The Premium Helvaults were randomized, per Helene Bergeot on twitter.
Ya know what would've been better than making them random? Making it so everyone got something worthwhile out of it, instead of the majority getting useless junk.
So you're upset *someone* opened better cards and/or you didn't open anything good from booster packs? Seriously? How in the hell is that WOTC's fault? I
Where you upset at Zendikar's Hidden Treasures, or SCG's Re-packs at their recent GP?
Jesus Christ... You never cease to dissapoint me, internet.
No.
EVERYONE gets a handful of commons, three uncommons, and a rare in a booster. 1/8th of all rares are mythic. Are you guaranteed a mythic every 8th booster? No, as the packs are randomly sorted. Are you guaranteed amazing/money uncommons/rares? No.
The previews for the Helvault event implied that epic **** was inside. No one expected that "all vaults are equal, but some vaults are more equal than others." Nowhere did WotC say that "Only 5% of Helvaults will have TOTALLY AWESOME **** IN THEM OMGWTFBBQ; the rest have meh stuff. Good luck finding the worthwhile vaults lolololololol." I would have been fine if they literally stated that.
Did WotC lie to those that got meh Helvaults? Not technically. Did they rip off the people that got meh Helvaults? Not technically. Did they withhold the full truth from everyone? Yup.
The problem with defining this format by what is "fun" is that everyone seems to define fun as what they don't lose to. If you keep losing to easily answered cards, that means you should improve your deck. If you don't want to improve your deck, then you should come to peace with the idea that you are going to lose because you chose to not interact with better strategies.
The Premium Helvaults were randomized, per Helene Bergeot on twitter.
Also important to note that she said NO judge foil promos were put into the helvault. So the first guy may have been trolling, and then it just happened to be true?
Quote from HeleneBergeot »
@xxxxxxxx No. Judge promos are for judges and therefore made available only to judges
Note, only Advanced WPN level stores have the possiblity of a "premium helvault"
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Also important to note that she said NO judge foil promos were put into the helvault. So the first guy may have been trolling, and then it just happened to be true?
Note, only Advanced WPN level stores have the possiblity of a "premium helvault"
She misunderstood the question. She clarified later that judge promos were inserted.
I'm glad some people got good stuff. In fact when I found out that they were doing this, it made opening the Helvault exciting again. I was disappointed, yes, but for a few hours there, I was once again gleaming at the idea that there was the potential to get something totally awesome out of it.
I'm actually kinda glad ours didn't have anything special as my LGS overbooked and then kept going, we had 70 players, and distributing that kind of stuff would have been a pain.
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"I've always been a fan of reality by popular vote" - Stephen Colbert (in response to Don McLeroy)
That's definitely a picture of my Helvault, I put Avacyn there.
You shoulda gone to Dragon's Lair.
Maybe tomorrow. Anyone want to venture the odds of of a TO getting 2 Premium Helvaults?
And just to confirm. Everyone at Dlair got Foil Oversized Promos, Foil Textless *** Promos, Foil Angel Token Promos, and a AVR Spindown Life Counter at the event?
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Top 64 Legacy Open SCG: Dallas/FortWorth 2013
SCG Open Trial (2013): 1st
There were three foil promotions: the tokens, the oversized cards, and the judge foils.
Put ten of any one class into each Helvault, with instructions to distribute one set of five to the first five people to open a tab, and the other set to the top 4 and a random.
75% of the Helvaults contain 10x foil tokens in addition to its normal complement. 23% contain the oversized foils, and the remainder contain the nuts. The percentages are just a rough sketch - but you get the idea.
Every Helvault has something nice for the players, you distribute a similar amount of product, and who's going to complain? Even though the store I play at ran max Zendikar prereleases, with between 25-50 people, and didn't get a hidden treasure, we had gotten calls in from players at other stores in the area who did. We had people coming just hoping to be the guy at this store to open one.
In addition, as I mentioned before, they didn't really incentivize the players to fill out the cards. Considering some of the things we were asked to do, and the fact that some players' decks actually could not complete individual tasks, which would void out their chance to complete certain boxes and get to open a seal - seals which the stores were told to open regardless of whether or not we bothered - could you give us a nice little trinket for doing all this stuff? At my store, they basically became coasters... We had one player playing in his first prerelease; once one person figured it out, he announced it, and one other player introduced himself to the first-timer by yelling from the other side of the store.
They shouldn't have to give us a reason. But, it would be nice, and a hell of a lot better than what they actually did to the people who matter - THE PLAYERS.
EDIT: I think a good analogy for the difference between the hidden treasures and the Helvault is the difference between 100 normal slot machines and 100 slot machines with 99 rigged to lose and 1 rigged to win. Hope you stepped up to the right machine.
Maybe tomorrow. Anyone want to venture the odds of of a TO getting 2 Premium Helvaults?
And just to confirm. Everyone at Dlair got Foil Oversized Promos, Foil Textless *** Promos, Foil Angel Token Promos, and a AVR Spindown Life Counter at the event?
Yep. And there were enough of the foil Angel/Demon token promos that we all got two of them.
Note, only Advanced WPN level stores have the possiblity of a "premium helvault"
Source? Not only does that treat these WPN stores like crap (if you do xyz, your business MIGHT get our good ****), but it also leaves a sour taste in the mouths of people who didn't know whether their store was a WPN store or not. That can't be true, as it's the worst marketing idea ever.
Yep. And there were enough of the foil Angel/Demon token promos that we all got two of them.
Yep. There were two packs of the foil tokens so everybody got two. I think they only took 48 people for the event instead of 54, but they didn't give out any of the extras.
Source? Not only does that treat these WPN stores like crap (if you do xyz, your business MIGHT get our good ****), but it also leaves a sour taste in the mouths of people who didn't know whether their store was a WPN store or not. That can't be true, as it's the worst marketing idea ever.
Helene Bergeot's Twitter
Here is a quote, "Stores that received a Premium Helvault were chosen at random among WPN Advanced stores"
I attended a Core WPN Pre-Release and knew to expect the normal promotional items. I probably would have registered for DLair (as it is the most casual-Advanced store in town) if I had known only Advanced stores would have premium helvaults. And then I actually would have gotten the premium stuff.
Here is a quote, "Stores that received a Premium Helvault were chosen at random among WPN Advanced stores"
I attended a Core WPN Pre-Release and knew to expect the normal promotional items. I probably would have registered for DLair (as it is the friendliest Advanced store in town) if I had known only Advanced stores would have premium helvaults. And then I actually would have gotten the premium stuff.
Oh wow. That's like the worst (store) rewards program ever lol.
Nothing in this game is degenerate or completely dominant. They haven't banned anything in standard in a long, long time. Hell they should have banned affinity right away, but they didn't until boxed sales collapsed too. Hasbro had to come in and fire people.
I'll enjoy watching all the whiners eat crow monday.
They really should have just put foil Avacyns or Griselbrands in every vault. Or heck, just foil Emancipation angel + Demonic Taskmaster. Those are still playable and everyone would get the same (the boosters you open are already random).
I do know why they made 'all foil' vaults instead of just putting 5 or 6 foils in. Because can you imagine if there were only 5 foils? TO's would be lynched if they said 'first 5 to open a seal get them' or 'top 5 players' or something.
No, the helvault really should have something nice and small for everyone (playable) instead of the lucksacks getting cool stuff and the rest underwhelming.
It really was a cool idea, and it could have been amazing for everyone, but someone botched it up again, leaving 5% of the playerbase ecstatic and the others with a sour taste in their mouth.
The least they could have done is make all the oversized cards foils.
I don't even need a judge promo card, but the fact that some people have oversized foil gisela instead of regular oversized gisela like me makes me sad.
That being said, the dice were sweet and the vault was cool. Had lots of fun.:D
Although almost any other rare than the spear for the prerelease promo would have been better...
That is my opinion EXACTLY. I want a foil Bruna and a foil Angel token.
It is frustrating to imagine that their prices will be bizarre high on Ebay (if their owners want to sell them).
It wasn't my plan to show up on the prerelease today after playing the whole day yesterday. I'm afraid to go there, pay 10 extra bucks to my hellvault ticket and open another non-foil Hellvault.
This will be unbelievable frustrating.
is it me or is everyone (who is complaining) here acting like little kids in a playground...?
looking over the metaphorical wall and complaining about other people's grass being greener is frustrating to see. i come on this forum to find out about people's exciting times with prereleases and new cards... but this site (inevitably, it seems) is full of whiners and moaners.
honestly, it gets you down. i don't know any other site that's so negative nearly all of the time. what's the deal?
scrolling up through the comments it's all like "i got this but i wanted this... i want i want i want... blah blah blah"
why can't people just appreciate something that's free.. i mean jeez!
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I'm still a bit up in the air about these things being true, but still, everyone is still getting what they pay for honestly. The helvault is like the lottery, but still everyone is getting something. No everyone can get judge foils or full art promos. Unless the created new ones just for this and they would not be worth that much.
This, in my mind, is not that different from opening a booster pack. Sometimes you get great pulls, but most of the time the pulls are worth less than a pack.
If this is all true, it's a pretty cool way for some people to get nice cards.
Plains - John Avon - 230
Island - Jung Park - 235
Island - Vincent Proce - 237
Swamp - John Avon - 238
Mountain - John Avon - 242
Forest - John Avon - 246
is it me or is everyone (who is complaining) here acting like little kids in a playground...?
Nope it's not you. I think this will cool down once people see that this means that these promos are actually going to be fairly easy to find after this weekend depending on how many shops got them. I'm thrilled to be able to get foil judge promos for cheaper in the long run. There will be plenty of people willing to trade/sell these away come monday.
My only completely legit problem is that the player cap cause by Helvault tournaments will hurt larger shops and hurt their prize support for next prerelease.
Nope it's not you. I think this will cool down once people see that this means that these promos are actually going to be fairly easy to find after this weekend depending on how many shops got them. I'm thrilled to be able to get foil judge promos for cheaper in the long run. There will be plenty of people willing to trade/sell these away come monday.
My only completely legit problem is that the player cap cause by Helvault tournaments will hurt larger shops and hurt their prize support for next prerelease.
To be fair, if teachers on the playground gave one or two kids a huge box of cookies every day when the other kids got a little cracker, I think the kids would probably be complaining rightfully.
It's going to hurt smaller shops too. I don't know if the one I like going to is advanced any more. But I know another one is. Now do I have to go there just in case there's some randomly distributed stuff that's very valuable? Some of the rich just get richer with stuff like this.
is it me or is everyone (who is complaining) here acting like little kids in a playground...?
looking over the metaphorical wall and complaining about other people's grass being greener is frustrating to see. i come on this forum to find out about people's exciting times with prereleases and new cards... but this site (inevitably, it seems) is full of whiners and moaners.
honestly, it gets you down. i don't know any other site that's so negative nearly all of the time. what's the deal?
scrolling up through the comments it's all like "i got this but i wanted this... i want i want i want... blah blah blah"
why can't people just appreciate something that's free.. i mean jeez!
It may be free for you. In my hometown the stores are charging $10 more to play the Hellvault prerelease.
So I own the right to complain about it.
We didn't see any foils. Our store got 2 Helvaults and there were only a handful of people playing so everyone could have easily gotten everything from them. The store owner decided, instead, to distribute 1 die, one legend, and one token to everyone and ebay the rest. He didn't even bother cracking the second Helvault and said he's going to open it at a later time to sell its contents -.-
So it's official: Helvault is the worst piece of propaganda ever pulled by Wizards? I mean, most of its contents was pure crap that no one cares about (in my store what got people most excited was the dual tokens), but if you were lucky enough to go to an Advanced Store and that store was lucky to get an all-star helvault you'd get 30 dollars promos? Not only that, but some of the promos were JUDGE promos, meaning you're bringing down the value from the cards said judges own...
Really, this was so pathetic that it makes me regret going to Avacyn Restored prereleases, I should have boycotted that.
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Ya know what would've been better than making them random? Making it so everyone got something worthwhile out of it, instead of the majority getting useless junk.
UBBreya's Toybox (Competitive, Combo)WR
RGodzilla, King of the MonstersG
-Retired Decks-
UBLazav, Dimir Mastermind (Competitive, UB Voltron/Control)UB
"Knowledge is such a burden. Release it. Release all your fears to me."
—Ashiok, Nightmare Weaver
No.
EVERYONE gets a handful of commons, three uncommons, and a rare in a booster. 1/8th of all rares are mythic. Are you guaranteed a mythic every 8th booster? No, as the packs are randomly sorted. Are you guaranteed amazing/money uncommons/rares? No.
The previews for the Helvault event implied that epic **** was inside. No one expected that "all vaults are equal, but some vaults are more equal than others." Nowhere did WotC say that "Only 5% of Helvaults will have TOTALLY AWESOME **** IN THEM OMGWTFBBQ; the rest have meh stuff. Good luck finding the worthwhile vaults lolololololol." I would have been fine if they literally stated that.
Did WotC lie to those that got meh Helvaults? Not technically. Did they rip off the people that got meh Helvaults? Not technically. Did they withhold the full truth from everyone? Yup.
Just think of the Helvaults as oversized booster packs!
Some people get good stuff, others get jank.
It all makes sense, yo!
Also important to note that she said NO judge foil promos were put into the helvault. So the first guy may have been trolling, and then it just happened to be true?
Note, only Advanced WPN level stores have the possiblity of a "premium helvault"
Top 64 Legacy Open SCG: Dallas/FortWorth 2013
SCG Open Trial (2013): 1st
She misunderstood the question. She clarified later that judge promos were inserted.
EDH Decks:
RBG Kresh, the Bloodbraided RBG
GW Rhys, the Redeemed GW
Legacy:
RGW Enchantress RGW
That's definitely a picture of my Helvault, I put Avacyn there.
You shoulda gone to Dragon's Lair.
I'm actually kinda glad ours didn't have anything special as my LGS overbooked and then kept going, we had 70 players, and distributing that kind of stuff would have been a pain.
"I've always been a fan of reality by popular vote" - Stephen Colbert (in response to Don McLeroy)
GPolukranos, Kill ALL the Things!G
Maybe tomorrow. Anyone want to venture the odds of of a TO getting 2 Premium Helvaults?
And just to confirm. Everyone at Dlair got Foil Oversized Promos, Foil Textless *** Promos, Foil Angel Token Promos, and a AVR Spindown Life Counter at the event?
Top 64 Legacy Open SCG: Dallas/FortWorth 2013
SCG Open Trial (2013): 1st
There were three foil promotions: the tokens, the oversized cards, and the judge foils.
Put ten of any one class into each Helvault, with instructions to distribute one set of five to the first five people to open a tab, and the other set to the top 4 and a random.
75% of the Helvaults contain 10x foil tokens in addition to its normal complement. 23% contain the oversized foils, and the remainder contain the nuts. The percentages are just a rough sketch - but you get the idea.
Every Helvault has something nice for the players, you distribute a similar amount of product, and who's going to complain? Even though the store I play at ran max Zendikar prereleases, with between 25-50 people, and didn't get a hidden treasure, we had gotten calls in from players at other stores in the area who did. We had people coming just hoping to be the guy at this store to open one.
In addition, as I mentioned before, they didn't really incentivize the players to fill out the cards. Considering some of the things we were asked to do, and the fact that some players' decks actually could not complete individual tasks, which would void out their chance to complete certain boxes and get to open a seal - seals which the stores were told to open regardless of whether or not we bothered - could you give us a nice little trinket for doing all this stuff? At my store, they basically became coasters... We had one player playing in his first prerelease; once one person figured it out, he announced it, and one other player introduced himself to the first-timer by yelling from the other side of the store.
They shouldn't have to give us a reason. But, it would be nice, and a hell of a lot better than what they actually did to the people who matter - THE PLAYERS.
EDIT: I think a good analogy for the difference between the hidden treasures and the Helvault is the difference between 100 normal slot machines and 100 slot machines with 99 rigged to lose and 1 rigged to win. Hope you stepped up to the right machine.
The MirroCube - 420 card Mirrodin themed cube
And if I've offended you, I'm sorry, but maybe you need to be offended. But here's my apology and one more thing...
Yep. And there were enough of the foil Angel/Demon token promos that we all got two of them.
Source? Not only does that treat these WPN stores like crap (if you do xyz, your business MIGHT get our good ****), but it also leaves a sour taste in the mouths of people who didn't know whether their store was a WPN store or not. That can't be true, as it's the worst marketing idea ever.
Yep. There were two packs of the foil tokens so everybody got two. I think they only took 48 people for the event instead of 54, but they didn't give out any of the extras.
Helene Bergeot's Twitter
Here is a quote, "Stores that received a Premium Helvault were chosen at random among WPN Advanced stores"
I attended a Core WPN Pre-Release and knew to expect the normal promotional items. I probably would have registered for DLair (as it is the most casual-Advanced store in town) if I had known only Advanced stores would have premium helvaults. And then I actually would have gotten the premium stuff.
Top 64 Legacy Open SCG: Dallas/FortWorth 2013
SCG Open Trial (2013): 1st
Oh wow. That's like the worst (store) rewards program ever lol.
And the ones with the expensive promos also got the foil tokens? How the hell does that make sense?
This just pisses me off more.
Who's eating crow?
I do know why they made 'all foil' vaults instead of just putting 5 or 6 foils in. Because can you imagine if there were only 5 foils? TO's would be lynched if they said 'first 5 to open a seal get them' or 'top 5 players' or something.
No, the helvault really should have something nice and small for everyone (playable) instead of the lucksacks getting cool stuff and the rest underwhelming.
It really was a cool idea, and it could have been amazing for everyone, but someone botched it up again, leaving 5% of the playerbase ecstatic and the others with a sour taste in their mouth.
This great banner was made by Topher
That is my opinion EXACTLY. I want a foil Bruna and a foil Angel token.
It is frustrating to imagine that their prices will be bizarre high on Ebay (if their owners want to sell them).
It wasn't my plan to show up on the prerelease today after playing the whole day yesterday. I'm afraid to go there, pay 10 extra bucks to my hellvault ticket and open another non-foil Hellvault.
This will be unbelievable frustrating.
looking over the metaphorical wall and complaining about other people's grass being greener is frustrating to see. i come on this forum to find out about people's exciting times with prereleases and new cards... but this site (inevitably, it seems) is full of whiners and moaners.
honestly, it gets you down. i don't know any other site that's so negative nearly all of the time. what's the deal?
scrolling up through the comments it's all like "i got this but i wanted this... i want i want i want... blah blah blah"
why can't people just appreciate something that's free.. i mean jeez!
This, in my mind, is not that different from opening a booster pack. Sometimes you get great pulls, but most of the time the pulls are worth less than a pack.
If this is all true, it's a pretty cool way for some people to get nice cards.
http://forums.mtgsalvation.com/showthread.php?t=4832736
Trading 10 full art zen basics for 8 of yours!
I want
Plains - John Avon - 230
Island - Jung Park - 235
Island - Vincent Proce - 237
Swamp - John Avon - 238
Mountain - John Avon - 242
Forest - John Avon - 246
Nope it's not you. I think this will cool down once people see that this means that these promos are actually going to be fairly easy to find after this weekend depending on how many shops got them. I'm thrilled to be able to get foil judge promos for cheaper in the long run. There will be plenty of people willing to trade/sell these away come monday.
My only completely legit problem is that the player cap cause by Helvault tournaments will hurt larger shops and hurt their prize support for next prerelease.
To be fair, if teachers on the playground gave one or two kids a huge box of cookies every day when the other kids got a little cracker, I think the kids would probably be complaining rightfully.
It's going to hurt smaller shops too. I don't know if the one I like going to is advanced any more. But I know another one is. Now do I have to go there just in case there's some randomly distributed stuff that's very valuable? Some of the rich just get richer with stuff like this.
It may be free for you. In my hometown the stores are charging $10 more to play the Hellvault prerelease.
So I own the right to complain about it.
Really, this was so pathetic that it makes me regret going to Avacyn Restored prereleases, I should have boycotted that.