How does this hose undying? Are people expecting to spend 6 mana to make their opponent's Messenger an 8/7?
Cast murder on messenger, while murder is on the stack pop something with this mechanic (if this is the mechanic, you can be sure there's a card that gives one +1/+1 counter for much cheaper). Messenger gets the counters the promptly dies.
Note - I'm not advocating this, just saying that's how it would work afaik.
This is the card for the release week. Also, I paraphrased the reminder text. So it may not be 100% accurate.
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"A card is considered functionally identical to another card if it has the same card type, subtypes, abilities, mana cost, power, and toughness." - Wizards of the Coast Official Reprint Policy
Cast murder on messenger, while murder is on the stack pop something with this mechanic (if this is the mechanic, you can be sure there's a card that gives one +1/+1 counter for much cheaper). Messenger gets the counters the promptly dies.
Note - I'm not advocating this, just saying that's how it would work afaik.
But the mechanic says that it can only be used as a sorcery...
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Cast murder on messenger, while murder is on the stack pop something with this mechanic (if this is the mechanic, you can be sure there's a card that gives one +1/+1 counter for much cheaper). Messenger gets the counters the promptly dies.
Note - I'm not advocating this, just saying that's how it would work afaik.
It's sorcery speed only, so that doesn't work. Granted, you can put the counter on the Messenger first, but that still seems really terrible. I understand logistically how putting counters on your opponent's creatures stops them from undying, but I meant how does it hose it in a non-kitchen table/terrible way.
because we know how many */* creatures are in RTR right?
or what the other mechanics do right?
There are 104 creatures in the game with a power or toughness defining CDA. There are 6620 creatures in the game. That qualifies as few and far between.
While there could be a higher-than-average number of CDA set creatures, it's not really a hole in my reasoning.
I'm disappointed that the Golgari mechanic isn't more unique, but it doesn't seem unplayable, at least. It does have hilarious synergy with Jarad, at least.
It's sorcery speed only, so that doesn't work. Granted, you can put the counter on the Messenger first, but that still seems really terrible. I understand logistically how putting counters on your opponent's creatures stops them from undying, but I meant how does it hose it in a non-kitchen table/terrible way.
Ah, yeah you're right. Well, like I initially said, I'm not really giving much of a look at this until it's proved legitimate. I've seen far too many fakes the past few days (some even taken straight from my photobucket of custom cards) to not be skeptical.
But well, its not crazy cool, but kinda feels like Reinforce, which was decent but just like making way too much "tricks" for limited, pretty much meaningless in constructed.
OK, this is a bit closer to how I feel about this mechanic.
Dredge was innovative. This really isn't.
Yes, but RnD, and many players describe dredge as 'not magic'.
A mechanic doesn't need to be 'innovative' to be good.
This gives extra value out of dead dudes, and encourages self-mill.
That said, there are MANY places to upload pictures, its kind of a peeve that a thread would be created without them.
Imgur
Twitter
Facebook
Text to someone who can upload
etc
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Today (Wednesday - Gen Con Indy 2012, Trade Day) from 1:00 PM to 3:00 PM, Wizards of the Coast ran the presentation 'Go Beyond the Game with the Wizards Play Network' and was hosted by Richard Dracass, Trade Marketing Team Manager and Helene Bergeot, Director of Organized Play Programs & Operations.
If we ask nicely, perhaps Helene might post an image to her Twitter.
"A card is considered functionally identical to another card if it has the same card type, subtypes, abilities, mana cost, power, and toughness." - Wizards of the Coast Official Reprint Policy
OK, this is a bit closer to how I feel about this mechanic.
Dredge was innovative. This really isn't.
Yup. All it does is make dudes bigger, which is certainly Green, but it's not interesting. It gives your dudes more value which is always nice, but it feels kinda safe, ya know?
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I'm very skeptical that they'd print a 5/5 for 2GG with no drawback and a powerful upside.
So I'd say either missing something or fake.
I like the mechanic, but I wouldn't call it a powerful upside. Just graveyard usefulness. As for a 5/5 for 2gg, that is pretty consistent with trying to get green critters above the curve p/t.
Thanks for putting up the picture much more believable now, although the picture is fuzzy. Honestly I can only make out 5/5 for 2gg and an ability as well as the golgari symbol.
This upsets me mostly because both revealed guild mechanics seem to interact strictly with creatures. (Populate and now Scavenge) Dredge and Convoke both were abilities with a fair amount of flexibility to them. Sure, just like their precursors, you can slap these abilities on pretty much any card...but they ONLY really seem to synergize with creatures.
Don't be too hasty, we've seen only two guilds out of five. Selesnya the token would have been seriously lame if they didn't have a token creature keyword. And Golgari, the graveyard guild right on the heals of a graveyard centered block, flash back is tapped out and they didn't want to use returning mechanics so that leaves out dredge (which means people are going to be initially disappointed with Golgari anyways and they know it). The most open design space that exists in the graveyard (that has the a mulching life from death flavor) is on creatures so that's not a surprise.
When you see Izzet, that's when you're going to see an exciting, flexible, not creature centric mechanic. Azorius and Rakdos may also excite you.
In the same way you can tell someone is from the XVIII century because he is arroused by ankles, you can tell someone is from USA because he feels nipples disturbing.
Yeah sorry about the lack of photos. First time I got something like this at a show as opposed to the store where I can scan or immediately get a picture up.
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"A card is considered functionally identical to another card if it has the same card type, subtypes, abilities, mana cost, power, and toughness." - Wizards of the Coast Official Reprint Policy
I think I was thinking of a weird scenario that came up in CCC instead. Derp.
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Cast murder on messenger, while murder is on the stack pop something with this mechanic (if this is the mechanic, you can be sure there's a card that gives one +1/+1 counter for much cheaper). Messenger gets the counters the promptly dies.
Note - I'm not advocating this, just saying that's how it would work afaik.
My custom sets:
Caeia Block (Released - Beta)
Generals of Dareth (In Design)
because we know how many */* creatures are in RTR right?
or what the other mechanics do right?
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But the mechanic says that it can only be used as a sorcery...
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OK, this is a bit closer to how I feel about this mechanic.
Dredge was innovative. This really isn't.
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It's sorcery speed only, so that doesn't work. Granted, you can put the counter on the Messenger first, but that still seems really terrible. I understand logistically how putting counters on your opponent's creatures stops them from undying, but I meant how does it hose it in a non-kitchen table/terrible way.
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There are 104 creatures in the game with a power or toughness defining CDA. There are 6620 creatures in the game. That qualifies as few and far between.
While there could be a higher-than-average number of CDA set creatures, it's not really a hole in my reasoning.
Lyzolda, the Blood Witch | Maga, Traitor to Mortals | Mayael the Anima | Rafiq of the Many | Rhys the Redeemed
Sasaya, Oorochi Ascendant | Sygg, River Cutthroat | Thada Adel, Acquisitor | Ulamog, the Infinite Gyre
Ah, yeah you're right. Well, like I initially said, I'm not really giving much of a look at this until it's proved legitimate. I've seen far too many fakes the past few days (some even taken straight from my photobucket of custom cards) to not be skeptical.
My custom sets:
Caeia Block (Released - Beta)
Generals of Dareth (In Design)
But well, its not crazy cool, but kinda feels like Reinforce, which was decent but just like making way too much "tricks" for limited, pretty much meaningless in constructed.
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Yes, but RnD, and many players describe dredge as 'not magic'.
A mechanic doesn't need to be 'innovative' to be good.
This gives extra value out of dead dudes, and encourages self-mill.
That said, there are MANY places to upload pictures, its kind of a peeve that a thread would be created without them.
Imgur
Twitter
Facebook
Text to someone who can upload
etc
Twitter
So I'd say either missing something or fake.
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Draft: (#1) (#2) (#3) (#4) (#5)
Today (Wednesday - Gen Con Indy 2012, Trade Day) from 1:00 PM to 3:00 PM, Wizards of the Coast ran the presentation 'Go Beyond the Game with the Wizards Play Network' and was hosted by Richard Dracass, Trade Marketing Team Manager and Helene Bergeot, Director of Organized Play Programs & Operations.
If we ask nicely, perhaps Helene might post an image to her Twitter.
~
Yup. All it does is make dudes bigger, which is certainly Green, but it's not interesting. It gives your dudes more value which is always nice, but it feels kinda safe, ya know?
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--- Drana, Kalastria Bloodchief --- Ghoulcaller Gisa --- Akroma, Angel of Fury --- Titania, Protector of Argoth ---
Attached it here for you.
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I like the mechanic, but I wouldn't call it a powerful upside. Just graveyard usefulness. As for a 5/5 for 2gg, that is pretty consistent with trying to get green critters above the curve p/t.
Watchwolf, Leatherback Baloth, even Young Wolf comes back as a 2/2
Garruk's Predators
Liliana's Corruption
Don't be too hasty, we've seen only two guilds out of five. Selesnya the token would have been seriously lame if they didn't have a token creature keyword. And Golgari, the graveyard guild right on the heals of a graveyard centered block, flash back is tapped out and they didn't want to use returning mechanics so that leaves out dredge (which means people are going to be initially disappointed with Golgari anyways and they know it). The most open design space that exists in the graveyard (that has the a mulching life from death flavor) is on creatures so that's not a surprise.
When you see Izzet, that's when you're going to see an exciting, flexible, not creature centric mechanic. Azorius and Rakdos may also excite you.
GModern Belcher
GGreen Deck Wins
3I'm the King
RBlazeTron
Yup, it's there! Seems like it'll be a useful mechanic in at least Limited.
Hahaha such a great point, poor poor jade leech.