Cunning LethoMancer? Infest? Jund Charm? (It would mean a green splash, but could be usefull.
Course the other option is to go the Grixis route and run with Resounding Scream which, normally I wouldn't recommend, but with the fact that your opponent will be trying to hold on to cards, this might actually be supercycled sometimes.
Is Tar Fiend actually playable? if you go that route, is it worth including BB to get some tokens for it?
Personally, I'm still partial to the option of dropping Tidehollow Sculler on T2 with a multicoloured build. That would mean no blighting, no resounding scream, but open up Esper Charm. With the Charm available also comes the new UB counter spell.
Now... this is a weird call, but if you do go the Esper route then Bant Battlemage might help give Nyx evasion.
Cunning LethoMancer? Infest? Jund Charm? (It would mean a green splash, but could be usefull.
Course the other option is to go the Grixis route and run with Resounding Scream which, normally I wouldn't recommend, but with the fact that your opponent will be trying to hold on to cards, this might actually be supercycled sometimes.
Is Tar Fiend actually playable? if you go that route, is it worth including BB to get some tokens for it?
Personally, I'm still partial to the option of dropping Tidehollow Sculler on T2 with a multicoloured build. That would mean no blighting, no resounding scream, but open up Esper Charm. With the Charm available also comes the new UB counter spell.
Now... this is a weird call, but if you do go the Esper route then Bant Battlemage might help give Nyx evasion.
lol ideas were just flowing on this huh? Me, im a fan of mono color decks,
but i like the grixis and esper routes w/ nyx. Guess it wouldn't make much sense in Jund.
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~Intelligence is Bliss; Ignorance is Denial.
Skill is an ability that relates more so to the type of deck that's built and how said player pilots it. It also relates to the ability to assess the board and use the cards available to you in the most optimal way relative to each situation.
When a deck is filled with above par cards and every play is solid, there comes a diminishing need to "think" for the lack of wanting to use a better word.
Hmm, honestly i dont like Sculler. using him could turn into a method of owning your own attacking Nyx, (i.e. burn tidehollow, when Nyx attx then clear it.) Same w/ Lethemancer; i see no unearth or reanimation. Lethemancer could be a bad idea.
I rather play Oona and r-rats.
If you can find a replacement for Esper Charm you can drop W entirely. Countersquall ftw?
Lol, Nyx w/ the Muse on the field, your opponent wont know who to remove w/ that 1 card in hand.
Skill is an ability that relates more so to the type of deck that's built and how said player pilots it. It also relates to the ability to assess the board and use the cards available to you in the most optimal way relative to each situation.
When a deck is filled with above par cards and every play is solid, there comes a diminishing need to "think" for the lack of wanting to use a better word.
If we look to extended, this creature may have found his home in The Rock Death Cloud decks. Cards are almost nonexsitent in your opponent's hand with retracing Raven's Crime and busting a big Death Cloud..
wow, Wotc did a hell of a job stopping Instant discard, Esper Charm ftw i guess.
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~Intelligence is Bliss; Ignorance is Denial.
Skill is an ability that relates more so to the type of deck that's built and how said player pilots it. It also relates to the ability to assess the board and use the cards available to you in the most optimal way relative to each situation.
When a deck is filled with above par cards and every play is solid, there comes a diminishing need to "think" for the lack of wanting to use a better word.
I had debated Dream Salvag too. But I'm a little concernedd that the best you could hope for is UUWB, 2 cards, for draw 2, opponent discards two. Seems a little useless.
Errr whoever mentioned sedraxis specter should be shot...the only useful thing about that card is the unearth. Otherwise hypnotic specter FTW at least all old school players would go that route and having the discard at random is pretty much better than them taking 1 more damage and choosing a useless land to discard or something.
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"Yawgmoth," Freyalise whispered as she set the bomb, "now you will pay for your treachery."
I had debated Dream Salvag too. But I'm a little concernedd that the best you could hope for is UUWB, 2 cards, for draw 2, opponent discards two. Seems a little useless.
Umm.... Have you ever, ever, Ever heard of a single card with that ability?
in a control deck (UB, like dream salvage so flavorfully fits in) that is a good play. C'mon most draws for cost four and draw for crap *cough* insight *cough.*
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~Intelligence is Bliss; Ignorance is Denial.
Skill is an ability that relates more so to the type of deck that's built and how said player pilots it. It also relates to the ability to assess the board and use the cards available to you in the most optimal way relative to each situation.
When a deck is filled with above par cards and every play is solid, there comes a diminishing need to "think" for the lack of wanting to use a better word.
Yes, it's better than any one single card, that's true. but while Esper Charm is always good, Dream Salvage is only good if you have both it and the charm in your hand in the same turn. More, if you do have them both you're putting off playing Esper Charm for a turn just for the sake of the Dream Salvage.
Not that this is a bad play, just that you're giving up a known good play for a potentially better one. I personally would rather have the known quality.
@Barl: Wow, that was incredibly offensive. I should be shot because I listed all of the possible options that might be available in the current T2 environment? I had understood that this was an open discussion in which I could suggest idea for, well, discussion. You are 100% right... there are better options. But, in the same light there are better options than making death threats.
Yes, it's better than any one single card, that's true. but while Esper Charm is always good, Dream Salvage is only good if you have both it and the charm in your hand in the same turn. More, if you do have them both you're putting off playing Esper Charm for a turn just for the sake of the Dream Salvage.
Not that this is a bad play, just that you're giving up a known good play for a potentially better one. I personally would rather have the known quality.
@Barl: Wow, that was incredibly offensive. I should be shot because I listed all of the possible options that might be available in the current T2 environment? I had understood that this was an open discussion in which I could suggest idea for, well, discussion. You are 100% right... there are better options. But, in the same light there are better options than making death threats.
For cripes sakes, it's a discussion of a game.
well that's not a reason to 'not' run Salvage. in hard discard, salvage is good. 6 mana r-rats/pulling teeth, esper charm, and salvage is a sweet turn for you. You can even drop it post Oona attack discardation. <--- (more copyrighting, lol.)
Random thought: I miss delirium skeins and wistful thinking.
lol i thinl Bark was just using a hyperbole.
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~Intelligence is Bliss; Ignorance is Denial.
Skill is an ability that relates more so to the type of deck that's built and how said player pilots it. It also relates to the ability to assess the board and use the cards available to you in the most optimal way relative to each situation.
When a deck is filled with above par cards and every play is solid, there comes a diminishing need to "think" for the lack of wanting to use a better word.
Yeah, it probably was just hyperbole, it just caught me as being a little uncool rather than funny. Perhaps if he had just called it a really dumb suggestion I would have agreed.
For your point about the turn with r-rats/pulling teeth, espeer charm + salvage, it sounds like a fantastic idea. My only concern is that if you are playing discard, shouldn't your opponent already have an empty hand by the time this happens? (or at least no more than 1 or 2 cards in hand)?
Yeah, it probably was just hyperbole, it just caught me as being a little uncool rather than funny. Perhaps if he had just called it a really dumb suggestion I would have agreed.
For your point about the turn with r-rats/pulling teeth, espeer charm + salvage, it sounds like a fantastic idea. My only concern is that if you are playing discard, shouldn't your opponent already have an empty hand by the time this happens? (or at least no more than 1 or 2 cards in hand)?
true but making a good player discard 1 card a turn wont affect him/her much. somewhere along the lines theres gonna be a 2-3 discard play there. i've gotten salvage off in a four discard mind shatter before.
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~Intelligence is Bliss; Ignorance is Denial.
Skill is an ability that relates more so to the type of deck that's built and how said player pilots it. It also relates to the ability to assess the board and use the cards available to you in the most optimal way relative to each situation.
When a deck is filled with above par cards and every play is solid, there comes a diminishing need to "think" for the lack of wanting to use a better word.
In Regards to dream salvage:
First of all you can pretty much just cycle it pretty easily in a deck like this, second of all if they discard two cards in a turn which in the list I posted is really possible it would be really good. It still may not be that great but I definitely think it is a viable option to be tested at least.
Edit:
Oh yeah, and in regards to hippie, maybe play green for birds of paradise. And if your going to play with birds in green maybe play Doran, decklist:
So the manabase is a little shaky, and you wanna be pretty fast so maybe no Treetop Village and there are a lot of three drops. I think theres something here though.
Has everyone forgotten that Mind shatter on turn 4 or 5 in this proposed deck is mind twist and then they are living off the top and you can Raven's Crime the cards they keep to try to make him smaller. I have made discard decks since the game started and Mind Shatter is a copy of Mind Twist even with the extra black it will always come in and clean up an opponents remaining hand
Of note is that since the Nyx's ability is active in the graveyard, there may be times when you can pop the lark and get Nyx out, prior to smashing their hand.
It might be a little slower, but probably also more stable with the control elements.
What we're doing here is akin to taking the text of Moby Dick, locating specific words therein, rearranging them to create a passage from Fight Club, and concluding from this evidence that Tyler Durden is based on Ahab.
Okay, I stand corrected. Lark will never see Nyx... still, not the worst thing in the world. However, that did get me thinking. if we are talking about the potential R/B list for Nyx then is Flamekin Harbinger worth including?
Okay, I stand corrected. Lark will never see Nyx... still, not the worst thing in the world. However, that did get me thinking. if we are talking about the potential R/B list for Nyx then is Flamekin Harbinger worth including?
how would it be? Nyxathid is a Horror... at least according to the spoily it is... not an Elemental.
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"As the size of an explosion increases, the number of social situations it is incapable of solving approaches zero." -- Varsuvius, Order of the Stick
+4 Blightning. Worth adding red, in my opinion.
Infest?
Jund Charm? (It would mean a green splash, but could be usefull.
Course the other option is to go the Grixis route and run with Resounding Scream which, normally I wouldn't recommend, but with the fact that your opponent will be trying to hold on to cards, this might actually be supercycled sometimes.
Sedraxis Spectre
Is Tar Fiend actually playable? if you go that route, is it worth including BB to get some tokens for it?
Personally, I'm still partial to the option of dropping Tidehollow Sculler on T2 with a multicoloured build. That would mean no blighting, no resounding scream, but open up Esper Charm. With the Charm available also comes the new UB counter spell.
Now... this is a weird call, but if you do go the Esper route then Bant Battlemage might help give Nyx evasion.
lol ideas were just flowing on this huh? Me, im a fan of mono color decks,
but i like the grixis and esper routes w/ nyx. Guess it wouldn't make much sense in Jund.
Skill is an ability that relates more so to the type of deck that's built and how said player pilots it. It also relates to the ability to assess the board and use the cards available to you in the most optimal way relative to each situation.
When a deck is filled with above par cards and every play is solid, there comes a diminishing need to "think" for the lack of wanting to use a better word.
Hmm, honestly i dont like Sculler. using him could turn into a method of owning your own attacking Nyx, (i.e. burn tidehollow, when Nyx attx then clear it.) Same w/ Lethemancer; i see no unearth or reanimation. Lethemancer could be a bad idea.
I rather play Oona and r-rats.
If you can find a replacement for Esper Charm you can drop W entirely. Countersquall ftw?
Lol, Nyx w/ the Muse on the field, your opponent wont know who to remove w/ that 1 card in hand.
Lol.
Skill is an ability that relates more so to the type of deck that's built and how said player pilots it. It also relates to the ability to assess the board and use the cards available to you in the most optimal way relative to each situation.
When a deck is filled with above par cards and every play is solid, there comes a diminishing need to "think" for the lack of wanting to use a better word.
I'm a little worried about the 4cc mana base without pushing vivids in there.
Is Spectre the right call instead of the sceptre? Sceptre does have the activation cost, but can't be evaded.
Thanks to Spiderboy4 at High~Light Studios for the sig.
Skill is an ability that relates more so to the type of deck that's built and how said player pilots it. It also relates to the ability to assess the board and use the cards available to you in the most optimal way relative to each situation.
When a deck is filled with above par cards and every play is solid, there comes a diminishing need to "think" for the lack of wanting to use a better word.
4 Tidehollow Sculler
2 Ravenous Rats
2 Raven's Crime
4 Nyxathid
4 Bitter blossom
4 Esper Charm
3 Unmake
2 Terror
2 Profane command
2 Elspeth, Knight Errant
1 Dream Salvage
2 Ad Nauseum
--------------------------------------------
4 Mutavault
4 Caves of Koilos
4 Arcane Sanctum
3 Fetid Heath
4 Underground River
4 Swamp
1 Plains
1 Sunken Ruins
Other cards to think about: dusk urchins, Demigod of revenge
Currently Playing:
Retired
Umm.... Have you ever, ever, Ever heard of a single card with that ability?
in a control deck (UB, like dream salvage so flavorfully fits in) that is a good play. C'mon most draws for cost four and draw for crap *cough* insight *cough.*
Skill is an ability that relates more so to the type of deck that's built and how said player pilots it. It also relates to the ability to assess the board and use the cards available to you in the most optimal way relative to each situation.
When a deck is filled with above par cards and every play is solid, there comes a diminishing need to "think" for the lack of wanting to use a better word.
Not that this is a bad play, just that you're giving up a known good play for a potentially better one. I personally would rather have the known quality.
@Barl: Wow, that was incredibly offensive. I should be shot because I listed all of the possible options that might be available in the current T2 environment? I had understood that this was an open discussion in which I could suggest idea for, well, discussion. You are 100% right... there are better options. But, in the same light there are better options than making death threats.
For cripes sakes, it's a discussion of a game.
well that's not a reason to 'not' run Salvage. in hard discard, salvage is good. 6 mana r-rats/pulling teeth, esper charm, and salvage is a sweet turn for you. You can even drop it post Oona attack discardation. <--- (more copyrighting, lol.)
Random thought: I miss delirium skeins and wistful thinking.
lol i thinl Bark was just using a hyperbole.
Skill is an ability that relates more so to the type of deck that's built and how said player pilots it. It also relates to the ability to assess the board and use the cards available to you in the most optimal way relative to each situation.
When a deck is filled with above par cards and every play is solid, there comes a diminishing need to "think" for the lack of wanting to use a better word.
For your point about the turn with r-rats/pulling teeth, espeer charm + salvage, it sounds like a fantastic idea. My only concern is that if you are playing discard, shouldn't your opponent already have an empty hand by the time this happens? (or at least no more than 1 or 2 cards in hand)?
true but making a good player discard 1 card a turn wont affect him/her much. somewhere along the lines theres gonna be a 2-3 discard play there. i've gotten salvage off in a four discard mind shatter before.
Skill is an ability that relates more so to the type of deck that's built and how said player pilots it. It also relates to the ability to assess the board and use the cards available to you in the most optimal way relative to each situation.
When a deck is filled with above par cards and every play is solid, there comes a diminishing need to "think" for the lack of wanting to use a better word.
First of all you can pretty much just cycle it pretty easily in a deck like this, second of all if they discard two cards in a turn which in the list I posted is really possible it would be really good. It still may not be that great but I definitely think it is a viable option to be tested at least.
Edit:
Oh yeah, and in regards to hippie, maybe play green for birds of paradise. And if your going to play with birds in green maybe play Doran, decklist:
4 Birds of Paradise
2 Noble Hierarch <--- Creates White and Green.
4 Tidehollow Sculler
3 Nyxathid
3 Hypnotic Specter
3 Doran, the Seige Tower
2 Raven's Crime
4 Thoughtsieze
4 Bitter blossom
4 Nameless Inversion
3 Garruk Wildspeaker
--------------------------------------------
4 Caves of Koilos
4 Murmuring Bosk" target="blank">Murmuring Bosk
2 Fetid Heath
4 Llanowar Wastes" target="blank">Llanowar Wastes
4 Brushland
2 Twilight Mire
4 Forest
So the manabase is a little shaky, and you wanna be pretty fast so maybe no Treetop Village and there are a lot of three drops. I think theres something here though.
4 Tidehallow Sculler
4 Hypnotic Specter
3 Nyxathid
3 Revillark
4 Mulldrifter
2 Raven's Crime
2 Mind Shatter
4 Esper Charm
3 Bitter Blossom
3 Wrath of God
4 Thoughtseize
3 Makeshift Mannequin
4 Fetid Heath
2 Swamp
1 Underground River
1 Adarkar Waste
4 Reflecting Pool
4 Caves of Koilos
3 Vivid Marsh
4 Arcane Sanctum
Of note is that since the Nyx's ability is active in the graveyard, there may be times when you can pop the lark and get Nyx out, prior to smashing their hand.
It might be a little slower, but probably also more stable with the control elements.
However, I think I'd like to see 1 more Shatter.
Since when? Abilities apply while the card is in play, unless otherwise stated.
Guildmaster Jarad
It's not a characteristic-setting ability, though.
And even if it were, the chosen opponent would be undefined while in the GY.
Practice for Khans of Tarkir Limited:
Draft: (#1) (#2) (#3) (#4) (#5)
how would it be? Nyxathid is a Horror... at least according to the spoily it is... not an Elemental.