but Primeval Titan has only had it's Coreset printings. And prior to the banning, (and the banning may not even change this) it was a heavily played card in Commander/EDH.
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Haha, yeah! Guys, here is your premium version of Primeval Titan to use in your EDH games. Ops, the card is banned? Oh well...
No, it's not win.
For greedy ***** it may be, but for the consumer it's decidedly LOSE.
Currently Playing:
Standard:
Nothing, the format Bores me!
Legacy:
RBurn (Made on the Cheap!)R
RGBelcherRG
WSoldier StompyW
BReanimatorB
EDH:
BUGRWSliver OverlordWRGUB
BGeth, Lord of the VaultB
I get to watch great leaders, terrible oppressors, and trend setters rise and fall.
Limited, Standard, Modern, everything is a different playing field I feel I can observe, but will not actually touch.
I look forward to the stories I will hear.
And more so to the ones I will watch unfold first hand.
Isn't the unknown exciting?
This would be COMPLETELY useless. Giving every store the same free stuff to give out doesn't make any store stand out, nor does it do anything to make the stores money. Yes, the latter is important. The latter is why FTV exists. It is not why this product exists, though, as it's clear that this product is being marketed at a very small segment of their audience. And while you may all complain, I can assure you that everyone that they have targeted with this product is thrilled. I've gone over this in great detail, but if you do not already know with 100% certainty that you are buying this, you are not part of that target demographic. If your answer is "I'd buy it if" or "I want it but" then you are not part of that target demographic.
Wizards could put $100 bills in packs and people would complain about how they were folded.
http://www.twitter.com/Dr_Jeebus - Follow me on Twitter!
Check out www.mtgbrodeals.com for daily content from the brothers of Mu Tau Gamma!
I disagree. I think that this product is being marketed at a much larger audience (EDH players) and that the vast majority of the targeted people are incredibly disappointed. The fact that they happen to have found a tiny alternate market for the product is purely an accident.
The marketing materials make it clear that this was intended to be targeted at avid commander players. this product has, however, entirely missed that target and hit something else.
This is targeted at EDH players who love to spend a lot of money to pimp out their decks. Period.
Ux Whirza
Rb Goblins
Legacy
U Urza Stompy
Duel Commander
Sai, Master Thopterist
What? Going by the product they are coming out with, this wouldn't be targeted at EDH players at all. It's targetted at ZOMG super collectors who have everything mint, in box and never touch it for fear that it will lose value.
I preordered one of these, and I plan on opening it and playing with the cards and using the sleeves and the life counter. Don't really care about the oversized generals, though.
Congratulations on being one of the lucky few?
Translation: I've repeated myself and ignored critics.
Oh, so you're devolved in tautology territory now for your arguments? "The product is for people who buy the product." Great reasoning!
In all honesty, I'm not sure why I'm posting in this thread again and espcially responding to another one of your astounding claims in particular. Must be bored.
Credit goes to Brofoux for the Sig pic.
Current Modern Deck
Black Licorice
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?p=11006564#post11006564
Who's eating crow?
This honestly makes far more sense than the 2-4 individual units per store that's been tossed around, and I wouldn't be at all surprised if it turned out to be true. Not sure how you got at 4-16, but either way, I expect the numbers to be greater than the 2-4 that was the previously accepted distribution.
The product info sheet sent to dealers specifically mentioned cases, and amount of units per case (I think it was 4?); there just wasn't a UPC or price per case listed.
meat's Trade Corner
Credit goes to Brofoux for the Sig pic.
Current Modern Deck
Black Licorice
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?p=11006564#post11006564
'too expensive' -> 'amount of units' -> 'elitist product' -> 'too expensive' -> etc, etc..
Edit: Oh, and a unit is just one Commander's Arsenal.. Confirmed. So 2-4 CA per shop. Browse back a few pages
AND: some guys here missed some math classes in elementary school.
I really hope this is the case...
and 4 x 2 is 8.
I am petitioning for the removal of mythic rarity. Sig this to join the cause!
I am petitioning for the removal of the reserved list. Sig this to join the cause!