I would be very disappointed if wizards coped out and used direct characters or stories, even if theros has a story arc that doesn't thrill me, i would still prefer a meh orginal lore over recycled lore.
But getting back to the topic, a legendary hero cycle would be awesome, i would love a flood of legendaries i think it'd be helpful to creative deck building, it would challenge players to not auto include four of a good card.
So I've been working on a Magic fanfic in a Greek Myth based plane since August.
Two mechanics I've came up with for it are Intoxicate Cost and Instinct [snip]
This isn't the place for custom card creation, and you are aware that wizards isn't going to use your mechanics.
-B
... I'd actually kind of like the same thing from Theros I hope will show up in every block as a big feature: Aven.
I love merfolk, I was known for a merfolk deck among my friends at one point... but I cut my teeth playing on the Aven. I thought that they made MUCH more sense for the role that the merfolk filled in Zendikar and I'd like to see them again here though I doubt they'll make an appearance.
Well Zendikar was the first block after they decided it was okay for merfolk to have legs, so they were testing the waters (heh) with that to see what sort of things mechanically and artistically they could do with that.
They import characters from Greek mythology, even keeping the same name. For example, printing a Zeus card.
They make their own characters, but they are still based on specific figures from Greek mythology. For example, from Innistrad, Civilized Scholar is Dr. Jekyll.
They make their own characters that are obviously inspired by Greek mythology, but there's no one-to-one correspondence.
No way #1 is true since they haven't done it since...Arabian Nights? Maybe Legends? #2 is possible, I guess, but if you have a card named "Xeus, Master of Okympus", what's the point, really? Just call him Zeus and be done with it. So #3 has to be correct.
An awesome mechanic that shows off the "heroic" part of Greek mythology. Something to symbolize creatures becoming stronger as their myth grows.
Underutilized tribes getting more love. Dryads! Centaurs! Gorgons, chimeras, and hydras dire!
More options.
A storyline where the end goal isn't necessarily "big bad evil guy must be stopped". Journey into Nyx would be a great set to do something along those lines, with a descent-into-the-netherworld plot instead of having to stop, say, Ouranos or whatever BBEG happens to be on hand.
1. Return of quests and expeditions from Zendikar. Maybe also some parts of storyline taking form of heroic quests.
2. More unique characters. Not just adding legendaries (yay to nostalgia - tons of "bastards of gods" around), but also traditional elves, goblins, angels, etc. stepping aside for less usual stuff.
3. Some kind of deeper exploration of divinity counters, maybe obtaining them through quests see pt.1.
They're actually the villains of the story, and I'm actually reminded of the story of the tower of Babel. Zeus actually destroys them in the end. Presumably. Zeus is ready to pronounce his judgment, rises, and Plato ends it all Sopranos-like, leaving us wondering wha
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Card advantage is not the same thing as card draw. Something for 2B cannot be strictly worse than something for BBB or 3BB. If you're taking out Swords to Plowshares for Plummet, you're a fool. Stop doing these things!
Minotaurs, Dryads, Cyclops, a Gorgon planeswal-
(RTR Block)
What I really want to see from this since I'm a strong fan of the stuff from Greek and Roman mythology and history...
1) GODS, not planeswalkers or avatars/elementals.
2) Grandiose cards that make the story seem grander (thematically not necessarily but can be mechanically as well).
3) A non-planeswalker Protagonist that we can follow that has a Greek-esque story in which he (or perhaps she) has a quest of pure grandeur.
I don't care what the general public thinks, a EDH block even in the Vorthos sense would be very awesome.
The greek stories were grand as they were grand and tall tales as they were tall. Which really makes me hope they went for a "Larger than Life" themed blocked.
I really don't mind if they have to do it like the Weatherlight Crew style in that many cards feature specific characters, their exploits, and tells us more about them in flavortext and artwork.
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Failed Opression Stories:
Legend of Korra
Return to Ravnica
(Not that the stories or character are inhernetly bad, but that they failed to further delve into the topic. Like Gateless/Non-Benders feeling opressed by the Guilds/Benders that sought a revolution but it became less of importance according to the story.)
What I really want to see from this since I'm a strong fan of the stuff from Greek and Roman mythology and history...
1) GODS, not planeswalkers or avatars/elementals.
2) Grandiose cards that make the story seem grander (thematically not necessarily but can be mechanically as well).
3) A non-planeswalker Protagonist that we can follow that has a Greek-esque story in which he (or perhaps she) has a quest of pure grandeur.
I don't care what the general public thinks, a EDH block even in the Vorthos sense would be very awesome.
The greek stories were grand as they were grand and tall tales as they were tall. Which really makes me hope they went for a "Larger than Life" themed blocked.
This sums up what I want out of Theros very well! Greatness! Something that makes you go "Woah!"
I want this to reflect on Limited and hopefully Standard too. Not games that end early because of small weenies bashing, but games that end late in an epic clash of titans with earth-shattering spells!
How do you picture this on cards? They can't be planeswalkers according to you. I don't think creatures would fit as a god. Surely a god is stronger than a creature (unless in the form of an avatar). I don't think (hope) they won't add another cardtype. Unless you can use a couple of spells, like Zeus' lightning blast or Athena's Wisdom* I don't think there is room for an actual god on cards in Magic.
*obviously with different names, but I used the Greek gods as an example
To be fair on that point, would it be hard for them to invent a new creature type? After all we have had Praetors and the three Eldrazi titans. Which both can and have been worshipped as gods for their immense power in the sense of political, religious, mental, and physical. Both cases featured their Grand and Powerful entities that were not of the norm in terms of creature typing.
Plus although the Greek/Roman deities did focus on several aspects, they were also well known for specific ones as well. Sure you have Zeus who is a ruler of gods, but his best well known aspects are shapeshifting and throwing lightning bolts. Aries is seen as the god of war and Boros would be like the perfect representation of a god who is focused on the sole aspect of war.
Also in the past few years, WOTC has gone out of their way too not only define a colorless non-artifact spells, levelers, double faced cards, and cards that were Old-Color Pie (Phyrexia) mechanics that didn't seem to fit at first.
Which allows us to believe that if what we think is correct, then what is grand will be grand through a new set of mechanics, creature typings, and possible borders. After all we have long since traversed away from sets like Homelands and traveled throughout the years to an evergrowing development that can lend itself to grand storytelling and mechanics in mtg.
The only weak part for instance in Dragon's Maze is the minor faults of the guild champions, but the story has still try to hold itself in a strong way. Yet its been a very long time since a legends focused block has been done.
It all depends on how they handled it.
If they chose to stick to a routine formula and avoided another Legend Block, then I would say that would be the biggest slap in the face to a Greek/Roman block as many of the great stories are told with Fearsome Beasts, Larger than Life Heroes, and Mighty Gods and Demi-Gods.
We all know that it won't be Tribal. WOTC has specifically stated that a Tribal Block (again) is out of the question and that they would never make another such thing as the potential for such Tribal Synergy can make cards overtly powerful. Its a reason why their was no Tribal typing on any Myr cards from the Scars of Mirrodin block. Tribal + Artifacts could lead to disaster considering the original Mirrodin was just absolutly broken off its hinges and that was just artifacts.
It all depends IMHO how they not only handle the Instants/Sorceries/Enchantments/Planeswalkers/Lands but the Creatures as well. Which is why I'm putting on my hard hat when we start seeing the Limited Junk start showing up.
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Failed Opression Stories:
Legend of Korra
Return to Ravnica
(Not that the stories or character are inhernetly bad, but that they failed to further delve into the topic. Like Gateless/Non-Benders feeling opressed by the Guilds/Benders that sought a revolution but it became less of importance according to the story.)
IF this set is going to be based on Greek and Roman mythology, I want a few things:
1) Hyperion. Refer him good, and refer to him often.
2) Typhon. This is not egomania, this is about him having a hundred dragon heads. This is about him defeating Zeus (if only once) and about him having the moxy to marry Echidna and become the father of monsters.
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[I was permabanned and all I got to show for it was .... well, nothing.]
IF this set is going to be based on Greek and Roman mythology, I want a few things:
Except IT'S NOT. Because Wizards doesn't do things like that.
Lord... it's like people didn't pay attention to Kamigawa, where there were OVERWHELMING cultural influences but they didn't literally copy/paste the mythology onto the world.
I don't want any mystery in this block, just all out war. I want the story to be riveting with action and a possible love affair gone awry, or family members at each other's throats, and I want many minotaur, centaur, and krakens involved, along with the return of griffins. Going from "are we going to war?! I'll show you!" To "my massive and incredible army, do you see it?! I'll kill you!" To "what have I done? This wasn't worth it! I will stop this!" Or maybe, "That's our great leader. oh crap he just got screwed over by such and such over there at the end of this story." To "look at him now, he's such a mess, but look! A glimmer of hope in training and some optimism for revenge." To "did you see that? he freaking pwnt face man! Oh dude that was awesome!"
I'm tired of Magic lore lately. Its always revolving around mystery and humans. Give me some actual fantasy and Therese Nielson, or like Therese Nielson, arts. Go back a little to your original roots Wizards!
*I'm not even a Therese Nielson fan, but all of this computer generated art is boring too.
One more thing, I want a character, possibly 2, have a legendary creature card in each set, traversing color, strength, and flavor.
Sure, it could be possible to invent a new creature type "god". But in my opinion gods, even the non-omnipotent or omniscient Greek gods would be too strong to be a creature*. Just like the old planeswalkers (and even the new planeswalkers?) were too strong to turn into a creature, gods would be too. I would say that real gods (as opposed to fake gods like Serra) are possibly even stronger than Old time planeswalkers.
*unless we would be talking about some random nymph or so, but I assume you are talking about gods of the Zeus/Athena level.
The only closet thing to god level from Old-Walker days was the stuff like Karona (the walking plot hole nightmare) and Yawgmoth because of how much effort was taken to bring down Yawgmoth and how powerful Yawgmoth was when compared to the likes of say Urza.
Its just a personal pet peeve of mine from a Vorthos stand point when something that is supposed to represent something old and powerful gets a creature type like Avatar or Elemental. Avatar because maybe its just from too much dnd but usually an Avatar was a stand-in weaker version of the real thing, and that Elemental feels like a tack-on to something that would be hard to explain normally.
Come on Red featuring Minotaurs as the primary race.
Private Mod Note
():
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Failed Opression Stories:
Legend of Korra
Return to Ravnica
(Not that the stories or character are inhernetly bad, but that they failed to further delve into the topic. Like Gateless/Non-Benders feeling opressed by the Guilds/Benders that sought a revolution but it became less of importance according to the story.)
All I'm hoping for is a spiritual successor to Kamigawa, but with Greco-Roman themes instead of Japanese ones, and have the main theme at common and have some actual good cards.
Even if I don't get any of that, I'm fine with the that. The flavor interests me already.
Also, I still think it's possible that Kiora could fit in Theros, but I's probably prefer to see her in a year or two instead, so she's not too closely released with Ral, her Duels twinsie.
If it's the Greco-Roman set it seems to be, I've but a few desires:
-A legitimate, engaging storyline. None of this "guilds are just kinda there" for the first two sets, then running around a random maze. No, I'd like a classic, Kamigawa-style storyline where characters have fully fleshed-out backstories.
-Nothing absurdly over the top. We don't need an Emrakul to portray gods; they can be powerful and special in their own way, and don't even really need their own cards.
-Nothing too cheesy-heroic. White and Green haven't gotten a real villain in a good, long time, and Black hasn't gotten much in the way of protagonists either; I'd rather they not go back to the Avacyn-style trope of white good vs black evil.
-Cool creature types. Gladiators and minotaurs would make my day.
So I guess it's safe to say that Kiora won't be appearing in Theros. Bummer.
On the other hand, if he said "She's goint to appear, sooner than later", everybody would scream "SHE'S IN THEROS OH MY URZA §§§".
This answer is vague enough to make us speculate. Basically, we don't know.
A defined "under" and "over" world. I would love to see a thematic or mechanic difference in the two.
And add my vote to "an actual story". Innistrad had a story, even though the ending was pretty wack. New Phyrexia had a somewhat open-ended ending. Return to Ravnica? I didn't really care for the storyline, or lack thereof. It seemed to be, "Hey, here's a bunch of guilds! Oh, and maze!" Not my cup of tea.
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Club Flamingo Entries: +50
Club Flamingo Wins: 1!
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But getting back to the topic, a legendary hero cycle would be awesome, i would love a flood of legendaries i think it'd be helpful to creative deck building, it would challenge players to not auto include four of a good card.
Two mechanics I've came up with for it are Intoxicate Cost and Instinct
[snip]
This isn't the place for custom card creation, and you are aware that wizards isn't going to use your mechanics.
-B
How about a new muse cycle?
Return of divinity counters?
Too bad they didnt save Vraska for here.
Nicol Bolas, a balance of Vorthos and PowerUBR
Nath of the Gilt LeafBG
Others
Squee, Goblin of AwesomenessR
Nekusar, the Mindblazer!UBR
Vela the NightcladUB
I used to be a world champion, but then I took a wolf to the knee. And three Galvanic Blasts to the face.
Concerning when returning to Kamigawa would be acceptable
Level 1 Judge
I write flavor articles for RoxieCards.
I play and judge at Giga Bites Cafein Marietta, Georgia.
I love merfolk, I was known for a merfolk deck among my friends at one point... but I cut my teeth playing on the Aven. I thought that they made MUCH more sense for the role that the merfolk filled in Zendikar and I'd like to see them again here though I doubt they'll make an appearance.
You can check out my artwork here and here
Level 1 Judge
I write flavor articles for RoxieCards.
I play and judge at Giga Bites Cafein Marietta, Georgia.
No way #1 is true since they haven't done it since...Arabian Nights? Maybe Legends? #2 is possible, I guess, but if you have a card named "Xeus, Master of Okympus", what's the point, really? Just call him Zeus and be done with it. So #3 has to be correct.
I don't expect explicit 1:1 references.
Level 1 Judge
I write flavor articles for RoxieCards.
I play and judge at Giga Bites Cafein Marietta, Georgia.
----------------------------
Club Flamingo Wins: 10
----------------------------
EDH Decks
BG Vicious Varolz | RW Jor Kadeen, the Mean Machine | RG Atarka: Muh_Dragons.dec (WIP) | WU Brago, Blink Eternal (WIP)
----------------------------
2. More unique characters. Not just adding legendaries (yay to nostalgia - tons of "bastards of gods" around), but also traditional elves, goblins, angels, etc. stepping aside for less usual stuff.
3. Some kind of deeper exploration of divinity counters, maybe obtaining them through quests see pt.1.
The Atlanteans lived on an island, but their flavor wasn't that of an inherently curious, Vulcan-like population:
A translation of Critias for those interested in the story of Atlantis.
They're actually the villains of the story, and I'm actually reminded of the story of the tower of Babel. Zeus actually destroys them in the end. Presumably. Zeus is ready to pronounce his judgment, rises, and Plato ends it all Sopranos-like, leaving us wondering wha
On phasing:
(RTR Block)
What I really want to see from this since I'm a strong fan of the stuff from Greek and Roman mythology and history...
1) GODS, not planeswalkers or avatars/elementals.
2) Grandiose cards that make the story seem grander (thematically not necessarily but can be mechanically as well).
3) A non-planeswalker Protagonist that we can follow that has a Greek-esque story in which he (or perhaps she) has a quest of pure grandeur.
I don't care what the general public thinks, a EDH block even in the Vorthos sense would be very awesome.
The greek stories were grand as they were grand and tall tales as they were tall. Which really makes me hope they went for a "Larger than Life" themed blocked.
I really don't mind if they have to do it like the Weatherlight Crew style in that many cards feature specific characters, their exploits, and tells us more about them in flavortext and artwork.
Legend of Korra
Return to Ravnica
(Not that the stories or character are inhernetly bad, but that they failed to further delve into the topic. Like Gateless/Non-Benders feeling opressed by the Guilds/Benders that sought a revolution but it became less of importance according to the story.)
This sums up what I want out of Theros very well! Greatness! Something that makes you go "Woah!"
I want this to reflect on Limited and hopefully Standard too. Not games that end early because of small weenies bashing, but games that end late in an epic clash of titans with earth-shattering spells!
To be fair on that point, would it be hard for them to invent a new creature type? After all we have had Praetors and the three Eldrazi titans. Which both can and have been worshipped as gods for their immense power in the sense of political, religious, mental, and physical. Both cases featured their Grand and Powerful entities that were not of the norm in terms of creature typing.
Plus although the Greek/Roman deities did focus on several aspects, they were also well known for specific ones as well. Sure you have Zeus who is a ruler of gods, but his best well known aspects are shapeshifting and throwing lightning bolts. Aries is seen as the god of war and Boros would be like the perfect representation of a god who is focused on the sole aspect of war.
Also in the past few years, WOTC has gone out of their way too not only define a colorless non-artifact spells, levelers, double faced cards, and cards that were Old-Color Pie (Phyrexia) mechanics that didn't seem to fit at first.
Which allows us to believe that if what we think is correct, then what is grand will be grand through a new set of mechanics, creature typings, and possible borders. After all we have long since traversed away from sets like Homelands and traveled throughout the years to an evergrowing development that can lend itself to grand storytelling and mechanics in mtg.
The only weak part for instance in Dragon's Maze is the minor faults of the guild champions, but the story has still try to hold itself in a strong way. Yet its been a very long time since a legends focused block has been done.
It all depends on how they handled it.
If they chose to stick to a routine formula and avoided another Legend Block, then I would say that would be the biggest slap in the face to a Greek/Roman block as many of the great stories are told with Fearsome Beasts, Larger than Life Heroes, and Mighty Gods and Demi-Gods.
We all know that it won't be Tribal. WOTC has specifically stated that a Tribal Block (again) is out of the question and that they would never make another such thing as the potential for such Tribal Synergy can make cards overtly powerful. Its a reason why their was no Tribal typing on any Myr cards from the Scars of Mirrodin block. Tribal + Artifacts could lead to disaster considering the original Mirrodin was just absolutly broken off its hinges and that was just artifacts.
It all depends IMHO how they not only handle the Instants/Sorceries/Enchantments/Planeswalkers/Lands but the Creatures as well. Which is why I'm putting on my hard hat when we start seeing the Limited Junk start showing up.
Legend of Korra
Return to Ravnica
(Not that the stories or character are inhernetly bad, but that they failed to further delve into the topic. Like Gateless/Non-Benders feeling opressed by the Guilds/Benders that sought a revolution but it became less of importance according to the story.)
1) Hyperion. Refer him good, and refer to him often.
2) Typhon. This is not egomania, this is about him having a hundred dragon heads. This is about him defeating Zeus (if only once) and about him having the moxy to marry Echidna and become the father of monsters.
Except IT'S NOT. Because Wizards doesn't do things like that.
Lord... it's like people didn't pay attention to Kamigawa, where there were OVERWHELMING cultural influences but they didn't literally copy/paste the mythology onto the world.
Last reminder for everyone about this.
I'm tired of Magic lore lately. Its always revolving around mystery and humans. Give me some actual fantasy and Therese Nielson, or like Therese Nielson, arts. Go back a little to your original roots Wizards!
*I'm not even a Therese Nielson fan, but all of this computer generated art is boring too.
One more thing, I want a character, possibly 2, have a legendary creature card in each set, traversing color, strength, and flavor.
The only closet thing to god level from Old-Walker days was the stuff like Karona (the walking plot hole nightmare) and Yawgmoth because of how much effort was taken to bring down Yawgmoth and how powerful Yawgmoth was when compared to the likes of say Urza.
Its just a personal pet peeve of mine from a Vorthos stand point when something that is supposed to represent something old and powerful gets a creature type like Avatar or Elemental. Avatar because maybe its just from too much dnd but usually an Avatar was a stand-in weaker version of the real thing, and that Elemental feels like a tack-on to something that would be hard to explain normally.
Come on Red featuring Minotaurs as the primary race.
Legend of Korra
Return to Ravnica
(Not that the stories or character are inhernetly bad, but that they failed to further delve into the topic. Like Gateless/Non-Benders feeling opressed by the Guilds/Benders that sought a revolution but it became less of importance according to the story.)
So I guess it's safe to say that Kiora won't be appearing in Theros. Bummer.
Click the pic for more info.
Even if I don't get any of that, I'm fine with the that. The flavor interests me already.
Also, I still think it's possible that Kiora could fit in Theros, but I's probably prefer to see her in a year or two instead, so she's not too closely released with Ral, her Duels twinsie.
-A legitimate, engaging storyline. None of this "guilds are just kinda there" for the first two sets, then running around a random maze. No, I'd like a classic, Kamigawa-style storyline where characters have fully fleshed-out backstories.
-Nothing absurdly over the top. We don't need an Emrakul to portray gods; they can be powerful and special in their own way, and don't even really need their own cards.
-Nothing too cheesy-heroic. White and Green haven't gotten a real villain in a good, long time, and Black hasn't gotten much in the way of protagonists either; I'd rather they not go back to the Avacyn-style trope of white good vs black evil.
-Cool creature types. Gladiators and minotaurs would make my day.
Cubetutor Link
On the other hand, if he said "She's goint to appear, sooner than later", everybody would scream "SHE'S IN THEROS OH MY URZA §§§".
This answer is vague enough to make us speculate. Basically, we don't know.
And add my vote to "an actual story". Innistrad had a story, even though the ending was pretty wack. New Phyrexia had a somewhat open-ended ending. Return to Ravnica? I didn't really care for the storyline, or lack thereof. It seemed to be, "Hey, here's a bunch of guilds! Oh, and maze!" Not my cup of tea.
Club Flamingo Wins: 1!